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The Chosen One
02-20-2014, 10:08 PM
http://www.motherjones.com/mojo/2014/02/michele-bachmann-obama-won-because-hes-black-and-america-felt-guilty


In an interview published (http://api.viglink.com/api/click?format=go&jsonp=vglnk_jsonp_13929199886828&key=56bae19399997e47ab410dba99e01ff4&loc=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.huffingtonpost.com%2F2014%2F0 2%2F20%2Fmichele-bachmann-hillary-clinton_n_4823433.html%3F1392916434&v=1&libId=207c3921-4238-4c61-8e62-da107b30a078&out=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.tricities.com%2Fnews%2Fopinio n_columns%2Farticle_cfb1f01e-9914-11e3-8a53-001a4bcf6878.html&ref=http%3A%2F%2Ft.co%2FRID6E5yT9f&title=Michele%20Bachmann%27s%20Bad%20News%20For%20 Hillary%20Clinton%3A%20People%20%27Aren%27t%20Read y%27%20For%20A%20Female%20President&txt=Rep.%20Michele%20Bachmann%20(R-Minn.)%20doesn%27t%20seem%20too%20concerned) Wednesday, Bachmann said that Barack Obama won the presidency because white people felt too guilty about past racial injustices. "I think there was a cachet about having an African-American president because of guilt," she said in an interview with Cal Thomas, a syndicated conservative columnist.

No Michele... they voted for Obama because they looked at the alternatives in your party and said... yeaaaaaahhhh. no.

zitothebrave
02-20-2014, 10:17 PM
**** someone should have told Herman Cain about that white guilt **** SHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOT

50PoundHead
02-20-2014, 10:56 PM
Don't make me post my picture of me with Michelle when she served in the Minnesota Legislature. I hesitate to post it because I was about 20 pounds heavier ten years ago and Patty Hearst was hiding out in my jowls.

sturg33
02-20-2014, 11:03 PM
Bachman has always been a fool. I loved it when Ron Paul humiliated her about Iran on national television

50PoundHead
02-20-2014, 11:43 PM
Bachman has always been a fool. I loved it when Ron Paul humiliated her about Iran on national television

Oh let me tell you from close proximity, you can tell it's not an act. I have seen these baby blues from less than five feet away. Crazy, crazy, crazy eyes.

http://blogs.villagevoice.com/runninscared/MBachmannNewsweek.jpg

weso1
02-21-2014, 06:08 PM
That's why I voted for Obama. And I've felt relieved ever since.

yeezus
02-21-2014, 06:17 PM
She's another one who is just delusional about the state of her party, which is that of a joke.

Oklahomahawk
02-21-2014, 08:35 PM
She's another one who is just delusional about the state of her party, which is that of a joke.

I wonder what Repubs say about the big 3 (Palin, Bachmann, and Cruz) when nobody's around or maybe in small groups (away from discussion forums). Any one conservative on this forum has more IQ points than those 3 wastes of DNA put together. I loathe Pelosi, Reed, and Biden, but as dumbarsed as they are they leave the TEA party darlings in the dust and what's worse for Repubs, the fourth horse's arse of the apocalypse is now joining them officially, give it up folks for the Motor City Madman, Mr. Ted Nugent. I guess the end times can now ensue.

weso1
02-21-2014, 11:20 PM
She's another one who is just delusional about the state of her party, which is that of a joke.

Isn't she talking about the state of the democratic party in that quote?

weso1
02-21-2014, 11:27 PM
I wonder what Repubs say about the big 3 (Palin, Bachmann, and Cruz) when nobody's around or maybe in small groups (away from discussion forums). Any one conservative on this forum has more IQ points than those 3 wastes of DNA put together. I loathe Pelosi, Reed, and Biden, but as dumbarsed as they are they leave the TEA party darlings in the dust and what's worse for Repubs, the fourth horse's arse of the apocalypse is now joining them officially, give it up folks for the Motor City Madman, Mr. Ted Nugent. I guess the end times can now ensue.

It's pretty obvious that the decision makers in the republican party don't like "the big 3". They keep pushing moderate candidates, the type the dems keep begging for and of course when they run they hate them and make them seem ultra conservative.

Oklahomahawk
02-21-2014, 11:43 PM
It's pretty obvious that the decision makers in the republican party don't like "the big 3". They keep pushing moderate candidates, the type the dems keep begging for and of course when they run they hate them and make them seem ultra conservative.

Honestly I think the Republican Party is just going through a "dry spell" right now, much as the Dems did back in the Mondale/Dukakis/Gore period. Right now the Repubs are IMO too fragmented, between the supposed religious right and the TEA partiers, the Talk-Radio/Fox types and the bulk of actual conservative human beings who most likely feel deserted by their party (trust me, I've been there and done that) and right now they just don't have a voice. Personally I think the reason the party overall nominates the so-called "moderates" they do is more of a compromise to find somebody that as many different elements of the base can stomach (not necessarily like) and they wind up with somebody nobody can really get excited about.

I also think that if the party leaders don't get the religious fanatics (not saying real Christians here, but those who pick up the banner of Christianity and carry it with them to the brothels and flag burnings), extreme Limbaugh/Hannity/Coulter/Malkin types and the TEA moron types like Palin/Cruz/Bachmann, they're gonna just continue to lose votes and states and support or at best just have to hope the Dems get drunk of success and drive off a cliff, in other words you finally win a Super Bowl because the other team's plane crashes. The danger in purging what desperately needs to be purged is you take a chance on losing those votes in the short run and that's something nobody wants to take a chance on.

The Chosen One
02-22-2014, 12:04 AM
Not sure if I agree with it being a dry spell.

It has more to do with issues IMO. Republicans have been extremely anti-***, using abortion over and over, and because people naturally assume Republicans are the rich whites, they also blame the GOP for the housing crisis recession.

I think McCain had a legitimate chance to win, it was selecting Palin that put the dagger in his campaign.

Romney would've been better off not selecting Paul Ryan.

Nobody saying Democrats are better, but they just seem to be the anti-loudmouth shove opinion down your throat.

Gary82
02-22-2014, 12:20 AM
Palin gave McCain a chance to win. It turns out she was an idiot. Romney had an opportunity after Obama ****ed up the first debate, but he couldn't capitalize.

zitothebrave
02-22-2014, 12:28 AM
The problem with the Rs is they basically have to hope for voter suppression. Because of their religious aspect they alienate many voters. Even the religious folks don't always agree with them. I think any presidential candidate out there should not ever even bring up Abortion or *** rights. Use politician speak to get around it. Romney had a better shot of winning than McCain because McCain didn't campaign against Bush, which Obama did and Bush was hated. Romney had bad Obama. His problem was he was Mormon. I'ts really quite simple, that alone made him unelectable on the national stage. Considering how much people didn't like Obama going into the last election and really aside from the Mormon thing and the 48% thing what really did he have against him? I don't think the last one was enough to lose him the election.

The Chosen One
02-22-2014, 01:42 AM
Doubt Mormonism was the reason he didn't get elected.

The 47% thing hurt him the most. The hotel video is when his ratings started going down until the first debate. Also I think the night Benghazi happened when Romney's camp hit Obama's camp hard while the facts were still coming out.

Krgrecw
02-22-2014, 02:02 AM
Fact that Romney was Mormon had no effect on his outcome. No republican would had beat Obama.

Romney was to passive. He should had attacked Obama on Benghazi. That's Why many like Christie. He's not a wuss

The Chosen One
02-22-2014, 02:27 AM
Romney was to passive. He should had attacked Obama on Benghazi. That's Why many like Christie. He's not a wuss

Which is sad actually, because if that's what it would have taken for Romney to win against Obama then I feel more sorry for the country if that's what we've been relegated to.

goldfly
02-22-2014, 02:38 AM
look at yall debate about the "republican" party and why they didn't/don't win on the national level anymore

they are nothing more than a regional party for the most part and have to gimmick it to make sure they have enough seats in congress to make sure nothing really happens anymore

their platform is a way of the past and it is thankfully dying

dying too slow imo but whatever


it is pathetic to watch their base of so called christians grasp at straws on issues while playing the victim of religious persecution while doing everything in their power to pass laws based on their so called religious views


they can give up on the white house and you can act like it is cause they are mormon or too passive etc (i am sure some dumbass will say, cause one side just gives **** away so they don't work) but it is cause their are holding on too dying ideas and the people in the center (where elections are won) don't want to be part of the religion party (actual religion and the religion of protecting rich people) that holds the country back

50PoundHead
02-22-2014, 08:55 AM
Obama won in 2008 because of the state of the country (war fatigue and economic crisis) and he won in 2012 as a result of his ground game (organized get out the vote effort). I don't think Romney ever recovered from his 47% comments.

Nationally, I think the Dems simply command the middle a bit better than the Republicans right now and as much as both the active right and the active left want to spin it, America is not an ideologically-driven nation.

But let's get back to Bachmann!

zitothebrave
02-22-2014, 10:15 AM
'

Fact that Romney was Mormon had no effect on his outcome.

That is very naive thinking by you. While many people won't outright say they didn't vote for Romney because he's Mormon it for sure was a reason for doubt and not voting for many people. There were more than just that of course, but if you don't think that he lost votes for being a Mormon then you're crazy. Unfortunately I don't think he added voters that he lost like Obama did with people who wouldn't vote for him because he's black by bringing in the youth vote to higher levels.

BedellBrave
02-22-2014, 10:48 AM
The problem with the Rs is they basically have to hope for voter suppression. Because of their religious aspect they alienate many voters. Even the religious folks don't always agree with them. I think any presidential candidate out there should not ever even bring up Abortion or *** rights. Use politician speak to get around it. Romney had a better shot of winning than McCain because McCain didn't campaign against Bush, which Obama did and Bush was hated. Romney had bad Obama. His problem was he was Mormon. I'ts really quite simple, that alone made him unelectable on the national stage. Considering how much people didn't like Obama going into the last election and really aside from the Mormon thing and the 48% thing what really did he have against him? I don't think the last one was enough to lose him the election.


McCain is an war-happy arse.

McCain didn't campaign against Bush and more importantly didn't campaign against Obama.

Glad now he lost.

The Mormon thing played in with some for Romney. But that he was Mr. RomneyCare, made that 47percenter remark, and was just another in the Dole-McCain line of moderates did him more damage.

BedellBrave
02-22-2014, 10:55 AM
look at yall debate about the "republican" party and why they didn't/don't win on the national level anymore

they are nothing more than a regional party for the most part and have to gimmick it to make sure they have enough seats in congress to make sure nothing really happens anymore

their platform is a way of the past and it is thankfully dying

dying too slow imo but whatever


it is pathetic to watch their base of so called christians grasp at straws on issues while playing the victim of religious persecution while doing everything in their power to pass laws based on their so called religious views


they can give up on the white house and you can act like it is cause they are mormon or too passive etc (i am sure some dumbass will say, cause one side just gives **** away so they don't work) but it is cause their are holding on too dying ideas and the people in the center (where elections are won) don't want to be part of the religion party (actual religion and the religion of protecting rich people) that holds the country back

Yes, all parties who want any chance of sniffing a win must submit to the tenets of the American-moral-code, primarily: you must approved and support everything the LBGT leaders want and you must honor the holy sacrament of cutting and crushing and removing fetuses from the womb of any woman (particularly black women - don't want too many of those black kids around) whose convenience rights trump the right to life of some "parasite."

57Brave
02-22-2014, 01:24 PM
I thought Romney lost because he was distracted over the Dressage thingy. Didn't stay focused

romney lost because he didnt stand for things everyday people were looking for - as in anything -anything at all besides deregulation and tax breaks for those already burdened with tax break after tax break. . Same reason McCain,Santorum,Perry,gingrich,Cain,Bachmann and yes, Palin -- what do any of them stand for outside of "being" President?

" tenets of the American-moral-code..."
you're joking ---- right?

BedellBrave
02-22-2014, 01:50 PM
Nope. Course I could nuance the "American" bit by saying, "the prevailing American…"

BedellBrave
02-22-2014, 02:08 PM
http://images.sodahead.com/polls/003746203/5841336146_margaret_sanger_jewslatinos_human_weeds _xlarge.jpeg

The Chosen One
02-22-2014, 02:39 PM
It has nothing to do with submitting.

If any gop said they wouldn't be for *** marriage and not against it then they would have been fine. But instead let's make a constitutional amendment to deny it from ever happening. At least Ron Paul said leave it up to the states which still is meh. A lot of the candidates took pride in saying I want to ban it.

BedellBrave
02-22-2014, 02:42 PM
It has nothing to do with submitting.

If any gop said they wouldn't be for *** marriage and not against it then they would have been fine. But instead let's make a constitutional amendment to deny it from ever happening. At least Ron Paul said leave it up to the states which still is meh. A lot of the candidates took pride in saying I want to ban it.


Baloney. It has everything to do with submitting. Or kowtowing if you prefer. Neither McCain nor Romney went balls to the walls on abortion or SSM.

Romney (http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2012/may/15/mitt-romney/mitt-romney-has-maintained-consistent-stance-same/)

The Chosen One
02-22-2014, 02:45 PM
They both said in primary debates they would defend traditional marriage (as if it was ever under attack) both have supported a ban on ssm.

BedellBrave
02-22-2014, 02:49 PM
They both said in primary debates they would defend traditional marriage (as if it was ever under attack) both have supported a ban on ssm.

Of course they defend marriage. But Romney hasn't really promoted a federal ban on ssm. He wasn't making that a major plank of his campaign. He played the primary and the pledge game. But that's what it was. A game. Read the link I provided.

Romney got played - and played well - by Obama's pivot on the issue.

And McCain? When did he back a federal marriage amendment?

BedellBrave
02-22-2014, 02:57 PM
And moving forward - like gold is saying - you've got to kowtow to the LBGT crowd and take the sacrament of abortion to be viable. You should be pleased.

The Chosen One
02-22-2014, 03:12 PM
Romney is the king of pivot.

The Chosen One
02-22-2014, 03:14 PM
And moving forward - like gold is saying - you've got to kowtow to the LBGT crowd and take the sacrament of abortion to be viable. You should be pleased.

*** marriage didn't catapult Obama into victory. Once again McCain and Romney especially their running mates answered the ban *** marriage bandwagon. ron Paul was respected by ***s because he gave the state's rights answer.

Krgrecw
02-22-2014, 03:31 PM
*** marriage didn't catapult Obama into victory. Once again McCain and Romney especially their running mates answered the ban *** marriage bandwagon. ron Paul was respected by ***s because he gave the state's rights answer.


***s weren't going to vote GOP anyways. Wasn't Obama anti-*** marriage at first?

BedellBrave
02-22-2014, 05:29 PM
Romney is the king of pivot.


No argument from me on that.

BedellBrave
02-22-2014, 05:36 PM
Worth a second posting.
http://images.sodahead.com/polls/003746203/5841336146_margaret_sanger_jewslatinos_human_weeds _xlarge.jpeg

goldfly
02-22-2014, 06:00 PM
Yes, all parties who want any chance of sniffing a win must submit to the tenets of the American-moral-code, primarily: you must approved and support everything the LBGT leaders want and you must honor the holy sacrament of cutting and crushing and removing fetuses from the womb of any woman (particularly black women - don't want too many of those black kids around) whose convenience rights trump the right to life of some "parasite."

i applaud you for staying the course in trying to act persecuted

goldfly
02-22-2014, 06:02 PM
Worth a second posting.

wasn't worth the first time

much less the 2nd time

i read the words of great men that say all men are created equal and at the same time owned slaves.

the quote is from 1922

thankfully a lot has changed since then

AerchAngel
02-22-2014, 06:03 PM
Worth a second posting.

She gives the KKK a good name compared to her.

She didn't hold anything back.

goldfly
02-22-2014, 06:11 PM
She gives the KKK a good name compared to her.

She didn't hold anything back.

she was most likely a member

Oklahomahawk
02-22-2014, 06:17 PM
Worth a second posting.

Brought to you by the Mel Gibson Society for Tolerance!!!

AerchAngel
02-22-2014, 06:22 PM
she was most likely a member

Nah, I can't say that. She did some good for good black folks back in the day and I agree with some of her methods, dumb poor people (especially blacks) who spread their legs to procreate so they can get more money from the government shouldn't have kids. That is the mindset I like about her. This is the same reason why people don't like me here. I believe in controlling the population and making people sterile after one abortion. I don't agree with killing innocent babies so the only way to do it is keep the female or male infertile and the "oops" won't happen, the innocent babies deserve better.


Yes warts and all but deep down she had issues.

Oklahomahawk
02-22-2014, 06:25 PM
Nah, I can't say that. She did some good for good black folks back in the day and I agree with some of her methods, dumb poor people (especially blacks) who spread their legs to procreate so they can get more money from the government shouldn't have kids. That is the mindset I like about her. This is the same reason why people don't like me here. I believe in controlling the population and making people sterile after one abortion. I don't agree with killing innocent babies so the only way to do it is keep the female or male infertile and the "oops" won't happen, the innocent babies deserve better.


Yes warts and all but deep down she had issues.

Doesn't that depend on your definition of "member"?? :icon_biggrin:

AerchAngel
02-22-2014, 06:32 PM
Doesn't that depend on your definition of "member"?? :icon_biggrin:

Only if it involves rape. Making a man a eunuch has possibilities if he has "issues".

Oklahomahawk
02-22-2014, 06:52 PM
Only if it involves rape. Making a man a eunuch has possibilities if he has "issues".

Man are you strict!!!

goldfly
02-22-2014, 06:59 PM
Man are you strict!!!

na

just muslim in his views

AerchAngel
02-22-2014, 07:00 PM
na

just muslim in his views

One of the few laws I do agree with, especially raping children like the pedophile in the state Penn.

Oklahomahawk
02-22-2014, 07:03 PM
One of the few laws I do agree with, especially raping children like the pedophile in the state Penn.

But wait, unborn babies aren't really babies, they're just globules of protoplasm...

BedellBrave
02-22-2014, 07:14 PM
i applaud you for staying the course in trying to act persecuted


I'm not persecuted. But if a political party wants to sniff victory nationally, it must kowtow to your point-of-view on these two matters. Pretty simple point really.

BedellBrave
02-22-2014, 07:15 PM
wasn't worth the first time

much less the 2nd time

i read the words of great men that say all men are created equal and at the same time owned slaves.

the quote is from 1922

thankfully a lot has changed since then


Does one of your patron saints embarrass you now?

BedellBrave
02-22-2014, 07:16 PM
She gives the KKK a good name compared to her.

She didn't hold anything back.

She was all for culling as many blacks from the herd as possible and her organization is doing a damn good job of it.

BedellBrave
02-22-2014, 07:18 PM
But wait, unborn babies aren't really babies, they're just globules of protoplasm...

Slice'm, dice'm, salt'm.

Oklahomahawk
02-22-2014, 07:24 PM
Slice'm, dice'm, salt'm.

Mmmmmmm...... :winking0016:

BedellBrave
02-22-2014, 07:28 PM
Yeah, I probably shouldn't have gone there.

Oklahomahawk
02-22-2014, 07:30 PM
Yeah, I probably shouldn't have gone there.

Ironic isn't it? Unborn babies who really aren't just a mass of protoplasm are considered to be such by those who find it easier to sanction their mass murder that way, while this very thread was originally a about Michelle Bachmann who really is just a mass or protoplasm but is considered to be otherwise by so many people. It's a little mind boggling.

BedellBrave
02-22-2014, 07:34 PM
So that's what the thread was suppose to be about? My bad.

weso1
02-22-2014, 08:02 PM
Not sure if I agree with it being a dry spell.

It has more to do with issues IMO. Republicans have been extremely anti-***, using abortion over and over, and because people naturally assume Republicans are the rich whites, they also blame the GOP for the housing crisis recession.

I think McCain had a legitimate chance to win, it was selecting Palin that put the dagger in his campaign.

Romney would've been better off not selecting Paul Ryan.

Nobody saying Democrats are better, but they just seem to be the anti-loudmouth shove opinion down your throat.

I think it's both a dry spell and they need to rethink which issues they highlight. I really don't think the *** thing is a big deal. I think the big issues they need to rethink are taxes and immigration. Their core message of self responsibility and civil liberties is what they need to get back to.

Look, you guys hate Paul Ryan, but he is actually a very good candidate. The dry spell is over now, imo. Lots of good candidates are going to be out there this election cycle compared to the last one. They just need to clean up their message and move it more toward Rand Paul's philosophy, but not too far right.

The Chosen One
02-22-2014, 08:07 PM
I think it's both a dry spell and they need to rethink which issues they highlight. I really don't think the *** thing is a big deal. I think the big issues they need to rethink are taxes and immigration. Their core message of self responsibility and civil liberties is what they need to get back to.

Look, you guys hate Paul Ryan, but he is actually a very good candidate. The dry spell is over now, imo. Lots of good candidates are going to be out there this election cycle compared to the last one. They just need to clean up their message and move it more toward Rand Paul's philosophy, but not too far right.

At the end of the day people vote on economics and sometimes abortion. Even most ***s vote the same way.

BedellBrave
02-22-2014, 08:22 PM
I think it's both a dry spell and they need to rethink which issues they highlight. I really don't think the *** thing is a big deal. I think the big issues they need to rethink are taxes and immigration. Their core message of self responsibility and civil liberties is what they need to get back to.

Look, you guys hate Paul Ryan, but he is actually a very good candidate. The dry spell is over now, imo. Lots of good candidates are going to be out there this election cycle compared to the last one. They just need to clean up their message and move it more toward Rand Paul's philosophy, but not too far right.


I agree - they'll have to soft-pedal on SSM and immigration. With the birthrate near or below replacement levels, strong anti-immigration pushes that are easily framed by the opposition as xenophobic and racist are dumb, imo.

goldfly
02-24-2014, 02:20 AM
Does one of your patron saints embarrass you now?

you think she is "patron saint" of mine?


i don't care what she said or believed 100 years ago.

50PoundHead
02-24-2014, 08:14 AM
Hey, this thread was about my lady, Michelle Bachmann! What happened? She's probably following this as a member of the House Intelligence Committee and is sorely disappointed that the discussion has turned away from her.

Oklahomahawk
02-24-2014, 08:31 AM
Hey, this thread was about my lady, Michelle Bachmann! What happened? She's probably following this as a member of the House Intelligence Committee and is sorely disappointed that the discussion has turned away from her.

She's a member of the House "Intelligence" Committee?????????????????????????????????? And we wonder why this country is falling apart!?!??!?!??

BedellBrave
02-24-2014, 08:48 AM
Hey, this thread was about my lady, Michelle Bachmann! What happened? She's probably following this as a member of the House Intelligence Committee and is sorely disappointed that the discussion has turned away from her.

Sorry but Sanger is much more interesting.

sturg33
02-24-2014, 09:23 AM
I actually think generally speaking that women are the dumbest voters of all the voters.

They get all up in arms about abortion, and buy into the "Romney is going to make my legal killing illegal!" and vote democrat. When, anyone with a brain understands that that law isn't going anywhere, no matter how pro-life the President is (Regan, Bush, Bush...)

It's amazing to me that any voter would put issues like ***-marriage and abortion over issues like economics, health care, or national defense. But that is how the liberals have shifted the argument and they are quite good at the scare-tactics.

AerchAngel
02-24-2014, 11:07 AM
Slice'm, dice'm, salt'm.

It is from the slut on Coming to America when Eddie Murphy was looking for his princess?

AerchAngel
02-24-2014, 11:08 AM
I actually think generally speaking that women are the dumbest voters of all the voters.

They get all up in arms about abortion, and buy into the "Romney is going to make my legal killing illegal!" and vote democrat. When, anyone with a brain understands that that law isn't going anywhere, no matter how pro-life the President is (Regan, Bush, Bush...)

It's amazing to me that any voter would put issues like ***-marriage and abortion over issues like economics, health care, or national defense. But that is how the liberals have shifted the argument and they are quite good at the scare-tactics.

The only thing Dummicrats can rely on, scare tactics. They are lost when it comes to fiscal responsibility which the Repukans are just a tad a bit above in responsibility (war machine and in bed with big business), but even they suck, but not as much.

zitothebrave
02-24-2014, 11:11 AM
I actually think generally speaking that women are the dumbest voters of all the voters.

They get all up in arms about abortion, and buy into the "Romney is going to make my legal killing illegal!" and vote democrat. When, anyone with a brain understands that that law isn't going anywhere, no matter how pro-life the President is (Regan, Bush, Bush...)

It's amazing to me that any voter would put issues like ***-marriage and abortion over issues like economics, health care, or national defense. But that is how the liberals have shifted the argument and they are quite good at the scare-tactics.

Actually that's not true at all. President sets the SC and unless there's a constitutional Amendment allowing abortion an old ruling can always be overturned/revised.

sturg33
02-24-2014, 11:20 AM
Actually that's not true at all. President sets the SC and unless there's a constitutional Amendment allowing abortion an old ruling can always be overturned/revised.

Republicans don't want the law changed because if it ever is, they will never win an election again

The Chosen One
02-24-2014, 12:40 PM
Republicans don't want the law changed because if it ever is, they will never win an election again

So if it's Republicans that will never change it because they want to use it as a political ploy every election, why do you cast blame on Women and Democrats?

zitothebrave
02-24-2014, 12:48 PM
Republicans don't want the law changed because if it ever is, they will never win an election again

Then why campaign against it? Why not just say it's up to the parents and individual to make smart choices and so on so forth.

50PoundHead
02-24-2014, 01:01 PM
The only thing Dummicrats can rely on, scare tactics. They are lost when it comes to fiscal responsibility which the Repukans are just a tad a bit above in responsibility (war machine and in bed with big business), but even they suck, but not as much.

The Dems don't hold a monopoly on scare tactics. The NRA feasts on the fear of gun owners. You'd swear there is a homosexual conspiracy poised to take over the world if you listen to some commentators on the right. That's the problem right now. Nobody has what I would call a forward strategy.

The Chosen One
02-24-2014, 01:03 PM
The Dems don't hold a monopoly on scare tactics. The NRA feasts on the fear of gun owners. You'd swear there is a homosexual conspiracy poised to take over the world if you listen to some commentators on the right. That's the problem right now. Nobody has what I would call a forward strategy.

Exactly. The Obama is going to take all our guns away and put is in concentration camps like Hitler is probably the biggest scare tactic the NRA uses. Then when the next President is inaugurated they'll claim victory to preventing Obama from putting us in concentration camps.

sturg33
02-24-2014, 01:29 PM
So if it's Republicans that will never change it because they want to use it as a political ploy every election, why do you cast blame on Women and Democrats?

I blame women for being dumb enough to believe it will ever change.

I remember the stats from the last election and was astounded how many women voted for Obama and abortion was their biggest reason why.

sturg33
02-24-2014, 01:30 PM
Then why campaign against it? Why not just say it's up to the parents and individual to make smart choices and so on so forth.

Because campaigning against it gets the voters out. And each time they never overturn it they claim they need more republicans in office to get it done.

50PoundHead
02-24-2014, 01:39 PM
Because campaigning against it gets the voters out. And each time they never overturn it they claim they need more republicans in office to get it done.

Correct. It's all about motivating segments of voters and the right-to-life movement is a very active and relatively large voting base.

jpx7
02-24-2014, 02:57 PM
I blame women for being dumb enough to believe it will ever change.

I remember the stats from the last election and was astounded how many women voted for Obama and abortion was their biggest reason why.

So isn't it the fault of Grand Old Party for employing a benighted, backwards strategy that accomplishes the opposite of its goal, not an example of "women [...] being dumb"?

sturg33
02-24-2014, 03:11 PM
So isn't it the fault of Grand Old Party for employing a benighted, backwards strategy that accomplishes the opposite of its goal, not an example of "women [...] being dumb"?

I don't think so.

My girlfriend is in medical school. I was with her and several of her med school friends on election night 2012.

Once Obama was called as the winner, there was a massive cheer. And in unison they said "My uterus is mine, bitch!"

Note - my girlfriend was not one of these people. She is staunchly pro-choice, but now understands how little of importance it is when it comes to elections. She voted for Romney because she, like ALL of her med-school friends, were scared to death of ObamaCare and what it would mean for their futures. They ALL agreed it was terrible for them. And yet, they ALL voted for Obama out of fear of abortion.

Like I said - dumb.

zitothebrave
02-24-2014, 03:34 PM
SO then why don't republicans just come out and say that abortion isn't an issue they're going to campaign for or against? If it's such an issue and such a reason why Obama won then why not ditch it?

Pretty consistently in Gallop polls it indicates that only 20% of people think that abortion should be illegal. Ditch the right to life BS and let the RR go their own way. Approach everything from a more sensible ground. The RR would either fall in line, or make their own party, either way on a national stage the Rs have little hope for presidency because lets face it, they have many beliefs that are screwed by the views basically forced by the RR.

AerchAngel
02-24-2014, 04:09 PM
SO then why don't republicans just come out and say that abortion isn't an issue they're going to campaign for or against? If it's such an issue and such a reason why Obama won then why not ditch it?

Pretty consistently in Gallop polls it indicates that only 20% of people think that abortion should be illegal. Ditch the right to life BS and let the RR go their own way. Approach everything from a more sensible ground. The RR would either fall in line, or make their own party, either way on a national stage the Rs have little hope for presidency because lets face it, they have many beliefs that are screwed by the views basically forced by the RR.

Your post is disingenuous. Your 20% is illegal in ALL CIRCUMSTANCES, but the more important one people look at is the 52% that allows it to be legal in CERTAIN circumstances and I believe that to be higher.

Look at the link. (http://www.gallup.com/poll/1576/abortion.aspx)

zitothebrave
02-24-2014, 04:20 PM
When I say abortion to be illegal I presumed that's what people would read, my bad.

ANyway, the 52% in the middle side more to the dems belief of legal with certain stipulations (such as no 3rd trimester, etc.)

BedellBrave
02-24-2014, 04:28 PM
I don't think so.

My girlfriend is in medical school. I was with her and several of her med school friends on election night 2012.

Once Obama was called as the winner, there was a massive cheer. And in unison they said "My uterus is mine, bitch!"

Note - my girlfriend was not one of these people. She is staunchly pro-choice, but now understands how little of importance it is when it comes to elections. She voted for Romney because she, like ALL of her med-school friends, were scared to death of ObamaCare and what it would mean for their futures. They ALL agreed it was terrible for them. And yet, they ALL voted for Obama out of fear of abortion.

Like I said - dumb.


Sick, wicked, and depraved. I am so growing in my hatred of this country.

AerchAngel
02-24-2014, 04:30 PM
When I say abortion to be illegal I presumed that's what people would read, my bad.

ANyway, the 52% in the middle side more to the dems belief of legal with certain stipulations (such as no 3rd trimester, etc.)

I think it is higher, like rape, incest, health to the mother. It depends on how they worded the question.

The Chosen One
02-24-2014, 04:36 PM
Sick, wicked, and depraved. I am so growing in my hatred of this country.

Curious as to why that would upset you. Neither are saying they want to be able to abort at 6 months it has more to do with laws like in Virginia where ultrasound is mandatory by the government.

BedellBrave
02-24-2014, 04:43 PM
Curious as to why that would upset you. Neither are saying they want to be able to abort at 6 months it has more to do with laws like in Virginia where ultrasound is mandatory by the government.


My comment was in response to this (which I put in bold font):

And in unison they said "My uterus is mine, bitch!"


Such a mindset is hideously evil. Depraved. Wicked. And that it is so common is what I am lamenting.

The Chosen One
02-24-2014, 04:45 PM
My comment was in response to this (which I put in bold font):

And in unison they said "My uterus is mine, bitch!"

Exactly. Curious as to why that upsets you
That's exactly what my response was.

BedellBrave
02-24-2014, 04:46 PM
Reveling in one's "freedom" to mutilate innocent life is repugnant.

AerchAngel
02-24-2014, 04:47 PM
My comment was in response to this (which I put in bold font):

And in unison they said "My uterus is mine, bitch!"


Such a mindset is hideously evil. Depraved. Wicked. And that it is so common is what I am lamenting.

And I would have said, "yeah, murder is permissible if it involves my body".

Got to love infanticide.

BedellBrave
02-24-2014, 04:49 PM
We are a barbaric, decadent and narcissistic country.

jpx7
02-24-2014, 04:52 PM
And in unison they said "My uterus is mine, bitch!"


Sick, wicked, and depraved. I am so growing in my hatred of this country.

I agree it's a little silly-sounding and a bit hyperbolic, but – serious question – how is that sentiment "[s]ick, wicked, and depraved"?

BedellBrave
02-24-2014, 04:54 PM
I don't get you guys. Just don't.

BedellBrave
02-24-2014, 04:54 PM
Reveling in one's "freedom" to mutilate innocent life is repugnant.

^^^

jpx7
02-24-2014, 05:16 PM
Reveling in one's "freedom" to mutilate innocent life is repugnant.^^^

I hadn't seen that when I posted my question, but I guess (a) I'm not really sure that's the spirit of their "reveling" and (b) I don't find abortion nearly so abhorrent as you do.

BedellBrave
02-24-2014, 05:27 PM
I hadn't seen that when I posted my question, but I guess (a) I'm not really sure that's the spirit of their "reveling" and (b) I don't find abortion nearly so abhorrent as you do.


(a) Maybe not the spirit - but that's a part of the hideous problem - that they don't get the import of their words - that they act like there isn't an innocent human life involved in an abortion.

(b) I know and in respectful honesty, that troubles me about so many of you that I consider my friends. Despite all of our disagreements on this board, I like so many of you guys. This is one point that I wish we held more common ground. Sadly, we do not.

I speak for myself - and I do so recognizing my own sins - but abortion is a blight upon this country and that people don't merely say, "well it's not a good thing, but…", they go on to applaud it and revel in it, is barbaric to me.

sturg33
02-24-2014, 05:31 PM
(a) Maybe not the spirit - but that's a part of the hideous problem - that they don't get the import of their words - that they act like there isn't an innocent human life involved in an abortion.

(b) I know and in respectful honesty, that troubles me about so many of you that I consider my friends. Despite all of our disagreements on this board, I like so many of you guys. This is one point that I wish we held more common ground. Sadly, we do not.

I speak for myself - and I do so recognizing my own sins - but abortion is a blight upon this country and that people don't merely say, "well it's not a good thing, but…", they go on to applaud it and revel in it, is barbaric to me.

I have an interesting argument with my gf about it all the time. As I said, she is staunchly pro-choice, yet she recognizes the hypocrisy in being so.

Anyways, without going into it - I think I made some headway on her the other night. We were discussing abortion, and he mom was an OBGYN, and she is also considering being one. I asked her if her mom was pro-choice. She said that she was, but that she refused to perform an abortion. My gf said the exact same thing. I asked why, and she said "she didn't feel comfortable doing it."

Finally, it seemed like a light bulb went off. If you don't feel comfortable doing it, then it probably means that you think there is something "not right" about it. And it's not something as simple as killing a parasite. She agreed, and quickly changed the subject.

AerchAngel
02-24-2014, 05:35 PM
(a) Maybe not the spirit - but that's a part of the hideous problem - that they don't get the import of their words - that they act like there isn't an innocent human life involved in an abortion.

(b) I know and in respectful honesty, that troubles me about so many of you that I consider my friends. Despite all of our disagreements on this board, I like so many of you guys. This is one point that I wish we held more common ground. Sadly, we do not.

I speak for myself - and I do so recognizing my own sins - but abortion is a blight upon this country and that people don't merely say, "well it's not a good thing, but…", they go on to applaud it and revel in it, is barbaric to me.

I know people say they regret killing an unborn baby due to circumstances, like no birth control, having sex with many men (Maury, Springer types), but I honestly don't believe it. I know of several females growing up having multiple abortions and they were in their teens. Being promiscuous does not give you the right to kill babies because of an "oops". you made that decision to spread your snatch and you should keep the child as a reminder your own good feelings of ectasy comes at a price. I rather pay your fees for not killing the baby than rather see another soul killed without even having a chance, but the consequences of "oops" is your tubes getting tied until you deem fit to be a parent.

BedellBrave
02-24-2014, 05:36 PM
I have an interesting argument with my gf about it all the time. As I said, she is staunchly pro-choice, yet she recognizes the hypocrisy in being so.

Anyways, without going into it - I think I made some headway on her the other night. We were discussing abortion, and he mom was an OBGYN, and she is also considering being one. I asked her if her mom was pro-choice. She said that she was, but that she refused to perform an abortion. My gf said the exact same thing. I asked why, and she said "she didn't feel comfortable doing it."

Finally, it seemed like a light bulb went off. If you don't feel comfortable doing it, then it probably means that you think there is something "not right" about it. And it's not something as simple as killing a parasite. She agreed, and quickly changed the subject.


Good words sturg - I wish you well!

Oklahomahawk
02-24-2014, 05:38 PM
Exactly. Curious as to why that upsets you
That's exactly what my response was.

I'll give Bedell a break before he has an aneurism, here's the thing at least from my perspective, such as it is. As far as the statement, "my uterus is mine, bitch" goes, I couldn't agree more, a woman should have the right to say what does and does not go on in her body, but is that right, or any other right absolute? Will my 1st amendment right to free speech keep me from getting my ass kicked if I tell a Hell's Angel member he's ugly, stupid, AND he stinks?? Of course not, that freedom is conditional on other things like behavior. A woman has and should have every right in the world to decide what goes on in her body, but when she has sex without using one of the 913 different kinds of birth control available to women is she not both exercising her rights to determine what goes on in her body AND taking her rights to a place where she's not the only one involved anymore? I know you guys won't understand me on this any more than I can understand your "anything goes" attitude on this, but when she gets pregnant it isn't just her body anymore.

Now you can change the phrase "unborn infant" to fetus, parasite, loogie, inconvenient little bastard, or pretty much anything you choose to ease your consciences (if indeed anyone has those anymore) but it's still a child and all the "more illuminated and enlightened patrons of Master Science H. Logic" out there who have convinced themselves that it isn't a baby until it's born, or until it graduates from high school, or whatever criteria YOU set for it, can look down their "smarter than you" nose at people like me if they want, but the bottom line that you just can't get away from is that it is a freaking human being baby and snuffing it out just because you "aren't ready to be a parent" is murder, nothing less.

You guys can believe this or not, and since I'm not 100% in your camp on this I'm sure you won't, but IF it really were just the woman's uterus and there wasn't anyone (any other human) else involved except her and her right to her own reproductive rights I really would be right there with you, standing up for anyone trying to tell her what to do with her body, but once she chooses to act on those rights and have sex sans birth control she may get by with it or she may not, but once she gets pregnant it isn't just her anymore. It's like a woman claiming she has the right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness and jumping out of an airplane to prove that nobody can tell her what to do, then half way down she realizes her chute was improperly packed and she says she still has the right to life...... but she's still going to splat, unless she's over water in which case she's going to do a combination of splat/splash. I still wish her well and hope she survives but all the legislation and Supreme Court decisions in the world can't put her back up in that plane again.

Now for those who bring up rape, incest, life of the mother in danger, etc., those don't make me feel any better about abortions but I DO recognize those aren't the same exact situation as "oops, I forgot to make him use a condom" or whatever. I will happily sign off on allowing the abortions from the group I just mentioned if you guys will sign off on stopping all the "oops" cases. Deal??? Of course not, because you guys want a world full of rights, but totally devoid of consequences.

Speaking only for myself, my only concern in this matter is the life of the CHILD, you can call it by whatever name makes you feel better, but it's still a CHILD, if you could take the unborn child from the mother's womb during an abortion and place it into some sort of high-tech incubator then I would be 1000% totally fine with abortion. I have ZERO interest in trying to force a woman to not have her rights to her own body, but for the 87 bazillionth time, once she's pregnant it isn't just her body anymore.

And you guys know that "well you Republicans are only interested in those babies until they're born then you don't give a sh!t" line won't work on me because I'm likely even less popular in their club on any given day than I am in yours when I make statements like this.

OK, enjoy and have a nice evening, but when you're out there practicing those absolute freedoms don't forget to NOT yell fire in a crowded theater because for some reason the Supreme Court DID decide exercising those rights seemed to have negative effects on others' rights.

sturg33
02-24-2014, 05:38 PM
I always thought RP made the best argument with regards to abortion:

"Who are we to decide we can throw one baby in the trash, and then do everything we can to save a different baby."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MkAsLPrnJGc

The Chosen One
02-24-2014, 05:39 PM
I want gay marriage but I wouldn't feel comfortable having sex with another man.

Oklahomahawk
02-24-2014, 05:48 PM
I want gay marriage but I wouldn't feel comfortable having sex with another man.

yeah, I've stepped into enough fires (from the frying pan) this evening but while I would never tell two consenting adults what they could/couldn't do in the privacy of their own homes, let me ask you this, how many societies over time have allowed or even encouraged same sex marriage? Remember now we aren't talking about same-sex, well "sex", we're talking about marriage which has always been a sort of combination of the religious beliefs of the society involved (and those have certainly varied over the centuries) and the civil rules and regulations of the society involved?

How many? Which ones?

Oklahomahawk
02-24-2014, 05:55 PM
I always thought RP made the best argument with regards to abortion:

"Who are we to decide we can throw one baby in the trash, and then do everything we can to save a different baby."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MkAsLPrnJGc

Sorry sturg, this message won't fly, it deals too much with morality (and I mean real morality, not some political photo-op BS morality) and too little with being popular enough to get to sit at the cool kids table. Oh and while I'm on the Paul family, a line from Smokey and the Bandit (from the late great Jackie Gleason to the man playing his son in the movie) comes to mind regarding Ron and his offspring Rand, "There is no way, NO WAY, that you came from my loins!!!!

jpx7
02-24-2014, 05:57 PM
yeah, I've stepped into enough fires (from the frying pan) this evening but while I would never tell two consenting adults what they could/couldn't do in the privacy of their own homes, let me ask you this, how many societies over time have allowed or even encouraged same sex marriage? Remember now we aren't talking about same-sex, well "sex", we're talking about marriage which has always been a sort of combination of the religious beliefs of the society involved (and those have certainly varied over the centuries) and the civil rules and regulations of the society involved?

How many? Which ones?

Let me ask you this: how many societies over time have disallowed or even discouraged slavery? How many? Which ones?

Oklahomahawk
02-24-2014, 06:01 PM
Let me ask you this: how many societies over time have disallowed or even discouraged slavery? How many? Which ones?

The two have absolutely nothing to do with one another, but every society that we as humans would deem to be a great, noteworthy society throughout time, every single one of them were built on the back of slave labor. Now you can do a figure 8 and some 180's and maybe some other geometric maneuvers if you want, but if you do I can dig up some other silly BS practices those societies have that also have nothing to do with same sex relations and before long we'll have both forgotten what we started this conversation over. By the way, even though I'm not in favor of same sex "marriage' I am 100% in favor of civil unions, you can even call it civil-marriage if you want, with 100% of the same rights and guarantees, and I have even pledged to go along with any state that allows same sex marriage by a vote of the people. My stance has not changed.

jpx7
02-24-2014, 06:11 PM
The two have absolutely nothing to do with one another, but every society that we as humans would deem to be a great, noteworthy society throughout time, every single one of them were built on the back of slave labor. Now you can do a figure 8 and some 180's and maybe some other geometric maneuvers if you want, but if you do I can dig up some other silly BS practices those societies have that also have nothing to do with same sex relations and before long we'll have both forgotten what we started this conversation over. By the way, even though I'm not in favor of same sex "marriage' I am 100% in favor of civil unions, you can even call it civil-marriage if you want, with 100% of the same rights and guarantees, and I have even pledged to go along with any state that allows same sex marriage by a vote of the people. My stance has not changed.

My only point is I don't find historical precedent very germane to this conversation; as you say, we can "dig up [all sorts of] silly BS practices" from the past, but I don't think they're per se justifications for present policy.

Personally, as I've said before, I actually take a sort of sturg-esque position on this topic: I don't think the government should be in the business of any marriage, whether it be heterosexual, homosexual, cissexual, transsexual, pansexual, parasexual, ultrasexual, or catasexual.

Oklahomahawk
02-24-2014, 06:22 PM
My only point is I don't find historical precedent very germane to this conversation; as you say, we can "dig up [all sorts of] silly BS practices" from the past, but I don't think they're per se justifications for present policy.

Personally, as I've said before, I actually take a sort of sturg-esque position on this topic: I don't think the government should be in the business of any marriage, whether it be heterosexual, homosexual, cissexual, transsexual, pansexual, parasexual, ultrasexual, or catasexual.

I'm not crazy about the government getting involved either, especially not at the national level, but do the people of a state, county, or community not have at least some rights to decide what does/doesn't get practiced in their own community? It's a tough question to be sure. I've just been in too many discussions with the "anything goes crowd", when they hear a particular state is going to vote in favor of same sex marriage they're like, "yeah, democracy works, the will of the people rules!!! Isn't America great???" but then when the votes don't go their way they want to find a judge who'll vote to make it legal because it's "clearly a civil rights issue" and the government shouldn't be telling people what they can and can't do. It's really like the TEA party buffoons who hold up signs saying "keep your government hands off my medicare" not realizing that Medicare really is "government money" and therefore must pass through government hands. LOL

It's really just a matter IMO of "everybody wants what THEY want" and we're all guilty of that from time to time. We just don't see it that way when it's us and what we're after. Human nature I suppose.

I will say this, while I believe and stand for what I said about same sex marriage it's really not something I consider anything close to "epic". Stand up and hold you hand up as high as you can reach. That's where I consider abortions done only for birth control as far as importance goes, now lean down towards the floor and hold your hand about 6 inches off the floor. that's the importance level I place on same sex marriage. I feel the way I do about it and don't care if anyone else agrees or disagrees, but I don't lose any sleep over it one way or the other.

zitothebrave
02-24-2014, 06:53 PM
I think it is higher, like rape, incest, health to the mother. It depends on how they worded the question.

True. The wording is very important.

I personally take it very simply. If the baby can live on it's own outside of the womb, then no abortion. If it can't, then it's the mother's choice. Seems like around 22 weeks is the earliest.

Oklahomahawk
02-24-2014, 07:06 PM
True. The wording is very important.

I personally take it very simply. If the baby can live on it's own outside of the womb, then no abortion. If it can't, then it's the mother's choice. Seems like around 22 weeks is the earliest.

That's essentially what Roe v Wade says though almost nobody seems to realize it. It's not nearly as "anything goes" as anti-abortion folks think and it's certainly not as "anything goes" as the pro-choice folks think and it definitely DOES NOT allow partial birth abortions.

BedellBrave
02-24-2014, 07:35 PM
I want gay marriage but I wouldn't feel comfortable having sex with another man.


So you want women to be able have someone else mutilate innocent human children in their wombs, even though you being the one slicing the child up would make you too queazy?

BedellBrave
02-24-2014, 07:37 PM
Hey Hawk, thanks buddy.

The Chosen One
02-24-2014, 07:41 PM
So you want women to be able have someone else mutilate innocent human children in their wombs, even though you being the one slicing the child up would make you too queazy?
Tell me why politicians especially gop candidates running for office use the in the case of rape incest or mother's health verbiage?

sturg33
02-24-2014, 09:13 PM
Tell me why politicians especially gop candidates running for office use the in the case of rape incest or mother's health verbiage?

Cause politicians pander to what gets votes. I certainly wouldn't cite those cases as exceptions

Oklahomahawk
02-24-2014, 09:16 PM
Hey Hawk, thanks buddy.

:icon_biggrin:

BedellBrave
02-24-2014, 09:24 PM
Tell me why politicians especially gop candidates running for office use the in the case of rape incest or mother's health verbiage?


I asked first and you conveniently didn't answer.

BedellBrave
02-24-2014, 09:25 PM
:icon_biggrin:

Btw, that was an epic response - your earlier one.

goldfly
02-24-2014, 09:58 PM
as crazy as the stance is

i respect the ones that think the woman should give birth no matter how it was conceived over the ones that gives exceptions for it

weso1
02-25-2014, 01:26 AM
Tell me why politicians especially gop candidates running for office use the in the case of rape incest or mother's health verbiage?

Because it's compromise. I thought you guys wanted compromise? I guess not.

weso1
02-25-2014, 01:30 AM
as crazy as the stance is

i respect the ones that think the woman should give birth no matter how it was conceived over the ones that gives exceptions for it

Why do you respect the black and white position on this issue and not others?

sturg33
02-25-2014, 06:54 AM
Because it's compromise. I thought you guys wanted compromise? I guess not.

Well, we either believe it's a living human baby or we don't. Just because a mother is raped, doesn't mean the baby should be murdered.

yeezus
02-25-2014, 07:52 AM
So you want women to be able have someone else mutilate innocent human children in their wombs, even though you being the one slicing the child up would make you too queazy?

I don't understand the relevance here.
My gf is a RN, and the crap she tells me about, I would get queasy doing.
That doesn't mean I think no one should do it.

The Chosen One
02-25-2014, 08:47 AM
Because it's compromise. I thought you guys wanted compromise? I guess not.

Absolutely. But I thought with no exceptions was the actual movement

goldfly
02-25-2014, 09:12 AM
Why do you respect the black and white position on this issue and not others?

cause if you tell me it is a human and all life is a plan from God

then it means it was Gods plan for your father to rape you and have a baby

making up scenarios where the fetus/baby is more important than the others is weird if you are trying to tell me how precious they all are

weso1
02-25-2014, 10:10 AM
cause if you tell me it is a human and all life is a plan from God

then it means it was Gods plan for your father to rape you and have a baby

making up scenarios where the fetus/baby is more important than the others is weird if you are trying to tell me how precious they all are

Not everyone argues it that way though.

weso1
02-25-2014, 10:16 AM
Well, we either believe it's a living human baby or we don't. Just because a mother is raped, doesn't mean the baby should be murdered.

You can also argue that you simply don't know if it's a living baby. And since we don't know at the very least it would be nice to minimize abortion as much as possible. So it's rational to expect people to have a very good reason before they choose to abort a fetus. Rape, incest, etc. are some of those reasons. Irresponsibility, maybe not such a good reason.

Also, we all know abortion is here to stay and the extreme position of ending all abortions has very little chance of ever seeing the light of day. So in a more practical sense you're just trying to compromise, because it's better to potentially save thousands of lives than no lives at all isn't it?

sturg33
02-25-2014, 03:31 PM
I don't understand the relevance here.
My gf is a RN, and the crap she tells me about, I would get queasy doing.
That doesn't mean I think no one should do it.

I thought it went without saying, but I suppose that was giving you too much credit.

But the reason she "wouldn't feel right about doing it" was a moral issue, not a physical/ability/queasy issue

BedellBrave
02-25-2014, 05:06 PM
I don't understand the relevance here.
My gf is a RN, and the crap she tells me about, I would get queasy doing.
That doesn't mean I think no one should do it.


I guess you missed the "mutilate innocent human life" bit.

You guys are pieces of work.

BedellBrave
02-25-2014, 05:11 PM
You can also argue that you simply don't know if it's a living baby. And since we don't know at the very least it would be nice to minimize abortion as much as possible. So it's rational to expect people to have a very good reason before they choose to abort a fetus. Rape, incest, etc. are some of those reasons. Irresponsibility, maybe not such a good reason.

Also, we all know abortion is here to stay and the extreme position of ending all abortions has very little chance of ever seeing the light of day. So in a more practical sense you're just trying to compromise, because it's better to potentially save thousands of lives than no lives at all isn't it?


And here sadly are couple of other things we know: we all know that it is an innocent living human in the womb that is being killed and we pretty much all know that the pro-abortion folks don't want to compromise any.

BedellBrave
02-25-2014, 05:14 PM
cause if you tell me it is a human and all life is a plan from God

then it means it was Gods plan for your father to rape you and have a baby

making up scenarios where the fetus/baby is more important than the others is weird if you are trying to tell me how precious they all are


Well, I guess I can be grateful that you haven't trotted out your "parasite" line yet.

goldfly
02-25-2014, 07:00 PM
Not everyone argues it that way though.

no ****

goldfly
02-25-2014, 07:07 PM
Well, I guess I can be grateful that you haven't trotted out your "parasite" line yet.

Virginia Republican Says A Pregnant Woman Is Just A 'Host,'

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/02/24/steve-martin-virginia_n_4847959.html?utm_hp_ref=mostpopular

weso1
02-25-2014, 07:17 PM
Virginia Republican Says A Pregnant Woman Is Just A 'Host,'

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/02/24/steve-martin-virginia_n_4847959.html?utm_hp_ref=mostpopular

Host doesn't imply parasitism.

weso1
02-25-2014, 07:18 PM
no ****

Well, when you base your answer on only one specific argument then it makes one wonder.

goldfly
02-25-2014, 07:21 PM
Well, when you base your answer on only one specific argument then it makes one wonder.

well, when i speak about one type of view. i would venture to guess i am talking about that view

weso1
02-25-2014, 07:29 PM
well, when i speak about one type of view. i would venture to guess i am talking about that view

:Gasp:

yeezus
02-25-2014, 10:02 PM
I thought it went without saying, but I suppose that was giving you too much credit.

But the reason she "wouldn't feel right about doing it" was a moral issue, not a physical/ability/queasy issue

That's wonderful.
I wouldn't feel right about her having an abortion if she were to get pregnant, and I'm confident we would keep it. Personally, I wouldn't do it. I wouldn't feel right (about having an abortion, that is).
But not everyone is me, so, they can choose if they feel it's right for them.
I'm not even sure where I addressed you, but whatever. Carry on with your senseless, dense arguments. We all know you're great at that. Not something to be proud of.

yeezus
02-25-2014, 10:05 PM
I guess you missed the "mutilate innocent human life" bit.

You guys are pieces of work.

You said:

"So you want women to be able have someone else mutilate innocent human children in their wombs, even though you being the one slicing the child up would make you too queazy?"

So, you misspoke, I suppose, but what YOU said was "you slicing up the child would make you too queasy," meaning me (you) literally "slicing the child up" myself.

It's simple English. Not too difficult. Don't speak literally if you don't mean to, and use "one" instead of "you" appropriately.

BedellBrave
02-25-2014, 10:23 PM
You said:

"So you want women to be able have someone else mutilate innocent human children in their wombs, even though you being the one slicing the child up would make you too queazy?"

So, you misspoke, I suppose, but what YOU said was "you slicing up the child would make you too queasy," meaning me (you) literally "slicing the child up" myself.

It's simple English. Not too difficult. Don't speak literally if you don't mean to, and use "one" instead of "you" appropriately.


Thank you kind sir.

Oklahomahawk
02-25-2014, 10:29 PM
I'm sorry you guys but I had to report this exchange (oh and I apologize for the language):

http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/520/073/eb9.jpg

BedellBrave
02-25-2014, 10:37 PM
Nor soup sir.

Oklahomahawk
02-25-2014, 10:39 PM
Nor soup sir.

Seinfeld reference???

BedellBrave
02-25-2014, 10:40 PM
Is that where "Soup Nazi" is from?

Oklahomahawk
02-25-2014, 10:41 PM
Is that where "Soup Nazi" is from?

Yep

BedellBrave
02-25-2014, 10:47 PM
After-birth abortions (http://www.slate.com/articles/health_and_science/human_nature/2012/03/after_birth_abortion_the_pro_choice_case_for_infan ticide_.html) - well isn't this just peachy?

Oklahomahawk
02-25-2014, 10:51 PM
So, how's the world treating you this evening??? Did you guys get any of the snow from that storm last week?

Oklahomahawk
02-25-2014, 10:54 PM
After-birth abortions (http://www.slate.com/articles/health_and_science/human_nature/2012/03/after_birth_abortion_the_pro_choice_case_for_infan ticide_.html) - well isn't this just peachy?

I don't even know how to respond to that one, though I do have to agree with the author, "after birth abortion" at least sounds better (and less likely to get your arse thrown in prison) than that ticky tacky word infanticide!!!

I'm curious what our pro choice friends here have to say about the mischief the Dutch are up to these days.

goldfly
02-25-2014, 11:00 PM
Is that where "Soup Nazi" is from?

ate his soup one time when i was in NYC

it is really good

last time i checked, he still only opens during the winter though

which sucks

Oklahomahawk
02-25-2014, 11:02 PM
ate his soup one time when i was in NYC

it is really good

last time i checked, he still only opens during the winter though

which sucks

I didn't know the guy and his business weren't really real. I thought it was just something they made up for the show. I guess I should have known better, they weren't even creative enough to make up a plot most of the time, they just took those talented people and turned them loose and said "go and be funny while we film it".

By the way, if you don't mind my asking what kind of soup did you have from the SN?

goldfly
02-25-2014, 11:28 PM
I didn't know the guy and his business weren't really real. I thought it was just something they made up for the show. I guess I should have known better, they weren't even creative enough to make up a plot most of the time, they just took those talented people and turned them loose and said "go and be funny while we film it".

By the way, if you don't mind my asking what kind of soup did you have from the SN?


lobster bisque

i loved Seinfeld (the show, big fan of the person as well though)

Curb is more the "not making a plot" etc. Curb has an idea but it has no script

the "soup nazi" is just north of times square.

Oklahomahawk
02-26-2014, 06:16 PM
lobster bisque

i loved Seinfeld (the show, big fan of the person as well though)

Curb is more the "not making a plot" etc. Curb has an idea but it has no script

the "soup nazi" is just north of times square.


Wow, that sounds amazing!!! Even half-arsed done lobster bisque is good, I can just imagine how good it must have been coming from the soup nazi

BedellBrave
02-26-2014, 09:09 PM
So, how's the world treating you this evening??? Did you guys get any of the snow from that storm last week?


We got about 8 inches about 2 weeks ago. Most we've gotten in several years.

Oklahomahawk
02-26-2014, 10:07 PM
We got about 8 inches about 2 weeks ago. Most we've gotten in several years.

Wow, that's a bunch for you guys, of course that would be a bunch for us too. It's "snowed" 3 or 4 times this winter but I don't figure we've actually accumulated more than about 1 maybe 1 1/2 inches total. It's been so close to use so many times but we've just missed out on it. I'm more than ready for Spring but if we were to get a snow day I could probably get over it. :)

sturg33
02-27-2014, 12:36 AM
That's wonderful.
I wouldn't feel right about her having an abortion if she were to get pregnant, and I'm confident we would keep it. Personally, I wouldn't do it. I wouldn't feel right (about having an abortion, that is).
But not everyone is me, so, they can choose if they feel it's right for them.
I'm not even sure where I addressed you, but whatever. Carry on with your senseless, dense arguments. We all know you're great at that. Not something to be proud of.

What is my 'senseless, dense argument' in this case?

AerchAngel
02-27-2014, 10:16 AM
What is my 'senseless, dense argument' in this case?

Snowfall right now on ground is well over 2 feet and in some place 3 1/2 feet to 4 feet, drifts over my head of 6' and some change.

We just got a new dog and we can't see her and that is how high the snow is and she is a big dog.

50PoundHead
02-27-2014, 10:27 AM
I'm thinking of posting a couple of pics from my driveway. We had ten inches of snow last Friday and it's been below zero (-16 this morning) since. We're used to it up here in Minnesota, but this has been a horrid winter here by our standards. That said, it has probably been more harrowing in the South where the infrastructure and support simply aren't built for the kind of weather they've had.

AerchAngel
02-27-2014, 10:42 AM
I'm thinking of posting a couple of pics from my driveway. We had ten inches of snow last Friday and it's been below zero (-16 this morning) since. We're used to it up here in Minnesota, but this has been a horrid winter here by our standards. That said, it has probably been more harrowing in the South where the infrastructure and support simply aren't built for the kind of weather they've had.

We went to Rochester yesterday to pick up our new dog. At first I didn't think you all got hit like we did until I got intotdown. Most porches couldn't be seen. Drifts were over my head. It was ugly.

But not compared to the drive, Eau Claire to Rochester is a drive I rather not ever have to do again, it was awful.

50PoundHead
02-27-2014, 11:06 AM
We went to Rochester yesterday to pick up our new dog. At first I didn't think you all got hit like we did until I got intotdown. Most porches couldn't be seen. Drifts were over my head. It was ugly.

But not compared to the drive, Eau Claire to Rochester is a drive I rather not ever have to do again, it was awful.

Did you take 94 into the Twin Cities and go south on 52 or did you angle down to LaCrosse and take 90 West? I agree that if you take the angle, it's a real b*tch of a drive.

AerchAngel
02-27-2014, 11:16 AM
Did you take 94 into the Twin Cities and go south on 52 or did you angle down to LaCrosse and take 90 West? I agree that if you take the angle, it's a real b*tch of a drive.

I took US 10 to Durand and then to Wabasha, from there to Rochester was pure hell. It reminded me of Germany and it's windy roads, but these had snow on them still.

50PoundHead
02-27-2014, 02:39 PM
I've made that drive once or twice and it's horrible.

AerchAngel
02-27-2014, 03:49 PM
I've made that drive once or twice and it's horrible.

Closest to being white I'd ever been going down those snow covered hills.

I had white knuckles gripping the steering wheel.