The petering out of "new atheism" or how Dawkins is so yesterday

[BedellBrave]

Well, that didn't take too long (http://www.spectator.co.uk/features/8885481/after-the-new-atheism/).

Interesting article. And I think, a win for anti-fundamentalism.

[The Chosen One]

Why do Christians fear Atheists?

[AerchAngel]

Why do Christians fear Atheists?

A better question is.....why do Atheists fear Christianity? And to further it more than Islam?

[The Chosen One]

A better question is.....why do Atheists fear Christianity? And to further it more than Islam?
Because athiests do not want Christian laws nor Sharia laws. Athiests don't care about gay marriage and are not actively trying to constitutional ban it.

Atheists just wish the Christian right would stop politicizing religion into politics. Separation of church and state.

[goldfly]

A better question is.....why do Atheists fear Christianity? And to further it more than Islam?

that isn't a better question

[AerchAngel]

that isn't a better question

That is your opinion, which means nada to me.

[AerchAngel]

Because athiests do not want Christian laws nor Sharia laws. Athiests don't care about gay marriage and are not actively trying to constitutional ban it.

Atheists just wish the Christian right would stop politicizing religion into politics. Separation of church and state.

And that could be swung the other way around asking the left to quit telling Christians (left and right) what they can and cannot accept or submit to their rules. There are plethora of blacks on the left wishing their own party to quit forcing them to accept laws they do not agree with.

I love this quote...so who politicizing it: "“The sense I have is blacks are tired of being lobbied or targeted. They’ve kind of turned back on some of the advocates and lobbyists and are asking, ‘Why don’t you get some Republicans?’” one high-level Democratic insider said Friday." (http://americablog.com/2013/05/illinois-fails-to-pass-gay-marriage-bill-black-caucus-a-problem.html)

You see how that works?

[The Chosen One]

And that could be swung the other way around asking the left to quit telling Christians (left and right) what they can and cannot accept or submit to their rules. There are plethora of blacks on the left wishing their own party to quit forcing them to accept laws they do not agree with.

I love this quote...so who politicizing it: "“The sense I have is blacks are tired of being lobbied or targeted. They’ve kind of turned back on some of the advocates and lobbyists and are asking, ‘Why don’t you get some Republicans?’” one high-level Democratic insider said Friday." (http://americablog.com/2013/05/illinois-fails-to-pass-gay-marriage-bill-black-caucus-a-problem.html)

You see how that works?

Except it's not the same AA.

We are supposed to have separation between church and state for a reason. Look at the debacle that almost happened in AZ and last week Kansas.

Atheism isn't a religion, it's a status.

There is no following or preaching, it's simply I do not believe in god. There is no organized book or constitution, it's just being it.

I'm not actually an atheist, although it is very troubling to me how many people kill and fight in the name of god. I asked a very very conservative woman jesusaholic that used to be one of my teachers, if 9 innocent children and women die because we drone and go for 1 guy, is it worth the 9 other innocent deaths? She said "As a Christian, I pray we fight them over there so it isn't fought on our homeland". The land of the free and the brave, drone strike and kill 9 innocent kids because of 1 person, that's acceptable? She finally said yes. You want to be pro-life for a fetus, and at the same time be OK with killing innocents around the world...

Very very troubling logic.

[goldfly]

keith

you know the road it is going down

first of all, he didn't answer the question and he then changed the topic and asked his own question

then bedell is going to come in and say atheism is a religion and we all must submit to it etc etc etc etc

[AerchAngel]

Except it's not the same AA.

We are supposed to have separation between church and state for a reason. Look at the debacle that almost happened in AZ and last week Kansas.

Atheism isn't a religion, it's a status.

There is no following or preaching, it's simply I do not believe in god. There is no organized book or constitution, it's just being it.


Then act like Dalyn and just ignore both sets of Christians on left and right and their politicking. He does a great job and if you are an Atheist, follow his lead. He is a person I like and trust and we are on the opposite side in religion and I don't tell him what he should think nor he does it to me unlike you all.

[The Chosen One]

keith

you know the road it is going down

first of all, he didn't answer the question and he then changed the topic and asked his own question

then bedell is going to come in and say atheism is a religion and we all must submit to it etc etc etc etc

I've considered going into atheism, because I do not like dictatorships, and any religion that says you have to submit to a specific person or you will not be rewarded is a dictatorship. When good things happen, everyone thanks god, when bad stuff happens nobody says anything or "this is god's path for me". When my aunt was laying in bed dying of cancer and could no longer speak, and my mom was on phone crying for 3 hours, should I thank god for giving all that pain to my mom and her sister? Not to mention they're devout catholics, so the fact they'd have to experience so much torment because of "god's will" is a sick joke. If he really was all-knowing, controlling, and held all the cards, then he plays some sick tricks. People starving everywhere around the world becuse they were born in s---holes and poverty. Yet we thank god because we were "blessed" to be born in America and enjoy the rewards of living here.

What a sick joke!

[AerchAngel]

keith

you know the road it is going down

first of all, he didn't answer the question and he then changed the topic and asked his own question

then bedell is going to come in and say atheism is a religion and we all must submit to it etc etc etc etc

Atheism is not a religion, but a belief, also Bedell never told anyone here to submit and if he did, shame on him, but I do know, you all want all the Right or Christians to submit or accept your beliefs, that is the standard MO on here.

[AerchAngel]

I've considered going into atheism, because I do not like dictatorships, and any religion that says you have to submit to a specific person or you will not be rewarded is a dictatorship. When good things happen, everyone thanks god, when bad stuff happens nobody says anything or "this is god's path for me". When my aunt was laying in bed dying of cancer and could no longer speak, and my mom was on phone crying for 3 hours, should I thank god for giving all that pain to my mom and her sister? Not to mention they're devout catholics, so the fact they'd have to experience so much torment because of "god's will" is a sick joke. If he really was all-knowing, controlling, and held all the cards, then he plays some sick tricks. People starving everywhere around the world becuse they were born in s---holes and poverty. Yet we thank god because we were "blessed" to be born in America and enjoy the rewards of living here.

What a sick joke!

Who said you have to submit? I do not submit to any religion, because I don't believe in them, never have really. That is why I not a part of any church. I go to church, but I do not belong to a church. This misnomer that if you go to church you are devoted to religion is hogwash.

Things happen in this world, nothing has been foreordain, it just happens and you are the one that make decisions on what happens to you like drunk driving, drug overdose, using a weapon to kill. No one made you do it, you did it yourself and God, Satan or Casper the friendly ghost has no bearing on that.

[weso1]

Why do Christians fear Atheists?

I don't think all christians fear it but some do.

Because it directly challenges their faith and hope in something.

[AerchAngel]

I don't think all christians fear it but some do.

Because it directly challenges their faith and hope in something.

That is why I did the reverse, some atheists fear that God is real and they will spend eternity in Hell because they never believe.

That would definitely scare me.

But in the end, each person is responsible for themselves and believe what they want, just don't tell me what to believe and not to believe and we are square. There has to be respect on both sides and we definitely do not have this on this board and the left is worse at than the right. I do not tell you all what to believe but by golly you try to tell me what I need to accept or submit to.

[jpx7]

and the left is worse at than the right

Each side always says that.

[jpx7]

That is why I did the reverse, some atheists fear that God is real and they will spend eternity in Hell because they never believe.

As someone who is more frightened of the oblivion that I believe meets us at death than any other spiritual/intellectual fate, this is one atheist that believes "Hell" is a hopeful proposition—sort of like how Stanley Kubrick believed all ghost stories were inherently optimistic.

But, having spoken with a lot of atheists—most much more passionate than I am about the whole thing—I really do not believe many at all "fear that God is real and they will spend eternity in Hell because they never believe". It's more that they fear (and I'm paraphrasing the thoughts of others here, and not my own) that so many humans could be so ignorant to the obvious rationality of divine absence.

[AerchAngel]

Each side always says that.

Not really, when I say I am against gay marriage (religious, not government) or against abortion, all the left come on here and trash me and say I must accept it and they are right, but I never tell them that they should accept that gay marriage is wrong in a religious sense or that abortion is murder. You all like to label and force people to your way of thinking, I would not do such a thing, I try to respect people opinions but you all cannot even do that. It is either your way or no way, there is no compromising while I try to compromise and have.

[BedellBrave]

Why do Christians fear Atheists?


I don't. I even consider a few as friends - particularly a couple of the guys on here.

[BedellBrave]

Except it's not the same AA.

We are supposed to have separation between church and state for a reason. Look at the debacle that almost happened in AZ and last week Kansas.

Atheism isn't a religion, it's a status.

There is no following or preaching, it's simply I do not believe in god. There is no organized book or constitution, it's just being it.

I'm not actually an atheist, although it is very troubling to me how many people kill and fight in the name of god. I asked a very very conservative woman jesusaholic that used to be one of my teachers, if 9 innocent children and women die because we drone and go for 1 guy, is it worth the 9 other innocent deaths? She said "As a Christian, I pray we fight them over there so it isn't fought on our homeland". The land of the free and the brave, drone strike and kill 9 innocent kids because of 1 person, that's acceptable? She finally said yes. You want to be pro-life for a fetus, and at the same time be OK with killing innocents around the world...

Very very troubling logic.


Balderdash.

[BedellBrave]

Anyone actually interested in engaging in a discussion of the article?

[57Brave]

Who knew "atheism" ever petered in?

[AerchAngel]

I don't. I even consider a few as friends - particularly a couple of the guys on here.

Exactly and Dalyn being one of my favorites here is one. I do not see him forcing his way of thinking down our throat. I do not force my thinking down your throat, I will give my opinion and that is it.

[BedellBrave]

Who knew "atheism" ever petered in?


This new form has been fairly popular in the West over the past decade or so.

[AerchAngel]

Anyone actually interested in engaging in a discussion of the article?

They have no interest. They want you to submit to their way of thinking and that his how sheep operates or better yet Church of Scientology methods of brainwashing.

[weso1]

I've considered going into atheism, because I do not like dictatorships, and any religion that says you have to submit to a specific person or you will not be rewarded is a dictatorship. When good things happen, everyone thanks god, when bad stuff happens nobody says anything or "this is god's path for me". When my aunt was laying in bed dying of cancer and could no longer speak, and my mom was on phone crying for 3 hours, should I thank god for giving all that pain to my mom and her sister? Not to mention they're devout catholics, so the fact they'd have to experience so much torment because of "god's will" is a sick joke. If he really was all-knowing, controlling, and held all the cards, then he plays some sick tricks. People starving everywhere around the world becuse they were born in s---holes and poverty. Yet we thank god because we were "blessed" to be born in America and enjoy the rewards of living here.

What a sick joke!

How exactly does one go into atheism? Is there some fee you have to pay or something? What's wrong with being agnostic these days and just admitting that you don't know? It's like we passed over agnosticism and went directly into a faith for non believers. Are the meetings held in some hip downtown metrosexual coffee shop?

[BedellBrave]

Exactly and Dalyn being one of my favorites here is one. I do not see him forcing his way of thinking down our throat. I do not force my thinking down your throat, I will give my opinion and that is it.


Agreed. I both respect and like Dalyn.

[AerchAngel]

Bedel this is the gist of it:

"What, if anything, do these newer atheists have to say? In previous generations, the atheist was keen to insist that non-believers can be just as moral as believers. These days, this is more or less taken for granted. What distinguishes the newer atheist is his admission that non-believers can be just as immoral as believers. Rejecting religion is no sure path to virtue; it is more likely to lead to complacent self-regard, or ideological arrogance."

Speaking of Dalyn, about 7 years ago we had a terrible fight and it was because of this bold line here. He said I had a pompous attitude about how Atheists were all bad but he was right that Atheists can be a righteous as Christians but the only distinction is they don't believe in God and it is not God's will. I fought him and lost because both believers and non believers can be good and now they come to accept they can be bad as well. Dalyn said this a long time ago that they are no different than Christians in any scope of life and I was too pig headed to see the truth at that time.

Because of that mutual respect we are friends today because he told me to open my eyes and accept all flaws in everyone and who am I to judge them? Sorry that there are people on this board who do not have his candid ability to accept who you as you are. I accept people here, their flaws in thinking and all, but they won't accept me and that is fine by me.

[Gary82]

That is why I did the reverse, some atheists fear that God is real and they will spend eternity in Hell because they never believe.


I find it hard to believe that an atheist would fear Hell, Hades, or any form of afterlife designed for eternal damnation. In the mind of an atheist, Hell is a fairy tale. It would be the same thing as fearing the boogey man.

Those who fear it are at best agnostics.

[weso1]

Anyone actually interested in engaging in a discussion of the article?

I have no clue if it's true what the author is saying about their truly being a shift toward a less arrogant and more understanding version of atheism. But if he's right then it's a positive step for the atheism religion and bad news for theism folks. A more accessible and kindler gentler version of atheism could attract new members, people who are turned off by what at times feels like a majority of assholes who lead the atheist point of view.

[AerchAngel]

I find it hard to believe that an atheist would fear Hell, Hades, or any form of afterlife designed for eternal damnation. In the mind of an atheist, Hell is a fairy tale. It would be the same thing as fearing the boogey man.

Those who fear it are at best agnostics.

Not saying you would, but some could fear that God could be real and they made it their life's journey to ignore Him. I only have one fear in life, one and has nothing to do with religion, so that question is moot for me. You can believe what you want how you want, just don't push that BS on any side my way.

Bedell, the article is good, but the comments are better. There are some bitter people on both sides of the aisles, some good stuff there.

[jpx7]

You all like to label and force people to your way of thinking, I would not do such a thing

Says the poster making gross, blanket generalizations about one "side" ...

Also: for the record, I can't recall a single poster advocating that religious organizations should be forced into marrying homosexuals. Certainly, at least, I haven't, which undercuts your repeated use of "you all".

[weso1]

Anyone actually interested in engaging in a discussion of the article?

I have no clue if it's true what the author is saying about there truly being a shift toward a less arrogant and more understanding version of atheism. But if he's right then it's a positive step for the atheism religion and bad news for theism folks. A more accessible and kindler gentler version of atheism could attract new members, people who are turned off by what at times feels like a majority of assholes who lead the atheist point of view.

[Gary82]

Not saying you would, but some could fear that God could be real and they made it their life's journey to ignore Him.

I would equate that fear to a Christian fearing that maybe the Muslims were right, or the Jews, or Hindus, or Buddah, or Ancient Greek mytholgy, L Ron Hubbard.

[Dalyn]

That is why I did the reverse, some atheists fear that God is real and they will spend eternity in Hell because they never believe.


If they do, they aren't really atheists. Not a moment of my day is wasted worrying about hell.

And this new atheist thing is just something the media put out there and some people tried to make money off it, and a few others started talking about it because they thought it made them hipsters. The only thing new is that people started listening after 9/11. This isn't about Christianity or Islam or any other religion (on its own). It is about religion. Period.

[Gary82]

I have no clue if it's true what the author is saying about their truly being a shift toward a less arrogant and more understanding version of atheism. But if he's right then it's a positive step for the atheism religion and bad news for theism folks. A more accessible and kindler gentler version of atheism could attract new members, people who are turned off by what at times feels like a majority of assholes who lead the atheist point of view.

The problem with atheism is the same problem with religion. Certainty. That can at times breed arrogance. If atheists are turning more understanding and accepting, then their numbers will shoot up. My generation is already turned off to the church.

[AerchAngel]

But if he's right then it's a positive step for the atheism religion and bad news for theism folks.

Dalyn is a prime example. He is not arrogant, he's willing to listen and even engaged in talk. He has his faults and would admit it, which other Atheists I deal with didn't/don't. Dalyn would say you were wrong but will not poke his finger in your chest and tell you that you are wrong but would rationalize it, a lot of them would rather stick a knife in your chest and watch you bleed to death.

The religious nuts would brow beat you. Since I am not a religious nut nor I would brow beat you, even Bedell wouldn't do that and he is of clergy. The Muslims is another can of worms, they would probably kill an atheist where they stand and that would be the end of it, if they even utter there were no allah, they would be riddled with bullets. Christians for the most part would say okay and get into a good argument about it.

[AerchAngel]

If they do, they aren't really atheists. Not a moment of my day is wasted worrying about hell.

And this new atheist thing is just something the media put out there and some people tried to make money off it, and a few others started talking about it because they thought it made them hipsters. The only thing new is that people started listening after 9/11. This isn't about Christianity or Islam or any other religion (on its own). It is about religion. Period.


I think you took it out of context, I am saying if they were wrong (not saying either way), by bible description this is a possibility, something about if you don't know me, I don't know you and where you will end up.



I can't see a Christian fearing an atheist because if he did he is no Christian to be honest, because he has betrayed his belief.

[weso1]

Mod, please forgive me for I hath sinned. I am sorry for my accidental double post whilest trying to edit it.

[Dalyn]

Dalyn is a prime example. He is not arrogant, he's willing to listen and even engaged in talk. He has his faults and would admit it, which other Atheists I deal with didn't/don't. Dalyn would say you were wrong but will not poke his finger in your chest and tell you that you are wrong but would rationalize it, a lot of them would rather stick a knife in your chest and watch you bleed to death.

The religious nuts would brow beat you. Since I am not a religious nut nor I would brow beat you, even Bedell wouldn't do that and he is of clergy. The Muslims is another can of worms, they would probably kill an atheist where they stand and that would be the end of it, if they even utter there were no allah, they would be riddled with bullets. Christians for the most part would say okay and get into a good argument about it.

Moving out of the south helped my approach. I was a lot more defensive AND offensive a decade ago when I had to deal with this **** in my daily life. I am a lot less emotional about it, which always helps in regards to reason and debate. Sometimes I feel like I've lost passion--tired of it all--and I consider that a flaw.

[AerchAngel]

The problem with atheism is the same problem with religion. Certainty. That can at times breed arrogance. If atheists are turning more understanding and accepting, then their numbers will shoot up. My generation is already turned off to the church.


It has already shot up, just people don't talk about it.

And your first statement has nailed it. No one is certain, only those who believe/non believe is more important to that answer as either side can't really answer that question nor shouldn't or you would go insane figuring it out. Live your life the way you want and be respectful toward others. You don't have to agree with and respect their opinions. Both Atheists and Christians can do this instead of fighting. If those who want to not believe that is their choice and vice-versa, there is no need to fear what the other is doing or saying, you are responsible for live here on Earth and those you touch.

[Dalyn]

The problem with atheism is the same problem with religion. Certainty. That can at times breed arrogance. If atheists are turning more understanding and accepting, then their numbers will shoot up. My generation is already turned off to the church.

There is very little--perhaps nothing--I am certain about.

[57Brave]

I can't see a Christian fearing an atheist because if he did he is no Christian to be honest, because he has betrayed his belief.

That being the case, what is the point of this thread/discussion?

[jpx7]

"Rejecting religion is no sure path to virtue; it is more likely to lead to complacent self-regard, or ideological arrogance."

I entirely agree with the first part of the claim; I am very skeptical of the second part. I don't think ardent atheism is any "more likely to lead to complacent self-regard, or ideological arrogance" than ardent theism: it's this utter faith in absolutes, whichever way it swings, that in my mind leads to "complacent self-regard, or ideological arrogance."

[AerchAngel]

There is very little--perhaps nothing--I am certain about.

You see, a simple yet powerful answer to a very difficult question.

Who can argue against that without it being exhaustive and counter productive?

[AerchAngel]

I entirely agree with the first part of the claim; I am very skeptical of the second part. I don't think ardent atheism is any "more likely to lead to complacent self-regard, or ideological arrogance" than ardent theism: it's this utter faith in absolutes, whichever way it swings, that in my mind leads to "complacent self-regard, or ideological arrogance."

I kind of agree with that last line. It is absolutes and no one can say they are right or wrong and this will be debated until our deaths, but since noone I know of credence died and came back and told it all in the present day, we won't know and go by our innate instinct.

[AerchAngel]

That being the case, what is the point of this thread/discussion?

Because it can. Some good stuff in here. There is no finger pointing or Church of Scientology brainwashing going on.

[Dalyn]

Well, that didn't take too long (http://www.spectator.co.uk/features/8885481/after-the-new-atheism/).

Interesting article. And I think, a win for anti-fundamentalism.

"A polemical approach to religion has swung out of fashion. In fact, admitting that religion is complicated has become a mark of sophistication."

This kind of thing is just silly (and kind of disgusting). It's what I meant about the hipsters. I hope the article is right (and the hipsters start calling themselves agnostic again or Buddhist or whatever has some signs that make great shirts or tattoos).

[AerchAngel]

"A polemical approach to religion has swung out of fashion. In fact, admitting that religion is complicated has become a mark of sophistication."

This kind of thing is just silly (and kind of disgusting). It's what I meant about the hipsters. I hope the article is right (and the hipsters start calling themselves agnostic again or Buddhist or whatever has some signs that make great shirts or tattoos).

A pied piper approach to be heard, perhaps?

[Dalyn]

A pied piper approach to be heard, perhaps?

I don't know. It's like they showed up in the middle of a war with some nice shiny new uniforms and declared war, spent a weekend or three playing poker in the jungle, and then declared the war so yesterday and ran back home.

[Dalyn]

I also think it's funny how the article points out that certain social changes makes some of the things "new atheists" talked about no longer valid. That means they were heard and changes were made. How is THAT a bad thing (for so-called new atheists)? :happy0157:

[AerchAngel]

I don't know. It's like they showed up in the middle of a war with some nice shiny new uniforms and declared war, spent a weekend or three playing poker in the jungle, and then declared the war so yesterday and ran back home.

We have a rapidly changing and challenging world so they must come up with a new way to spread the news. I guess this is what they came up with.

It really wasn't needed unless they are scared of something...maybe control? It is not like you all need it, all atheists aren't the same.

[Dalyn]

We have a rapidly changing and challenging world so they must come up with a new way to spread the news. I guess this is what they came up with.

It really wasn't needed unless they are scared of something...maybe control? It is not like you all need it, all atheists aren't the same.

Dude. Religion (around the world) IS scary.

[AerchAngel]

Dude. Religion (around the world) IS scary.

Thanks for ruining my next post. It was centered on this. :facepalm:

[Dalyn]

Thanks for ruining my next post. It was centered on this. :facepalm:

Go ahead. Don't let me stop you. I'm sure it'll be worth reading.

[AerchAngel]

Go ahead. Don't let me stop you. I'm sure it'll be worth reading.

The world is changing and certain religions are losing their members, the Atheists are gaining members, Islam is getting scarier, the Christians are becoming more protective of their laws and eventually something is going to clash and we are seeing the results. Reading the article and Dalyns posts, I am seeing something here akin to funneling all Atheists into one group to have the same mind concept which I don't think Dalyn agrees with. This will take away individualism that Atheists enjoys.

If I am mistaken I am sorry, but I agree that religion is becoming more scary and to think the ones on this board think the religious right is scary even though they are protecting life (abortion) or standing up to a principality (religious marriage and rights) but not out there causing war because someone thinks differently. Eventually those who want everyone to accept and submit will win, but what will they fight next, to abolish religion all-together, make it a crime to go against your government?

Turbulent times are here to stay and I do not know where this will go, but it will be beyond my lifetime to see the end game.

[weso1]

"A polemical approach to religion has swung out of fashion. In fact, admitting that religion is complicated has become a mark of sophistication."

This kind of thing is just silly (and kind of disgusting). It's what I meant about the hipsters. I hope the article is right (and the hipsters start calling themselves agnostic again or Buddhist or whatever has some signs that make great shirts or tattoos).

Atheist denominations are beginning to appear.

[zitothebrave]

Balderdash.

WEll it would depend on what one would define a religion as.

Typically religion is defined as belief in a god or gods. But some define it as a group with the same/similar idea.

[Dalyn]

Atheist denominations are beginning to appear.

:roll: I am sure the media will try that approach now and someone will try to make money off it. Good luck to them.

[weso1]

:roll: I am sure the media will try that approach now and someone will try to make money off it. Good luck to them.

It's unavoidable as atheism continues to grow, imo. There will be many different denominations. You will be considered a fundamentalist although you will hate the term.

In the year 3000!

[Dalyn]

It's unavoidable as atheism continues to grow, imo. There will be many different denominations. You will be considered a fundamentalist although you will hate the term.

In the year 3000!

If I am alive in the year 3000, they can call me whatever the **** they want.

[Dalyn]

I'll just hang with Jonnie Goodboy Tyler. The rest will take care of itself.

[The Chosen One]

Well like Al Pacino says in Stand Up Guys, they say you die twice. Once when you take your last breathe and the second time when the last person utters your name.

If in the year 3000 someone is still talking about me I know I did good.

[Dalyn]

Well like Al Pacino says in Stand Up Guys, they say you die twice. Once when you take your last breathe and the second time when the last person utters your name.

If in the year 3000 someone is still talking about me I know I did good.

Or REALLY bad.

[The Chosen One]

Or REALLY bad.
If I wanted to kill you you'd be dead already. :Alone:

[The Chosen One]

The only gods atheists believe in are the baseball gods. With that said the Braves are in the heart of the bible belt. Christian god sure has been tickling him self screwing us over.

[Mrs. Meta]

Oh, religion...oh, atheism!

Spose you could say I have an interesting relationship with both.

As a kid, I was given a multitude of blessings and promises that my cerebral palsy would be healed (hey, it still might! :cooter:), but the older I got, the more I realized as a very distinct (and probable) possibility is that I will probably be bearing this cross for the rest of my mortal ministry, as my church likes to put it. Hellz, even some of my leaders there have told me the same thing I've thought, "jared, you might not be healed in this life, but if you can endure, I know beyond a shadow of a doubt that great blessings await you in the next life!" <<< paraphrased.

So yeah, I have faith yet still, but mainly because the alternative (LOL HOLY ****, JUST GONNA WORSE BRAH, TILL YA DIE N THEN *POOF* OBLIVIONLOL!) is a little less than jake, if you will. The strange about that (again, very plausible) alternative, is that what Jpx7 spoke of fearing, well...I really do not. I mean, I'm not about to seek death, but the way I see it is, when I die, I will either get sweet relief from the harsh realities of this life and meet my maker, or...get some said relief as I evaporate into nothingness...or something.

It would really be so easy (and it is so very tempting) for me to be like "whelp, divine intervention ain't bailing me out - gotta just deal with what I've been dealtlol!" and just completely deny (while simultaneously removing the mental burden of possible healing) what according to our reality, is pretty much impossible.

Anyway, point is, I feel sorta torn between two lovers in regards to faith and atheism. My situation (speaking solely for myself) pretty much necessitates that I believe that there's a chance (thank you, jim carrey!) or a greater purpose to what I was dealt. On the other side of the coin, though, that isn't how I cope; I cope by realizing my reality and at least trying to make the best of it everyday...and whatever happens (or doesn't), I feel like Imma ready for it.

Sorry, if I come across as preachy or whatever, but in reading this thread, just sorta donned on me that I seem to be straddling a line between atheism and religion on pretty much a daily basis.

Carry on, ya'll.

[Oklahomahawk]

Science H. Logic folks, if you guys could use all this nervous energy for something constructive who knows what we might be able to accomplish??? Uggghhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[AerchAngel]

Oh, religion...oh, atheism!

Spose you could say I have an interesting relationship with both.

As a kid, I was given a multitude of blessings and promises that my cerebral palsy would be healed (hey, it still might! :cooter:), but the older I got, the more I realized as a very distinct (and probable) possibility is that I will probably be bearing this cross for the rest of my mortal ministry, as my church likes to put it. Hellz, even some of my leaders there have told me the same thing I've thought, "jared, you might not be healed in this life, but if you can endure, I know beyond a shadow of a doubt that great blessings await you in the next life!" <<< paraphrased.

So yeah, I have faith yet still, but mainly because the alternative (LOL HOLY ****, JUST GONNA WORSE BRAH, TILL YA DIE N THEN *POOF* OBLIVIONLOL!) is a little less than jake, if you will. The strange about that (again, very plausible) alternative, is that what Jpx7 spoke of fearing, well...I really do not. I mean, I'm not about to seek death, but the way I see it is, when I die, I will either get sweet relief from the harsh realities of this life and meet my maker, or...get some said relief as I evaporate into nothingness...or something.

It would really be so easy (and it is so very tempting) for me to be like "whelp, divine intervention ain't bailing me out - gotta just deal with what I've been dealtlol!" and just completely deny (while simultaneously removing the mental burden of possible healing) what according to our reality, is pretty much impossible.

Anyway, point is, I feel sorta torn between two lovers in regards to faith and atheism. My situation (speaking solely for myself) pretty much necessitates that I believe that there's a chance (thank you, jim carrey!) or a greater purpose to what I was dealt. On the other side of the coin, though, that isn't how I cope; I cope by realizing my reality and at least trying to make the best of it everyday...and whatever happens (or doesn't), I feel like Imma ready for it.

Sorry, if I come across as preachy or whatever, but in reading this thread, just sorta donned on me that I seem to be straddling a line between atheism and religion on pretty much a daily basis.

Carry on, ya'll.

You would make Job proud.

[Mrs. Meta]

You would make Job proud.

Hey, that's my job!

...:icwudt:

Thank you, though - really.

[Dalyn]

If I wanted to kill you you'd be dead already. :Alone:

https://scontent-b-iad.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/t1/p403x403/1978624_754565754567788_1083852987_n.jpg

I guess this should remind us all that death is coming for us, one **** at a time.

[Oklahomahawk]

https://scontent-b-iad.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/t1/p403x403/1978624_754565754567788_1083852987_n.jpg

I guess this should remind us all that death is coming for us, one **** at a time.

Hey don't scoff, that other Keith Lockhart single handedly killed the Braves offense for at least 5 years, taking out one person would be a piece of cake.

[Dalyn]

Hey don't scoff, that other Keith Lockhart single handedly killed the Braves offense for at least 5 years, taking out one person would be a piece of cake.

"I help, yes?"

http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/board/attachments/ootp-mods-rosters-photos-quick-starts/148395d1237827899-gambo-t_wil1-photo-vinny_castilla.jpg

[Oklahomahawk]

"I help, yes?"

http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/board/attachments/ootp-mods-rosters-photos-quick-starts/148395d1237827899-gambo-t_wil1-photo-vinny_castilla.jpg

I'd rather have Vinny out there than that other Lockhart, heck I'd rather have our Lockhart out there than that other Lockhart

[Oklahomahawk]

If I am alive in the year 3000, they can call me whatever the **** they want.

I'll remind you of that!!!

[The Chosen One]

Hey don't scoff, that other Keith Lockhart single handedly killed the Braves offense for at least 5 years, taking out one person would be a piece of cake.

Are you TRYING to get banned?

Is that your MO right now?

[BedellBrave]

WEll it would depend on what one would define a religion as.

Typically religion is defined as belief in a god or gods. But some define it as a group with the same/similar idea.


For instance, certain forms of Buddhism can be considered atheistic, so an exclusively "religion=belief in god/gods" is, imho, an overly Western and insufficient, though common, definition.

Btw, there are atheist "churches" popping up all over the place. Isn't that interesting - this pull to form congregations and services modeled after the practices of Christianity. The early Hazel Motes (character in Flannery O'Connor's Wise Blood) would have been proud!

[BedellBrave]

Dang it - they already are splitting and having problems with their own atheological liberals. Link (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/01/06/atheist-church-split_n_4550456.html)

[BedellBrave]

These are/were the fundies:

http://viz.cwrl.utexas.edu/files/The-Four-Horsemen.jpg

[AerchAngel]

These are/were the fundies:

http://viz.cwrl.utexas.edu/files/The-Four-Horsemen.jpg

fundies?

more like the Furies.

[jpx7]

more like the Furies.

Chthonic blood gods who punish who those who have committed dark familial sins?

[Oklahomahawk]

Are you TRYING to get banned?

Is that your MO right now?

So which part of this bothered you the most??

[The Chosen One]

So which part of this bothered you the most??

How dare you speak this radical sensationalist fundamentalism about Clutch Lockhart?

Remember that 3-run homerun he hit in San Francisco to pad our lead in the NLDS? What pinch hitter would you rather have in a pinch hit situation? Lenny Freakin Harris? Greg Norton???

[Oklahomahawk]

How dare you speak this radical sensationalist fundamentalism about Clutch Lockhart?

Remember that 3-run homerun he hit in San Francisco to pad our lead in the NLDS? What pinch hitter would you rather have in a pinch hit situation? Lenny Freakin Harris? Greg Norton???

If there is or ever was a "clutch" Lockhart it's you, I really honestly would prefer to have you at the plate all those times than him.

[pfiggy]

If there is or ever was a "clutch" Lockhart it's you, I really honestly would prefer to have you at the plate all those times than him.

asterisker!!!

[Oklahomahawk]

asterisker!!!

Pfigster, what's happening my friend??? Long time no hear from...

[pfiggy]

Nuthin' 'appenin' bud, you? I been keepin' a low profile, what with NSA, the FCC, and AARP lookin' pfor me.

[Oklahomahawk]

Nuthin' 'appenin' bud, you? I been keepin' a low profile, what with NSA, the FCC, and AARP lookin' pfor me.

True dat!! All those groups are bad, especially the AARP!! Those beestards are relentless!!!