GDT #25, 2/29/'14: Braves (Wood) vs. Marlins (Fernandez)

[Dalyn]

Schafer is terrible. He can steal a base and play a little defense. That's it.

[Hawk]

Probably a good reason for that.

That's some foolproof logic, for sure.

[Hawk]

Probably should have been more addressed in the offseason.

Players that could possibly have been had:

Lobaton
Mark Reynolds
Jeff Baker
Schumaker
Mcgehee
Reed Johnson
Overbay


I know you aren't going to have great bats on the bench, but you need to have at least a couple that have some type of threat to get a hit. THe Braves historically cheap out or are forced to cheap out on the bench and construct it with fringe prospects and old vets. Or they end up searching for a bat in July.

I really dislike the way the bench is set up currently, but I do agree with the concept of having a 3rd catcher to allow for the backup catcher to hit. (would have worked good with Ross as our backup), but the backup is Laird. Pena isn't good, Pastor is probably a AAA player. Schafer is a good pinch runner I guess. Doumit was a bad move.

You forgot Paul Janish.

[Hawk]

Schafer is terrible. He can steal a base and play a little defense. That's it.

And makes some incredible magic brownies*.

*(that Fredi likes to eat before making out the lineup)

[nsacpi]

Probably should have been more addressed in the offseason.

Players that could possibly have been had:

Lobaton
Mark Reynolds
Jeff Baker
Schumaker
Mcgehee
Reed Johnson
Overbay


I know you aren't going to have great bats on the bench, but you need to have at least a couple that have some type of threat to get a hit. THe Braves historically cheap out or are forced to cheap out on the bench and construct it with fringe prospects and old vets. Or they end up searching for a bat in July.

I really dislike the way the bench is set up currently, but I do agree with the concept of having a 3rd catcher to allow for the backup catcher to hit. (would have worked good with Ross as our backup), but the backup is Laird. Pena isn't good, Pastor is probably a AAA player. Schafer is a good pinch runner I guess. Doumit was a bad move.

Interesting list. I think Baker, Overbay and Reynolds went into situations where they anticipated playing as platoon players not bench players. Don't know if we could have competed offering them a spot on the bench. Reed Johnson is a nice player, but the team wanted Doumit instead for the power and ability to play catcher.

In the off-season I wanted Eric Chavez, but he expressed a strong preference to stay near his house in AZ.

[gilesfan]

That's some foolproof logic, for sure.

So you think there numbers are going to change if they ever reach a number of at bats that is acceptable for you?

[Braves1976]

Pastornicky deserves out of this organization.

Nonsense, Pastornicky deserves is a real shot to play regularly at second. He has the bat and speed to be a good second baseman if given the shot, IMO. He also isn't a bad defender at second like he is at short. He is pretty terrible at short as he doesn't have the arm for it, etc. But he is better at second defensively than Uggla (and La Stella too from what I've seen).

That said, I liked the Doumit pick-up initially but now I am thinking it might not work for us. He is so bad defensively and seems to be like Joey T in that he needs to start regularly to hit much. But hopefully he'll come around and improve his hitting. If not he is terrible because he hurts us so much defensively.

[Hawk]

Nonsense, Pastornicky deserves is a real shot to play regularly at second. He has the bat and speed to be a good second baseman if given the shot, IMO. He also isn't a bad defender at second like he is at short. He is pretty terrible at short as he doesn't have the arm for it, etc. But he is better a second defensively than Uggla (and La Stella too from what I've seen).

We agree on this, but it seems unlikely that he is offered the chance ... particularly given the way the organization has utilized him (or rather, hasn't) the past two seasons. Kid needs a change of scenery.

[Braves1976]

Schafer is terrible. He can steal a base and play a little defense. That's it.

Schafer is the worst player on our bench, IMO. He has the speed and can play some defense as you note but that is about it. I wanted the Braves to sign Bonficacio who ended up signing with the Cubs. He'd been a great replacement for Schafer IMO. He could also lead off some and play third with CJ struggling too.

[nsacpi]

Doumit has helped some indirectly via the Gattis pinch hits. It is part of the equation when it comes to bench construction. I like Terdoslavich better as a hitter and outfielder, but if Joey T is on the bench instead of Doumit maybe Gattis does not get used as a pinch hitter. There are all sorts of subtle tradeoffs when you put a bench together. And you have to look at a slightly bigger picture and consider what is available in the upper levels of the farm system.

[nsacpi]

Schafer is the worst player on our bench, IMO. He has the speed and can play some defense as you note but that is about it.

He's on the team because he is out of options, unlike Constanza and Cunningham who could fill in as well as the 4th outfielder.

[Dalyn]

He's on the team because he is out of options, unlike Constanza and Cunningham who could fill in as well as the 4th outfielder.

He isn't worth the money. We should've traded/released him.

[Braves1976]

We agree on this, but it seems unlikely that he is offered the chance ... particularly given the way the organization has utilized him (or rather, hasn't) the past two seasons. Kid needs a change of scenery.

That's fair to say, I agree he is unlikely to get much of a shot here. If anything he'll probably be a stop-gap for La Stella and/or Peraza. And that's only if they pull the plug on Uggla soon enough for him to do so.

[Braves1976]

BTW, I don't get the dislike for Pena. He is a good back-up for short. If Simmons is hurt for long we are in trouble no matter who's our back-up at short. So I don't even want to consider that happening. But I must say Pena backing up short sure beats Janish and others who couldn't hit a lick.

[Hawk]

And you have to look at a slightly bigger picture and consider what is available in the upper levels of the farm system.

It's interesting ... historically, the Braves actually seem to employ the minor league system rather minimally when it comes to constructing the core of their bench (Laird, R. Johnson, Janish, Francisco, Diaz, Hinske, Overbay, Wilson, Ross, Mather, Lugo, Conrad, etc.)

[Heyward]

I agree the bench sucks, should probably have JoeyT up sometime, at least he can hit somewhat.

[UNCBlue012]

BTW, I don't get the dislike for Pena. He is a good back-up for short. If Simmons is hurt for long we are in trouble no matter who's our back-up at short. So I don't even want to consider that happening. But I must say Pena backing up short sure beats Janish and others who couldn't hit a lick.

I love Pena! He's one of my favorites actually. I think we need to bring up Cunningham and JoeyT or LaStella in my opinion. I don't hate Schafer at all, he's just not that good of a hitter.

[nsacpi]

It's interesting ... historically, the Braves actually seem to employ the minor league system rather minimally when it comes to constructing the core of their bench (Laird, R. Johnson, Janish, Francisco, Diaz, Hinske, Overbay, Wilson, Ross, Mather, Lugo, Conrad, etc.)

That's a good point. Although Conrad was in our system for several years. And our best bench player in recent memory--Martin Prado--was homegrown. Of course he eventually became a regular. But I think the Braves have an institutional preference for veteran bench players, to the point that it occasionally comes back to bite us in the form of a young player being traded or let go and then achieving success elsewhere. An example would be Gregor Blanco. Betemit is another example of a player was better than a lot of the older players who rode the bench for us. Of course we got something in return for trading those players, but I think we sold them short. We have an interesting group of potentially good bench players right now who have come up through our system--Pastornicky, Terdoslavich, Cunningham, Bethancourt, Salcedo, Reyes. Not all of them are ready right now. But if we can use them as bench players we can save a bit of money rather than getting someone like Hinske or Doumit.