Yankees as Possible Trade Partner or Repository for Toxic Assets

[nsacpi]

Three observations:

1) The Yankees have shown a willingness to take on players with bad contracts and a willingness to pay a substantial part of said bad contracts in trades for Vernon Wells and Alfonso Soriano in recent years.

2) The Yankees don't have much in the way of farm talent they can trade for major league talent.

3) Michael Pineda and Mark Teixeira have recently suffered injury setbacks. Nova is already out for the season. CC is on the DL. They need starting pitching.

It seems to me this is a golden opportunity to peddle Uggla and part of his contract. We can sweeten the pot by also sending a starting pitcher their way. Could be Harang. Could be Floyd. Could be Santana. Could be a younger guy like Hale or Martin. The side benefit and it is not a minor one is we can move Wood back into the rotation now without worrying about innings limits.

[thethe]

Ervin Santana would be interesting to trade in my mind. I like him a lot but I think they would unload 8M of ugglas salary plus a lower level relief prospect from the Yankees.

[stpeteirish]

what do we get besides salary relief, nothing? Not trading Santana for nothing, might trade Harang if they'd pay Uggla.

[Jay212033]

If the Braves trade Santana they better get a decent prospect in return or that would've been a wasted signing especially since they lost their 1st rd pick to sign him.

[Heyward]

Dont see them trading Santana.

Harang or Floyd is possible though.

[skidlee]

The yanks farm is actually not that bad. They have some decent talent.

[skillet]

Face it, nobody wants any part of Uggla. We either keep him as a very expensive bench bat or release him.

[NinersSBChamps]

Seems like we discussed this weeks ago.

[nsacpi]

Face it, nobody wants any part of Uggla. We either keep him as a very expensive bench bat or release him.

That's right. The idea is to compensate another team to take on part of his salary. What they do after that with him is up to them.

[The Chosen One]

So the jist of the logic here is

Package:

Uggla + Harang/Hale/Floyd and maybe some cash to sweeten the deal, and we get nothing?

I'd do it just to unload the burden of Uggla's deal.

Fortunately we do have depth if we do deal Harang/Hale/Floyd/Santana. Hale would be enticing to them because he's under control long term while Harang and Floyd are only here for a year as well as Santana. If we do it, we have to do it sooner than later because the Yanks would still need to be in contention. Right now because of their injuries their team could go either way. If they still think they have a shot this year they would definitely make a move.

If one of them is gone, we could still plug Wood and another in. Hell we could trade TWO of them and still have some depth. We'd be hurt in the bullpen, and that's a big wildcard because Walden needs to stay healthy, Venters needs to come back strong (which isn't a given) and/or Wren needs to make a move at the deadline for an arm.

[The Chosen One]

Looking at teams currently in ht bottom of their divisions and who might be a decent veteran reliever to pick up for the stretch run:

LaTroy Hawkins (Colorado)
Oliver Perez (Arizona)
Joe Beimel (Seattle)

Maybe Detroit could eat up salary to free up Joe Nathan?

[nsacpi]

So the jist of the logic here is

Package:

Uggla + Harang/Hale/Floyd and maybe some cash to sweeten the deal, and we get nothing?

I'd do it just to unload the burden of Uggla's deal.

Fortunately we do have depth if we do deal Harang/Hale/Floyd/Santana. Hale would be enticing to them because he's under control long term while Harang and Floyd are only here for a year as well as Santana. If we do it, we have to do it sooner than later because the Yanks would still need to be in contention. Right now because of their injuries their team could go either way. If they still think they have a shot this year they would definitely make a move.

If one of them is gone, we could still plug Wood and another in. Hell we could trade TWO of them and still have some depth. We'd be hurt in the bullpen, and that's a big wildcard because Walden needs to stay healthy, Venters needs to come back strong (which isn't a given) and/or Wren needs to make a move at the deadline for an arm.

It is early days but Shae Simmons looks like he will be an effective pitcher for us this year. That reduces any concerns about lack of depth in the pen if we move Wood to rotation. The pen can be Kimbrel, Carpenter, Walden, Simmons, Avilan, Varvaro and Venters. Until Venters comes back Thomas or Hale can hold down the last spot.

We have a bit of a surplus of #6 starter types in the higher minors or in our pen: Hale, Schlosser, Martin, Daniel Rodriguez, Northcraft. We can afford to move one of those in a deal. For a team like the Yankees that is short of pitching depth, that type of player is more valuable than for a team like us that has a fair amount of depth.

So I'd do a deal like this: Harang, Martin, Uggla for a decent lower level prospect. With some cash going their way to cover part of Uggla's salary.

To me the main plusses here are moving Wood back into the rotation and getting some additional salary flexibility either this year or next year. There is some downside risk. We could have additional injuries to our starting pitching, in which case we'd have to tap into some of the #6 starter depth.

[The Chosen One]

I am not big on Carpenter as some. He did a good job filling in for Walden as the setup guy last season but he can be really wild. He's not good with damage control... as in once he starts walking and such then he creates self-inflicted wounds.

When we get to the postseason, I see a repeat of him not being able to contain his emotions and let the moment beat him. He has nasty stuff, but he still has yet to learn how to control it. He does get K's but he also doesn't have the command I think. He does K guys but he also pitches to contact a lot too which I find dangerous because he's one fastball over the plate from giving up the lead. While he does have a solid amount of K's, I still don't view him as a strikeout pitcher.

I'd be more comfortable with a healthy Walden + another veteran guy. Hopefully it's Venters, if not then I hope Wren does take a look at Hawkins, Ollie for late inning relief.

[cajunrevenge]

I agree about Carpenter. I think he can be a great middle reliever, I just don't trust him high pressure situations. I think that's why his ERA was so great last year, he spent most of it as a middle reliever. I don't care if hedoesnt give up a run the rest of the regular season(Chris Hammond) I will **** bricks if he is put in a high leverage situation in the playoffs.

I don't particuarly like Walden either. I think I am just spoiled by the awesomeness of O'Ventrel. Especially Venters with his 70% groundball rate and 10 k/9. I wish we could trade for that back.

[skidlee]

I really don't understand trying to "pay" a team to take uggla. I would just rather pay him to leave and use what prospects we would send with him to improve the pen and maybe the bench.

[clvclv]

Seems like we discussed this weeks ago.

I brought it up two weeks ago here...

http://www.chopcountry.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1718

[NinersSBChamps]

I brought it up two weeks ago here...

http://www.chopcountry.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1718

Yeah I thought that you did. No reason to start a completely new thread.

[DirkPiggler]

I really don't understand trying to "pay" a team to take uggla. I would just rather pay him to leave and use what prospects we would send with him to improve the pen and maybe the bench.

Only way I see it, and the way I thought the OP meant it, was if the trade partner would take on all or most of Uggla's remaining salary in exchange for whatever pitcher we send with him. If the Yankees would take on all or even most of this year's salary plus the $12 million or so we'll owe the Owl next year hell yes I'd give up a decent prospect or a spare starting pitcher like Harang. Otherwise I agree with you - regard Uggla as a sunk cost, send him on his way, and use whatever pitcher you would send with him in a trade to bolster the bullpen or bench for the stretch run.

[nsacpi]

Only way I see it, and the way I thought the OP meant it, was if the trade partner would take on all or most of Uggla's remaining salary in exchange for whatever pitcher we send with him. If the Yankees would take on all or even most of this year's salary plus the $12 million or so we'll owe the Owl next year hell yes I'd give up a decent prospect or a spare starting pitcher like Harang. Otherwise I agree with you - regard Uggla as a sunk cost, send him on his way, and use whatever pitcher you would send with him in a trade to bolster the bullpen or bench for the stretch run.

If we can gain an extra $5-10M in payroll flexibility in 2014 or 2015 by including Uggla in a trade along the lines I've outlined, I think it would be a good thing.

There is also an additional benefit from getting Wood back into the rotation.

[skidlee]

Whats a decent prospect though? I would rather keep Hale and Northcraft. Martin isn't enough IMO.

I don't see anyone taking on anything more then a million bucks for Uggla. He is lost and can't be found.

[skidlee]

If we can gain an extra $5-10M in payroll flexibility in 2014 or 2015 by including Uggla in a trade along the lines I've outlined, I think it would be a good thing.

There is also an additional benefit from getting Wood back into the rotation.

No one is going to take 5-10 mill of uggla.

He cant be fixed

[skidlee]

If we can gain an extra $5-10M in payroll flexibility in 2014 or 2015 by including Uggla in a trade along the lines I've outlined, I think it would be a good thing.

There is also an additional benefit from getting Wood back into the rotation.

No one is going to take 5-10 mill of uggla.

He cant be fixed


The trade market is going to be full of starters way better then Harang or Floyd. And some will not cost a lot in terms of prospects.

[nsacpi]

No one is going to take 5-10 mill of uggla.

He cant be fixed

I never said anyone would take that for Uggla.

[Enscheff]

If TLS is truly the answer at 2B, then I see no reason to throw away talent just to get Uggla off the books. What position is Wren going to upgrade with Uggla's money that warrants giving up a useful starting pitcher? Maybe 3B? I doubt it since they just (inexplicably) extended CJ. A BP arm? Doesn't make sense to deplete the starting rotation depth to add an arm the BP when Wren has demonstrated his best skill is building a BP on the cheap.

Every position is pretty much set in stone, so unless there is an injury I really don't see the urgency in using talent to free up that cash.

[nsacpi]

Bench and maybe pen are areas where having the ability to upgrade would be a good thing.

[Tapate50]

Bench and maybe pen are areas where having the ability to upgrade would be a good thing.

Mac would look awful good on this bench.

[skidlee]

Its looking more and more like the braves need to add a top 3 starting pitcher at the deadline IMO

[50PoundHead]

I think the only option with Uggla if they truly want to unload him is to simply release him.

I think we are going to need a couple more parts to make the playoffs. I can see the argument for acquiring a starter, but I don't know at what cost. Another bullpen arm is also needed. We may have some guys internally who could beef up the bench, but another proven bench bat would be helpful (especially a LHH who could play 3B like Eric Chavez).

[NinersSBChamps]

Nobody is going to do the Braves a favor and take Uggla. Wasn't Wren on record saying something like the payroll will be back to where it was before they signed Ervin? If that's the case we aren't making any splashes via trade.

[The Chosen One]

Its looking more and more like the braves need to add a top 3 starting pitcher at the deadline IMO

I'll go to war with Teheran Minor Wood Santana Floyd/Harang/Hale. Santana has more upside than Harang or Floyd imo.

[Julio3000]

Yeah, rotation depth is never bad, but I am not at all concerned on that score right now. Our top three (inc. Wood) is damned good. Our next three-four are better than most.

I'd love to get another good bullpen arm, because I don't trust Walden to be healthy for a full season and I don't like Carpenter as a setup guy. One more BP injury will put us in a tough spot.

Schafer is a waste of a spot right now.

[nsacpi]

If Venters doesn't come around, we'll probably pick up a lefty reliever at the deadline a la Scott Downs, but hopefully one who pitches better for us.