Pedroia/McCann

[nsacpi]

Pedroia's deal is a potentially interesting precedent for McCann and the Braves. Both players strongly identify with the teams they came up with and are valued for their leadership as well as contributions on the field.

Pedroia's extension will cover his ages 31-37 seasons at an annual rate of slightly over 14M per year.

McCann is 29 now, so his contract will cover a similar period in his career. Of course, everyone will have to take into account that catchers have a different aging curve. This is likely to express itself in the form of a shorter contract.

Over the years Pedroia has been a bit more productive. As measured by WAR, I think it would be reasonable to assume over the next few years he will be about 1 win per year better than McCann.

It will be interesting to see what McCann will get compared to the deal Pedroia just signed.

[BlackwaterPark]

Catchers at 31-37 and 2B at 31-37 are completely different animals...

[nsacpi]

Catchers at 31-37 and 2B at 31-37 are completely different animals...

For sure. I think McCann will be getting a 4-5 year deal covering his age 30-33 seasons or age 30-34 seasons.

[Tino25Dynasty]

I'd LOVE for McCann to show loyalty to his hometown but...

I think he's gonna test the market and you bet SOMEONE will overpay for him... Good hitting catchers like him aren't easy to come by. And while yes, he is getting older someone will just hope and pray he's got 2 to 3 good years left of what he's been and give him a big time 5 year deal. We'll see

[weso1]

Pedroia's deal is a potentially interesting precedent for McCann and the Braves. Both players strongly identify with the teams they came up with and are valued for their leadership as well as contributions on the field.

Pedroia's extension will cover his ages 31-37 seasons at an annual rate of slightly over 14M per year.

McCann is 29 now, so his contract will cover a similar period in his career. Of course, everyone will have to take into account that catchers have a different aging curve. This is likely to express itself in the form of a shorter contract.

Over the years Pedroia has been a bit more productive. As measured by WAR, I think it would be reasonable to assume over the next few years he will be about 1 win per year better than McCann.

It will be interesting to see what McCann will get compared to the deal Pedroia just signed.

I noticed that deal earlier and thought the same thing you did. A 5 year deal at 14 mil might be about the best we can hope.

[BRule]

He got 14.2 a year, Mac should get that for 3-4 years, no longer then that, though.

[Carp]

You offer 4/55 and see if he bites. He could/should get more on the open market, but that's a good offer for someone who means a lot to this franchise right now

[The Chosen One]

You offer 4/55 and see if he bites. He could/should get more on the open market, but that's a good offer for someone who means a lot to this franchise right now

I hope McCann bites.

In this market that's a lot for our team, but it shows just how much we want him back.

Kinda wish the money we gave to BJ could've been used to McCann.

[Metaphysicist]

Catchers at 31-37 and 2B at 31-37 are completely different animals...

Not sure the difference is that huge. 2B probably take the second biggest beating out there, and the early 30s has been pretty gloomy for good 2B. The list of recent guys who fell off in that range is pretty lengthy: Chuck Knoblauch, Orlando Hudson, Brian Roberts, Luis Castillo, Ryne Sandberg, Roberto Alomar, Craig Biggio, DeSheilds, Vidro, Giles, Loretta, etc.

[zitothebrave]

Not sure the difference is that huge. 2B probably take the second biggest beating out there, and the early 30s has been pretty gloomy for good 2B. The list of recent guys who fell off in that range is pretty lengthy: Chuck Knoblauch, Orlando Hudson, Brian Roberts, Luis Castillo, Ryne Sandberg, Roberto Alomar, Craig Biggio, DeSheilds, Vidro, Giles, Loretta, etc.

A few of them have some good reason for falling off, Knoblauch and Giles were roiding, and Alomar had the HIV.

[Julio3000]

True. Chase Utley is still good, but can't stay healthy recently. I can think of a couple of others off the top of my head: Quilvio Veras was done in by injuries. Edgardo Alfonso tailed off right in that range; he played more 3B later in his career, but still logged a lot of innings at 2B.

[thethe]

Kent was still good in his late thirties.

[Julio3000]

Kent had a forcefield of concentrated prickishness that kept him largely free of injury.

It didn't work on motor vehicles, though.

[zitothebrave]

Kent had a forcefield of concentrated prickishness that kept him largely free of injury.

It didn't work on motor vehicles, though.

Not to mention steroids.

[nsacpi]

Uggla

[Julio3000]

Was waiting for that.

[50PoundHead]

I hope McCann bites.

In this market that's a lot for our team, but it shows just how much we want him back.

Kinda wish the money we gave to BJ could've been used to McCann.

The buzz was we offered Upton somewhere between $2M and $3M more per year than anyone else was offering. One can decry the whole Upton signing, but for me it's more about the appearance that we were bidding against ourselves and threw dollars that will be needed elsewhere into his contract. McCann may be test case number one on that theory. Maybe we can unload Uggla.

[Metaphysicist]

A few of them have some good reason for falling off, Knoblauch and Giles were roiding, and Alomar had the HIV.

Well, I don't see how that follows. The prototypical roiding 2B was B**t B**ne, and he is one of the few exceptions where a guy improved in his early 30s. Giles in particular was brought low by the chronic destruction of his body and his penchant for concussing himself, regardless of what he did or did not inject. Alomar having HIV is still just a rumor, as last I heard it.

[Carp]

Does Biggio really need on that list? I mean his productiom started to dip a little around 30, but he was still injury free and very productive well into his 30's.

[BRule]

Biggio was really good from 30-33, from 34-39 he was either average or slightly below average. When he was 40 and 41, he was obviously finished.

[Russ2dollas]

The buzz was we offered Upton somewhere between $2M and $3M more per year than anyone else was offering. One can decry the whole Upton signing, but for me it's more about the appearance that we were bidding against ourselves and threw dollars that will be needed elsewhere into his contract. McCann may be test case number one on that theory. Maybe we can unload Uggla.

BJ was too much money and looks awful now. But at the time we had a massive hole in CF and 3B. We had to fill it. Nobody thought Schafer was a viable option. Bourn was going to wait until the end. We needed to fill a whole so we could have enough knowledge to intelligently fill the other hole. If the Jup trade was available earlier in the year (wasn't b/c Az wanted more=Simmons), then I'd hate on the BJ signing. But we had to fill CF and go from there. If Bourn had known what the market was, maybe he'd of stayed in ATL.

Uggla needs to go. Not so much b/c of his performance, he's not terrible in $/WAR, but b/c he doesn't fit. We have too many sluggers. I think a LaStella (assuming he is decent in pros) is exactly the type of guy we need at 2B. We might have to get creative to move him. I think it's possible we make a BIG move this offseason with Heyward (if he says he's 100% going to FA) or Kimbrel. In that trade we might get someone to take Uggla.

Mac I'd love to keep. I'm not sure Gattis is a starter. And even if he is he's another slugger type. Maybe Mac takes a home town discount. Maybe Mac would take an incentive based contract in the last couple of years to protect vs injury. I'm not sure how creative the Braves would be.

If we hold steady for the most part (no buy out of Kimbrel, Heyward, Freeman, Minor, etc), then what about paying Mac 20-25 million next year? Contract is 5/75.
Year 1: 25---10 million signing bonus
Year 2: 15
Year 3: 13
Year 4: 12
Year 5: 10---------by this time it's still reasonable that McCann is a 2 WAR player. Plus inflation, etc 10 million isn't terrible. He'd be very tradeable

[Teheran_49]

McCann has been probably our best hitter since he's came back. His numbers are really really good considering the AB's he's had. Also, Gattis has shown that he doesn't do well with the off-speed stuff so it's going to be a tough call on B-Mac's contract.

P.S.-I was ajgoldglove25 on the other site

[50PoundHead]

BJ was too much money and looks awful now. But at the time we had a massive hole in CF and 3B. We had to fill it. Nobody thought Schafer was a viable option. Bourn was going to wait until the end. We needed to fill a whole so we could have enough knowledge to intelligently fill the other hole. If the Jup trade was available earlier in the year (wasn't b/c Az wanted more=Simmons), then I'd hate on the BJ signing. But we had to fill CF and go from there. If Bourn had known what the market was, maybe he'd of stayed in ATL.

Uggla needs to go. Not so much b/c of his performance, he's not terrible in $/WAR, but b/c he doesn't fit. We have too many sluggers. I think a LaStella (assuming he is decent in pros) is exactly the type of guy we need at 2B. We might have to get creative to move him. I think it's possible we make a BIG move this offseason with Heyward (if he says he's 100% going to FA) or Kimbrel. In that trade we might get someone to take Uggla.

Mac I'd love to keep. I'm not sure Gattis is a starter. And even if he is he's another slugger type. Maybe Mac takes a home town discount. Maybe Mac would take an incentive based contract in the last couple of years to protect vs injury. I'm not sure how creative the Braves would be.

If we hold steady for the most part (no buy out of Kimbrel, Heyward, Freeman, Minor, etc), then what about paying Mac 20-25 million next year? Contract is 5/75.
Year 1: 25---10 million signing bonus
Year 2: 15
Year 3: 13
Year 4: 12
Year 5: 10---------by this time it's still reasonable that McCann is a 2 WAR player. Plus inflation, etc 10 million isn't terrible. He'd be very tradeable

On Upton, I was trying to reference the $3 million per year difference between what we offered him and what others were supposedly offering. I wasn't nuts about the Upton signing, but knew we needed a CF. I just think we went a bit too high in landing him.

[Russ2dollas]

On Upton, I was trying to reference the $3 million per year difference between what we offered him and what others were supposedly offering. I wasn't nuts about the Upton signing, but knew we needed a CF. I just think we went a bit too high in landing him.
I agree....I think most thought it was too much, but not by a ton.........now it looks like a killer