Flint, Mich

[57Brave]

http://www.legislature.mi.gov/documents/2011-2012/billanalysis/Senate/pdf/2011-SFA-4214-F.pdf

If we can get our minds off of Bill Clintons dick and President Obama giving federal employees the day after Christmas off there is this.

Let's use this as a starting point of conversation on how exactly we repair this city.

http://www.mlive.com/news/flint/index.ssf/2016/01/hillary_clinton_flint_deserves.html
///

Haven't heard from Trump,Cruz,Carson or Rubio. I am sure Rand Paul is all over this and Gary Johnson is aghast

[57Brave]

Think about that. This was supposed to be an event with dancing kids with cat whiskers drawn on their faces, eating healthy food, and winning a damn raffle. Now, it's being used as a chance for parents in one of the poorest cities in the country to see if their state has permanently damaged their kids because that's better than spending a little extra money on water tests or, you know, water safety. And what are they raffling now? Aquafina twelve-packs?


Freeman Elementary School in Flint, Michigan: A Demonstration of Heartbreaking Urban Disregard


If you go looking for information or updates on the crisis of lead poisoning the water of Flint, Michigan, you'll come across so many stories that make you despair for the treatment of the urban, industrial population in this greatest nation in the history of everything ever. If you're not up on this insane story about the criminal neglect and outright damnation of a poor city, especially its children, by cost-cutting Republicans, Rachel Maddow and her staff have been doing the kind of investigative reporting work that used to be a regular part of our media. If it's too much work to watch Maddow, you can read a quick summary to get up to speed.


- See more at: http://rudepundit.blogspot.com/2016/01/freeman-elementary-school-in-flint.html#sthash.Dj9lmxvi.PLaJkocE.dpuf

[57Brave]

Which gets us to Freeman Elementary School, a pre-kindergarten to sixth-grade public school in Flint and its family fun day, which will be held tomorrow at the school. Of course, it's not going to be just family fun, as a headline from the local paper reveals:


Yes, as the article says, "Children will be able to get their blood tested for lead during a family fun night this week at Freeman Elementary School in Flint." And then, heartbreakingly, "Lead testing is planned for infants up to children six years old, along with water filter giveaways, dance fitness for children, face painting, balloon artist, a free healthy meal, refreshments and raffles." -
.....

[57Brave]

http://www.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/2016/01/11/officials-announce-new-steps-flint-water-crisis/78634678/

[57Brave]

Imagine if you lived in a city where the drinking water supply had been poisoned by lead after cost-saving measures were enacted by an unelected, appointed official. Now imagine you were being billed for that “privilege”.

http://www.eclectablog.com/2016/01/wouldnt-it-be-outrageous-if-flint-was-still-billing-its-residents-for-water-hah-oh-wait-they-are.html

'''''

can we now put notions of austerity as the guiding political principle in the grave ?
Of course it must be considered but at what cost ?

How does the old saying go "Payz me now or Payz me later "

[57Brave]

Heard this was in the works. States response vs federal response red tape was an issue

In another thread an incurious poster wondered Obama's response. Was traveling and could not respond in time
found this though and a partial explanation to the whys and wherefores of the delayed federal response.

Also heard there is Justice Department investigation


President Obama declares emergency in Flint
"... under federal law, only natural disasters such as hurricanes and floods are eligible for disaster declarations, federal and state officials said. The lead contamination of Flint's drinking water is a man-made catastrophe."


http://www.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/2016/01/16/president-obama-declares-emergency-flint/78898604/

[57Brave]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CY3hRSNUsAA-h1z.png:large

[57Brave]

The city of Flint, Mich., is in the midst of a water crisis several years in the making. The city opted out of Detroit's water supply and began drawing water from the Flint River in April 2014, part of a cost-saving move. Eighteen months later, in the fall of 2015, researchers discovered that the proportion of children with above-average lead levels in their blood had doubled.

The city reconnected to Detroit's water system in October, but the damage was done. Water from the Flint River was found to be highly corrosive to the lead pipes still used in some parts of the city. Even though Flint River water no longer flows through the city's pipes, it's unclear how long those pipes will continue to leach unsafe levels of lead into the tap water supply. Experts currently say the water is safe for bathing, but not drinking.

A group of Virginia Tech researchers who sampled the water in 271 Flint homes last summer found some contained lead levels high enough to meet the EPA's definition of "toxic waste."

The researchers posted their test results online, which I represent graphically below with other visuals to help understand just how high above normal Flint's lead levels really were.

Lead in water is measured in terms of parts per billion (ppb). If a test comes back with lead levels higher than 15 ppb, the EPA recommends that homeowners and municipalities take steps to reduce that level, like updating pipes and putting anti-corrosive elements in the water when appropriate.

But 15 ppb is a regulatory measure, not a public health one. Researchers stress that there is no 100 percent "safe" level of lead in drinking water, only acceptable levels. Even levels as low as 5 ppb can be a cause for concern, according to the group studying Flint's water.

So let's start with Flint's neighboring cities. At the city level, public health officials are most concerned with the 90th percentile level of lead exposure in homes they test -- that is, 90 percent of homes will have a lead level below this threshold, while 10 percent will register above it.
Content from JPMorgan Chase & Co.
With better data and a greater understanding of where the skills gaps are, the city is aggressively tackling this challenge. More

Forty-five minutes away from Flint in Troy, Mich., the 90th percentile level for lead in 2013 was 1.1 parts per billion. Not too shabby at all. In the graphics that follow, each splotch represents 1 part per billion. The splotches aren't proportionally scaled to the cups -- 1 part per billion is way too small to be visualized at this level. But all of the following graphics are scaled proportionally to each other, to give an impression of relative lead levels.



In Detroit, the water supply Flint had previously been connected to, the 90th percentile reading was 2.3 parts per billion -- still highly acceptable.



Here's an illustration of water at the 5 parts per billion level. This is below the borderline for EPA acceptability, but the team of researchers studying Flint's water say that levels this high can be a cause for concern, particularly for young children.



Now things get interesting. Here's a glass illustrating the 90th percentile reading among the 271 Flint homes tested by researchers last summer:



At 27 parts per billion, it's five times as high as the level of concern, and nearly twice as high as the EPA's already-generous guidelines. According to the researchers who ran these tests, the health effects of lead levels this high "can include high blood pressure and other cardiovascular problems, kidney damage and memory and neurological problems."

Recall, though, that 10 percent of the homes in the sample had lead levels even higher than this. Here's the highest lead reading in that sample, from a home in the city's 8th Ward:



That's more than 10 times the EPA limit. It's 30 times higher than the 5 ppb reading that can indicate unsafe lead amounts.

But that 158 ppb reading is far from the worst one that turned up in Flint, unfortunately. In the spring of 2015, city officials tested water in the home of LeeAnne Walters, a stay-at-home mother of four and a Navy wife. They got a reading of 397 ppb, an alarmingly high number.

But it was even worse than that. Virginia Tech's team went to Walters' house to verify those numbers later in the year. They were concerned that the city tested water in a way that was almost guaranteed to minimize lead readings: They flushed the water for several minutes before taking a sample, which often washes away a percentage of lead contaminants. They also made residents collect water at a very low flow rate, which they knew also tended to be associated with lower readings.

So the Virginia Tech researchers took 30 different readings at various flow levels. What they found shocked them: The lowest reading they obtained was around 200 ppb, already ridiculously high. But more than half of the readings came in at more than 1,000 ppb. Some came in above 5,000 -- the level at which EPA considers the water to be "toxic waste."

The highest reading registered at 13,000 ppb.



The professor who conducted the sampling, Dr. Marc Edwards, was in "disbelief."

"We had never seen such sustained high levels of lead in 25 years of work," he said.

According to Edwards, the team retested the water with extra quality controls and assurance checks, and obtained the exact same results.

You can check out their description of the testing at the website they set up for their water study. It includes unsettling photos of LeeAnne Walters' tap water containing rust and metal particles large enough to be seen with the naked eye.

The Walters family had stopped drinking the water a long time ago, according to the Virginia Tech team. But still, the lead levels were too high. One of Walters' 4-year-old sons was diagnosed with lead poisoning.

It appears that the city of Flint and state of Michigan have finally started to take the water problem seriously. Again, they reconnected the city to Detroit's supply back in October, but the water remains unsafe to drink.

In recent days the National Guard was activated to help distribute drinking water to the city's residents. And in yet another unsettling wrinkle in Flint's saga, 87 cases of Legionnaire's Disease, 10 fatal, have been diagnosed in the city since June. It's not yet clear whether that outbreak is linked to the water.
Christopher Ingraham writes about politics, drug policy and all things data. He previously worked at the Brookings Institution and the Pew Research Center.

[Krgrecw]

Nice to see that it only took a few months for Obama to do something about this.

[cajunrevenge]

Not surprised. Hell hole of a city elects democrats to run the city every time and they wonder why they live in a hell hole. But go on, keep electing that guy handing out free 20$ bills. If he ****s up too bad we can just guilt trip the rest of the state/country to help.

[57Brave]

Nice to see that it only took a few months for Obama to do something about this.

As explained above , since this wasn't a natural disaster the Feds were bound by law to wait for the states request

[57Brave]

Not surprised. Hell hole of a city elects democrats to run the city every time and they wonder why they live in a hell hole. But go on, keep electing that guy handing out free 20$ bills. If he ****s up too bad we can just guilt trip the rest of the state/country to help.

This decision was not made by and was out of the hands of elected city officials.
They (elected city representatives) fought the change.

This info is linked above

[Krgrecw]

As explained above , since this wasn't a natural disaster the Feds were bound by law to wait for the states request



And you don't think the Feds could had done something about that? Like tell the governor to ask for help?

[57Brave]

And you don't think the Feds could had done something about that? Like tell the governor to ask for help?

Obviously - but the Feds, by law - can't do anything without the states request.
My understanding is the Jsutice Department began their investigation before last week.
That info is in the links above - somewhere.

The Feds don't tell Governors to do anything, let alone admit they screwed up

[57Brave]

Flint and Katrina: Poor People, Poor Treatment and Water

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/benjamin-a-davis/flint-and-katrina-poor-pe_b_9001928.html

[57Brave]

Rubio says he hasn't followed the Flint water crisis. "It's just not an issue we've quite frankly followed or been briefed on"

[The Chosen One]

Must have been a little preoccupied with his own water bottle since his version of Watergate.

[57Brave]

The governor’s office declined to answer questions about what role it played in the decision-making process that led to Flint using the local river as its main water source, but what is clear is that the lead-contamination crisis took place while the city was under the control of Snyder-appointed emergency managers

http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2016/jan/16/flints-water-crisis-what-went-wrong

[cajunrevenge]

This decision was not made by and was out of the hands of elected city officials.
They (elected city representatives) fought the change.

This info is linked above

My understanding is the change was made to save money because the city was bankrupt. I blame the ones who bankrupted the city. Like the one mayor who claimed a big surplus when facing reelection then immediately after being reelected said it was actually in huge debt.

[Krgrecw]

My understanding is the change was made to save money because the city was bankrupt. I blame the ones who bankrupted the city. Like the one mayor who claimed a big surplus when facing reelection then immediately after being reelected said it was actually in huge debt.




You have to see if from 57's viewpoint; find the nearest republican to the situation and put all the blame on them.

[57Brave]

My understanding is the change was made to save money because the city was bankrupt. I blame the ones who bankrupted the city. Like the one mayor who claimed a big surplus when facing reelection then immediately after being reelected said it was actually in huge debt.

Yeah, it is fair to say that.
Again once you scratch the surface it goes a little deeper. Actually, a lot deeper
snyder and the (R) legislature legally set up the de facto city governments to manage the cities. (forget the term)
To act as the grown ups in the room -- if you will
Not poison the pipes - which is what they did

there was a 1989 documentary on the demise of Flint

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roger_%26_Me
................................

[gilesfan]

You have to see if from 57's viewpoint; find the nearest republican to the situation and put all the blame on them.

It has to be a republicans fault bc they hate poor people and democrats support poor people.

[57Brave]

A comparison to Katrina would seem apt except for the fact that action on Snyder’s behalf when he first knew of the problem could have stopped the problem entirely, instead of just mitigating it. Katrina was a natural disaster, and while the response and planning were entirely inadequate and racially unjust, there was no decision that could have been made to stop it entirely. At any step in the process Snyder or someone in his administration could have spoken up and actually helped Flint citizens. But they got poisoned instead.

http://www.dailykos.com/stories/2016/1/19/1471761/-Snyder-calls-Flint-crisis-his-Katrina-admits-he-knew-of-lead-concerns-last-summer

[57Brave]

Last July, after more than a year of public complaints about the drinking water in Flint, Michigan—water so pungent and foamy that a local pastor had stopped using it for baptisms—reporters were calling the state’s Department of Environmental Quality. The response from the department was of limited urgency. In an internal e-mail to colleagues, a spokeswoman, Karen Tommasulo, wrote, “Apparently it’s going to be a thing now.”


http://www.newyorker.com/news/news-desk/the-crisis-in-flint-goes-deeper-than-the-water?intcid=mod-latest

[57Brave]

This is the outcome of policies advocated by the Conservative Movement since 1980 and the so called Reagan Revolution.
Government on the cheap and criminal disregard for those at the bottom of the economic ladder

"Make America Great Again"

http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/jan/21/flint-water-crisis-emails-reveal-governor-snyder-informed-of-problems-a-year-ago

http://images.dailykos.com/images/193503/story_image/flint-water.jpg?1452214569

[57Brave]

The picture


http://www.vox.com/2016/1/20/10789810/flint-michigan-water-crisis



The stage was set on March 16, 2011, when Michigan Gov. Rick Snyder signed Public Act 4. This measure broadened an earlier law that provided an "emergency financial manager" for financially distressed cities and school districts. Under the new law, "emergency financial managers" became "emergency managers" with the power to cancel or renegotiate city contracts, liquidate assets, suspend local government, unilaterally draft policy, and even disincorporate. (It is worth noting that Michigan emergency managers have done all of these things except disincorporate, which was entertained by a manager in the city of Pontiac.)

[57Brave]

WSJ report

Again, look at the picture

http://www.wsj.com/article_email/water-contamination-crisis-strains-flint-residents-resources-1453401814-lMyQjAxMTE2NDIyMTMyOTE4Wj

[BedellBrave]

My understanding is the change was made to save money because the city was bankrupt. I blame the ones who bankrupted the city. Like the one mayor who claimed a big surplus when facing reelection then immediately after being reelected said it was actually in huge debt.


As I read more and more about it (and 57, honestly I was avoiding doing so just because your were the one beating the drum), there looks to be blame to be shared from the bottom (local government), to middle (state), to the top (feds EPA), and including business and the political spectrum Rs and Ds. Now, to address the problem. The Emergency Manager, Water Plant officials, Governor and others must face the music. And 57 - you make a good point - there is a role - significant role for responsible government to play. Yes, let's do things efficiently, but public safety is the responsibility of government - and to provide it does cost money. But there are also non-governmental charities - right now -doing great service. See the WSJ article 57 gives and the subsequent link I provide below. So, besides criticizing the ones who were behind this (rightfully so) and waiting for the government (and paying your taxes), you can give directly to help.

[BedellBrave]

WSJ report

Again, look at the picture

http://www.wsj.com/article_email/water-contamination-crisis-strains-flint-residents-resources-1453401814-lMyQjAxMTE2NDIyMTMyOTE4Wj


Thanks for the article link! And speaking of doing something, one of those dastardly Christian charities, is doing great service there. Mission of Hope is taking donations. Check them out:

Link (https://www.facebook.com/hope4flint)

[57Brave]

"The Environmental Protection Agency boss for the Midwest resigned Thursday amid ongoing fallout over the drinking water crisis in Flint, Michigan."

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/flint-water-crisis-epa_us_56a16670e4b076aadcc601a4

........................

That is the regional head of the EPA. The fed responsible - reading the article and from reports I heard this morning (she was still employed in that report) she tried to brush this under the rug. For reasons I'm not sure I understand
The Emergency Manager Governor Snyder appointed that oversaw this disaster is still employed.
As an Emergency Manager of Detroit School System

[BedellBrave]

"The Environmental Protection Agency boss for the Midwest resigned Thursday amid ongoing fallout over the drinking water crisis in Flint, Michigan."

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/flint-water-crisis-epa_us_56a16670e4b076aadcc601a4

........................

That is the regional head of the EPA. The fed responsible - reading the article and from reports I heard this morning (she was still employed in that report) she tried to brush this under the rug. For reasons I'm not sure I understand
The Emergency Manager Governor Snyder appointed that oversaw this disaster is still employed.
As an Emergency Manager of Detroit School System


A whole bunch of heads should roll. Put'm in orange jump suits and send them to work their arses off cleaning Flint up.

[57Brave]

from 2011:
I remember seeing this and hearing Ms Klein's " what could go wrong with this" predictions

“Gov. Rick Snyder’s budget in Michigan is expected to cut aid to cities and towns so much that a lot of cities and towns in Michigan are expected to be in dire financial straits. Right now, Gov. Snyder is pushing a bill that would give himself, Gov. Snyder and his administration, the power to declare any town or school district to be in a financial emergency. If a town was declared by the governor and his administration to be in a financial emergency they would get to put somebody in charge of that town, and they want to give that emergency manager that they just put in charge of the town the power to, “reject, modify, or terminate any contracts that the town may have entered in to, including any collective bargaining agreements.”

http://archives.politicususa.com/2011/03/09/rachel-maddow-michigan.html

.....

I too remember people on the old board cheering Gov Snyder's anti-union stance.
Here I am with this scratch the surface . . .

[57Brave]

The human damage is incalculable. Think of a mother waking in the middle of the night to make formula for her baby girl and unwittingly using liquid death as a mixer. Lead poisoning stunts IQs in children, many of whom in Flint are already traumatized by poverty, arson and rampant gunfire outside their doors. And for what? I hate to get all MSNBC-y, but this man-made disaster can be traced to one fact: Republicans not giving a **** about poor kids as much as they give a **** about the green of the bottom line.

Read more: http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/who-poisoned-flint-michigan-20160122#ixzz3y0UKbvAN
Follow us: @rollingstone on Twitter | RollingStone on Facebook

[57Brave]

Detroit Freepress is reporting Gov Snyder has hired a PR firm.

Word is state is not paying but nothing on who is paying

[57Brave]

Now it seems clear why Snyder wouldn’t release the e-mails: They would have revealed that the switch was not about saving money.


http://motorcitymuckraker.com/2016/01/23/gov-snyder-lied-flint-water-switch-was-not-about-money-records-show/

[57Brave]

Emergency managers and gerrymandering: How Republican attacks on democracy led to Flint water crisis


By Stephen Wolf
Tuesday Jan 26, 2016 · 2:00 PM EST


http://www.dailykos.com/

[57Brave]

When Rick Snyder needs to have something done, he often turns to one man: Richard Baird. Baird has long been Snyder’s “right hand man”, enjoying a position in the governor’s Executive Office and listed as his “Transformation Manager”:


http://www.eclectablog.com/2016/01/gov-snyder-puts-former-transformation-manager-linked-to-numerous-scandals-in-charge-of-flintwatercrisis-response.html

////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////


"Baird has a list of scandals in Michigan that he is tied to. He was originally paid from a fund set up by Gov. Snyder called the New Energy to Reinvent and Diversify (NERD) Fund. Funding for the NERD Fund was never fully revealed before it was shut down by the governor under mounting criticism and evidence that donors were receiving special favors in return for their contributions. For example ... "

[57Brave]

Revealed: Rick Snyder gave state workers in Flint clean water a year before providing it to residents

http://www.rawstory.com/2016/01/revealed-rick-snyder-gave-state-workers-in-flint-clean-water-a-year-before-providing-it-to-residents/

[57Brave]

The mantra of every Koch-headed, right-wing politico is that government should be run like a business, always focused on cutting costs.


http://www.nationalmemo.com/what-really-poisoned-the-water-in-flint-michigan/

[57Brave]

The plan is hailed as a goodwill gesture by many after scientists and investigators found high levels of lead exposure in Flint citizens, but Snyder is also facing class action lawsuits from citizens who are upset that they are having to pay for contaminated water at all

http://www.dailykos.com/stories/2016/2/4/1479801/-Michigan-Governor-Rick-Snyder-calls-for-30-discount-for-lead-poisoned-water

[50PoundHead]

The mantra of every Koch-headed, right-wing politico is that government should be run like a business, always focused on cutting costs.


http://www.nationalmemo.com/what-really-poisoned-the-water-in-flint-michigan/

I did find it interesting that the committee got to yell at everyone except Snyder, who they apparently didn't subpoena.

[57Brave]

House rules state only the majority gets to call witness'. Also not called were the Emergency Managers .
Listened to Elijah Cummings this morning talking about keeping the pressure on via PR to have governor and the managers testify

Have no idea who they did call. Perhaps the guy that operates the valves.

[57Brave]

was Flint discussed at last night's debate ?
Anything on infrastructure ?

[Runnin]

was Flint discussed at last night's debate ?
Anything on infrastructure ?
I hear China is buying up all the clean water.

[57Brave]

Michigan state (R) Legislature passes law making Sodomy a felony with 15 years

No mention of a water poisoned city but, sodomy ...

http://www.thenewcivilrightsmovement.com/johnwright/michigan_senate_passes_bill_saying_sodomy_is_a_fel ony

[57Brave]

FLINT, MI – Gov. Rick Snyder and other state officials allegedly withheld lead testing results from county health officials while they worked to find ways to present the information to the public, according to emails obtained by The Flint Journal.

http://www.mlive.com/news/flint/index.ssf/2016/02/snyder_ordered_deq_to_withhold.html#incart_special-report

[BedellBrave]

Does it affect Goldman Sachs in anyway? That's the only issue of importance.

[57Brave]

Not one pipe has been replaced nor has the Michigan Legislature sanctioned one nickel to repair the poisoned water system

[Krgrecw]

Not one pipe has been replaced nor has the Michigan Legislature sanctioned one nickel to repair the poisoned water system


That's sad. How much money have you donated to help the people of flint, since you're so worried about it?

[57Brave]

they have asked that people stop sending bottled water. Would rather have people's energy spent on passing on the news to the uninterested.

[goldfly]

That's sad. How much money have you donated to help the people of flint, since you're so worried about it?

not really sure the point of this post

are you not worried about your fellow americans being poisoned?

[Oklahomahawk]

not really sure the point of this post

are you not worried about your fellow americans being poisoned?

This was meant to be rhetorical, right?

[zitothebrave]

That's sad. How much money have you donated to help the people of flint, since you're so worried about it?

Remember this is the City of Flint's fault. They had to switch sources of water, and weren't ready, and some higher ups in the Water Treatment were concerned.

This is why we need to stop bailing out big businesses and giving aid to foreign countries who don't really need it, and instead bail out our own people with new and better infrastructure.

[goldfly]

This was meant to be rhetorical, right?

not when it comes to KG

[57Brave]

not looking good

http://www.mlive.com/news/flint/index.ssf/2016/02/snyders_staff_signed_off_on_ed.html

[57Brave]

“Since we’re in charge, we can hardly ignore the people of Flint,” he wrote to communications officials in the governor’s office, the DEQ, and Treasury Department. “After all, if GM refuses to use the water in their plant and our own agencies are warning people not to drink it…we look pretty stupid hiding behind some financial statement.”


http://thinkprogress.org/health/2016/02/26/3754137/flint-snyder-aides-emails/


Governor Snyder was elected in the TBag wave of 2010. Promising to erdicate the state of labor unions and reel in financial aste.
In other words, form state policies more resembling a for profit business.

Should government be run like a for profit business ?

[57Brave]

The Mayor went around the Governor (who wanted to do more studies-run out the clock) by using the method used in Lansing, Mich.

They began changing out the pipes yesterday. Don't know when it expected to be finished.
Read somewhere the method they used to target the worst cases to create an order. If I find it I'll pass it on

[cajunrevenge]

“Since we’re in charge, we can hardly ignore the people of Flint,” he wrote to communications officials in the governor’s office, the DEQ, and Treasury Department. “After all, if GM refuses to use the water in their plant and our own agencies are warning people not to drink it…we look pretty stupid hiding behind some financial statement.”


http://thinkprogress.org/health/2016/02/26/3754137/flint-snyder-aides-emails/


Governor Snyder was elected in the TBag wave of 2010. Promising to erdicate the state of labor unions and reel in financial aste.
In other words, form state policies more resembling a for profit business.

Should government be run like a for profit business ?

Well what do you do when the city is broke and no one will lend them money anymore? You raise taxes. Then the rich people leave. Then you raise taxes more to compensate. Then the middle class leaves. Then your Detroit with not enough productive citizens to tax to pay for the poor people.

[57Brave]

Do you know how the once thriving city of Flint went broke ?

The demise of Flint was immortalized in the 1988 documentary Roger and Me. Worth a watch

[sturg33]

https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xtl1/v/t1.0-9/12798977_953958834703288_2506605010965960297_n.png ?oh=903f3eb8edeb398051c20142b74a00b5&oe=575E74A1

[BedellBrave]

First Slate, now Moore! What's happening? My world is spinning.

[Oklahomahawk]

First Slate, now Moore! What's happening? My world is spinning.

Well the truth shall set you free, but then again sometimes it just confuses the ****e out of you. ;)

[Julio3000]

I suppose the pertinent question to ask is what if Flint had voted another way?

Would anything have been materially different? Or was Flint just a loser in the larger conversation of global economics and trade, as you, Bedell, have been hinting at in reference to the Trump phenomenon. Tough to have it both ways.

[BedellBrave]

I suppose the pertinent question to ask is what if Flint had voted another way?

Would anything have been materially different? Or was Flint just a loser in the larger conversation of global economics and trade, as you, Bedell, have been hinting at in reference to the Trump phenomenon. Tough to have it both ways.


No, I think there's something to that Julio - it's just 57's incessant drum beat that I object to.

[57Brave]

No, I think there's something to that Julio - it's just 57's incessant drum beat that I object to.

"get off my lawn"

without that drum beat this would be ignored and brushed aside

[57Brave]

there is precidence. Rick Scott fleeced the taxpayers in Fla to pay his legal fees
so ...


Michigan Taxpayers Face Paying Millions In Legal Fees Over Flint Crisis
Critics called the proposals a "kick in the teeth" to those who suffered from lead-tainted water.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/michigan-governor-flint-legal-fees_us_56dfad1be4b0b25c91801ecc
.....

I have to laugh at the hand wringing on the right over the emergence of Trump.
This is just one more incidence of intolerant voting/thinking where Trump could have been stopped, but, Snyder blew all the dog whistles from unions to immigrants to abortion.
#own it

[sturg33]

"get off my lawn"

without that drum beat this would be ignored and brushed aside

But... the entire Flint legislator is democrat

[Runnin]

First Slate, now Moore! What's happening? My world is spinning.
I thought you guys were talking about Michael Mooore. lol

[BedellBrave]

I thought you guys were talking about Michael Mooore. lol


Ha! Yeah, there's about a 400 pound difference between the two. :-)

[57Brave]

GOP: Sure, we poisoned Flint. But why didn't somebody stop us!

http://www.eclectablog.com/2016/03/after-refusing-to-point-fingers-gov-snyder-points-fingers-at-congressional-flintwatercrisis-hearing.html

...............

Let’s go through some of these ridiculous government statements.

Donald Trump has called for entirely eliminating the EPA and handing power over to the states. He said this, and I quote, “Environmental protection, we waste all of this money. We’re going to bring this back to the states. […]

Another Republican candidate, Sen. Ted Cruz, agrees with Mr. Trump. He said this, and I quote, “I think states should press back using every tool they have available. […]

Marco Rubio, now a former Republican candidate, has vowed to scale back the Clean Water Act. He said this: “Regulations in this country are out of control, especially the ‘Employment Prevention Agency’, the EPA.” […]

Sen. Joni Ernst of Iowa said this: “Let’s shut down the federal EPA and focus on those issues where, here in the state, the state knows best how to protect resources.” […]

[sturg33]

But... the entire Flint legislator is democrat

^

[57Brave]

not sure what that means

[sturg33]

not sure what that means

It means stop blaming everything in the world on republicans... the flint government has failed them. The flint government is all democrats... and has been nearly a century

[57Brave]

the article posted lays plenty of blame on the EPA.
But the damage was already done.

Please research the implementation of the Emergency Manager law
I outlined, linked on the Scout board . 2010-11 ish

You obviously have not read the reports coming from Michigan
This has been an issue on the Governors doorstep for 18 months.
People in Flint still don't have water.

Not sure where your blind defense of (R) is at all viable.

I am truly curious, do you ever read anything that there is the least possibility your preconceived notions are blown to **** ?

Read, read

[sturg33]

Not sure where your blind defense of (R) is at all viable.

I am truly curious, do you ever read anything that there is the least possibility your preconceived notions are blown to **** ?



This is truly... truly hilarious coming from you

[57Brave]

here :

http://www.eclectablog.com/2016/03/breaking-gop-reps-walberg-chaffetz-lied-at-flintwatercrisis-hearing-about-meeting-with-epa-staffer-miguel-del-toral.html

[57Brave]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CeJrLBqXEAArPfH.jpg:large

[57Brave]

Flint,Mich school :


http://images.dailykos.com/images/221178/story_image/IMG_0264.JPG?1457456743

[AerchAngel]

Correct me if I am wrong, isn't everyone in that town run by BLACK Democrats? Last I knew of, the town, then the county is responsible for water, lastly the state and if a crisis the Federal government and we know how Obama handles things like that..he doesn't.

So it goes back to the city council.

So why is this an issue when no one in that town will do anything about it? I feel some hustling (white people have another name for it) is going on in this one.

[Krgrecw]

Correct me if I am wrong, isn't everyone in that town run by BLACK Democrats? Last I knew of, the town, then the county is responsible for water, lastly the state and if a crisis the Federal government and we know how Obama handles things like that..he doesn't.

So it goes back to the city council.

So why is this an issue when no one in that town will do anything about it? I feel some hustling (white people have another name for it) is going on in this one.



Apparently 57 is the only person who cares about Flint.

[AerchAngel]

Apparently 57 is the only person who cares about Flint.

And the black Democrats who run the city either unless they get some money out of it.

I think their hustling days are over if State or Feds get involved.

[57Brave]

Examination of Snyder’s internal emails reveals that the administration was well aware that the water treatment plant for Flint wasn’t yet ready to fully cleanse the polluted waters of Flint River, but pushed through the switch anyway against the warnings of water quality supervisor Michael Glasgow, who is recorded saying in April 2014 that “if water is distributed from this plant in the next couple of weeks, it will be against my direction.I need time to adequately train additional staff and to update our monitoring plans before I will feel we are ready. I will reiterate this to management above me, but they seem to have their own agenda.”

http://occupydemocrats.com/2016/04/07/just-flint-victims-file-racketeering-charges-gov-rick-snyder/

[sturg33]

So the state government wasn't able to handle it, but the federal government would be the knight and shining armor for this tiny little town led by incompetent fools?

OK then

[Oklahomahawk]

It seems to me, and again this is probably just me, that we have two distinct groups of greedy, power mad, blood sucking aholes who are all too busy trying to make political points off the suffering of other people and who are all too willing to point out the failings of "the other side" but who don't seem to give a ****e about actually making things better for anyone but themselves.

Of course this is probably just me.

[57Brave]

what does that have to do with poisoned water in Flint, Michigan ?

[Oklahomahawk]

what does that have to do with poisoned water in Flint, Michigan ?

Both parties have been in power at one level or another and should do/should have done something about this, now it seems to me that both sides want the other side to fix it and accept the blame and the people of Flint are still stuck with poisoned water.

[57Brave]

Both parties did not institute and implement the Emergency Manager. Both parties did not cut corners as noted above. Both parties have not voluntarily adressed this issue. Please read the history of the switch in water supply systems and the history of the plagued institution of Emergency Managers.

Of course there will be a flood of posts blaming the unions for the demise of the Rust Belt and a flood of posts dog whistling the poverty of the region. Both are is purely beside the point and other discussions for other days.
The point is the current administration cut corners when it came to a city's water supply. Then when the problem was discovered went to lengths to cover it up. All the while not lifting a finger to alleviate the problem.

All of these assertions have been linked earlier and can be very easily looked up.

Bottom line? Governor Snyder administration contaminated the water system of Flint. Overlooking that fact by saying both sides are at fault is a humongous change of subject

[Oklahomahawk]

Both parties did not institute and implement the Emergency Manager. Both parties did not cut corners as noted above. Both parties have not voluntarily adressed this issue. Please read the history of the switch in water supply systems and the history of the plagued institution of Emergency Managers.

Of course there will be a flood of posts blaming the unions for the demise of the Rust Belt and a flood of posts dog whistling the poverty of the region. Both are is purely beside the point and other discussions for other days.
The point is the current administration cut corners when it came to a city's water supply. Then when the problem was discovered went to lengths to cover it up. All the while not lifting a finger to alleviate the problem.

All of these assertions have been linked earlier and can be very easily looked up.

Bottom line? Governor Snyder administration contaminated the water system of Flint. Overlooking that fact by saying both sides are at fault is a humongous change of subject

I think Michael Moore might disagree with you.

[AerchAngel]

It seems the Democrat leaders who were making money off of poison water got their water (money)
shut off and now they are blaming the governor.

Typical.

My dad is a bleeding Democrat and he said the Republicans in his town wanted stipends from water and trash to stay quiet. He hated that. He admits the blacks are doing what the whites were doing in our town, ignore the problem make money and try to get COUNTY, state, FEDERAL to do something to make more money.

In Illinois under the Democrats, LOL. The governor now can't because they don't have money paying for the senators and republicans who are making 70k a year for the rest of their lives plus the government workers who are making money as well for the rest of their lives.

They said if they need to pay everyone and the current union asking price, our taxes would be higher than Alaska, California, New York and Hawaii. We are #3 right now.

My parents are up here with me now, 12 hour drive taking care of the kids while I work. My mom went to our Woodmans and was like, your stuff is much cheaper than ours. Three bags of groceries, $30 dollars, mostly produce. She ask, China? Nope, they tell you on the label, mostly local. She was in heaven. She said when she goes home, the liquor is so cheap here, she will take a lot back home with her for the wedding. Illinois and Kentucky heavily taxed those items.

Even though our town is like 40 pct black, he never won mayor. He got all the black vote and none of the whites.

[57Brave]

I think Michael Moore might disagree with you.

I posted a few months back an explanation of the process that the initial complaints and fixes constitutionally go through the Governors office. As he has hands on the administrative wheel.

Also posted as recently as this week where the administration rushed to make this happen before all of the data was in. Kinda like was done with expelling the United Nations WMD inspectors in 2002 Iraq.

Yeah, probably some (D) could have done more but ... The Governors administration pushed this through. That is a documented fact. They knew the water was contaminated before Michael Moore Barack Obama or Michelle Obama's mother.
Guess in Missouri that is called closing the barn door after the horse gets out. (D) didn't close the door fast enough after Snyder left it open and ALL the horses escaped




Let's give the benefit of the doubt and assume you got distracted and didn't get to finish the article in the Washington Times.
Big difference between the charge of "remaining silent" and "#Ethnic cleansing"

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2016/mar/7/michael-moore-rails-against-democrats-for-flint-wa/
.................................................. .................................................. .................................................. ..

Michael Moore you use a source?
Hawk - man

[BedellBrave]

OHawk, you know it can really only be the problem of one party. Dude, get with the program.

[57Brave]

FLINT, MI – Gov. Rick Snyder and other state officials allegedly withheld lead testing results from county health officials while they worked to find ways to present the information to the public, according to emails obtained by The Flint Journal.

http://www.mlive.com/news/flint/index.ssf/2016/02/snyder_ordered_deq_to_withhold.html#incart_special-report

xxx

[Oklahomahawk]

OHawk, you know it can really only be the problem of one party. Dude, get with the program.

Ah, but I can hopefully be the problem of both of these ahole parties. At least that's my goal in life. :)

[57Brave]

I re read the article posted above and didn't find anything about party politics or even a mention of what party Gov Snyder represents

Sure both parties do it blah blah blah
and both parties are corrupt blah blah blah

Counting down from 10 as I type. Sitting at 6 fully expecting that by 4 some one invokes abortion or beleaguered christians
Or AA's wife ...


Flint's poisoned water and contaminated delivery system
...................

" Even though the city reconnected to the Detroit water system in October, local and state officials have warned pregnant women and young children against using the water unless it has been tested because lead levels continue to exceed what can be handled by a filter."

[Oklahomahawk]

I re read the article posted above and didn't find anything about party politics or even a mention of what party Gov Snyder represents

Sure both parties do it blah blah blah
and both parties are corrupt blah blah blah

Counting down from 10 as I type. Sitting at 6 fully expecting that by 4 some one invokes abortion or beleaguered christians
Or AA's wife ...


Flint's poisoned water and contaminated delivery system
...................

" Even though the city reconnected to the Detroit water system in October, local and state officials have warned pregnant women and young children against using the water unless it has been tested because lead levels continue to exceed what can be handled by a filter."

Well without trying to dig up the entire sordid affair, let me just ask two quick questions.

1.) How long did the Dems govern over either/both Michigan and/or Flint in particular?
2.) Did the Dems know about Flint's water and do nothing or was it really unknown stuff until VERY recently?
3.) Did the current governor purposely ignore or cover up facts about the water supply there?

My whole point on this is not to blame or exonerate one party or the other, it just seems to me that both parties have had a chance to do something about this (maybe I"m wrong) and the Dems seem to want to point fingers at the Repubs not doing anything about it when they (maybe) have had opportunities to fix it, and the Repubs pretty clearly don't want to do anything about it for the same reason they don't want to do anything about, well anything, money.

In the meantime who's suffering? The people of Flint.

[57Brave]

It is all in the thread.

First post outlines the Emergency Manager.

There was/is no city government for all intent and purposes. It was disolved by the Governor 2011 ish(?).

Go ahead read the statute. it is scary even before knowing what was to happen to Flint

[57Brave]

Some good news


http://flintwaterstudy.org/2016/04/results-of-flint-resident-water-lead-sampling-march-2016/

[57Brave]

Read somewhere the deteriorating infrastructure of Flint is the tip of the iceberg. My understanding is there are 5 other Michigan cities alone with lead contaminated water issues.
We can write this off as a partisan squabble or face the fact we are leaving a generation of young Americans in toxic situations

This:


https://www.hillaryclinton.com/briefing/factsheets/2016/04/13/hillary-clintons-plan-to-fight-for-environmental-and-climate-justice/


“What happened in Flint would have never happened in a wealthy suburb of Detroit. It’s no coincidence that black children are twice as likely as white children to suffer from asthma, three times more likely to be hospitalized, and five times more likely to die from the disease…

“Children of color are more likely than white kids to suffer lead poisoning, which can lead to lifelong learning challenges…it’s no coincidence that nearly half of all Latinos in the United States live in places where the air does not even meet EPA public health standards or that race is the single biggest factor determining whether you live near a toxic site…climate change is going to make the burden even heavier.

“So today I’m announcing a new plan to fight for environmental justice….I want to set an ambitious national goal to eliminate lead as a major public threat within five years.

[57Brave]

Chad Livengood Verified account
‏@ChadLivengood

With Snyder in the room, Thompson said Flint residents "want the governor to come in and drink the water unfiltered out of someone’s home.”

[sturg33]

And I'd like for Bernie to give up 90% of his wealth to the government.

[57Brave]

Flint Water Crisis Yields First Criminal Charges

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/04/21/us/first-criminal-charges-are-filed-in-flint-water-crisis.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&clickSource=story-heading&module=first-column-region&region=top-news&WT.nav=top-news&_r=0

[57Brave]

This is getting interesting. Palace intrigue - wounded pols ...
No pipe repairs
sheeeesh

"Michigan AG Bill Schuette is a Republican, and in 99.92 percent of circumstances it seems unlikely he’d do anything that steps on the floppy toes of Rick Snyder’s clown shoes. However, Schuette is on everyone’s list of Guys Who Really Want To Be Governor. So there’s the possibility that Schuette sees that the emperor is wounded and thinks this might be a really good time to throw that spear. And Snyder sees that Schuette is aiming at him, and he’s ... "

http://www.dailykos.com/stories/2016/4/20/1517990/-Michigan-AG-holds-press-conference-on-Flint-charges-Rick-Snyder-gets-ready-to-conference-him-back

"Anyway. The water in Flint is still poisoned. Stay tuned."

[sturg33]

Flint Water Crisis Yields First Criminal Charges

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/04/21/us/first-criminal-charges-are-filed-in-flint-water-crisis.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&clickSource=story-heading&module=first-column-region®ion=top-news&WT.nav=top-news&_r=0

Are these like the potential criminal charges against Hilary? Or are we supposed to care about these since it favors your team?

[Garmel]

Are these like the potential criminal charges against Hilary? Or are we supposed to care about these since it favors your team?

You already know the answer to that, sturg.

[Krgrecw]

57 don't forget to set your DVR and have your tissues handy:


Lifetime is developing a TV movie centered on the drinking water contamination incident that occurred in Flint, Michigan. The water issue, which began in April 2014 after the city changed its water source, is recognized as one of the country’s worst water-involved breaches.

[57Brave]

Are these like the potential criminal charges against Hilary? Or are we supposed to care about these since it favors your team?

What you don't understand "we" is it isn't the party or "team" that is winning and losing over this it is the abject failure of an ideology.

Flint is the offspring of
government on the cheap

What you don't get is the difference between the short story and the long story

[57Brave]

http://www.vox.com/cards/flint-michigan-water-crisis


The water crisis started with a broke city under emergency management trying to save money. It turned into a scandal that could sicken as many as 8,000 children and raised tough questions for Michigan's governor.

[Krgrecw]

http://www.vox.com/cards/flint-michigan-water-crisis


The water crisis started with a broke city under emergency management trying to save money. It turned into a scandal that could sicken as many as 8,000 children and raised tough questions for Michigan's governor.



Who broke the city?

[57Brave]

that inane question is why Donald Trump is your standard bearer in the 2016 General Election.

Fix the damn pipes

[57Brave]

GALESBURG, Ill. (AP) — This railroad town promotes its ties to Abraham Lincoln, Ronald Reagan and the poet Carl Sandburg. But Galesburg's long history also shows in a hidden way: Aging pipes have been leaking lead into the drinking water for decades.

Blood tests show cause for concern. One in 20 children under the age of 6 in Knox County had lead levels exceeding the state standard for public health intervention, a rate six times higher than the Illinois average, in 2014.


http://bigstory.ap.org/article/5aff8cb852c94585a85c9dc5fa32e9d8/us-water-systems-repeatedly-exceed-federal-standard-lead

[57Brave]

Obama goes to Flint today
......
http://billmoyers.com/story/what-president-obama-needs-to-do-in-flint/#.VynhXF0w-Z4.twitter

If the crisis engulfing Flint, Michigan, had occurred in one tragic swoop, had the hard-bitten city been hit with a Superstorm Sandy or a Hurricane Katrina, the president of the United States would not have taken two years to come and personally inspect the damage. He would not have taken two years to hear directly from the victims about their needs, their losses.

But this was no act of nature wreaking mass destruction. Flint is a different kind of disaster – a totally avoidable, man-made catastrophe created by a state government hell-bent on imposing austerity at any cost.

[57Brave]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CjYOzx2WEAETRdk.jpg:large

[AerchAngel]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CjYOzx2WEAETRdk.jpg:large

Kind of hard when you have no money and the Republican Senator from Utah is holding everyone up. He is the problem not the governor.

[57Brave]

Marc Edwards, the scientist who first uncovered the crisis in Flint, described water testing in some of America’s largest cities as an “outrage”.






http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2016/jun/02/lead-water-testing-cheats-chicago-boston-philadelphia

[sturg33]

Certainly a failure from the Michigan government

[bravos4evr]

Flint is a ****hole, it would be better for the planet if they all got the lead out and croaked bunch of damn social parasites...

[57Brave]

Certainly a failure from the Michigan government

Two different issues

[Oklahomahawk]

Flint is a ****hole, it would be better for the planet if they all got the lead out and croaked bunch of damn social parasites...

That tone is SOOOO familiar. How would you feel about Bobby Cox returning as Braves' skipper? Are you an avid bike rider?

[bravos4evr]

That tone is SOOOO familiar. How would you feel about Bobby Cox returning as Braves' skipper? Are you an avid bike rider?

Bobby is old and out of touch so no.

and **** no I am not a bike rider. and no I am not someone you know.

[57Brave]

Following the Flint water crisis hearings, Ranking Member Cummings said publicly that the Committee had not received all of the information they had requested from Gov. Rick Snyder. I reached out to Rep. Cummings to follow up on that and other issues related to Flint.

http://www.eclectablog.com/2016/06/rep-elijah-cummings-gov-rick-snyder-now-appears-to-be-openly-defying-congress-regarding-the-flintwatercrisis.html

[57Brave]

Doing the right thing

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/29/us/politics/congress-shutdown-flint-spending.html?_r=0

[57Brave]

Good News:



Federal Government Approves $119M Plan to Remove Lead from Michigan Homes

The state is starting with Flint.
Yessenia Funes Nov 15, 2016 4:26PM EST



The federal government approved a $119 million lead abatement plan for the state of Michigan yesterday (November 14). The plan will distribute roughly $24 million per year in state and federal funds to Michigan over five years or until all eligible homes are lead-free.

This Centers for Medicare and Medicaid Services-approved plan amends the state’s current Children’s Health Insurance Plan (CHIP) by using CHIP funds to pay for lead removal. Therefore, homes and other residential structures receiving federal funds for lead abatement must house either someone younger than 19 who is eligible for CHIP or Medicaid or a pregnant woman who currently lives or visits there frequently.

The state will prioritize the predominantly Black city of Flint, where its almost 100,000 residents continue to face lead-contaminated drinking water, but the plan will also identify other areas that are at similar risk, according to the statement by the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services.

Michigan Department of Health and Human Services will select communities based on the percentage of the population that is low income, under the age of 6 with an elevated blood lead level, lives in pre-1978 and pre-1940 housing and “other social determinant factors” like unemployment levels, according to the CHIP amendment.

“This approval is an unprecedented step for the state and federal government in helping Flint families protect their children from the risks associated with lead,” said Nicole Lurie, assistant secretary for preparedness and response at the federal health department, in the statement.

The removal of lead will follow a typical environmental investigation with assessment including surfaces like indoor and outdoor paint, windows, floors and garages. The city must replace lead service lines before homes’ interior plumbing and fixtures can be fixed, but the plan does make clear that “related abatement may begin prior to the completion of water related activities.”
......

Curious to see what other cities are eligible

[57Brave]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C2nWv7_UAAAdMtk.jpg:large

[57Brave]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C2waHHPWQAUeOTc.jpg:large

[57Brave]

ABC News Verified account
‏@ABC

House GOP quietly closes Flint, Mich. water investigation http://abcn.ws/2hIn3NW

Bakari Sellers ‏@Bakari_Sellers 23m23 minutes ago

Bakari Sellers Retweeted ABC News

There hasn't been clean water in over 1,000 days. This is sad!

..........................

key word, quietly

[57Brave]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C3qO2wxUcAA6FUc.jpg:large

[57Brave]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C5WW97gUoAEP3qv.jpg:large

[cajunrevenge]

Sorry, priority is to send billions of dollars in foreign aid to other countries.

[AerchAngel]

Sorry, priority is to send billions of dollars in foreign aid to other countries.

Another case where Obama did not help blacks.

Oh the list of him turning his head in regards to helping the race that got him voted is LONG.

[cajunrevenge]

Yeah no, white people got Obama elected. Blacks vote for Democrats overwhelmingly regardless. What did he take them from, 88% to 95% democrat?

[thethe]

Another case where Obama did not help blacks.

Oh the list of him turning his head in regards to helping the race that got him voted is LONG.

Illegal immigration has also destroyed the African American community.

[zitothebrave]

Yeah no, white people got Obama elected. Blacks vote for Democrats overwhelmingly regardless. What did he take them from, 88% to 95% democrat?

Don't even bother with AA. In his mind the Obama getting 95% of 13% of the voter block got him elected. If Obama pulled Al Gore's 90% and 10%. Basically 16M votes vs 11M votes. Obama had 10M more votes than McCain so yes it would have eaten into it, but not enough to lose him the election. And don't pretend that those black people would have voted for McCain, McCain got about 1M black votes which is what Bush got. So yeah Obama did more to get black people to the polls, but he also did better than Gore in Asians, Hispanics, and even a little more in White votes(probably from . ANd what Obama gained in the Black voters showing up, he likely lost in White people showing up to stop him.. McCain carried 55% of the white Vote which is the same of Bush, Which makes for about 54M white votes for McCain vs. about 46 for Bush.

But the facts don't matter here. We live in a world that exists post facts where fake news is is an acceptable source.

[zitothebrave]

Illegal immigration has also destroyed the African American community.

Nope. What destroted the African American community was companies shipping jobs overseas. The majority of the black population is urban based which the majority of jobs that blacks worked int he city were working factory jobs. There's still jobs in cities but they're mainly in the financial sector and service industry to those businesses.

Also the CIA making crack and releasing it in inner cities.

[57Brave]

But the facts don't matter here. We live in a world that exists post facts where fake news is is an acceptable source.

It is only fake news if you believe it

[Julio3000]

Yeah no, white people got Obama elected. Blacks vote for Democrats overwhelmingly regardless. What did he take them from, 88% to 95% democrat?

I think you'd have to look at turnout numbers before determining that.

[thethe]

Nope. What destroted the African American community was companies shipping jobs overseas. The majority of the black population is urban based which the majority of jobs that blacks worked int he city were working factory jobs. There's still jobs in cities but they're mainly in the financial sector and service industry to those businesses.

Also the CIA making crack and releasing it in inner cities.

I agree that the first point played a role as well but illegal immigrants are taking low wage jobs and unfortunately those are the jobs that African Americans are disproportionately represented.

If liberals truly cares about African Americans they would remove a good majority of the illegal immigrants in this country.

Sounds like trumps policies (cracking down on illegal immigration and getting jobs back to america) ate more hepful to the African American community than anything Obama did.

[zitothebrave]

I agree that the first point played a role as well but illegal immigrants are taking low wage jobs and unfortunately those are the jobs that African Americans are disproportionately represented.

If liberals truly cares about African Americans they would remove a good majority of the illegal immigrants in this country.

Sounds like trumps policies (cracking down on illegal immigration and getting jobs back to america) ate more hepful to the African American community than anything Obama did.

Except nope. Most immigrants I know do the ****tiest work. We're talking migrant workers, double shifts at different fast food places, etc. And honestly I know no one who'd hire someone who doesn't speak English over someone who would for similar wage. The issue is these people are doing jobs that no one wants to do. I know plenty of people who'd rather scrap and get by than be a migrant worker.

[Hawk]

Except nope. Most immigrants I know do the ****tiest work. We're talking migrant workers, double shifts at different fast food places, etc. And honestly I know no one who'd hire someone who doesn't speak English over someone who would for similar wage. The issue is these people are doing jobs that no one wants to do. I know plenty of people who'd rather scrap and get by than be a migrant worker.

Well, hello arguments from 2002.

http://www.pewhispanic.org/2015/03/26/share-of-unauthorized-immigrant-workers-in-production-construction-jobs-falls-since-2007/

[thethe]

Let's just completely ignore all the good paying construction jobs.

[Julio3000]

Let's just completely ignore all the good paying construction jobs.

There's a pretty substantial building boom (bubble?) going on in my community...housing and CRE. There have been a couple of articles in local media over the last year or so about the lack of skilled-trade labor (carpenters, plumbers, etc.) available to support the construction boom. This is, it should be noted, in a very conservative Southern town with a lot of loud (if narrow) anti-immigrant sentiment. I'm not trying to make a particular political point with this, just noting that where I live there is a net demand for labor in that exact category.

[thethe]

There's a pretty substantial building boom (bubble?) going on in my community...housing and CRE. There have been a couple of articles in local media over the last year or so about the lack of skilled-trade labor (carpenters, plumbers, etc.) available to support the construction boom. This is, it should be noted, in a very conservative Southern town with a lot of loud (if narrow) anti-immigrant sentiment. I'm not trying to make a particular political point with this, just noting that where I live there is a net demand for labor in that exact category.

That may be the case but I'd rather legal citizens get these jobs over illegals. It may take time for the market to catch up but if the demand is there jobs will be filled eventually.

[57Brave]

why would you think building trade jobs could be filled over night?
Many of those positions take years of apprenticeships and training.

Who will train electricians,brick layers and plumbers ?

Many of the people Trumpwishes to deport come to USA after working those jobs for years.
And, willing to work 16 hours a day 7 days a week

[thethe]

why would you think building trade jobs could be filled over night?
Many of those positions take years of apprenticeships and training.

Who will train electricians,brick layers and plumbers ?

Many of the people Trumpwishes to deport come to USA after working those jobs for years.
And, willing to work 16 hours a day 7 days a week

Then labor will be filled one way or another. I'd rather legal citizens get the benefit as opposed those that are breaking the law.

[57Brave]

of course, or are you playing mister obvious today.

We do not have skilled craftsmen to fulfill the infrastructure upgrade promises made

We do not have the numbers to pick all of the fruit that will go bad in the fields

This is not a good idea.
On any level outside of scapegoating

[57Brave]

Geting back on topic.

Do we have the pipe fitters required to re-do the worn out pipes in inner cities ?
WE don't have unions to oversee Apprentice, Journeyman programs that have been the training for generations of trade workers
Hooray -- we've eliminated the unions
How short sighted your school of thought is

[zitothebrave]

Let's just completely ignore all the good paying construction jobs.

Nope. Having lived in NJ the jobs they're taking are the bottom of the barrel chrun and burn hard work construction jobs. Not good paying ones.

[zitothebrave]

Well, hello arguments from 2002.

http://www.pewhispanic.org/2015/03/26/share-of-unauthorized-immigrant-workers-in-production-construction-jobs-falls-since-2007/

So you disproved my information by confirming?

8 times as many undocumented as US born farmers and about twice as many in service (restaurant) Which again, have you ever worked in the industry? Because they're doing the jobs that most don't really want to do in that industry.

[Julio3000]

Yeah, I'm not sure how the changes in those numbers substantively affect the big picture.

[Hawk]

So you disproved my information by confirming?

8 times as many undocumented as US born farmers and about twice as many in service (restaurant) Which again, have you ever worked in the industry? Because they're doing the jobs that most don't really want to do in that industry.

Hint: Trendline

And no thanks on the anecdotal contribution.

[zitothebrave]

Hint: Trendline

And no thanks on the anecdotal contribution.

The trend is that illegals are doing different menial entry level jobs that almost no US citizen really wants to do? At least really doesn't want to do for a short period of time?

I'm sorry, but the facts are the facts, illegals are a problem, but banning them isn't the solution. An easier path to citizenship to get them to pay taxes is the solution. Or if you want to ban illegals punish people who hire illegals. Nothing will stop them if they just get a slap on the wrist and their help gets deported which they can replace with someone else.

[Julio3000]

I'm just not sure why the comprehensive immigration reform knocked down by House republicans in the last congress isn't a better solution.

[Hawk]

The trend is that illegals are doing different menial entry level jobs that almost no US citizen really wants to do? At least really doesn't want to do for a short period of time?

Again, this argument is over a decade old. Repeating it over and over again (while referencing the Mexican dishwashers you know) doesn't make it any less stale, outdated, or culturally ignorant.

Do FOB illegals often settle for undesirable jobs that are tantamount to slave labor? Yes.
Do they continue working these jobs for extended periods of time? No.
Do they have families? Children? Yes.
Are they also part of the illegal workforce? Yes.
Did you read past the first sentence of the study I linked? No.
Are you blindly ignoring the evolution of the immigrant community at-large over the past 10 years? Yes.


I'm sorry, but the facts are the facts, illegals are a problem, but banning them isn't the solution. An easier path to citizenship to get them to pay taxes is the solution. Or if you want to ban illegals punish people who hire illegals. Nothing will stop them if they just get a slap on the wrist and their help gets deported which they can replace with someone else.

Ok. Sure. Your non-existent facts are 'the facts' ... so I'll refrain from saying anything about how utterly one dimensional your viewpoint here is.

[zitothebrave]

I'm sorry but I personally know no illegals who have jobs beyond the menial. I'm sure there are some, but I'm guessing it's a small percentage.

And it's not the last decade, immigrants have been doing ****ty work for pretty much the entirety of the US. Who built the railroads? Who worked the ****ty factory conditions of early industrial revolution? Etc.

[Hawk]

I'm sorry but I personally know no illegals who have jobs beyond the menial.

:YDS:

[thethe]

:YDS:

Haha...too much.

I'm sure this sample population is tremendous.

[zitothebrave]

Haha...too much.

I'm sure this sample population is tremendous.

It's not. But considering I've personally known hung around in a healthy chunk of management circles in my day. I figure if illegals were prominently getting up the ladder, I'd have met one.

[sturg33]

I'm sorry but I personally know no illegals who have jobs beyond the menial.

LOL so you think that major corporations should be hiring illegals and paying them big money?

[zitothebrave]

LOL so you think that major corporations should be hiring illegals and paying them big money?

Not at all. Hawk seems to think that illegals are working management.

[Hawk]

Hawk seems to think that illegals are working management.

:Bowman:

[57Brave]

According to the World Health Organization, “lead affects children’s brain development resulting in reduced intelligence quotient (IQ), behavioral changes such as shortening of attention span and increased antisocial behavior, and reduced educational attainment. Lead exposure also causes anemia, hypertension, renal impairment, immunotoxicity and toxicity to the reproductive organs. The neurological and behavioral effects of lead are believed to be irreversible.”

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2015/12/15/toxic-water-soaring-lead-levels-in-childrens-blood-create-state-of-emergency-in-flint-mich/?utm_term=.5fb71272a987

[Chipper]

According to the World Health Organization, “lead affects children’s brain development resulting in reduced intelligence quotient (IQ), behavioral changes such as shortening of attention span and increased antisocial behavior, and reduced educational attainment. Lead exposure also causes anemia, hypertension, renal impairment, immunotoxicity and toxicity to the reproductive organs. The neurological and behavioral effects of lead are believed to be irreversible.”

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2015/12/15/toxic-water-soaring-lead-levels-in-childrens-blood-create-state-of-emergency-in-flint-mich/?utm_term=.5fb71272a987

Hogwash!!! They're scientists, what do they know?

[57Brave]

http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2017/03/flint-must-pay-full-price-for-undrinkable-water.html

[57Brave]

Hey progress rather than perfection. Right ?
The article says isn't "good news" but I see progress as --- progress

http://www.eclectablog.com/2017/03/mayor-karen-weaver-two-more-years-of-water-filter-use-for-flint.html
//////////////////////////

As a reminder, water filters do not work with hot water so bathing and showering will continue to be a monumental task for the people of Flint unless they are willing to risk exposure to lead

[57Brave]

Kyle Griffin‏Verified account @kylegriffin1

FLINT, Mich. (AP) — The head of Michigan's health department is charged with involuntary manslaughter in the Flint water crisis.

[57Brave]

Flint residents are headed in to the third autumn drinking bottled water and bathing babies quickly and still righteously rail against the governor ignoring their complaints, which ranged from water color to it possibly causing rashes and other problems. Genesee County also has seen at least 88 cases of Legionnaires', 61 of them in people exposed to Flint water.

http://www.freep.com/story/news/columnists/rochelle-riley/2016/08/24/riley-nobodys-off-table-michigans-probe-flint-crisis/89253672/

[AerchAngel]

Flint residents are headed in to the third autumn drinking bottled water and bathing babies quickly and still righteously rail against the governor ignoring their complaints, which ranged from water color to it possibly causing rashes and other problems. Genesee County also has seen at least 88 cases of Legionnaires', 61 of them in people exposed to Flint water.

http://www.freep.com/story/news/columnists/rochelle-riley/2016/08/24/riley-nobodys-off-table-michigans-probe-flint-crisis/89253672/

The received 27 mil and the Democratic counsel that overseen it. What did they do with the money? Hmmmmmm?

[Krgrecw]

The received 27 mil and the Democratic counsel that overseen it. What did they do with the money? Hmmmmmm?

Aa, flint is proof that blacks that make something of thier lives (council, prez, etc) even hate and want nothing to do with inner cities. They'll come around when they want votes but they really don't care about them.

[AerchAngel]

Aa, flint is proof that blacks that make something of thier lives (council, prez, etc) even hate and want nothing to do with inner cities. They'll come around when they want votes but they really don't care about them.

Its okay, 57 is a racist that wants black under his foot so if they can make money off of what the government give them, it is okay by him. That is why I can't stand that motherfu*cker. If I saw him in real life I would spit a loogy in his face and that is not assault and if he did try, I would get the ACLU involved and I will say he offended my race which he does constantly with his paternalism.

I send his post to my folks, my cousins and they all agreed with me, he is a sorry piece of sh*t closet racist. No wonder he hates it when I post as a black man. I speak the real truth, not that Democrat Liberal version of their truth, or I should say their "talking" points.

[57Brave]

The received 27 mil and the Democratic counsel that overseen it. What did they do with the money? Hmmmmmm?

Bought bottled water and began re engineering the pipes.
One of the articles posted says as much


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NrGeOHpEGk0

[57Brave]

https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2017/8/17/1690849/-EPA-report-20-of-the-nation-has-been-exposed-to-potentially-unsafe-drinking-water-in-past-decade




The findings highlight how six decades of industrial dumping, farming pollution, and water plant and distribution pipe deterioration have taken a toll on local water systems. Those found to have problems cleaning their water typically took more than two years to fix these issues, with some only recently resolving decades-old violations of EPA standards and others still delivering tainted water, according to data from the agency’s Safe Drinking Water Information System.

Many local water treatment plants, especially those in small, poor and minority communities, can’t afford the equipment necessary to filter out contaminants. Those can include arsenic found naturally in rock, chemicals from factories and nitrates and fecal matter from farming. In addition, much of the country’s aging distribution pipes delivering the water to millions of people are susceptible to lead contamination, leaks, breaks and bacterial growth. [...]

“We’re in this really stupid situation where, because of neglect of the infrastructure, we’re spending our scarce resources on putting our fingers in the dike, if you will, taking care of these emergencies, but we’re not doing anything to think about the future in terms of what we should be doing,” said Jeffrey Griffiths, a former member of the Drinking Water Committee at the EPA’s Science Advisory Board.

[57Brave]

https://www.publicintegrity.org/2017/08/21/21114/crumbling-pipes-tainted-water-plague-black-communities?utm_content=buffer20b75&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=publici-buffer

Like many poor African-American communities, Campti’s poverty is a significant impediment to making crucial improvements to the town’s infrastructure – including its old water system. Hayes is a lifelong resident of the town, where according to the U.S. Census Bureau, more than half of the predominantly African-American population lives in poverty. Campti’s median household income is only $15,428.

[57Brave]

https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2017/9/21/1700356/-Study-reveals-Flint-water-crisis-lead-to-increased-infertility-and-fetal-death-rates


Fertility rates decreased by 12% among Flint women, and fetal death rates increased by 58%, after April 2014, according to research by assistant professors and health economists David Slusky at Kansas University and Daniel Grossman at West Virginia University. The pair examined vital statistics data for Flint and the rest of the state of Michigan from 2008 to 2015, zoomed down to the census-tract level.

That post-April 2014 time period is significant, because that's when — in an effort to save money — the city of Flint switched from water supplied by the city of Detroit to using the Flint River as a drinking water source, without adding needed anti-corrosives to the water. Lead levels in drinking water supplies spiked as a result.

...



There is no safe level of lead in the body, but the impacts of lead are considered most severe on the developing brains and nervous systems of children and fetuses. It can lead to lower intelligence, behavioral problems and diminished life achievement, according to researchers. And the damage is irreversible; it cannot be undone. [...]

Babies born in Flint were also nearly 150 grams lighter than in other areas, were born a half-week earlier and gained 5 grams per week less than babies in other areas examined over the time period.
/////////////////////////////////////

this comment:


xaxnar
Sep 21 · 03:42:25 PM

Call it environmental ethnic cleansing. The poor, minorities are always expendable.

[57Brave]

The Rude Pundit‏ @rudepundit 1h1 hour ago

Republicans' Fake Concern for Fetuses: Flint Edition:

https://shar.es/1Vu2CX


There is something I keep coming back to whenever I read or hear about Flint, something I wrote back in January 2016: "Michigan has a $700 million surplus in its state budget. It would have cost perhaps $100 a day to put phosphates into the water when the supply was first switched to prevent the water from corroding the pipes" and leeching lead into the water. It was forseeable and preventable. An ounce of prevention, man, just the tiniest bit. I wonder how much funding was spent on things like the militarization of the police instead of making people's homes safe at a fundamental level.

[57Brave]

oh yeah, what with uninsuring millions of kids / giving themselves a tax break /the bungled response to a natural disaster
Flint has been without drinking water for over 750 days.

wonder where else ?
What is in your water ?
How old are your pipes ?

Trump kids cost the government $300K to go skiing.
Suppose that money went toward ...

[Jaw]

http://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/michigan/flint-water-crisis/2017/10/02/consolidated-class-action-lawsuit-flint/106233252/

Attorneys for 21 law firms have filed a consolidated class-action lawsuit against two engineering firms, Flint officials and state officials including Michigan Gov. Rick Snyder and former state Treasurer Andy Dillon over Flint’s lead-contaminated water.

In June, Federal Judge Judith Levy in Ann Arbor ruled that Flint residents have sufficiently argued that the conduct of government officials “was so egregious as to shock the conscience” — a key legal standard. Levy ordered the lawyers to consolidate the arguments after she dismissed other parts of the lawsuit.

The lawsuit argues that the engineering firms and government officials unconstitutionally did not treat the predominantly black residents of Flint the same as the predominantly white residents of great Genesee County. The suit on behalf of Flint’s 100,000 residents and other users of its water system also says the defendants acted recklessly and did not respect residents’ due process rights.


The defendants “devised or acquiesced to an Interim Plan that allowed the predominately white water users of Genesee County to receive the safe superior water from DWSD and the predominately black water users of Flint would have to accept during the interim period grossly inferior, previously rejected and potentially unsafe Flint River water,” according to the lawsuit filed Friday.

In late July, a three-judge panel of the 6th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals allowed plaintiffs in one case before Levy to try to seek relief from Snyder in the form of compensation for education, medical monitoring and evaluation services for ongoing harm from Flint’s lead-contaminated water. In the other case, the appeals judges dismissed the possibility of seeking penalties for Snyder, the state of Michigan, the state Department of Environmental Quality and the Michigan Department of Health and Human Services.

All three judges -- appointed by Democratic presidents -- argued that the 11th Amendment gives the state and Snyder immunity against damages sought by private citizens.


The residents can't even sue the politicians who were supposed to be serving them. What a disgrace.

[57Brave]

Matt Pearce‏Verified account @mattdpearce

After Flint's water was poisoned in 2014, fertility decreased 12% among women and fetal death rates increased 58%.

[57Brave]

Brookings‏Verified account @BrookingsInst

70% of the world’s people will live in cities by 2050. How digital technology can make urban areas safer

: http://brook.gs/2i0bJxN
.................................................. .........

and our cities are old and insufficient. The water undrinkable and the electrical grid outdated

[57Brave]

http://www.eclectablog.com/2016/12/billionaire-betsy-devos-trumps-pick-for-sec-of-education-has-even-found-a-way-to-profit-from-the-flintwatercrisis.html


The DeVos connection to Boxed Water is a short straight line. DeVos is the chairwoman of a privately held investment group named The Windquest Group:

..................

[57Brave]

Alison Young‏Verified account @alisonannyoung

Flint 3rd grade reading proficiency dropped from 41.8% in 2013,

the first year of the lead water poisoning, to 10.7%


https://www.freep.com/story/news/columnists/rochelle-riley/2018/02/06/sh-h-h-snyder-state-update-left-out-75-drop-reading-proficiency-flint/1074057001/

[AerchAngel]

57 look at these dates and who was responsible and in charge. I will skip the city setup as from major on down are all Democrats. (https://www.cnn.com/2016/03/04/us/flint-water-crisis-fast-facts/index.html)

Oct 15, 2015
Jan 5, 2016
MOST IMPORTANT Jan 14, 2016

It seems that both sides, greed, negligence and a whole lot of crap has went on. This is not solely on one party since the EPA under Obama basically ignored them.

GM leaving the city hurt the most because all the jobs (good ones) have left and it wasn't replaced. So whatever scraps that were leftover the Democrat council of the city entrenched themselves but neglected to do anything until it was too late.

If the city management (all Democrats) done something in the beginning, this could've been avoided.

[57Brave]

The history of this crisis has been reviewed ad nauseum.

What is new is test scores results and consequences of failing infrastructure. Coming in from grade schools no less
Wanna bet Flint isn't the only city ?

[AerchAngel]

The history of this crisis has been reviewed ad nauseum.

What is new is test scores results and consequences of failing infrastructure. Coming in from grade schools no less
Wanna bet Flint isn't the only city ?

The only issue I have with this is you are blaming one party and one party only when it is every party from the bottom to the top including the last three presidents.

[Krgrecw]

The only issue I have with this is you are blaming one party and one party only when it is every party from the bottom to the top including the last three presidents.

Baltimore has schools where no student is proficient. What does Baltimore and Detroit have in common?

[57Brave]

The only issue I have with this is you are blaming one party and one party only when it is every party from the bottom to the top including the last three presidents.

I blame indifference

[Jaw]

The history of this crisis has been reviewed ad nauseum.

What is new is test scores results and consequences of failing infrastructure. Coming in from grade schools no less
Wanna bet Flint isn't the only city ?

I expect (and hope) that some of this drop is because everyone who had the means has fled the area to some place where the dang water isn't poisonous.

Regardless, this is inexcusable. This president and the last should have declared a state of emergency for Flint and done whatever necessary to fix it. Poisonous tap water in a major metropolitan area of America. Unbelievable.

[57Brave]

To the point of similarities between Flint and Baltimore -- poverty


"... under federal law, only natural disasters such as hurricanes and floods are eligible for disaster declarations, federal and state officials said. The lead contamination of Flint's drinking water is a man-made catastrophe."

For an in time overview with context read the first pages of this thread. Links galore

[57Brave]

http://www.businessinsider.com/drinking-water-could-get-dirtier-trump-infrastructure-plan-2018-2


According to a study of more than three decades of the nation's tap water records, which was also released on Monday, some of the country's smaller water utilities are already struggling with the chore of keeping tap water clean. Roughly 16 million Americans get exposed to stomach bugs from drinking water coming out of their faucets each year. Some also get exposed to cancer and neurological disorders, the study authors wrote in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences.

[57Brave]

http://www.eclectablog.com/2018/04/less-than-a-month-after-tests-show-elevated-lead-levels-in-flint-state-stops-distributing-bottled-water.html


So, Flint is on its own. The state took over the city, poisoned its water, killed a dozen residents due to an outbreak of Legionnaires’ Disease, destroyed its infrastructure, imposed an austerity budget on the beleaguered city, and then handed them back the keys to the kingdom. It’s the sort of story that you expect to hear about in a banana republic, not in a modern U.S. city. But that’s life under a corporatist Republican who set out to show how a state government should be run like a business.

[sturg33]

Lol, Flint too, is republican fault.

Love it

[57Brave]

Like most Rust Belt cities, the infrastructure is old and decaying .
Decisions made at the state level during the Snyder Administration did little to ease the situation
https://www.google.com/search?q=flint+michigan+water+crisis&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&client=firefox-b-1-ab
You tell me

oh, I don't know about (R) "fault"
kinda like Puerto Rico (Maria) or New Orleans (Katrina) , it wasn't (R) fault there was a hurricane.
The response and civic responsibility was less than overwhelming.
Their governance leaves much to be desired

Not their fault like say ... Iraq.
.................


3-2-1
"HRC and Kerry voted ..."

[57Brave]

Josh Fox
‏Verified account @joshfoxfilm
30m30 minutes ago

In Flint, Mich., there’s so much lead in children’s blood that a state of emergency is declared



The story I (didn't) saw is behind a WaPo paywall

Wonder how your water is fairing -- and if there is a CDC study to reference ?
Flint is not an isolated incident

[57Brave]

https://scontent-atl3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/30740910_1673300196090652_4719054503427907954_n.jp g?_nc_cat=0&_nc_eui2=v1%3AAeHjHjJNfkJrx3zXtBkRr3FZztetsrvaIJ9c ZAww8BbLunApcP57WUnd4gywQ9oaeyUUSyDEI-ni544lq22tZpmSt2T-iZ6i7lfs7aoGY6IxuQ&oh=bc37a6740b0919a3cf698dff85bc17b6&oe=5B68BC96

https://www.esquire.com/news-politics/politics/news/a41309/justin-amash-federal-aid-flint/

[cajunrevenge]

https://youtu.be/VOVzSoNkbGk


sure would pay for a lot of clean water......

[sturg33]

Leave it to the private sector

1017614594607493122

[57Brave]

Not so sure we characterize this as "private sector" -- I see more a lone philanthropist applying a band aid.
Never the less a good deed

http://fortune.com/2018/10/08/musk-gives-clean-water-flint-schools/

but it still doesn't solve the problem of a crumbling worn out water system.
Not only in Flint

But what if we ALL contribute of say $5 per month at the appropriated time we could get a jump and begin the process
We really need an Infrastructure Week where we the people get and stay focused issues of electrical grid, water and gas delivery system, Public transportation, recycling and refuse removal .

---- successes and failures ---

Perhaps once it starts showing successes --- good faith sucesses --- we start contributing $7-8 a month at the appropriated time until we are again up and running.

Water filters though a nice/good thing are not going to put all of this back together

[57Brave]

came across this this morning

thoughts ????


Gerry Canavan
‏ @gerrycanavan
20h20 hours ago

I really think if more Americans traveled overseas regularly they would

be stunned by how dirty, broken-down, and generally dysfunctional essentially

all infrastructure in the US is, both public (roads, buses, trains)

and private (cell networks, laundromats).

[57Brave]

https://66.media.tumblr.com/1f70c399ae2a5f48b566e8c9fa6ea06e/tumblr_p76dvd2pA21v2d0ejo1_540.jpg

[57Brave]

LANSING – Gov. Gretchen Whitmer, in a response to the Flint water crisis and more recent concerns about drinking water quality, signed an executive directive Wednesday requiring state employees to immediately report to their bosses any threat to public health or safety.

https://www.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/flint-water-crisis/2019/01/02/gretchen-whitmer-michigan-flint-water-crisis/2463552002/

//////////////////////////////////////////////////

LANSING, Mich. - Michigan Attorney General Dana Nessel is asking Wayne County Prosecutor Kym Worthy to take over criminal cases connected to the Flint water crisis.

https://www.clickondetroit.com/news/flint-water-crisis/michigan-ag-nessel-asks-wayne-county-prosecutor-worthy-to-take-over-flint-water-cases

[57Brave]

Brian Krassenstein
‏ @krassenstein

BOOM!!

15 people have just been charged in the Flint, Michigan water contamination disaster.

Charges are pending on an additional 8 individuals!

Thanks you Justice system!

[57Brave]

Imagine the good that could be done with a $5.7B investment in re piping our cities

[Krgrecw]

Imagine the good that could be done with a $5.7B investment in re piping our cities

Why didn’t Obama do it?

[57Brave]

Why didn’t Obama do it?

because Presidents dont spend money without authorization of congress.
The House specifically
So we will never know whether he would have or not

your question is the same as why doesn't Trump build the wall

[57Brave]

https://6abc.com/education/wolf-says-$45b-plan-could-help-schools-clean-up-lead-paint/5210447/

[57Brave]

Eyewitness News
‏Verified account @ABC7NY

Residents see purple water after pump malfunction
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D8Pvm4LXkAEwjG0.jpg

https://7ny.tv/2IlxvsF



Bernie Sanders
‏Verified account @BernieSanders
15h15 hours ago

Bernie Sanders Retweeted Eyewitness News

This is the wealthiest country in the world. Americans need to be confident

they have clean drinking water. Period. When we are in the White House we will pass the

WATER Act to overhaul our nation's water infrastructure.

[57Brave]

David Eggert
@DavidEggert00
·
18m
BREAKING DETROIT (AP) --

The AP has learned ex-Michigan Gov. Snyder and others

have been told they’re being charged in Flint water scandal.

[Jaw]

The American Solidarity Party believes clean drinking water is a human right.

[57Brave]

By Julie Bosman
Jan. 13, 2021

Rick Snyder, the former governor of Michigan who oversaw the state when a water crisis devastated the city of Flint, has been charged with two counts of willful neglect of duty, according to court records.

The charges are misdemeanors punishable by imprisonment of up to one year or a maximum fine of $1,000.

Prosecutors in Michigan will report their findings in a wide-ranging investigation into the water crisis on Thursday, officials said, a long-awaited announcement that is also expected to include charges against several other officials and top advisers to Mr. Snyder.

The findings will be announced by Dana Nessel, the Michigan attorney general, Fadwa Hammoud, the state’s solicitor general, and Kym L. Worthy, Wayne County’s top prosecutor.


Charges had previously been filed in connection to the crisis, which began in 2014, but in June 2019, prosecutors stunned Flint by dropping all pending charges.

Fifteen state and local officials, including emergency managers who ran the city and a member of the governor’s cabinet, had been accused by state prosecutors of crimes as serious as involuntary manslaughter. Seven had already taken plea deals. Eight more, including most of the highest-ranking officials, were awaiting trial.

Brian Lennon, a lawyer for Mr. Snyder, said on Wednesday evening, “We believe there is no evidence to support any criminal charges against Gov. Snyder.”


Randall Levine, a lawyer for Richard L. Baird, a former top adviser to Mr. Snyder, said on Tuesday that he was informed this week that Mr. Baird would be among the people facing charges connected to the water crisis.

“At this time, we have not been made aware of what the charges are, or how they are related to his position with former Michigan Governor Rick Snyder’s administration,” Mr. Levine said. “Rich’s relationship with the Flint community has always been strong. When the Flint water crisis hit, he wasn’t assigned by Governor Snyder to go to Flint, but rather he raised his hand and volunteered.”

In 2016, Mr. Snyder offered an apology for what had happened, but for many residents in Flint, it did not go far enough.

“He pushed this whole thing to the side, and he pushed people to the side,” said Floyd Bell, a Flint resident whose two small grandchildren were poisoned by lead when they were babies and still struggle developmentally. “If he was truly aware of what was going on, he should be held accountable.”

Dr. Mona Hanna-Attisha, a Flint pediatrician who warned officials about lead in the drinking supply, said that the prospect of new charges was a reminder that “accountability and justice are critical to health and recovery.”

“This news is a salve, but it isn’t the end of the story,” she said in an email. “Healing wounds and restoring trust will take decades and long-term resources.”

Melissa Mays, one of the first people in Flint to draw attention to the problems with the city’s water, said that given the silence from the attorney general’s office for more than 18 months, she was apprehensive that the charges would go far enough.


“We in Flint have been living in prison for the past almost 7 years and being forced to pay for water that’s still being piped through corroded and damaged infrastructure in the streets and in our homes while the people responsible have been walking free,” she wrote in an email. “We in Flint deserve REAL justice and that means wealthy, white politicians and agency heads going to jail for their actions and inaction that’s caused so much harm and loss to us.”

[nsacpi]

willful neglect of duty

hmmm

[Carp]

The charges are misdemeanors punishable by imprisonment of up to one year or a maximum fine of $1,000.


So basically nobody is actually going to pay for willfully poisoning Americans. Awesome.

[Jaw]

It's been nearly 7 years that this has been a problem.

For comparison, the US built 6,000 cargo ships in 5 years during WW2, and commissioned 1,200 major combatant ships, including twenty-seven aircraft carriers and 18 battleships.

There is a bipartisan lack of will to fix it, and we are in decline.

[Carp]

It's been nearly 7 years that this has been a problem.

For comparison, the US built 6,000 cargo ships in 5 years during WW2, and commissioned 1,200 major combatant ships, including twenty-seven aircraft carriers and 18 battleships.

There is a bipartisan lack of will to fix it, and we are in decline.


We can send Pakistan 25 million for gender studies and spend like 10 billion on a useless wall.

But clean drinking water for Americans? Nah, we good.

[zitothebrave]

It's been nearly 7 years that this has been a problem.

For comparison, the US built 6,000 cargo ships in 5 years during WW2, and commissioned 1,200 major combatant ships, including twenty-seven aircraft carriers and 18 battleships.

There is a bipartisan lack of will to fix it, and we are in decline.

I think fixing the problem is expensive. But worth it and it's not like we haven't spent the money towards it.

I would love it if the Federal Government got their **** together and actually did something. But that's way too expensive. They can easily divert a few billion here and there but the estimated 1 trillion it would take to fix all the water problems in the US, that is too big of a pill to swallow. Even if in the last 20 years we've spent over 5.4 Trillion dollars on the "War on Terror" with an estimated another trillion coming in Vet care. And what do we have to show for the War on Terror? Middle East stability? Less terrorism?

[nsacpi]

#infrastructure

[Tapate50]

I think fixing the problem is expensive. But worth it and it's not like we haven't spent the money towards it.

I would love it if the Federal Government got their **** together and actually did something. But that's way too expensive. They can easily divert a few billion here and there but the estimated 1 trillion it would take to fix all the water problems in the US, that is too big of a pill to swallow. Even if in the last 20 years we've spent over 5.4 Trillion dollars on the "War on Terror" with an estimated another trillion coming in Vet care. And what do we have to show for the War on Terror? Middle East stability? Less terrorism?

Everything the government does is inefficient.

[57Brave]

I think fixing the problem is expensive. But worth it and it's not like we haven't spent the money towards it.

I would love it if the Federal Government got their **** together and actually did something. But that's way too expensive. They can easily divert a few billion here and there but the estimated 1 trillion it would take to fix all the water problems in the US, that is too big of a pill to swallow. Even if in the last 20 years we've spent over 5.4 Trillion dollars on the "War on Terror" with an estimated another trillion coming in Vet care. And what do we have to show for the War on Terror? Middle East stability? Less terrorism?


".... and $111 billion for water infrastructure — including $45 billion to ensure no child ever is forced to drink water from a lead pipe, which can slow children’s development and lead to behavioral and other problems."

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/31/business/economy/biden-infrastructure-plan.html?action=click&module=Spotlight&pgtype=Homepage

[57Brave]

Antonio Arellano
@AntonioArellano
BREAKING:

The Biden-Harris admin just announced that all US states and territories

will receive a new round of funding to fix America’s vast underground

water system and replace miles of corroded pipes that are creating health risks.



Replacing Lead Pipes

The general-purpose drinking water funding announced today can also be used to replace toxic lead pipes, accelerating progress towards the President’s goal of replacing every lead service line in the country.
The Bipartisan Infrastructure Law also includes a historic $15 billion in dedicated funding for lead pipe replacement. To date, EPA has announced $6 billion of this funding, which will help replace hundreds of thousands of lead pipes. EPA will announce additional lead pipe replacement funding from the Bipartisan Infrastructure for 2024 in the coming months.
Since Vice President Harris last visited Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania in June 2022 to highlight the importance of replacing lead pipes and securing clean water access, the city has received $42 million from the Bipartisan Infrastructure Law for lead pipe replacement, helping Pittsburgh towards its goal of replacing 100% of its lead pipes by 2026.
In November 2023, EPA proposed updates to the Lead and Copper Rule that require water systems to replace lead service lines within 10 years. EPA is also financing major lead pipe replacement projects through its WIFIA (Water Infrastructure Finance and Innovation Act) loan program. EPA announced low-interest loans of $340 million to the City of Philadelphia and $336 million to the City of Chicago to replace tens of thousands of lead pipes while creating thousands of jobs.
The Administration’s Get the Lead Out (GLO) Initiative – launched in November 2023 as a part of the President’s goal of replacing all lead service lines within a decade – establishes a partnership with 200 underserved communities nationwide to provide the technical assistance they need to access federal funding and remove lead service lines from their communities. This initiative builds on EPA and the Department of Labor’s partnership with 40 underserved communities to support lead pipe replacement.

https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/statements-releases/2024/02/20/fact-sheet-biden-harris-administration-announces-nearly-6-billion-for-clean-drinking-water-and-wastewater-infrastructure-as-part-of-investing-in-america-tour/

[chop2chip]

I’m not educated on the fine print so I reserved the right to have anyone’s corrections noted in advance.

I do support public infrastructure spending. My only concern is projects like these usually are kicked off with a warm fuzzy announcement and are never heard from again. Our government is S tier at writing checks, but F tier at cashing them.

[sturg33]

I’m not educated on the fine print so I reserved the right to have anyone’s corrections noted in advance.

I do support public infrastructure spending. My only concern is projects like these usually are kicked off with a warm fuzzy announcement and are never heard from again. Our government is S tier at writing checks, but F tier at cashing them.

what do you mean? this thread was started over 8 years ago

[57Brave]

Much to the consternation of their supporters our current administration has been horrible at publicizing their infrastructure projects / successes


https://www.reuters.com/world/us/bidens-infrastructure-law-has-begun-40000-projects-will-it-help-him-2024-2023-11-10/


Everyone from Marco Rubio (Ron Desantis) to Lauren Bobbit has claimed credit for the ground breaking of infrastructure
projects to their district all the while voting en bloc against funding said projects.

You can and should feel free to look all that up.
As I noted above the disappointment to POTUS supporters the lack of victory lap.