Russia Collusion Scandal (aka A Leftist fantasy)

[Runnin]

Thought it was time for its own thread.

Don, Jr. has hired N.Y. criminal lawyer, Alan Futerfas, to represent him. Futerfas, pronounced just like it reads, [FOO der fahs], has long represented clients such as alleged members of the Bonanno, Colombo, Gambino, and Genovese crime families. This seems like a kind of development.

But Trump cult members should not worry yet. The Donald makes the best deals, right? If a couple of people, be they family members or not, need to spend a few years in prison to protect "the administration", then so be it.

[Runnin]

Some of the actors in this drama:

https://img.huffingtonpost.com/asset/596429f41500006303bfcf23.png?ops=scalefit_720_noup scale

[57Brave]

Democratic House Candidates Were Also Targets of Russian Hacking

By ERIC LIPTON and SCOTT SHANE


https://www.nytimes.com/2016/12/13/us/politics/house-democrats-hacking-dccc.html



“It was like I was standing out there naked,” said Annette Taddeo, a Democrat who lost her primary race after secret campaign documents were made public. “I just can’t describe it any other way. Our entire internal strategy plan was made public, and suddenly all this material was out there and could be used against me.”

.....................................

Notice the date Dec 2016 and if memory serves I posted this article at the time.
Seems like a long time ago, doesn't it ?

[nsacpi]

The Donald makes the best deals, right?

He's gonna win so much for the American people, it's gonna be incredible. So many great deals. So many.

[Runnin]

He's gonna win so much for the American people, it's gonna be incredible. So many great deals. So many.

I guess by "American people" he means the fake media and lawyers in Washington, all of which are living off his exploits.

[nsacpi]

that's quite an email chain being dumped by junior...i guess he figured if the times had it he might as well share with the public...his commitment to transparency is commendable...highly commendable...

[Runnin]

“This is obviously very high level and sensitive information but is part of Russia and its government’s support for Mr. Trump ― helped along by Aras and Emin,” Goldstone added. “What do you think is the best way to handle this information and would you be able to speak to Emin about it directly?”

Trump Jr. replied, “If it’s what you say I love it.”

[nsacpi]

“This is obviously very high level and sensitive information but is part of Russia and its government’s support for Mr. Trump ― helped along by Aras and Emin,” Goldstone added. “What do you think is the best way to handle this information and would you be able to speak to Emin about it directly?”

Trump Jr. replied, “If it’s what you say I love it.”

smoking gun

btw the times headline about having the email could have been a bluff...i wonder if junior considered that possibility

[Runnin]

smoking gun

btw the times headline about having the email could have been a bluff...i wonder if junior considered that possibility

He does not seem like the considering type. This is why a smart, caring parent would protect his family from the dirty mess of politics.

[nsacpi]

He does not seem like the considering type. This is why a smart, caring parent would protect his family from the dirty mess of politics.

Apparently there are tapes out there of Donald talking very disparagingly about the intelligence of his sons. I wonder if he will reconsider.

[Julio3000]

To quote another of my favorite pop culture evergreens: This life's hard, but it's harder when you're stupid.

[Julio3000]

But have you guys considered how many yachts and vacation homes in the Hamptons those lawyers are going to buy? Massive economic stimulus. MAGA trickle-down.

[57Brave]

As Sarah Vowell taught us 10 years ago, everything in American life can be found / described by the Godfather.

How did Fredo react to his capabilities being marginalized and passed over by his younger brother ?

Is Jr the flip we all knew was coming ?

....................

Fredo Corleone: I'm your older brother, Mike (Ivanka/Jared) , and I was stepped over!
Michael Corleone: That's the way Pop wanted it.
Fredo Corleone: It ain't the way I wanted it! I can handle things! I'm smart! Not like everybody says... like dumb... I'm smart and I want respect!

[Julio3000]

As Sarah Vowell taught us 10 years ago, everything in American life can be found / described by the Godfather.

How did Fredo react to his capabilities being marginalized and passed over by his younger brother ?

Is Jr the flip we all knew was coming ?

My dude, they're ALL Fredo.

[Super]

My dude, they're ALL Fredo.

http://replygif.net/i/1408.gif

[The Chosen One]

The hilariously sad thing to me is, Junior basically admits to committing treason, well brags about it. Silver Spoon baby not sure if it's naivety or arrogance that he truly feels he cannot be touched because of how wealthy his family is. His dad was also a silver spoon baby, so the symptoms just enhance to his generation.

[Runnin]

And still not a tweet out of Pop to protect his son.

Evidently the FBI was already following this Russian lawyer and the meeting was recorded.

http://replygif.net/i/1408.gif

[57Brave]

Question is, how do we fix this ?

The EPA is gutted PP is gutted, education system is gutted the courts are gutted we have an illegitimate Supreme Court justice
and we aren't even 6 months into this.

That puts us 18 months until we can reverse the Congress when at least these people will be held accountable.
Remember, impeachment begins in the House
...

oh yeah, Health Care- almost forgot about that
Tillerson ties to Russian oil

What a fookin mess

[Julio3000]

Question is, how do we fix this ?

The EPA is gutted PP is gutted, education system is gutted the courts are gutted we have an illegitimate Supreme Court justice
and we aren't even 6 months into this.

That puts us 18 months until we can reverse the Congress when at least these people will be held accountable.
Remember, impeachment begins in the House
...

oh yeah, Health Care- almost forgot about that

Yeah, sadly, this is the big picture.

[Julio3000]

https://youtu.be/enyM_htgeWM

[57Brave]

Michael Cohen‏ @speechboy71 2m2 minutes ago

I'm struggling to come up with a reaction to these emails. It's so mind-bogglingly stupid it just beggars the imagination
4 replies 1 retweet 18 likes
Michael Cohen‏ @speechboy71 1m1 minute ago

How can people be this dumb? Better question: how the hell did 62 million people vote for them?


I mean, this is treason, right? How else can this be described?


And if Trump knew - and I have to assume he did - then he committed treason also. JFC we are so far down the rabbit hole right now.

[goldfly]

who cares about treason when you are making the best deals to make america great again by propping up your family name and giving tax cuts to rich people by taking insurance away from people that need it while playing golf every weekend?

[goldfly]

June 16th, 2015: Donald Trump announces his candidacy for President of the United States.

Circa Summer 2015: The US government alleges that Russian hackers first gain access to DNC computer networks.

Circa August 2015: Trump staff arranges first meeting between Trump and General Flynn, according to Flynn’s account in an August 2016 interview with The Washington Post. “I got a phone call from his team. They asked if he would be willing meet with Mr. Trump and I did. … In late summer 2015.”

August 8th, 2015: Roger Stone leaves formal role in Trump campaign. Whether he quits or was fired is disputed. Stone will continue as a key, albeit informal advisor, for the remainder of the campaign.

December 10th, 2015: Michael Flynn attends conference and banquet in Moscow to celebrate the 10th anniversary of RT (formerly Russia today). Flynn is seated next to Russian President Vladimir Putin at the concluding banquet.

March 19th, 2016: Hackers successfully hack into Clinton campaign Chairman John Podesta’s email.

March 21st, 2016: In a meeting with The Washington Post editorial board, Trump provides a list of five foreign policy advisors. The list includes Carter Page but not Michael Flynn. The list is Walid Phares, Carter Page, George Papadopoulos, Joe Schmitz, and ret. Lt. Gen. Keith Kellogg.

March 28th, 2016: Trump campaign hires Paul Manafort to oversee delegate operations for campaign. Manafort becomes the dominant figure running the campaign by late April and takes over as campaign manager on June 21st with the firing of campaign manager Corey Lewandowski.

February-April 2016: Flynn advisory relationship with Trump appears to have solidified over the Spring of 2016. In late January Flynn is mentioned as an advisor who has “regular interactions” with Trump. There are similar mentions in February and March. Yet as late as mid-March, Flynn appeared to downplay his ties to Trump. By May Flynn is routinely listed as an advisor and by late May is even being mooted as a possible vice presidential pick.

April 2016: DNC network administrators first notice suspicious activity on Committee computer networks in late April, 2016, according to The Washington Post. The DNC retains the services of network security firm Crowdstrike which expels hackers from the DNC computer network. Crowdstrike tells The Washington Post it believes hackers had been operating inside the DNC networks since the Summer of 2015.

April 19th, 2016: “DCLeaks.com” url/address registered.

May 3rd, 2016: Donald J. Trump becomes becomes presumptive nominee after Ted Cruz and John Kasich withdraw from race.

May 26th, 2016: Donald J. Trump officially secure majority of GOP delegates, officially clinching the nomination of the Republican party.

June 8th, 2016: First tweet posted to “DCLeaks” Twitter account.

June 9th, 2016: Donald Trump, Jr., Jared Kushner and Paul Manafort meet with Natalia Veselnitskaya. Trump agreed to take the meeting after being told by Trump associate Rob Goldstone that Veselnitskaya had damaging information about Hillary Clinton which came from a Russian government operation to help his father Donald J. Trump.

June 12th, 2016: Julian Assange first announces that Wikileaks has Clinton emails which are soon to be released. “Wikileaks has a very big year ahead … We have emails related to Hillary Clinton which are pending publication.”

June 14, 2016: Washington Post publishes first account of hacking of the DNC computer networks, allegedly by hackers working on behalf of the Russian government.

June 15th, 2016: “Guccifer 2.0”, later identified by US government officials and other private sector analysts as a fictive persona created by Russian intelligence operatives, contacts The Smoking Gun to take credit for hacking the DNC.

June 27th, 2016: First hacked DNC emails posted to “DCLeaks” website.

July 11th-12th, 2016: Trump campaign officials intervene to remove language calling for providing Ukraine with lethal aid against Russian intervention is Crimea and eastern Ukraine. It is, reportedly, the only significant Trump campaign intervention in the platform in which the Trump campaign has allowed activists a free hand.

July 12th, 2016: Official publication date, The Field of Fight by Michael Flynn and Michael Ledeen.

July 22, 2016: Wikileaks releases first tranche of DNC emails dating from January 2015 to May 2016.

July 27th, 2016: Donald Trump asks Russia to hack Clinton’s email to find 33,000 alleged lost emails: “Russia, if you’re listening, I hope you can find the 33,000 emails that are missing. I think you will probably be rewarded mightily by our press.”

August 1st, 2016: Trump campaign chair Paul Manafort denies Trump campaign changed GOP platform on Russia and Ukraine.

August 8th, 2016: Trump Advisor Roger Stone tells Southwest Broward Republican Organization “I actually have communicated with Assange. I believe the next tranche of his documents pertain to the Clinton Foundation but there’s no telling what the October surprise may be.”

August 14th, 2016: The New York Times publishes story detailing handwritten ledgers showing “$12.7 million in undisclosed cash payments designated for Mr. Manafort from Mr. Yanukovych’s pro-Russian political party from 2007 to 2012, according to Ukraine’s newly formed National Anti-Corruption Bureau.”

August 17th, 2016: Nominee Donald Trump receives his first intelligence briefing with Gen. Michael Flynn and Gov. Chris Christie in attendance.

August 19, 2016: Paul Manafort resigns from Trump campaign.

August 21, 2016: Trump advisor Roger Stone tweets: “Trust me, it will soon [sic] the Podesta’s time in the barrel.”

September 26th, 2016: Trump Russia-Europe Policy Advisor Carter Page steps down from campaign while disputing allegations that he engaged in private communications with Russian government officials. A Yahoo News article from three days earlier reported that US intelligence officials were probing whether he met privately with Russian officials in Moscow in July, including an alleged meeting with close Putin ally Igor Sechin, Chairman of Russian oil company Rosneft.

September 26th, 2016: At first presidential debate, Donald Trump casts doubt on Russian role in hacking campaign: “It could be Russia, but it could also be China. It could also be lots of other people. It also could be somebody sitting on their bed that weighs 400 pounds.”

October 7, 2016: A “Joint Statement from the Department of Homeland Security and Office of the Director of National Intelligence” officially accuses the Russian government of being behind hacking of the DNC “to interfere with the US election process.”

October 7, 2016: Wikileaks releases first batch of Podesta emails – one hour after release of Access Hollywood Trump tape.

October 12th, 2016: Stone says he has been in contact with Assange through an intermediary.

October 30th, 2016: In response to FBI Director James Comey’s letter to Congress about new developments in the Clinton email server probe, Senate Minority Leader Harry Reid writes a public letter to Comey in which he claims: “In my communications with you and other top officials in the national security community, it has become clear that you possess explosive information about close ties and coordination between Donald Trump, his top advisors, and the Russian government.”

December 9th, 2016: Sen. John McCain (R-AZ) hand delivers a selection of memos (aka ‘the Steele dossier’) to FBI Director James Comey.

December 29th, 2016: President Barack Obama outlines a wave a sanctions and expulsions of Russian diplomat in response to Russian efforts to interfere in the 2016 election.

December 29th, 2016: Russian presidential spokesman Dmitry Peskov vows retaliation for sanctions.

December 29th, 2016: Incoming National Security Michael Flynn has multiple phone conversations with Russian Sergey Kislyak. It is later reported that the calls covered US sanctions and suggestions that Obama’s punitive actions could be undone in a matter of weeks. Trump administration officials had repeatedly denied that the conversations involved more than pleasantries and logistics about future meetings.

December 29th-30th, 2016: Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov announces preliminary plans to expel American diplomats.

December 30th, 2016: Russian President Vladimir Putin says he will not retaliate against sanctions and expulsions but await presidency of Donald Trump.

January 19th, 2017: The New York Times reports that the FBI is leading an interagency task force probing ties between Russia and three close Trump associates: Paul Manafort, Carter Page and Roger Stone.

January 26th, 2017: Acting Attorney General Sally Yates and a senior intelligence official visit to White House Counsel Donald McGahn to deliver the message that National Security Advisor Flynn has deceived the Vice President about the subject matter of his calls and may be subject to Russian blackmail.

February 13th, 2017: Michael Flynn resigns as National Security Advisor.

[goldfly]

884816540473995264

[goldfly]

884796683267305472

[57Brave]

Brian Stelter‏Verified account @brianstelter 3h3 hours ago
Replying to @brianstelter @DonaldJTrumpJr

Confirmed from an NYT source: "We were preparing to publish" story -- Don Jr. camp "asked for more time" to comment "and then pre-empted us"

[nsacpi]

the backstory on Ms Veselniskaya and the Trumps

https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2017/7/11/1679688/-Natalia-Veselnitskaya-was-no-stranger-she-was-important-to-Trump-s-business

[jpx7]

Though I've often, over the past half-year or so, been critical of the Democrat's (and news media's) over-focus on This Russia Issue, and likewise felt it was a kind of canard to distract from more important issues (the epic party-wide failure of both vision and organization, on the one side; actual deleterious policy—hell, the spectre of the AHCA still hangs over us—on the other side), I will say that it's finally at the point now that I'll give it one (out of five) bags of popcorn.

[57Brave]

Do I understand you right that you were troubled (in the John McCain/Ben Sasse sense) by possible appearances of conflict of interest at Clinton Foundation promoted by Wikileaks fed by Russian propagandists yet find mounting evidence ( a years worth) of Russian involvement in our election at all levels,federal,state and local ------
a distraction ?

The Democrats have a vision.
An environmental vision
An economic vision
An education vision
A universal health care vision
etc etc etc

What they don't have is voters capable of keeping their collective eye on the ball

Had people not bought into Wiki whirlwind a year ago, we would not be fighting to have an EPA stocked with scientists or worrying about the National Park system becoming an arm of Mobile-Exxon but fighting to keep HRC from getting impeached over Benghazi

Which would be worlds better than the mess we are in today

[jpx7]

Do I understand you right that you were troubled (in the John McCain/Ben Sasse sense) by possible appearances of conflict of interest at Clinton Foundation promoted by Wikileaks fed by Russian propagandists yet find mounting evidence ( a years worth) of Russian involvement in our election at all levels,federal,state and local ------
a distraction ?

I wasn't especially "troubled" by the Clinton Foundation (I was much more discouraged by her long history of neoliberal corporatist policies, heavy reliance on corporate funding, and general corporate ties), but I also didn't dismiss it as a total non-issue, as you did. I am genuinely more troubled by almost everything Trump has done or says he plans to; but I think derailing other, more substantial organizational energies onto This Russia Issue is, by and large, a wasteful fool's errand, when weighed against things like the AHCA, the Muslim-targeting "not a ban" ban, or the criminally under-discussed posture with respect to federally-administered land conservation (not to mention against the fact that, even in the I'm With Her wet dreams, the best case immediate upshot is Mike Pence as POTUS).


The Democrats have a vision.
An environmental vision
An economic vision
An education vision
A universal health care vision
etc etc etc

What they don't have is voters capable of keeping their collective eye on the ball

Lol. "Democrats cannot fail; they can only be failed."

Reflective of the party norms, one of their golden boys (Senator Booker) still supports charter schools, and just had to be shamed into suspending big pharma donations to his campaign. I wouldn't call that "an education vision", and I would moreover call their "universal health care vision" very suspect—and looking more suspect, considering they can't even get their noses out of the corporate coffers long enough to pass single-payer in California, holding both the governor's mansion and a legislative super-majority (though, counter-balancing that, I'm encouraged by Senator Merkley coming out strong for single-payer nationally).


Had people not bought into Wiki whirlwind a year ago, we would not be fighting to have an EPA stocked with scientists or worrying about the National Park system becoming an arm of Mobile-Exxon but fighting to keep HRC from getting impeached over Benghazi

Which would be worlds better than the mess we are in today

Sure, the Clinton campaign didn't contribute to its own demise. It's just Assange & the Bernie Bros we have to blame for Mrs Clinton's epic failure to beat Andrew Dice Clay in a Suit and Orange Wig in a national election.

[Runnin]

Slate article on timeline of denials. (http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/politics/2017/07/a_timeline_of_team_trump_s_denials_of_collusion_wi th_russia.html)


June 3, 2016: Trump Jr. receives an email offering “information that would incriminate Hillary” as “part of Russia and its government’s support for Mr. Trump.”

June 8: Trump Jr. forwards the email thread to Kushner and Manafort.

June 9: Date of the meeting. Trump Jr. now says the information offered was not of interest and that the meeting focused on the lawyer’s desire to change adoption-related sanctions against Russia.



June 15: The Democratic National Committee’s Trump opposition research file is released online. The software firm CrowdStrike releases an analysis indicating that the DNC had been hacked by “Russian intelligence-related adversaries.”

July 22: On the eve of the Democratic National Convention, WikiLeaks releases hacked DNC emails.

July 24: Trump Jr. tells CNN’s Jake Tapper that the Clinton campaign’s suggestion that Russia was trying to intervene in the election on behalf of Trump is “disgusting” and “phony.”

It just goes to show you their exact moral compass. They’ll say anything to be able to win this. I mean this is time and time again, lie after lie. … It’s disgusting. It’s so phony. … These lies and the perpetuating of that kind of nonsense to try to gain some political capital is just outrageous.


The ignorance, the incompetence, the naivety.

[Krgrecw]

So Donald colluded, and than it was Jared and now it's Donald jr. Whose next? Baron?



The only person really on the take from Russia is hillary

[Krgrecw]

Slate article on timeline of denials. (http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/politics/2017/07/a_timeline_of_team_trump_s_denials_of_collusion_wi th_russia.html)


June 3, 2016: Trump Jr. receives an email offering “information that would incriminate Hillary” as “part of Russia and its government’s support for Mr. Trump.”

June 8: Trump Jr. forwards the email thread to Kushner and Manafort.

June 9: Date of the meeting. Trump Jr. now says the information offered was not of interest and that the meeting focused on the lawyer’s desire to change adoption-related sanctions against Russia.



June 15: The Democratic National Committee’s Trump opposition research file is released online. The software firm CrowdStrike releases an analysis indicating that the DNC had been hacked by “Russian intelligence-related adversaries.”

July 22: On the eve of the Democratic National Convention, WikiLeaks releases hacked DNC emails.

July 24: Trump Jr. tells CNN’s Jake Tapper that the Clinton campaign’s suggestion that Russia was trying to intervene in the election on behalf of Trump is “disgusting” and “phony.”

It just goes to show you their exact moral compass. They’ll say anything to be able to win this. I mean this is time and time again, lie after lie. … It’s disgusting. It’s so phony. … These lies and the perpetuating of that kind of nonsense to try to gain some political capital is just outrageous.


The ignorance, the incompetence, the naivety.

Clinton supporters want to talk about Morals?

I'd gladly take a guy who wants to win over a serial woman abuser and his wife who covers that stuff up.

[Hawk]

Lol. You guys are thirsty as ****.

[Runnin]

"A Conspiracy of Dunces" by Ross Douthat (https://www.nytimes.com/2017/07/11/opinion/trump-russia-collusion.html?smid=fb-share)

Here is a good rule of thumb for dealing with Donald Trump: Everyone who gives him the benefit of the doubt eventually regrets it.

This was true of clients and contractors and creditors throughout his business career. It was true of the sycophants and opportunists before whom he dangled cabinet appointments during the campaign and then, oh, never mind. It has been true of his cabinet members and spokesmen, whose attempts to defend and explain their boss’s conduct are gleefully undercut by the boss himself. And it should be true — for the sake of their souls, I sincerely hope it’s true — of the Republican leaders whose reputations for probity and principle he has stomped all over since winning their party’s nomination.

And now it’s true of me.

The benefit of the doubt I extended to Trump was limited, but on a rather important subject: I thought that direct collusion between his inner circle and Russian officialdom during the 2016 campaign was relatively unlikely and the odds of ever finding proof of such a conspiracy vanishingly low. A lot of weirdness around Trump and Russia, I argued, had a more normal explanation — he had made business deals with Russians, he still harbors a 1980s-era vision of superpower cooperation, and as a foreign-policy neophyte he clutched the idea of détente like a security blanket even as the Russians separately made moves to help him win.

[nsacpi]

As Sarah Vowell taught us 10 years ago, everything in American life can be found / described by the Godfather.

How did Fredo react to his capabilities being marginalized and passed over by his younger brother ?

Is Jr the flip we all knew was coming ?

....................

Fredo Corleone: I'm your older brother, Mike (Ivanka/Jared) , and I was stepped over!
Michael Corleone: That's the way Pop wanted it.
Fredo Corleone: It ain't the way I wanted it! I can handle things! I'm smart! Not like everybody says... like dumb... I'm smart and I want respect!

One important difference: There is no Michael in the Trump family.

[Runnin]

Lol. You guys are thirsty as ****.

And you, so hypercriticial of every foreign police move Obama made, now only indifferent to the bumbler in chief.

[Runnin]

One important difference: There is no Michael in the Trump family.

Maybe Barron is taking charge this very moment.

[jpx7]

"A Conspiracy of Dunces" by Ross Douthat (https://www.nytimes.com/2017/07/11/opinion/trump-russia-collusion.html?smid=fb-share)

Here is a good rule of thumb for dealing with Donald Trump: Everyone who gives him the benefit of the doubt eventually regrets it.

This was true of clients and contractors and creditors throughout his business career. It was true of the sycophants and opportunists before whom he dangled cabinet appointments during the campaign and then, oh, never mind. It has been true of his cabinet members and spokesmen, whose attempts to defend and explain their boss’s conduct are gleefully undercut by the boss himself. And it should be true — for the sake of their souls, I sincerely hope it’s true — of the Republican leaders whose reputations for probity and principle he has stomped all over since winning their party’s nomination.

And now it’s true of me.

The benefit of the doubt I extended to Trump was limited, but on a rather important subject: I thought that direct collusion between his inner circle and Russian officialdom during the 2016 campaign was relatively unlikely and the odds of ever finding proof of such a conspiracy vanishingly low. A lot of weirdness around Trump and Russia, I argued, had a more normal explanation — he had made business deals with Russians, he still harbors a 1980s-era vision of superpower cooperation, and as a foreign-policy neophyte he clutched the idea of détente like a security blanket even as the Russians separately made moves to help him win.

Lol.

Good title for the piece, though.

[Hawk]

And you, so hypercriticial of every foreign police move Obama made, now only indifferent to the bumbler in chief.

Sorry for being able to keep it in my pants over an innocuous email between Donald Trump Jr. and this guy:

http://i.onionstatic.com/avclub/6374/64/16x9/1200.jpg

Your desperation reeks.

I'm not of the belief that there's nothing to the Russian angle, but when you guys continually trot out the same recycled conspiratorial, toothless bitter fluff it gets old.

This (the email) is a nothing burger and you know it. Or at least I hope you do.

[nsacpi]

Humpty Dumpty wanted a wall

Humpty Dumpty had a great fall

All Putin's horses and all Putin's men

Couldn't put Humpty together again

[jpx7]

This (the email) is a nothing burger and you know it. Or at least I hope you do.

Can we not?

[nsacpi]

This (the email) is a nothing burger and you know it. Or at least I hope you do.

Nothing burger might end up being Reince's epitaph.

[Hawk]

Can we not?

Sorry.

[sturg33]

I wonder how much time liberals spend googling russian conspiracy stuff hoping to find the next juicy nugget.

57 posted in another thread that the only reason we have a Trump presidency is because Putin wanted it... I asked what exactly happened to cause the Trump victory, but have yet to hear a reason

[Runnin]

Sorry for being able to keep it in my pants over an innocuous email between Donald Trump Jr. and this guy:

Your desperation reeks.

I'm not of the belief that there's nothing to the Russian angle, but when you guys continually trot out the same recycled conspiratorial, toothless bitter fluff it gets old.

This (the email) is a nothing burger and you know it. Or at least I hope you do.

Desperate? For what? I'm just enjoying the reality show.

While I don't think much is gonna happen to him, for the record I think he's probably the most corrupt and guilty President we've ever had and his win is absolutely illegitimate. At this moment, that is the ONLY thing he cares about, protecting the win. If politics were still as rough and tumble as he claimed he longed for on the campaign trail, he and his whole crew would be deep in the soup, if not history months ago.

I can only imagine how the Fox News crowd would be reacting were it a Democrat.

[Runnin]

Stephen Colbert Apologizes to Eric Trump: “We Always Thought You Were the Dumb One”

[goldfly]

at the very very least

this email and meeting shows by his own admission they were down to collusion with the Russians

but like all the rest of the smoke, yeah, i'm sure it's nothing and just all a made up story like all the other russian interactions that this administration has lied about and they are getting lawyers over

[Hawk]

this email and meeting shows by his own admission they were down to collusion with the Russians

Huge reach.

But you know that, because you aren't simple.

[Hawk]

Desperate? For what? I'm just enjoying the reality show.

While I don't think much is gonna happen to him, for the record I think he's probably the most corrupt and guilty President we've ever had and his win is absolutely illegitimate. At this moment, that is the ONLY thing he cares about, protecting the win. If politics were still as rough and tumble as he claimed he longed for on the campaign trail, he and his whole crew would be deep in the soup, if not history months ago.

I can only imagine how the Fox News crowd would be reacting were it a Democrat.

Desperate to substantiate a year's worth of conspiracy theories?

This is the Joe Arpaio going to Hawaii stage of the fantasy.

I agree with you about the Fox News crowd, but you are behaving just as bad as they are with the tit for tat mentality.

[thethe]

Desperate? For what? I'm just enjoying the reality show.

While I don't think much is gonna happen to him, for the record I think he's probably the most corrupt and guilty President we've ever had and his win is absolutely illegitimate. At this moment, that is the ONLY thing he cares about, protecting the win. If politics were still as rough and tumble as he claimed he longed for on the campaign trail, he and his whole crew would be deep in the soup, if not history months ago.

I can only imagine how the Fox News crowd would be reacting were it a Democrat.

We saw that reaction with Hillary with much more conclusive evidence that she was corrupt.the interesting question is would the dems care if this was a Democrat and we saw that by not really caring about HRC and the DNC.

[Runnin]

Desperate to substantiate a year's worth of conspiracy theories?

This is the Joe Arpaio going to Hawaii stage of the fantasy.

I agree with you about the Fox News crowd, but you are behaving just as bad as they are with the tit for tat mentality.
There are always theories when there is this much smoke coming out of every window, but the speculation is over and the verdict is in:
the Trump campaign and now administration is far more corrupt and incompetent than anyone could have ever imagined.

Are you saying that collusion has still not been shown or that collusion is not a problem? To me it's clear that Jr. was perfectly
okay with it.

[Runnin]

We saw that reaction with Hillary with much more conclusive evidence that she was corrupt.the interesting question is would the dems care if this was a Democrat and we saw that by not really caring about HRC and the DNC.
Are you talking about all those times she was sued for being a crook and a fraud?

:facepalm:

[nsacpi]

I wonder how much time liberals spend googling russian conspiracy stuff hoping to find the next juicy nugget.

57 posted in another thread that the only reason we have a Trump presidency is because Putin wanted it... I asked what exactly happened to cause the Trump victory, but have yet to hear a reason

As I suspect you very well know...the real issues are 1) the targeting of our democratic process by a foreign country and 2) the willingness indeed the eagerness of the Trump campaign to accept assistance from that country. The interference need not be effective for 1 to be a major issue and for 2 to be a yuge political scandal.

In addition, the investigation into the above has encountered serious and possibly illegal political obstruction and may yield evidence of tangentially-related but nevertheless serious crimes by people close to the presidency including its current occupant.

Avert your eyes if you wish with red herrings, but these matters are not going away.

[57Brave]

Had Trump taken Obama's advise and not hired Michael Flynn

Just sayin'

[thethe]

Are you talking about all those times she was sued for being a crook and a fraud?

:facepalm:

Not sure there are a lot of people lining up to talk about what a good person trump is. I find it amusing though that Dems willfully turned a blind eye to the Clinton issues (both bill and hillary) are now warriors to stop trump.

Everyone will turn a blind eye to the people they support. Just call it like it is.

[Runnin]

Not sure there are a lot of people lining up to talk about what a good person trump is. I find it amusing though that Dems willfully turned a blind eye to the Clinton issues (both bill and hillary) are now warriors to stop trump.

Everyone will turn a blind eye to the people they support. Just call it like it is.

Your over-generalizations are troubling. It's dumb to lump all Dems in together. "Everyone" did NOT turn a blind eye to Hillary. The fact is that a lot of people, including every Dem on this board that I'm aware of, were uncomfortable with Hillary because of the choices she had made over the years, etc. A lot of independents were too; that's a big reason she lost.

Hillary and her husband both had to face legal scrutiny and the charges were found wanting. Bill was impeached and found innocent. That fact greatly diminishes your charge that there was clear evidence that she was corrupt.

We shall see how well Pumpkinead holds up under close examination and all our pre-speculation will be for naught.

[Runnin]

I wonder which one of these is less likely:

1) Jr. did not tell daddy about the meeting with the nice Russian girl.

2) Manafort agreed to go to a meeting about adoptions.

[57Brave]

Not sure there are a lot of people lining up to talk about what a good person trump is. I find it amusing though that Dems willfully turned a blind eye to the Clinton issues (both bill and hillary) are now warriors to stop trump.

Everyone will turn a blind eye to the people they support. Just call it like it is.

Looking back over the last weeks’ worth of news from Trump-friendly sources can be fun. There’s Sunday’s New York Post extravagantly rolling their eyes beneath the headline “The Times ‘exposé’ on Donald Trump Jr. is a big yawn.” And Wednesday’s Post taking a much drier approach on “Why Trump Jr released damning Russia emails.”

It’s not even necessary to walk the timeline back all the way to Sunday. On Tuesday morning, Washington Post conservative writer Ed Rogers went with “The media’s mass hysteria over ‘collusion’ is out of control.” He stuck with that title in a substantially revised noon update. And a 2 PM update. Only … by the time he got there, the disconnect between title, the opening paragraphs on said “media hysteria” and the rest of the piece was pretty severe.

After seeing today’s email exchange dump from Trump Jr., it is easy to see that the meeting should have never happened. Period.

I double down on the idea that this meeting was a rookie, amateur mistake. Even the lackey should not have taken this meeting. It was bad judgment, but not collaboration with the Russians.

The “rookie mistake” excuse is exactly the reason that the lawyer for the guy in the room with decades of hardcore political experience had to rush forward yesterday to say that his client didn’t actually read the invite to the meeting he was attending. Donald Trump Jr. has moved from he attended no meetings with Russians, to the meeting was just about adoption, to it was just opposition research, and landed on “it was before Russia-mania.”

But the story that everyone involved is settling on now is founded on one idea—the idea that the meeting didn’t lead to anything—and there’s no reason to think that’s any more true than every other abandoned position.

The Washington Post gives a quick run through ...

Trump Jr. has changed his story four times since then, most recently in Tuesday's tweet, which was a response to the Times's having obtained emails that show he agreed to meet the Russian lawyer after being offered “some official documents and information that would incriminate Hillary and her dealings with Russia and would be very useful to your father.”

While everything else about Trump Jr’s description of the meeting changes from one iteration to the next, the ending remains pretty similar—it was a short meeting, it didn’t produce meaningful information, and “there was no follow up.”

However, everything else that Donald Trump Jr. has said about the meeting has turned out to be a lie. So … why should any of that be true?

The other point that Trump Jr, along with the cast of lawyers, brings up every time is that the meeting was brief—20 to 30 minutes. That certainly doesn’t seem like enough time to relay a stack of juicy Clinton gossip. And the brevity is presented as equivalent to “not important.”

However, even the shorter of those two times is plenty of time to relay a simple message: This is a big deal, we have the goods, and you need to handle this more carefully.

It seems unlikely that attorney Natalia Veselnitskaya paid another visit to Trump Tower (though if she did, we’ll likely know very soon). But Veselnitskaya had plenty of opportunity to pass along details on how more information would be forthcoming. And she had the man in the room—Paul Manafort—with years of experience in taking secret information from Moscow.

And the other guy in the room, Jared Kushner, would be the guy who desperately sought a new communication channel with Moscow after the election.

As the Washington Post reiterates …

The progression of Trump Jr.'s position can be summarized like this:

I never represented the campaign in a meeting with a Russian.
Actually, I did, but the meeting was about adoption.
Well, the pretext of the meeting was incriminating information about Clinton, but we didn't actually get any.
This kind of meeting is totally normal.
The meeting didn't seem like such a bad idea at the time because the media wasn't focused on Russia yet.

The one tiny nail on which Trump Jr is hanging what’s left of his story—and the only thing that’s protecting Kushner and Manafort—is the idea that this meeting was trivial and didn’t lead to anything else.

Don’t believe it

[sturg33]

As I suspect you very well know...the real issues are 1) the targeting of our democratic process by a foreign country and 2) the willingness indeed the eagerness of the Trump campaign to accept assistance from that country. The interference need not be effective for 1 to be a major issue and for 2 to be a yuge political scandal.

In addition, the investigation into the above has encountered serious and possibly illegal political obstruction and may yield evidence of tangentially-related but nevertheless serious crimes by people close to the presidency including its current occupant.

Avert your eyes if you wish with red herrings, but these matters are not going away.

I'm so sick of seeing that the Russians caused Trump to win... not just heare, but all over the internet.

Nobody knows how or why, but they are sure of it!

[nsacpi]

I'm so sick of seeing that the Russians caused Trump to win... not just heare, but all over the internet.

Nobody knows how or why, but they are sure of it!

Well, I hope you get well soon and also hope that I did not contribute to your illness.

[Runnin]

The one tiny nail on which Trump Jr is hanging what’s left of his story—and the only thing that’s protecting Kushner and Manafort—is the idea that this meeting was trivial and didn’t lead to anything else.

Don’t believe it

I know there are a lot of people who will make a show of believing him when he says it was about nothing, but I don't believe there are any smart people left who would take anything a Trump said at face value.

If the meeting really was about nothing, then Putin set Trump up just to see how dumb he was. I think it's more sad than funny how colossally stupid and inept he is.

[cajunrevenge]

Anyone else feel like if Hillary won right now Republicans would be trying to impeach her over something and she would be blaming fake news much like Trump but in her own way. 57 would be doing all the denying and defending instead of all the Russiar threads.




Also, remember that time China tried to influence our elections in favor of the Clintons?

[sturg33]

Do the people on the left actually care that the Russians tried to "interfere?"

Haven't they done it every election?

Doesn't the US to it as well?

doesn't other countries?

Isn't this just a big which hunt?

[nsacpi]

Do the people on the left actually care that the Russians tried to "interfere?"

Haven't they done it every election?

Doesn't the US to it as well?

doesn't other countries?

Isn't this just a big which hunt?

even if the answer is yes to all of the above something new and different did happen this past election that should be of concern to all of us and needs to be thoroughly inestigated...im not going to explain what it is to you because it is in plain sight and it take a willful act of blindness not to see it

[sturg33]

even if the answer is yes to all of the above something new and different did happen this past election that should be of concern to all of us...im not going to explain what it is to you because it is in plain sight and it take a willful act of blindness not to see it

You have a fool in this very thread (goldfly) who said he committed treason.

the blood thirst of the left is what is new since the last election

[Hawk]

There are always theories when there is this much smoke coming out of every window, but the speculation is over and the verdict is in:
the Trump campaign and now administration is far more corrupt and incompetent than anyone could have ever imagined.

Are you saying that collusion has still not been shown or that collusion is not a problem? To me it's clear that Jr. was perfectly
okay with it.

From a legal perspective the Trump Jr. email likely wouldn't even be admissible in court (the probable reason behind why it was leaked). It doesn't demonstrate clear intent, and it's further clouded by the fact that the Russian overture was incorrectly characterized as a sharing of information about illegal activity at the state level. Now, it's very possible that this was just a cover to get in the door with Trump before revealing that the actual dirt was stolen emails ... but that's a presumption. You need more. And more can't be the Flynn angle, or the Sessions angle, or the piss play at the Ritz angle.

[nsacpi]

You have a fool in this very thread (goldfly) who said he committed treason.

the blood thirst of the left is what is new since the last election

foolishness from some does not justify willful blindness by others

[57Brave]

There is an argument for treason.
.................................................. ......................

18 U.S. Code § 2381 - Treason

US Code
Notes

prev | next

Whoever, owing allegiance to the United States, levies war against them or adheres to their enemies, giving them aid and comfort within the United States or elsewhere, is guilty of treason and shall suffer death, or shall be imprisoned not less than five years and fined under this title but not less than $10,000; and shall be incapable of holding any office under the United States.
(June 25, 1948, ch. 645, 62 Stat. 807; Pub. L. 103–322, title XXXIII, § 330016(2)(J), Sept. 13, 1994, 108 Stat. 2148.)
...........................

You could say conspiring to commit election fraud with a foreign agent constitutes "adheres to their enemies, giving aid and comfort".

Considering that foreign agent has in the past vowed to bury us
Thpough not a lawyer , I could see where treason would be in play

[sturg33]

There is an argument for treason.
.................................................. ......................

18 U.S. Code § 2381 - Treason

US Code
Notes

prev | next

Whoever, owing allegiance to the United States, levies war against them or adheres to their enemies, giving them aid and comfort within the United States or elsewhere, is guilty of treason and shall suffer death, or shall be imprisoned not less than five years and fined under this title but not less than $10,000; and shall be incapable of holding any office under the United States.
(June 25, 1948, ch. 645, 62 Stat. 807; Pub. L. 103–322, title XXXIII, § 330016(2)(J), Sept. 13, 1994, 108 Stat. 2148.)
...........................

You could say conspiring to commit election fraud with a foreign agent constitutes "adheres to their enemies, giving aid and comfort".

Considering that foreign agent has in the past vowed to bury us
I could see where treason would be in play

There is no legal analyst in the world who isn't a die-hard lib that would agree with you.

Despite what you would like, we are NOT at war with Russia

[nsacpi]

From a legal perspective the Trump Jr. email likely wouldn't even be admissible in court (the probable reason behind why it was leaked). It doesn't demonstrate clear intent, and it's further clouded by the fact that the Russian overture was incorrectly characterized as a sharing of information about illegal activity at the state level. Now, it's very possible that this was just a cover to get in the door with Trump before revealing that the actual dirt was stolen emails ... but that's a presumption. You need more. And more can't be the Flynn angle, or the Sessions angle, or the piss play at the Ritz angle.

from a legal perspective I doubt collusion will send anyone to jail...on that we appear to be in agreement...

however the growing body of evidence regarding collusion is a very big deal politically and very dangerous for the guy currently occupying the oval office

[57Brave]

oh really ?
it is common knowledge we have sustained a cyber attack by a foreign entity (Russia) if that isn't war, I don't know what is

what does "die-hard lib" have to do with what words mean.

[sturg33]

oh really ?
it is common knowledge we have sustained a cyber attack by a foreign entity (Russia) if that isn't war, I don't know what is

what does "die-hard lib" have to do with what words mean.

Have we declared Russia with war?

I must have missed that.

I even tried to "look it up"

Link, please

[nsacpi]

oh really ?
it is common knowledge we have sustained a cyber attack by a foreign entity (Russia) if that isn't war, I don't know what is

what does "die-hard lib" have to do with what words mean.

if we were smart we would recognize the asymmetries that exist between us and Russia and retaliate in a way that exploits our strengths and their weaknesses...we need to respond very strongly and intelligently to this

[57Brave]

from a legal perspective I doubt collusion will send anyone to jail...on that we appear to be in agreement...

however the growing body of evidence regarding collusion is a very big deal politically and very dangerous for the guy currently occupying the oval office

conspiracy to commit election fraud
and obstruction of justice
are very much in play

Collusion by itself is not a crime.
Just a word that encapsulates this escapade


http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2017/07/12/what-is-collusion-215366

[nsacpi]

Have we declared Russia with war?

I must have missed that.

I even tried to "look it up"

Link, please

I wouldn't say war...but they carried out a hostile act...we have to formulate an appropriate response

[nsacpi]

conspiracy to commit election fraud
and obstruction of justice
are very much in play

Collusion by itself is not a crime.
Just a word that encapsulates this escapade


http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2017/07/12/what-is-collusion-215366

conspiracy...yes I could see that sending people to jail in this matter...but I don't thing enough evidence has emerged...so far

[57Brave]

if we were smart we would recognize the asymmetries that exist between us and Russia and retaliate in a way that exploits our strengths and their weaknesses...we need to respond very strongly and intelligently to this

who is we ?
'we" had that opportunity in November to elect some one with a record of taking hard stances against the Russians and many choose a serial sex predator / suspected Russian agent / failed casino owner, because you know, there might be an appearance of possible wrongdoing ...
Crocodile tears my friend, crocodile tears

"we" as in Ben Sasse or Donald Trump or Jeff Sessions .... Paul Ryan --- John McCain lil Marco -- Rand Paul -- Justin Amash
Puh leeese

[sturg33]

If you wanted someone who was clean from Russia, HRC was not your gal.

[sturg33]

I wouldn't say war...but they carried out a hostile act...we have to formulate an appropriate response

We are not at war with them. They carried out an act that they and many other countries do every single year.

This is not new. this is a which hunt from the biggest group of entitled losers I've ever seen

[57Brave]

If you wanted someone who was clean from Russia, HRC was not your gal.

show your math

I would suggest you read the Politico article .

By your logic everyone in the US that ever lied aobut a BJ should stand impeachment.
Whether caught or not. I have it on good source ...

[nsacpi]

who is we ?
'we" had that opportunity in November to elect some one with a record of taking hard stances against the Russians and many choose a serial sex predator / suspected Russian agent / failed casino owner, because you know, there might be an appearance of possible wrongdoing ...
Crocodile tears my friend, crocodile tears

"we" as in Ben Sasse or Donald Trump or Jeff Sessions .... Paul Ryan --- John McCain lil Marco -- Rand Paul -- Justin Amash
Puh leeese

we is our country

[sturg33]

show your math

I really don't feel like it... because when we have the same convo 6 weeks from now, you'll forget everything as usual.

You can start with Podesta, and when you're done - the Clinton foundation.

You can look it up

[Hawk]

from a legal perspective I doubt collusion will send anyone to jail...on that we appear to be in agreement...

however the growing body of evidence regarding collusion is a very big deal politically and very dangerous for the guy currently occupying the oval office

It could go either way. I think that the investigation needs to produce a conviction, at the very least. Otherwise you run the risk of watching the tide turn as Republicans begin to universally retreat to a witch-hunt defense (the tax-payer dollar waste pivot always resounds). Then Trump morphs into a hero for keeping his hat on despite partisan attacks on his family, the base has an obvious rallying cry, and the Democrats are suddenly working from a disadvantage.

I agree that things appear dire for Trump, but I still see escape routes for him.

[nsacpi]

We are not at war with them. They carried out an act that they and many other countries do every single year.

This is not new. this is a which hunt from the biggest group of entitled losers I've ever seen

if you don't see the difference between what they did in collusion with the Trump campaign and previous elections you are being willfully blind

[57Brave]

I really don't feel like it... because when we have the same convo 6 weeks from now, you'll forget everything as usual.

You can start with Podesta, and when you're done - the Clinton foundation.

You can look it up

you have no math

"I really don't feel like it" is a chicken**** response

[Runnin]

Do the people on the left actually care that the Russians tried to "interfere?"

Haven't they done it every election?

Doesn't the US to it as well?

doesn't other countries?

Isn't this just a big which hunt?
If Trump were acting more Presidential and inspiring some confidence in his abilities it would be less of a story.

If he had not attacked the Media and the Intelligence Community and in effect dared them to come after him . . .

If he were not so blatantly enriching himself and his family through the office . . .

If he were not clearly trying to transform our 250 yr old democracy into an Eastern European kleptocracy overnight . . .

I agree it is a "which hunt". Which to hunt for? The collusion, the obstruction, the blatant profiteering or the general incompetence? Too many targets.

[sturg33]

you have no math

"I really don't feel like it" is a chicken**** response

As an unwise man has told me many times, google is your friend. "you can look it up"

[nsacpi]

It could go either way. I think that the investigation needs to produce a conviction, at the very least. Otherwise you run the risk of watching the tide turn as Republicans begin to universally retreat to a witch-hunt defense (the tax-payer dollar waste pivot always resounds). Then Trump morphs into a hero for keeping his hat on despite partisan attacks on his family, the base has an obvious rallying cry, and the Democrats are suddenly working from a disadvantage.

I agree that things appear dire for Trump, but I still see escape routes for him.

well once upon a time I saw plausible explanations other than the one now staring us in the face for actions taken by him and his surrogates...i think the escape routes are no longer there...what remains is for the legal and political process to play itself...the chances of it ending well for Trump are very small

[57Brave]

It has been looked up for close to 30 years. As a wise woman once wrote

"there is no there -- there "

"there" was a blow job -- a blow job
3 little words

[sturg33]

Honestly I'd rather he get impeached just so I can stop hearing about Russia every day.

it's exhausting and he's not good enough of a President to deal with it

[Hawk]

if we were smart we would recognize the asymmetries that exist between us and Russia and retaliate in a way that exploits our strengths and their weaknesses...we need to respond very strongly and intelligently to this

The thing that kills me about all of this is that I've always been a proponent of working with Russia. It just makes more geopolitical sense, especially given their entrenchment in the Middle East. Nevertheless, they do need us more than we need them, so retaliation shouldn't be off the table (assuming, for a moment, that their entanglement in our election was atypically nefarious). Unfortunately, the majority of our muscle here comes via the European combo punch ... which is looking pretty weak these days.

[57Brave]

It is funny how this paralells Watergate.
It is reported the night before leaving the White House Nixon was still going on about "the Kennedy's" - how privileged they were and how much they got away with.

It takes lack of discipline and a not very good plan to get caught.
Trump got caught

That is Trumps crime. Hubris and entitlement

[nsacpi]

Honestly I'd rather he get impeached just so I can stop hearing about Russia every day.

it's exhausting and he's not good enough of a President to deal with it

it will take some time but you are likely to be granted your wish

[nsacpi]

It is funny how this paralells Watergate.
It is reported the night before leaving the White House Nixon was still going on about "the Kennedy's" - how privileged they were and how much they got away with.

It takes lack of discipline and a not very good plan to get caught.
Trump got caught

That is Trumps crime. Hubris and entitlement

stupidity and incompetence on a collosal scale too

[57Brave]

I miss No Drama Obama

truth be known, and I think a lot of others do too

[Hawk]

Honestly I'd rather he get impeached just so I can stop hearing about Russia every day.

it's exhausting and he's not good enough of a President to deal with it

If Mike Pence becomes President of this country I'm moving to the Philippines.

[sturg33]

Trump got caught

That is Trumps crime. Hubris and entitlement

What is the crime and what did he get caught doing?

[nsacpi]

The thing that kills me about all of this is that I've always been a proponent of working with Russia. It just makes more geopolitical sense, especially given their entrenchment in the Middle East. Nevertheless, they do need us more than we need them, so retaliation shouldn't be off the table (assuming, for a moment, that their entanglement in our election was atypically nefarious). Unfortunately, the majority of our muscle here comes via the European combo punch ... which is looking pretty weak these days.

I distinguish between Russia and Putin...what is possible will change once he has passed from the scene

[CK86]

The Don Jr. emails prove that he was, at the very least, open to the idea of accepting Russia's help in order for his father to win the election. I don't see how that can be disputed based on reading the emails. Kushner's security clearances should've been removed a long time ago but nothing about this administration is normal.

That said, I also don't think it's going to be the thing that brings down the Trump administration. I believe we're at the top of the mountain and Don Jr's emails just pushed the snowball down the side of the mountain. We have a ways yet to go but winter is coming.

I'm gonna laugh so hard if there's actually a recording of the meeting.

[Runnin]

If Mike Pence becomes President of this country I'm moving to the Philippines.

I'm sure you can do better than that.

[nsacpi]

The Don Jr. emails prove that he was, at the very least, open to the idea of accepting Russia's help in order for his father to win the election. I don't see how that can be disputed based on reading the emails. Kushner's security clearances should've been removed a long time ago but nothing about this administration is normal.

That said, I also don't think it's going to be the thing that brings down the Trump administration. I believe we're at the top of the mountain and Don Jr's emails just pushed the snowball down the side of the mountain. We have a ways yet to go but winter is coming.

I'm gonna laugh so hard if there's actually a recording of the meeting.

there are a couple indications that Kushner's lawyers were sources for some of the information about the emails if not the emails themselves

[Julio3000]

Sorry for being able to keep it in my pants over an innocuous email between Donald Trump Jr. and this guy:

...

Your desperation reeks.

I'm not of the belief that there's nothing to the Russian angle, but when you guys continually trot out the same recycled conspiratorial, toothless bitter fluff it gets old.

This (the email) is a nothing burger and you know it. Or at least I hope you do.

I think you used to be of that belief, no? I'm curious as to why the development of the issue over time hasn't shifted your perspective more (compared to, say, 2 months ago or 6 or 8 months ago. The picture has changed quite a bit. Some of what has come to light is most likely fluff, and some seems quite substantive.

This thing with DJTJ is, at the VERY least, shows extremely poor judgment and is awful w/r/t optics. Is it more than that? Dunno. Is it nothing, as you believe and suggest that we all should? I don't know that, either, but until more is known, the case for it being nothing hangs on the word of some individuals who have not distinguished themselves with their probity.

[Krgrecw]

Let's say Trump did some shady business deal in England years ago

And someone over there reached out to hillarys people and offered them some dirt on trump during the election

Would you all be flabbergasted if hillary accepted? I don't think so.

[goldfly]

If Mike Pence becomes President of this country I'm moving to the Philippines.


I have already been told from a business in New Zealand they would sponsor a move

Although they would rather I stay here and fight the orange one in anyway I can so the world doesn't have to endure his awfulness.

I would suggest the same to you if you're serious on the move part. I think about it everyday. Lol

I swear pence was put on the ticket for this exact reason imo.

[goldfly]

Let's say Trump did some shady business deal in England years ago

And someone over there reached out to hillarys people and offered them some dirt on trump during the election

Would you all be flabbergasted if hillary accepted? I don't think so.

Hypotheticals are fun when trying to distract from documented and self admitted possible treason

[57Brave]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DEjK3sKVoAArBgn.jpg:large

[sturg33]

Hypotheticals are fun when trying to distract from documented and self admitted possible treason

Lol at treason.

Fool

[thethe]

Apparently this Russian lawyer attended anti trump protests....

[Julio3000]

Apparently this Russian lawyer attended anti trump protests....

Don't leave me in suspense, man! Tell me what this means!

[thethe]

Don't leave me in suspense, man! Tell me what this means!

You know what this means sir. Just as valid as the rest of the Russian conspiracy theories.

[sturg33]

Can goldfly tell me more about how facts don't matter in 2017, and then tell me how DJT jr is guilty of treason?

[goldfly]

ok children, can we spot the difference between 2 sentences and see how the words were twisted to say something else?

cause here is the original sentence again for the slow learning

"Hypotheticals are fun when trying to distract from documented and self admitted possible treason"

[Julio3000]

You know what this means sir. Just as valid as the rest of the Russian conspiracy theories.

That seems like a particularly disingenuous attempt at a false equivalency. We know that DJTJ received a solicitation to meet that explicitly offered the support of the Russian government, and he set up a meet and forwarded it to Manafort and Kushner, who also attended the meet. That's not a conspiracy theory. That's just what happened, apparently.

[Julio3000]

You know what this means sir. Just as valid as the rest of the Russian conspiracy theories.

No, tell me, please. What are you proposing?

[thethe]

That seems like a particularly disingenuous attempt at a false equivalency. We know that DJTJ received a solicitation to meet that explicitly offered the support of the Russian government, and he set up a meet and forwarded it to Manafort and Kushner, who also attended the meet. That's not a conspiracy theory. That's just what happened, apparently.

How was the meeting with this lawyer an example of support from the Russian government?

[goldfly]

That seems like a particularly disingenuous attempt at a false equivalency. We know that DJTJ received a solicitation to meet that explicitly offered the support of the Russian government, and he set up a meet and forwarded it to Manafort and Kushner, who also attended the meet. That's not a conspiracy theory. That's just what happened, apparently.

you're forgetting these people believe in Alternative Facts

[Julio3000]

How was the meeting with this lawyer an example of support from the Russian government?

Did you read the email exchange? That's kinda the whole point of it.

edit for clarity: It isn't an example of support but it is concrete proof of the willingness of important people in the Trump inner circle to accept "help" proffered by Moscow, and of Moscow's desire to a)conspire with them and/or b)compromise and burn them.

[sturg33]

ok children, can we spot the difference between 2 sentences and see how the words were twisted to say something else?

cause here is the original sentence again for the slow learning

"Hypotheticals are fun when trying to distract from documented and self admitted possible treason"

Oh? Your first post said this:


who cares about treason when you are making the best deals to make america great again by propping up your family name and giving tax cuts to rich people by taking insurance away from people that need it while playing golf every weekend?

Oh an by the ay, even possible treason is wrong... unless you know something the rest of us don't

[57Brave]

David Corn‏Verified account @DavidCornDC 59m59 minutes ago

Remember Trump denouncing the Steele dossier as "fake news"? Don Jr.'s emails prove one of Steele's big points. http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2017/07/donald-trump-jr-emails-steele-dossier/ …

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DEjoNG8VwAAnBtt.jpg:large

like a cheap suit

[VirginiaBrave]

TheThe,

What is it going to take for Trump loyal supporters to wake up and see this man for what he really is? At the least, he is a vain incompetent fool at worst he is the man that will end civilization as we know it.
How many more of his daily lies, twitter rants and misdeeds is it going to take for his blind supporters to say enough is enough?

[Julio3000]

Yeah, that's what I don't really get about the denialists here.

Even without accepting any inferences about the origin of the email and with full disclaimers that it doesn't by itself prove complicity in actual deeds, I don't know why this shouldn't be considered a big deal.

Junior got presented with an opportunity to cooperate with Russians to bring out dirt on HRC. He basically said "Hells yeah! Let's talk about timing" and cc's Manafort and Kushner.

Hawk says because one of the intermediaries is a goof who's clearly on the Bowman fitness plan, we shouldn't pay attention. Thethe says conspiracy and wants to shrink the bullseye to subatomic size.

[sturg33]

at worst he is the man that will end civilization as we know it.


This is why it's difficult to take you guys seriously

[VirginiaBrave]

This is why it's difficult to take you guys seriously

Well, God forbid NK nukes go to raining down on us, maybe in those few seconds you will take us seriously.

[sturg33]

Well, God forbid NK nukes go to raining down on us, maybe in those few seconds you will take us seriously.

You think in this hypothetical scenario it would be because of donald Trump?

Sure, champ

[VirginiaBrave]

You think in this hypothetical scenario it would be because of donald Trump?

Sure, champ

Maybe not but I know the world's fuse with the US is shorter with Trump in office.

[thethe]

Yeah, that's what I don't really get about the denialists here.

Even without accepting any inferences about the origin of the email and with full disclaimers that it doesn't by itself prove complicity in actual deeds, I don't know why this shouldn't be considered a big deal.

Junior got presented with an opportunity to cooperate with Russians to bring out dirt on HRC. He basically said "Hells yeah! Let's talk about timing" and cc's Manafort and Kushner.

Hawk says because one of the intermediaries is a goof who's clearly on the Bowman fitness plan, we shouldn't pay attention. Thethe says conspiracy and wants to shrink the bullseye to subatomic size.

Maybe it's because I don't see a difference between someone like Russia and an entity like the NYT or MSNBC. I see these as global players trying to wield influence but we are all fine with the dems working lock and step with these entities.

I know trump is an immoral man. I wouldn't say incompetent just not learned on political matters which of course is an issue. I vote for policies and not candidates and I can just not support the democratic ticket as their beliefs are diametrically opposed to mine. Sorry.

[thethe]

Maybe not but I know the world's fuse with the US is shorter with Trump in office.

Why is that exactly? Did north Korea have different aspirations under bush? Under obama?

[jpx7]

Do the people on the left actually care that the Russians tried to "interfere?"

Haven't they done it every election?

Doesn't the US to it as well?

doesn't other countries?

Isn't this just a big which hunt?

I've complained plenty about the US meddling in elections and other institutional mechanisms of foreign powers—it's actually a pretty old saw amongst the non-neoliberal-hawkish left, and even a concern for many more milquetoast liberals.

I think what separates this specific instance, in the minds and imaginations of many, is the bumbling obviousness with which a major US campaign sought out and/or accepted this sort of foreign intervention, hoping to leverage it on their behalf.

[jpx7]

the tax-payer dollar waste pivot always resounds

It (blessedly) knocked Arpaio out of power.

[jpx7]

If Mike Pence becomes President of this country I'm moving to the Philippines.

Prague, or going back to Myanmar. But both the Balkans and the Baltic are worth a look, in terms of work-visa viability.

[VirginiaBrave]

Why is that exactly? Did north Korea have different aspirations under bush? Under obama?

Trump is a bully with buttons that can be pushed. Obama is a decent measured human being, that is not going to risk lives uncalled for if it can be helped. Little Bush for all his faults, I do believe had intentions of making his cronies money, not unlike Trump, but after 9/11 I think he had no choice but grow into the job. At the time of his election, I thought he was the worst ever to hold the job in my lifetime now Trump has surpassed that. They do share the fact that they are and were illegitimately elected so there is that.

So your conscience would not let you vote HRC. I get that. Yet that same conscience lets you vote for a man you yourself called immoral?? I don't get that. If I were in your shoes and that conflicted I would have voted for myself rather than contributed to this mess.

[CK86]

How was the meeting with this lawyer an example of support from the Russian government?

Very first email:

"June 3, 2016 10:36 a.m.

Rob Goldstone to Donald Trump Jr.
Subject: Russia - Clinton - private and confidential

Good morning

Emin just called and asked me to contact you with something very interesting.

The Crown prosecutor of Russia met with his father Aras this morning and in their meeting offered to provide the Trump campaign with some official documents and information that would incriminate Hillary and her dealings with Russia and would be very useful to your father.

This is obviously very high level and sensitive information but is part of Russia and its government's support for Mr. Trump - helped along by Aras and Emin.

What do you think is the best way to handle this information and would you be able to speak to Emin about it directly?

I can also send this info to your father via Rhona, but it is ultra sensitive so wanted to send to you first.

Best
Rob Goldstone"

[CK86]

TheThe,

What is it going to take for Trump loyal supporters to wake up and see this man for what he really is? At the least, he is a vain incompetent fool at worst he is the man that will end civilization as we know it.
How many more of his daily lies, twitter rants and misdeeds is it going to take for his blind supporters to say enough is enough?

Some people just like getting conned. Trump is the greatest con-man in history. Just because he now has an "R" in front of his name, they'll defend him to the end. Instead of being country first, it's party first. I left the Republican party over this con-man and I can't imagine I'm the last.

[CK86]

http://www.cnn.com/2017/07/12/politics/video-trump-relationships-russian-associates/index.html

Video of Trump with Goldstone in Las Vegas.

[thethe]

Trump is a bully with buttons that can be pushed. Obama is a decent measured human being, that is not going to risk lives uncalled for if it can be helped. Little Bush for all his faults, I do believe had intentions of making his cronies money, not unlike Trump, but after 9/11 I think he had no choice but grow into the job. At the time of his election, I thought he was the worst ever to hold the job in my lifetime now Trump has surpassed that. They do share the fact that they are and were illegitimately elected so there is that.

So your conscience would not let you vote HRC. I get that. Yet that same conscience lets you vote for a man you yourself called immoral?? I don't get that. If I were in your shoes and that conflicted I would have voted for myself rather than contributed to this mess.

I live in NY. I didn't vote because it didn't matter but if I was in a state where it impacted the outcome I would have gladly voted for Trump because of the policies I believe in. That's what actually impacts me.

[thethe]

Very first email:

"June 3, 2016 10:36 a.m.

Rob Goldstone to Donald Trump Jr.
Subject: Russia - Clinton - private and confidential

Good morning

Emin just called and asked me to contact you with something very interesting.

The Crown prosecutor of Russia met with his father Aras this morning and in their meeting offered to provide the Trump campaign with some official documents and information that would incriminate Hillary and her dealings with Russia and would be very useful to your father.

This is obviously very high level and sensitive information but is part of Russia and its government's support for Mr. Trump - helped along by Aras and Emin.

What do you think is the best way to handle this information and would you be able to speak to Emin about it directly?

I can also send this info to your father via Rhona, but it is ultra sensitive so wanted to send to you first.

Best
Rob Goldstone"

I don't understand. If this information was valid shouldn't the American people know about it? Why does it matter what the source is if the information is pertinent?

Collusion is a strong word that doesn't describe what took place or may have taken place.

[CK86]

I don't understand. If this information was valid shouldn't the American people know about it? Why does it matter what the source is if the information is pertinent?

Collusion is a strong word that doesn't describe what took place or may have taken place.

You're moving the goalposts. Your previous post said "How was the meeting with this lawyer an example of support from the Russian government?" and the email explicitly says "is part of Russia and its government's support for Mr. Trump."

[thethe]

You're moving the goalposts. Your previous post said "How was the meeting with this lawyer an example of support from the Russian government?" and the email explicitly says "is part of Russia and its government's support for Mr. Trump."

Ok. That is clearly in the email exchange. Not sure at what authority this person has to speak on the behalf of the Russian government but that's another debate.

However, if the information which impplicated HRCs involvement with Russia is valid then I would want to know about it

[Krgrecw]

Russia is colluding with anti-fracking groups in America by spreading false information about fracking


Should we investigate these people Too?

[jpx7]

Russia is colluding with anti-fracking groups in America by spreading false information about fracking


Should we investigate these people Too?

Nice false-equivalency.

But regardless, fracking is bad and should be stopped.

[Oklahomahawk]

Russia is colluding with anti-fracking groups in America by spreading false information about fracking


Should we investigate these people Too?

If you want your state to go from never ever having an earthquake to being the new earthquake capital of the world then I'd suggest you not only allow fracking, but you should also encourage it.

[zitothebrave]

Russia is colluding with anti-fracking groups in America by spreading false information about fracking


Should we investigate these people Too?

Are those people in the oval office? As jpx said, nice false-equivalency.

[Krgrecw]

Are those people in the oval office? As jpx said, nice false-equivalency.

Does it matter?

Murder is murder
Treason is treason

[zitothebrave]

Does it matter?

Murder is murder
Treason is treason

Right

Treason -

the crime of betraying one's country, especially by attempting to kill the sovereign or overthrow the government.

For sure telling people lies about fracking is equivalent to trying to disrupt and election.

I wish I could be as delusional as you. It must be nice to be living in a fantasy world

[Krgrecw]

Are those people in the oval office? As jpx said, nice false-equivalency.


Right

Treason -

the crime of betraying one's country, especially by attempting to kill the sovereign or overthrow the government.

For sure telling people lies about fracking is equivalent to trying to disrupt and election.

I wish I could be as delusional as you. It must be nice to be living in a fantasy world



I was saying crimes are crimes regardless of who commits them but that's hard for people like you to understand.

i believe in a country of laws. Way, way more evidence of hillary and the Russians making weird deals than trump has. Evidence of anti-fracking groups being in cahoots with Russia, but that's no big deal. you guys don't care about being fair and being right. It's all about going after Trump with make believe accusation after make believe accusation.

[zitothebrave]

I was saying crimes are crimes regardless of who commits them but that's hard for people like you to understand.

i believe in a country of laws. Way, way more evidence of hillary and the Russians making weird deals than trump has. Evidence of anti-fracking groups being in cahoots with Russia, but that's no big deal. you guys don't care about being fair and being right. It's all about going after Trump with make believe accusation after make believe accusation.

Lol This is where you just don't get it.

Is it a crime when Russia does that but when Canadian companies do it too? Or is it different for you because of Russia. Or we can talk about it from former FLOTUS on the campaign trail in October

"We [the State Department and the U.S. government] were up against Russia pushing oligarchs and others to buy media. We were even up against phony environmental groups, and I’m a big environmentalist, but these were funded by the Russians to stand up against any effort, ‘Oh that pipeline, that fracking, that whatever will be a problem for you,’ and a lot of that money supporting that effort was coming from Russia."

Though again, this storm is from some reps from Texas who have big oil backing them.

Realize that Fracking is bad, and your false equivalency is stupid for that reason.

Again, ignoring the discussion of Fracking you're comparing potential collusion in a US presidential election to environmental activism groups. If you can't see the difference there's truly no hope for you.

[Hawk]

I think you used to be of that belief, no? I'm curious as to why the development of the issue over time hasn't shifted your perspective more (compared to, say, 2 months ago or 6 or 8 months ago. The picture has changed quite a bit. Some of what has come to light is most likely fluff, and some seems quite substantive.

This thing with DJTJ is, at the VERY least, shows extremely poor judgment and is awful w/r/t optics. Is it more than that? Dunno. Is it nothing, as you believe and suggest that we all should? I don't know that, either, but until more is known, the case for it being nothing hangs on the word of some individuals who have not distinguished themselves with their probity.

I believe the Russians may have overtly interfered with the election. I don't believe that the Trump campaign (proper) colluded with them.

Extremely poor judgement? No. I see due diligence.

I didn't say it was nothing at all, I said it was nothing alone.

[jpx7]

Extremely poor judgement? No. I see due diligence.

Wouldn't "due diligence" have been reporting this sort of improper solicitation to the appropriate authorities?

[Hawk]

Wouldn't "due diligence" have been reporting this sort of improper solicitation to the appropriate authorities?

How do you find it improper? The email discusses official documents coming from a Russian prosecutor.

The language about Russia being 'supportive' of Trump is Goldstone's so it's almost pointless to parse.

[thethe]

This smoking gun has had the same shelf life as every other one that has been released. Once it gets looked at rationale people determine it doesn't prove a thing.

[jpx7]

How do you find it improper? The email discusses official documents coming from a Russian prosecutor.

The language about Russia being 'supportive' of Trump is Goldstone's so it's almost pointless to parse.

I think accepting stolen/leaked official documents from a foreign national seems pretty improper, yes. And even if Goldstone's credibility is in question, I find parsing his contribution to the email chain far from "pointless", especially since he appears to have been recruited as a broken for this information transfer.

Even if Goldstone was just blowing smoke up Junior's ass, there's enough appearance of and potential for impropriety that I think "due diligence" isn't replying-all that he'd "love it, especially once patio weather roles around".

[thethe]

I think accepting stolen/leaked official documents from a foreign national seems pretty improper, yes. And even if Goldstone's credibility is in question find parsing his contribution to the email chain far from "pointless, especially since he appears to have been recruited as a broken for this information transfer.

Even if Goldstone was just blowing smoke up Junior's ass, there's enough appearance of and potential for impropriety that I think "due diligence" isn't replying-all that he'd "love it, especially once patio weather roles around".

Should he have informed the feds who have clearly proven to be completely partisan in their approach? If the evidence was clearly damning then due dilligence is what is required.

How could the trump campaign have confidence that the government would do the right thing. The same government that knew of the Russia involvement for months before election day and chose to do nothing.

[jpx7]

Should he have informed the feds who have clearly proven to be completely partisan in their approach? If the evidence was clearly damning then due dilligence is what is required.

How could the trump campaign have confidence that the government would do the right thing. The same government that knew of the Russia involvement for months before election day and chose to do nothing.

Lol.

[Hawk]

I think accepting stolen/leaked official documents from a foreign national seems pretty improper, yes. And even if Goldstone's credibility is in question find parsing his contribution to the email chain far from "pointless, especially since he appears to have been recruited as a broken for this information transfer.

Even if Goldstone was just blowing smoke up Junior's ass, there's enough appearance of and potential for impropriety that I think "due diligence" isn't replying-all that he'd "love it, especially once patio weather roles around".

I don't see where it's implicit that these documents are being leaked, much less stolen. In fact, that they are official legal documents coming from a court is explicit. Hypothetically they could have even been public record.

You perform due diligence to determine the legality of accepting/utilizing said documents.

[Runnin]

Maybe it's because I don't see a difference between someone like Russia and an entity like the NYT or MSNBC.

I know trump is an immoral man.
Bless your poor, brainwashed down to your DNA heart.

Not that it matters, but here's a difference:

Russia wants to damage democracy and freedom. MSNBC and the NYT wants to preserve democracy and freedom.

[jpx7]

My first comment in this thread regarded the fact that I think a lot of this is being overblown, or overemphasized, and otherwise is a waste of good, necessary anti-Trump, anti-regressive energies that should be better spent on more substantial battles. I've also made clear that I think President Pence could very likely be worse than President Trump, for my policy concerns and from my values perspective, so I'm not one of these folks rocking in the corner, blind, thirsty, foaming at the mouth for impeachment. I'll further elaborate that, in fact, I find the likelihood of real criminal prosecution, punishment, or even the anti-Trump needle being moved much from where it is to be quite small, barring much more substantial and legally-damning evidence arising.

Having said all that, I find the two notions advanced in this thread equally specious, and bordering on absurd, in the own way. The first is that the Trump Family is some persecuted Mel Gibson from Conspiracy Theory, buffeted from all sides, unsure of who to trust, and forced to take up their own vigilante investigation to uncover dark truths for the greater good of the nation. The second is that it is laudable due-diligence to follow-up (with demonstrable avidity) with a foreign national promising leaked and/or stolen documents* to influence an election, with purported foreign government support of said intervention—even if said support was exaggerated or fabricated, and even if nothing ultimately came of said meeting.

[Runnin]

Some people just like getting conned.
A lot of lazy people do like the idea of voting for an authoritarian who they foolishly is just gonna fix all their problems. Being an informed voter is way too much work for most people.

[jpx7]

*
I don't see where it's implicit that these documents are being leaked, much less stolen. In fact, that they are official legal documents coming from a court is explicit. Hypothetically they could have even been public record.

Damn, dude: I expect this from some posters, but you're better than this.


some official documents and information that would incriminate Hillary

That's the most elaborated the emails get about the information being offered, and no where there is it "explicit" that they are "official legal documents coming from a court"—though I assume you think it's implied since "The Crown prosecutor of Russia" is invoked? That's not enough for me to assume that the "official documents and information" (the latter of which could be unofficial information: adjectival conjunction is a grey area when not spelled out) are "official legal documents" (you added the "legal" descriptor)—much less for me to assume they might even be public record (how delightful a slide you took!).

In fact it's alleged to be "high level and sensitive information"—"ultra sensitive" indeed—which to me implies the information is pretty explicitly not just some banal legal—maybe even easily, publicly accessible—papers shuffled out of some Russian court.

[Runnin]

The atmosphere of crisis was apparent at the White House itself and in the broader Trump orbit, where hatches were battened down amid the storm.

At a press briefing that was conducted off camera and lasted 22 minutes, White House spokeswoman Sarah Huckabee Sanders repeatedly parried reporters’ questions on the emails by saying their queries should be directed to the personal lawyers of the people involved.

Something got their attention.

[Runnin]

Jr.- Daddy, got an email from your buddy Goldstone today. Says he knows someone with dirt on Hillary.

T - Fantastic. Take Jared and Manafort and check it out. And one more thing.

Jr. - What's that?

T - Don't do anything stupid.

https://s3.amazonaws.com/assets.forward.com/images/cropped/goldstone-3-1499719679.gif

[CK86]

Should he have informed the feds who have clearly proven to be completely partisan in their approach? If the evidence was clearly damning then due dilligence is what is required.

How could the trump campaign have confidence that the government would do the right thing. The same government that knew of the Russia involvement for months before election day and chose to do nothing.

They "chose to do nothing" because the candidate that won was bitching about the election being rigged for weeks leading up to the election in the event he had lost. So if they say, "Russia is tampering to benefit Trump," he can then just claim it's a conspiracy to help Hillary and people like you would accept it as fact.

Con-man Trump played both sides. He knew Russia was interfering and by claiming the election was rigged against him, he prevented the feds from saying anything of substance against him for fear of giving his claims validity. Had he just not hired Michael Flynn, like Obama said, he probably gets away with it all.

[Runnin]

From Frank Rich's latest, Watching the Downfall of a Presidency in Real Time: (http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2017/07/watching-the-downfall-of-a-presidency-in-real-time.html?utm_source=fb&utm_medium=s3&utm_campaign=sharebutton-t)

The good news for those who want to see justice done is that this scandal not only resembles Watergate but also The Godfather — albeit a Godfather where every Corleone is a Fredo and not a single lawyer is as crafty as Tom Hagen, despite the fact that Little Donald’s private attorney has a history of defending clients from mob families.

The level of stupidity of the conspirators is staggering: Not the least of the week’s news is that Kushner thought he could get away with omitting this Trump Tower meeting on the government questionnaire he filed to get his security clearance.

(The $2.5 million that Charles Kushner donated to Harvard to gain his son admission was not money well spent.) :happy0157:

My other favorite detail of the week (so far) is that Rob Goldstone, the former British tabloid writer and Miss Universe entrepreneur who served as the Trump campaign’s Russian middleman, posted on Facebook that he was “preparing for meeting” at Trump Tower on the day it took place. :suprise:

[goldfly]

yeah, i'm sure it is nothing again

i mean, i'm sure it never got brought up at all

885248325427089409

[goldfly]

Maybe it's because I don't see a difference between someone like Russia and an entity like the NYT or MSNBC.


the feds who have clearly proven to be completely partisan in their approach


What's totally insane is that you actually believe both of those statements

[thethe]

Bless your poor, brainwashed down to your DNA heart.

Not that it matters, but here's a difference:

Russia wants to damage democracy and freedom. MSNBC and the NYT wants to preserve democracy and freedom.

I don't believe that liberal/progressives believe in freedom. Or maybe we just define freedom differently.

[thethe]

A lot of lazy people do like the idea of voting for an authoritarian who they foolishly is just gonna fix all their problems. Being an informed voter is way too much work for most people.

This is rich coming from the side that votes for massive entitlement programs.

[thethe]

They "chose to do nothing" because the candidate that won was bitching about the election being rigged for weeks leading up to the election in the event he had lost. So if they say, "Russia is tampering to benefit Trump," he can then just claim it's a conspiracy to help Hillary and people like you would accept it as fact.

Con-man Trump played both sides. He knew Russia was interfering and by claiming the election was rigged against him, he prevented the feds from saying anything of substance against him for fear of giving his claims validity. Had he just not hired Michael Flynn, like Obama said, he probably gets away with it all.

So Obama put his party over the country. Got it.

[nsacpi]

I don't believe that liberal/progressives believe in freedom. Or maybe we just define freedom differently.

Sad. Very sad. That you would equate the NYT and MSNBC with the KGB is beyond absurd.

[57Brave]

Karen Finney‏Verified account @finneyk 8h8 hours ago

How is it not treason to meet with a rep of hostile foreign government aimed at subverting the will of the American people?

[thethe]

Sad. Very sad. That you would equate the NYT and MSNBC with the KGB is beyond absurd.

What is the KGB trying to do to the freedom's of americans? Because I can list out the ways the progressive left is trying to restrict mine.

[thethe]

Karen Finney‏Verified account @finneyk 8h8 hours ago

How is it not treason to meet with a rep of hostile foreign government aimed at subverting the will of the American people?

How is it considered definitive that this person is in fact a rep of russia? Because some guy from Britain said it?

[57Brave]

How is it considered definitive that this person is in fact a rep of russia? Because some guy from Britain said it?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5D_QKY0_Bxk

[nsacpi]

What is the KGB trying to do to the freedom's of americans? Because I can list out the ways the progressive left is trying to restrict mine.

man...u are way out there in the swamps of paranoia and delusion

[thethe]

man...u are way out there in the swamps of paranoia and delusion

Do you have an answer sir? Is the KGB going to invade the US? Is Putin going to be alive forever? I can tell you that the progressive left will outlast Putin.

[zitothebrave]

Do you have an answer sir? Is the KGB going to invade the US? Is Putin going to be alive forever? I can tell you that the progressive left will outlast Putin.

And the KGB in some form or another will exist for a long time. You really don't know much about world history and the struggled relationship of Russia with the west do you?

[thethe]

And the KGB in some form or another will exist for a long time. You really don't know much about world history and the struggled relationship of Russia with the west do you?

I'm aware of world history. Not as much of a buff as I'm sure many of you are but tyranny begins in the form of a large centralized government in almost all situations. Progressivism and radical Islam is more of a threat to my everyday life than the boogeyman KGB.

No Russian soldier will ever step foot on American soil.

[zitothebrave]

I'm aware of world history. Not as much of a buff as I'm sure many of you are but tyranny begins in the form of a large centralized government in almost all situations. Progressivism and radical Islam is more of a threat to my everyday life than the boogeyman KGB.

No Russian soldier will ever step foot on American soil.

I would not make that bet. If resources go as scarce as they could, Alaska would work out as a nice annexation for Russia.

And I laugh at that first paragraph because Trump has espoused tyrannical views since the campaign trail. Yet you voted for him. And for ****s sake you propagate what he's sewing by bringing up media outlets when the only hope you have against tyranny is the media.

[nsacpi]

Do you have an answer sir? Is the KGB going to invade the US? Is Putin going to be alive forever? I can tell you that the progressive left will outlast Putin.

I do have an answer. But the question is so nonsensical and absurd I'm not going to dignify it with a response.

[thethe]

I would not make that bet. If resources go as scarce as they could, Alaska would work out as a nice annexation for Russia.

And I laugh at that first paragraph because Trump has espoused tyrannical views since the campaign trail. Yet you voted for him. And for ****s sake you propagate what he's sewing by bringing up media outlets when the only hope you have against tyranny is the media.

Oh you mean the media which was caught working with the dnc and HRC? That media that is supposed to protect us.

[Julio3000]

I don't see where it's implicit that these documents are being leaked, much less stolen. In fact, that they are official legal documents coming from a court is explicit. Hypothetically they could have even been public record.

You perform due diligence to determine the legality of accepting/utilizing said documents.

If that "due diligence" was at all diligent, seems like there should have been lawyers involved.

[zitothebrave]

Oh you mean the media which was caught working with the dnc and HRC? That media that is supposed to protect us.

Yes, and they should be called out when they **** up but not villainized. You realize that Trump considers infowars a newssource? The company that employs ALex Jones, who admitted in the court of law (http://www.independent.co.uk/news/infowars-alex-jones-performance-artist-playing-character-lawyer-conspiracy-theory-donald-trump-a7687571.html) his show is an act

[thethe]

Yes, and they should be called out when they **** up but not villainized. You realize that Trump considers infowars a newssource? The company that employs ALex Jones, who admitted in the court of law (http://www.independent.co.uk/news/infowars-alex-jones-performance-artist-playing-character-lawyer-conspiracy-theory-donald-trump-a7687571.html) his show is an act

I'm not sure how many times I need to say that I don't support a candidate. I support policies. Trump is not who I would choose to champion my cause but he was the one who was closest to what I believe in.

[Julio3000]

I believe the Russians may have overtly interfered with the election. I don't believe that the Trump campaign (proper) colluded with them.

Extremely poor judgement? No. I see due diligence.

I didn't say it was nothing at all, I said it was nothing alone.

I can't see giving Junior a pass on judgment. I don't know of anyone outside of the Hannitys of the world who would take that line.

I'm trying to better understand the case that this (the bigger Trump/Russia picture) is not a big deal.

So the Russians "may have" overtly interfered with the election. You really think there's much room for hedging that now?

Hypothetically, if it's determined that the Trump campaign coordinated with Russia in targeting their social media/online propaganda campaign, would you change your mind?

[57Brave]

McClatchy and WSJ reports yesterday speak of conversations as far back as Spring 2015.

Interesting reads.

[Julio3000]

So is it at all sketchy that after Preet Bharara was fired, the DoJ settled the $200M Russian money laundering case his office was working on for $6M and no admission of wrongdoing?

The Russian attorney in the DJTJ matter was counsel for the defendant, btw.

[nsacpi]

I don't believe that the Trump campaign (proper) colluded with them.



The presence of Kushner and Manafort at the meeting strongly suggests (while falling short of proving) that the Trump campaign (proper) did collude.

[57Brave]

As far as we know it falls short.
As of last week at this time the people involved were denying there was a meeting

Then the meeting was about ...

The reports yesterday spoke to voting data the Russians possessed to target social media --- this is where the Trumps are vulnerable.
It is established the "fakenews" perpetrated vs Clinton was targeted and planned. It was not random ---

Where did the Russians get the voter data ?
It is foolish to rule anything out

[Krgrecw]

Colluders are the left version of birthers

[Oklahomahawk]

Colluders are the left version of birthers

Until any hard and fast evidence is presented (and I mean the kind that is undeniable, even in court) I would agree with you, but let me ask you this, how many hard core birthers can you name or have you seen who have really changed their tune about that "nothing burger"? I mean, even after the evidence that he was born in Hawaii was presented how many of them said, "well fook me, I was completely wrong about the Big O"? How many poor scared Texans to this day believe that Operation Jade Helm is about to happen any day now? Once people get an idea in their head (and we all know what those kinds of ideas get there) they're just not going to let it go.
Both Sean Hannity and Alex Jones have admitted and in public that they are essentially white versions of Steve Harvey but don't 99% of their followers still follow with at least close to total blind obedience? Don't the hard core followers of both the left and the right need to wake the fook up?

[The Chosen One]

Have a feeling this Russia thing is unfolding slowly and will unravel more around midterms.

1) Nobody in Congress will want to attach themselves in any way to help Trump.
2) Pence should he be promoted will have too much of the Trump stench attached to him to get anything done.

[The Chosen One]

Colluders are the left version of birthers

You were/still a birther.

[sturg33]

Bless your poor, brainwashed down to your DNA heart.

Not that it matters, but here's a difference:

Russia wants to damage democracy and freedom. MSNBC and the NYT wants to preserve democracy and freedom.

hahahahahahahahaha

[sturg33]

A lot of lazy people do like the idea of voting for an authoritarian who they foolishly is just gonna fix all their problems. Being an informed voter is way too much work for most people.

you voted for HRC, right?

hahahahahahahahahaha

[sturg33]

yeah, i'm sure it is nothing again

i mean, i'm sure it never got brought up at all

885248325427089409

Wasn't that from 2013?

[sturg33]

Karen Finney‏Verified account @finneyk 8h8 hours ago

How is it not treason to meet with a rep of hostile foreign government aimed at subverting the will of the American people?

hahahahahahahahahahahaa

[sturg33]

Russia is not a threat to our liberty. Our own government is a threat to our liberty, by passing things like the Patriot Act and NDAA.

But y'all don't care about that.

Y'all don't care about drone strikes killing 90% innocent people.

Y'all care about Russia!

Talk about brainwashed. The NYT and CNN are doing a very good job

[Oklahomahawk]

Have a feeling this Russia thing is unfolding slowly and will unravel more around midterms.

1) Nobody in Congress will want to attach themselves in any way to help Trump.
2) Pence should he be promoted will have too much of the Trump stench attached to him to get anything done.

I maintain that the Dems can't really "win" again until they let go of the Russia thing, or at least actually come up with some meaningful plans, platforms, etc., to stand on that actually mean something to most Americans and put the Russia thing on the back burner. If the "smoking guns" come out then fine, but right now that and their being in denial about the real reasons they lost in 2016 are holding them back from ever really winning again and for the life of me I can't figure out why the Repubs ridicule and otherwise make fun of them for their stance. I mean, the Repubs don't have to do anything (right now) to win again in 2018 as long as the Dems keep it up with this strategy. If the Repubs were smart they would at least pretend to cower in fear and beg the Dems to stop talking about Russia before you find something that will destroy us, yada, yada, yada so they would keep doing it (reverse psychology I guess).

Remember how when Dems wanted to impeach W because Iraq was a lie? What would they have gotten if they had successfully done so? That's right, President Cheney without the "acting" part in front of his name? Good idea? You tell me. What happens if they successfully impeach Trump? You know as well as I do that when politicians start talking about impeachment it makes a sympathetic martyr figure out of their intended victim. Look at how Bill's numbers kept going up every time the Repubs of the 1990s even used the word "impeach". Do you really want President Pence? Right now IMO the religious right is making major league hypocritical Scribes and Pharisee level aholes of themselves by not only going along with Trump, but actively supporting him, even though I suspect more than a few do so while holding their noses. Imagine how they could get behind a really religious sounding guy like Pence with (whatever passes for with them these days) a semi clear conscience in 2020. A damaged Trump would be way easier for them to beat than a uber religious martyr taking the place of a supposed quasi religious martyr in 2020.

Answer me this, do the Dems really even know what they want to accomplish? Have they thought any of this crap through? Was 2016 just a hiccup of cluelessness that they will recover from in 2018 and 2020 or are they returning to the Shangri-La of cluelessness they lived in during the 1980s?

[Julio3000]

MSNBC and NYT want to maximize shareholder value. Since they're elements of entities subject to US law, they have to do so within some fairly narrow strictures. You may not like their editorial slant but that's another conversation. Russia, as currently constituted, wants to promote their national interests and enrich and aggrandize their ruling class, particularly while undermining the norms and institutions of democracy. They are not subject to the same strictures.

So, thethe, I'm not sure how well they compare.

[Oklahomahawk]

Russia is not a threat to our liberty. Our own government is a threat to our liberty, by passing things like the Patriot Act and NDAA.

But y'all don't care about that.

Y'all don't care about drone strikes killing 90% innocent people.

Y'all care about Russia!

Talk about brainwashed. The NYT and CNN are doing a very good job

Oh I think Russia is a YUGE threat to our liberty and our security but not for the same reasons the Dems think. I pretty much agree with everything else you said though. Remember W liked to carpet bomb to get rid of bad guys and build his rating numbers, Obama preferred drone strikes to do the same, Trump likes the MOAB approach. The new boss, same as the previous bosses.

[Julio3000]

I maintain that the Dems can't really "win" again until they let go of the Russia thing, or at least actually come up with some meaningful plans, platforms, etc., to stand on that actually mean something to most Americans and put the Russia thing on the back burner. If the "smoking guns" come out then fine, but right now that and their being in denial about the real reasons they lost in 2016 are holding them back from ever really winning again and for the life of me I can't figure out why the Repubs ridicule and otherwise make fun of them for their stance. I mean, the Repubs don't have to do anything (right now) to win again in 2018 as long as the Dems keep it up with this strategy. If the Repubs were smart they would at least pretend to cower in fear and beg the Dems to stop talking about Russia before you find something that will destroy us, yada, yada, yada so they would keep doing it (reverse psychology I guess).

Remember how when Dems wanted to impeach W because Iraq was a lie? What would they have gotten if they had successfully done so? That's right, President Cheney without the "acting" part in front of his name? Good idea? You tell me. What happens if they successfully impeach Trump? You know as well as I do that when politicians start talking about impeachment it makes a sympathetic martyr figure out of their intended victim. Look at how Bill's numbers kept going up every time the Repubs of the 1990s even used the word "impeach". Do you really want President Pence? Right now IMO the religious right is making major league hypocritical Scribes and Pharisee level aholes of themselves by not only going along with Trump, but actively supporting him, even though I suspect more than a few do so while holding their noses. Imagine how they could get behind a really religious sounding guy like Pence with (whatever passes for with them these days) a semi clear conscience in 2020. A damaged Trump would be way easier for them to beat than a uber religious martyr taking the place of a supposed quasi religious martyr in 2020.

Answer me this, do the Dems really even know what they want to accomplish? Have they thought any of this crap through? Was 2016 just a hiccup of cluelessness that they will recover from in 2018 and 2020 or are they returning to the Shangri-La of cluelessness they lived in during the 1980s?

^^^^^

[57Brave]

" actually come up with some meaningful plans, platforms, etc., to stand on that actually mean something "

like fighting for health care or something ?
Last I checked in the minority in both Houses of Congress (D) and without the White House have stalled all (R) plans to strip ACA.
I would call that meaningful.

Please see Sen Sanders endorsement for MD Governor race from yesterday where he clearly spells out (D) goals

Started watching True Detective this week and as Det Rustin Cohle so aptly put, "just because you don't see it doesn't mean it is not there"

[sturg33]

" actually come up with some meaningful plans, platforms, etc., to stand on that actually mean something "

like fighting for health care or something ?
Last I checked in the minority in both Houses of Congress (D) and without the White House have stalled all (R) plans to strip ACA.
I would call that meaningful.

Please see Sen Sanders endorsement for MD Governor race from yesterday where he clearly spells out (D) goals

Started watching True Detective this week and as Det Rustin Cohle so aptly put, "just because you don't see it doesn't mean it is not there"

Do you guys remember when you lambasted republican congress for voting against everything Obama was doing?

Now you're cheering the exact same process?

Can you remember that the next time we're reversed?

And can we ever get past this 2-party "team" mentality?

[57Brave]

Not a fair assessment. The only thing (R) has proposed of consequence since January is TrumpCare

I am cheering for Susan Collins and Dan Heller

No, I can't remember the next time

No we have been operating on 2-party "team" mentality since the beginning of this noble experiment. It is kind of woven into the fabric of who we are.
Hamilton represented his interests and Jefferson his

You can look it up

[sturg33]

At least you admit you're a sheep

[57Brave]

Does that mean in your eyes today my credibility is sagging ?

[57Brave]

" actually come up with some meaningful plans, platforms, etc., to stand on that actually mean something "

Ari Berman‏Verified account @AriBerman

Ari Berman Retweeted Cory Booker

Booker introducing "Anti-Voter Suppression Act" to repeal Trump exec order creating 'election integrity' commission

[sturg33]

Does that mean in your eyes today my credibility is sagging ?

still waiting for you to answer the question I asked you 5 different times.

[thethe]

Russia is not a threat to our liberty. Our own government is a threat to our liberty, by passing things like the Patriot Act and NDAA.

But y'all don't care about that.

Y'all don't care about drone strikes killing 90% innocent people.

Y'all care about Russia!

Talk about brainwashed. The NYT and CNN are doing a very good job

Progressivism is a threat to our liberty. Continue to grow a central government and control how people think.

Russia will never impact my day to day life.

[Julio3000]

Progressivism is a threat to our liberty. Continue to grow a central government and control how people think.

Russia will never impact my day to day life.

Unless they help get a progressive candidate elected, I guess.

[57Brave]

Matthew Yglesias‏Verified account @mattyglesias 6m6 minutes ago

It's weird that Jr. and the White House lied repeatedly about this innocent meeting and now Republicans all trust him about what went down.

[goldfly]

Progressivism is a threat to our liberty. Continue to grow a central government and control how people think.

Russia will never impact my day to day life.

https://media0.giphy.com/media/xtc15Nu4ODSQE/giphy.gif

[57Brave]

And can we ever get past this 2-party "team" mentality?

Sen. Susan Collins‏Verified account @SenatorCollins

Still deep cuts to Medicaid in Senate bill. Will vote no on MTP. Ready to work w/ GOP & Dem colleagues to fix flaws in ACA

[Krgrecw]

You were/still a birther.
I never claimed to be a birther

[Julio3000]

I never claimed to be a birther

How do you rate the probabilities of:

1) Barack Obama having been born in Kenya and facilitating a cover-up to hide it.

AND

2) Donald Trump's campaign coordinating with Russians during the election.

I LOVE IT!

[BedellBrave]

CNN Report: Millions Of American Voters May Have Colluded To Elect Trump

http://babylonbee.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/jake.png

U.S.—A new, exclusive CNN investigative report revealed Thursday that millions of American voters may have potentially colluded with the Trump campaign to elect Donald Trump as President of the United States.

While Russia has been accused of interfering in the election, the breaking report indicates that the collusion may have extended to a significant portion of the U.S. population—“as many as 60 million citizens, and possibly even more.”

“The conspiracy goes much deeper than anyone expected,” Jake Tapper said on his news segment The Politics Lead. “We’re talking tens of millions of people involved in this secret plot to make sure Hillary didn’t make it into the White House and to prop up Donald Trump as the winner.”

The CNN report does not accuse anyone of hacking or rigging the vote, but rather suggests that those colluding with the real estate mogul in the far-reaching scheme may have simply walked into voting booths and cast their vote for Donald Trump, giving him the electoral college victory.

“It’s far more sinister than we thought,” a visibly disturbed Tapper said.

[BedellBrave]

:-)

[Krgrecw]

Former Democratic National Committee chair Rep. Debbie Wasserman Schultz introduced amendments that would seek to strip Donald Trump son-in-law Jared Kushner of his security clearance.
The former DNC chair and Florida Democrat ran the organization when it got hacked in an intrusion that the intelligence community concluded was orchestrated by the Kremlin. The disclosures that ensued proved embarrassing to Democratic nominee Hillary Clinton, and ultimately led to Wasserman Schultz stepping down from her post.

[sturg33]

Former Democratic National Committee chair Rep. Debbie Wasserman Schultz introduced amendments that would seek to strip Donald Trump son-in-law Jared Kushner of his security clearance.
The former DNC chair and Florida Democrat ran the organization when it got hacked in an intrusion that the intelligence community concluded was orchestrated by the Kremlin. The disclosures that ensued proved embarrassing to Democratic nominee Hillary Clinton, and ultimately led to Wasserman Schultz stepping down from her post.

Never forget... the reason DJT won is what was exposed of the crook HRC... not any rigging.

That's the unfortunate truth that the left refuses to acknowledge

[jpx7]

I don't believe that liberal/progressives believe in freedom. Or maybe we just define freedom differently.

Lol.

I disagree with sturg, but he at least has a (mostly) coherent platform. You, however, seem to be just a reactionary—but I'd love to read your "definitions".

[jpx7]

Russia is not a threat to our liberty. Our own government is a threat to our liberty, by passing things like the Patriot Act and NDAA.

But y'all don't care about that.

Y'all don't care about drone strikes killing 90% innocent people.

Y'all care about Russia!

Talk about brainwashed. The NYT and CNN are doing a very good job

Leave me out of this "y'all".

[jpx7]

That's the unfortunate truth that the left refuses to acknowledge

The left fairly despises HRC, bro.

[sturg33]

The left fairly despises HRC, bro.

I don't see how someone despised can get 57 million votes.

I wouldn't vote for someone I despised

[CK86]

Russia is not a threat to our liberty. Our own government is a threat to our liberty, by passing things like the Patriot Act and NDAA.

But y'all don't care about that.

Y'all don't care about drone strikes killing 90% innocent people.

Y'all care about Russia!

Talk about brainwashed. The NYT and CNN are doing a very good job

I do care about the Patriot Act and the NDAA and think both should be abolished. Likewise, I dislike the use of drones for precisely the reason you mentioned - the loss of innocent civilians. I do care about Russia because I don't want a candidate for President selling us out to another foreign power in exchange for winning the election. Just because I'm interested in the Russia angle doesn't mean I approve of those other things you mentioned - I don't.

[CK86]

So Obama put his party over the country. Got it.

Huh?

[goldfly]

i think my favorite thing is watching a the board "freedom lover" libertarian continually gives a pass to the republican party and how it's supposed to be what his thinking is than anything democrats do

and makes it even better when democrats hold no power at all

it's just fun imo

[57Brave]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DEsQ9KvWAAAaLo4.jpg:large

[sturg33]

i think my favorite thing is watching a the board "freedom lover" libertarian continually gives a pass to the republican party and how it's supposed to be what his thinking is than anything democrats do

and makes it even better when democrats hold no power at all

it's just fun imo

Can you re-post this in English?

[Oklahomahawk]

Apparently the Dems are better innovators and teachers than we gave them credit for. (http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/peter-w-smith-gop-operative-who-sought-clintons-emails-from-russian-hackers-committed-suicide-records-show/ar-BBEmFpX?li=BBmkt5R&ocid=spartanntp)

[Julio3000]

So the former GRU guy who was in the meeting with Junior, Manafort, and Kushner was accused in a lawsuit of being hired to run a hacking operation against a Russian mining company.

Odd that Junior's full disclosure and transparency omitted the mention of this guy at all.

[goldfly]

So the former GRU guy who was in the meeting with Junior, Manafort, and Kushner was accused in a lawsuit of being hired to run a hacking operation against a Russian mining company.

Odd that Junior's full disclosure and transparency omitted the mention of this guy at all.

dude

obviously

they are all just misremembering and lying for no reason at all man

THERE IS NOTHING THERE!

[57Brave]

Is there a member of the Trump Family / Inner Circle that has ever told the truth about anything to do with Russia ?
And let's be clear, Russia is not a distraction.

...

Steve Inskeep‏Verified account @NPRinskeep 5h5 hours ago

Here the president (a) makes a false claim, (b) admits it may be false, then (c) goes on as if it were true.
https://www.buzzfeed.com/gracewyler/the-russian-lawyer-who-met-with-trump-jr-was-granted-entry?utm_term=.bdRyeQjkM …




https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DEsZW3bXcAEzpcb.jpg:large

[Julio3000]

Is there a member of the Trump Family / Inner Circle that has ever told the truth about anything to do with Russia ?
And let's be clear, Russia is not a distraction.

...

Steve Inskeep‏Verified account @NPRinskeep 5h5 hours ago

Here the president (a) makes a false claim, (b) admits it may be false, then (c) goes on as if it were true.
https://www.buzzfeed.com/gracewyler/the-russian-lawyer-who-met-with-trump-jr-was-granted-entry?utm_term=.bdRyeQjkM …




https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DEsZW3bXcAEzpcb.jpg:large

This talking point is so dumb and desperate that it's a wonder that it even bubbled up . . . the fact that it's being repeated on the record by the POTUS is just . . . ugh.

She was allowed to travel to the US to work on the case brought against her client. I'm game to see that discussed, though, because I'd love to hear the explanation for why that case was settled so precipitously and unfavorably by the Sessions DoJ.

[The Chosen One]

Lol. Donnie had me laughing when he said at the G20 everyone was talking about Podesta's emails.

[57Brave]

More "Fake News"

Nicholas Kristof‏Verified account @NickKristof

CNN says 8 people, including 3 still unidentified, attended the Don Trump Jr. meeting with the Russians. Oops.

[goldfly]

just more misremembering, i guess, for a topic that is obviously nothing

https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/19905144_10100184992496402_7949517843605307104_n.j pg?oh=6046989d2163cc9fea8e92b4b06d3578&oe=59C84FEE


i mean, this russia thing certainly isn't pizza gate.

[57Brave]

It may not be Pizza gate but it is a distraction.
Troubling

[goldfly]

Lol. Donnie had me laughing when he said at the G20 everyone was talking about Podesta's emails.

that was easily just the dumbest lie he has had yet

[goldfly]

Trump Jr.’s Russia meeting sure sounds like a Russian intelligence operation

By Rolf Mowatt-Larssen July 14 at 1:48 PM
Rolf Mowatt-Larssen is the director of the Intelligence and Defense Project at Harvard’s Belfer Center. He served for three years as director of intelligence and counterintelligence at the Department of Energy and for 23 years as a CIA intelligence officer in domestic and international posts.

Donald Trump Jr. is seeking to write off as a nonevent his meeting last year with a Russian lawyer who was said to have damaging information about Hillary Clinton. “It was such a nothing,” he told Fox News’s Sean Hannity on Tuesday. “There was nothing to tell.”

But everything we know about the meeting — from whom it involved to how it was set up to how it unfolded — is in line with what intelligence analysts would expect an overture in a Russian influence operation to look like. It bears all the hallmarks of a professionally planned, carefully orchestrated intelligence soft pitch designed to gauge receptivity, while leaving room for plausible deniability in case the approach is rejected. And the Trump campaign’s willingness to take the meeting — and, more important, its failure to report the episode to U.S. authorities — may have been exactly the green light Russia was looking for to launch a more aggressive phase of intervention in the U.S. election campaign.

Let’s start with the interlocutor: Russian lawyer Natalia Veselnitskaya. When arranging the meeting, music promoter and Trump family acquaintance Rob Goldstone referred to a “Russian government attorney.” Both Veselnitskaya and the Kremlin have subsequently denied any association. What’s beyond dispute is that she has lobbied for the United States to repeal Magnitsky Act sanctions against Russian officials, that she regularly represents the interests of the Moscow regional government and that her clients include the vice president of state-owned Russian Railways.


My read, as someone who has been part of the U.S. intelligence community for more than four decades, is that Veselnitskaya is probably too well-connected to have independently initiated such a high-level and sensitive encounter. If she had, her use of known Trump and Kremlin associates (Aras and Emin Agalarov) to help make introductions and the suggestion, in Goldstone’s account, that she wanted to share “official documents and information” as “part of Russia and its government’s support” for Trump could have gotten her into significant trouble. Her efforts to meet Trump associates would have surely come to the attention of Russian authorities at some point, given Russian government email monitoring and other means of surveillance. The Kremlin would look harshly on someone going rogue in a manner that would surely damage ongoing Russian intelligence operational efforts related to the U.S. presidential campaign.

A better explanation is that Veselnitskaya is far enough removed from Moscow’s halls of power to make her a good fit as an intermediary in an intelligence operation — as a “cut-out” with limited knowledge of the larger scheme and as an “access agent” sent to assess and test a high-priority target’s interest in cooperation. She may have had her own agenda going into the meeting: to lobby against the Magnitsky Act, which happens to impact some of her clients. But her agenda dovetailed with Kremlin interests — and it would have added another layer of plausible deniability. Russian intelligence practice is to co-opt such a person. News Friday that she was accompanied by Rinat Akhmetshin, a Russian-American lobbyist who is reportedly suspected of, though denies, having ties to Russian intelligence, further bolsters this reading.


.......



https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/trump-jrs-russia-meeting-sure-sounds-like-a-russian-intelligence-operation/2017/07/14/5f7f3dfe-6762-11e7-9928-22d00a47778f_story.html?utm_term=.ef39496fd05a

[The Chosen One]

A lot of misremembering going on by Junior. Really takes after his father.

[Hawk]

Chapter 4: "The Meeting"

[Runnin]

just more misremembering, i guess, for a topic that is obviously nothing

https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/19905144_10100184992496402_7949517843605307104_n.j pg?oh=6046989d2163cc9fea8e92b4b06d3578&oe=59C84FEE

i mean, this russia thing certainly isn't pizza gate.
Kushner's lawyers said the reason he forgot to include all these other meetings was.. (http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/jurisprudence/2017/07/jeff_sessions_has_a_good_excuse_for_not_disclosing _his_russia_meetings_jared.html).. this is really good.... a member of Kushner's staff.... haha .... “prematurely hit the ‘send’ button ... before it was completed.”

This is way better than House of Cards.

[Runnin]

Do you think Putin knows any filthy rich Russian oligarchs willing to adopt a few well groomed adult American children? There is some baggage.

[Runnin]

Rinat Akhmetshin - The Russian-American was accused of orchestrating a cyberattack against a Russian mining company a few years ago.

https://img.huffingtonpost.com/asset/5968e1271a00003300dbec53.jpeg?cache=izzuiqitkm&ops=scalefit_720_noupscale

His agent says Rinat would like to play himself in the movie.

[Runnin]

So the leak about Jr.'s email and subsequent meeting came from Kushner's legal team who during their research to protect Kushner found the emails and realized their client could eventually be in line for a perjury charge. There must be a huge battle going on now between all the different legal teams, each only concerned with their own client and ready to do whatever it takes, collateral damage be damned.

All the different characters in this drama hiring different legal counsel was probably not a good idea.

[57Brave]

Lachlan Markay‏Verified account @lachlan

The Trump campaign began paying Don Jr's lawyer about two weeks before the email story broke, per new FEC filing


https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DEy49iGWAAAiLgL.jpg

....

This being one more indication the election was a fraud.
Keep adding them up

[Runnin]

Trump's new lawyer's name is Ty Cobb. By all accounts, despite the bow tie, he's a very serious dude well-versed in crisis management.

https://assets.bwbx.io/images/users/iqjWHBFdfxIU/i36rz4ziufsY/v0/400x-1.jpg

[The Chosen One]

Amateur Hour continues.

[goldfly]

It's weird that a certain poster here who claims to not get news from the right wing news organizations

Started spewing the same talking point as some trash right wing "journalists" that has been spitting the same "Russia isn't a threat to our civilativation and there are greater threats at home"


I love coincides like that

I'm sure it's nothing though

[57Brave]

Here goes, another dot for Jr.

It is only legal for Trump campaign to pay for Don Jrs lawyer if and only if the meeting June 2016 was campaign related.
Where did the Russians get the raw data for targeting digital media and will Trump release his taxes.

Henry Miller's first line in Tropic of Capricorn is " Once you give up the ghost, everything falls into place"