Talking Chop's Top 30 Prospect (midseason)

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Originally Posted by Skeeter31

I think using Newk for single innings is precisely what he needs. It’s a different mindset when your coming in to get a few outs as opposed to knowing you have to go multiple innings. You’re going to throw harder knowing you don’t have to throw 40-50 pitches.

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i think he should be getting rotation turns over fringe prospects like Bryse Wilson.

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Originally Posted by Southcack77

i think he should be getting rotation turns over fringe prospects like Bryse Wilson.

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in what way is Wilson a "fringe" prospect. unless we have different definitions of "fringe."

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Originally Posted by clvclv

Then why not utilize them in that role now rather than as pieces you trade for rentals? If these guys can turn into Giles/Smith types, why don't you just go ahead and put them in the pen while you have a chance to win instead of screwing around? Get rid of Blevins and Tomlin and fill those spots with Wilson/Ynoa/Weigel/Muller/Davidson types who can give you multiple innings right now AND be rotated on the Atlanta-Gwinnett shuttle for the next few years?

If someone would make Snitker quit yanking the guys he's been given to go multiple innings after one inning regardless of how they're pitching, the need to get 6-7 innings out of every SP would be greatly reduced. Unless they've made the decision to turn Newk and Touki into high-leverage weapons for good, the argument against using some of these really good arms we have in the pen makes sense - if you plan to continue developing them as SPs, it is pretty stupid to use them as 1 inning RPs. However, if Snitker would use them the right way, that would go a long way towards "fixing" the pen. There's very little reason Newk or Touki should only pitch one inning when they're called on, and the same would apply to Wilson/Ynoa/Weigel/Muller/Davidson.

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cuz starting pitchers are more valuable...so if a prospect has a 1 in 5 chance of developing as a starting pitcher it makes sense to give him every opportunity to do so...you take the path the Braves have taken with Newk

but generally a year or half a season in the major league pen is not an impediment to a young starting pitcher's development as a starter...Earl Weaver liked to do this with his young starting pitchers...and Max Fried has said his time in the pen was good for him...so I'm fine with Touki being in the pen this year and guys like Wilson and Wright having some time there in the second half

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Originally Posted by Super

in what way is Wilson a "fringe" prospect. unless we have different definitions of "fringe."

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I think he's an almost definite bullpen guy.

Wow. Wilson still looks like the second best young starting pitcher the Braves have to me.

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Originally Posted by Southcack77

i think he should be getting rotation turns over fringe prospects like Bryse Wilson.

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Wilson absolutely is not a fringe prospect. I'd put him over Wright at this point as our 2nd best pitching prospect.

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Originally Posted by Southcack77

I think he's an almost definite bullpen guy.

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You've got to be kidding... "almost definite" lol

Nick: I know you guys weren’t excited about the Braves draft after day two. With the six HS picks they’ve now signed from rounds 11-19, how significantly does that change things?
12:03
Eric A Longenhagen: Somewhat, they’re adding a bunch of 35+ FV types. Depth is nice, now they need to develop those players.

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Originally Posted by Carp

Wilson absolutely is not a fringe prospect. I'd put him over Wright at this point as our 2nd best pitching prospect.

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That's cool. It's just that you are wrong.

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Originally Posted by Southcack77

That's cool. It's just that you are wrong.

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He's certainly no JoJo

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Originally Posted by Southcack77

That's cool. It's just that you are wrong.

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I think that gaps a lot smaller than you think, chief.

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Originally Posted by Southcack77

i think he should be getting rotation turns over fringe prospects like Bryse Wilson.

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Wilson is a better starting pitcher prospect than Newcomb at this point, so your angle here isn’t sensible.

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Originally Posted by Skeeter31

I think using Newk for single innings is precisely what he needs. It’s a different mindset when your coming in to get a few outs as opposed to knowing you have to go multiple innings. You’re going to throw harder knowing you don’t have to throw 40-50 pitches.

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That may well be the case - and I have no problem with that. I've been the one banging the drum the loudest around here for turning some of these guys into Closers and setup guys because I think they could become elite guys in those roles. I'd love to see someone like Folty/Touki/Newk in the 8th and 9th - would eliminate the need to trade pieces for a Smith or Giles, and they might be even better.

The point is, it's not a crime to try those guys out in those roles for a while to see if they take to it. If you put Newk in the 8th and Folty in the 9th and they started blowing everyone away and convincingly slamming the door on people, it's relatively easy to go out and find a #3/#4 SP to replace them if you no longer need to worry about the back end - especially when we have quite a few more arms that could turn out to be #3 types already in the system and "ready" (or close). To this point, neither has shown the first sign that you can count on them to be front of the rotation types because they're just so *amn inconsistent, so what's the harm in finding out whether they could be your late-inning answers? I think Newk could turn out to be a lot like Brad Hand if you put him in that role.

The company line was that Newk and Touki were being moved to the pen for now because they could give you multiple strong innings on days that Julio or someone else doesn't have it and can't get you through 5 or 6, and Snitker simply isn't using them for that. For me, it's the same frustration that everyone has with the way he uses/doesn't use Camargo/Culberson to sit Markakis against lefties.

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Originally Posted by nsacpi

cuz starting pitchers are more valuable...so if a prospect has a 1 in 5 chance of developing as a starting pitcher it makes sense to give him every opportunity to do so...you take the path the Braves have taken with Newk

but generally a year or half a season in the major league pen is not an impediment to a young starting pitcher's development as a starter...Earl Weaver liked to do this with his young starting pitchers...and Max Fried has said his time in the pen was good for him...so I'm fine with Touki being in the pen this year and guys like Wilson and Wright having some time there in the second half

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That's my point - use them there and see how they take to it. If they turn into shutdown guys, leave them there - if not, send them back to Gwinnett to stretch back out and try a couple more starters in the pen in their place.