Official official offseason thread

[Slippyjms]

Before we get to SS how much would it cost to round out the rest of the roster? Pederson and Duvall to fix LF and 4th OF and Drury as our UTIL player.

Duvall and Pederson have the ability to fake it in CF at least in the short term. Duvall could cover Harris if he can’t improve his platoon split while Drury could cover Pederson. Drury can also provide days off or DH days to Acuña Olson Riley Albies and d’Arnaud.

That leaves us with Pina as the backup catcher allowing us to move Contreras to more of a full time DH role while potentially providing Olson cover against tough lefties.

That leaves Arcia to cover SS and any other IF position

Tough lefty lineup

Acuña RF
SS
Contreras 1B
Riley DH
d’Arnaud C
Albies 2B
Drury LF
Duvall CF
Arcia 3B

After that all we need is to find a quality LHRP and a solid RHRP and figure out who we want manning SS for the next several years. With the shift ban I’m very concerned about the defensive effects

[DirkPiggler]

There is no mystery to Acuna's down year: he was coming off a terrible knee injury, and has a dinosaur manager with no idea how to manage the workload of modern players. Acuna was pushed too hard in RF, wasn't forced to tone it down on the bases, and he was in a constant state of being banged up as a result. Snit is a grandpa dinosaur, and Acuna suffered as a result.

There's only one stat we need to look at: 34.0% FB rate. That mark is easily the lowest of his career, and well below the 45.6% rate he posted last year while having a monster season. Guys who hit the ball as hard as Acuna (Grade 70+ power) need to hit it in the air, and he needs healthy and fresh legs to get that done. The same incompetence that lead to Swanson and Olson playing 162 games is the same incompetence that made it impossible for Acuna to stay productive.

I have no doubt Acuna will come to ST and be the monster we expect early in 2023. It is then up to Snit/AA to figure out how to manage 21st century athletes in the year 2023 to keep him healthy and effective. Yes, that means giving him an occasional day off and instructing him on when being aggressive on the bases makes sense....neither of which Snit has shown any competency in doing.

It seemed like they tried to limit Acuña's baserunning when he hit weak ground balls. I can't pinpoint when, but it seems like I recall either the TV or radio announcers mentioning this. That seems like ass backward logic. The marginal value of a stolen base isn't going to be worth the risk of reinjury most of the time. It probably isn't in turning an out into a hit the few times RA could beat one out either, but it made zero sense to hold him back on one and not the other.

[Hudson2]

Before we get to SS how much would it cost to round out the rest of the roster? Pederson and Duvall to fix LF and 4th OF and Drury as our UTIL player.

Duvall and Pederson have the ability to fake it in CF at least in the short term. Duvall could cover Harris if he can’t improve his platoon split while Drury could cover Pederson. Drury can also provide days off or DH days to Acuña Olson Riley Albies and d’Arnaud.

That leaves us with Pina as the backup catcher allowing us to move Contreras to more of a full time DH role while potentially providing Olson cover against tough lefties.

That leaves Arcia to cover SS and any other IF position

Tough lefty lineup

Acuña RF
SS
Contreras 1B
Riley DH
d’Arnaud C
Albies 2B
Drury LF
Duvall CF
Arcia 3B

After that all we need is to find a quality LHRP and a solid RHRP and figure out who we want manning SS for the next several years. With the shift ban I’m very concerned about the defensive effects

0% chance that Olson sits vs lefties. Only way I see Drury brought in is if we can get rid of Ozuna.

[CJ9]

There’s no need to spend on a utility player the caliber of Drury when we have a manager who refuses to give players off days.

[bravesfanforlife88]

There’s no need to spend on a utility player the caliber of Drury when we have a manager who refuses to give players off days.

He probably gets a long term contract to be a starter based on the year he had

[50PoundHead]

He probably gets a long term contract to be a starter based on the year he had

I am really curious as to what Drury's market will look like. Is a career year at age 30 the kind of bait that lands someone a big contract? Probably someone who is a finishing touch on a good team and I don't know what that nets him. Universal DH is a benefit to guys like Drury and the rebound that started when he was with the Mets in 2021 might continue. With a 2022 salary of $700,000, he was one of the biggest veteran bargains of this past season, but there's a fair amount of risk going forward.

[Enscheff]

There’s no need to spend on a utility player the caliber of Drury when we have a manager who refuses to give players off days.

This is 100% accurate. Snit is simply incapable of properly deploying a deep roster. Even if he were, Grissom is probably talented enough to be that guy.

A bench of Heredia, Arcia and Pina is plenty good for whatever limited tactics Snit is able to understand. Like it or not, some combination of Contreras/Rosario/Ozuna will be taking up the bulk of the LF/DH PAs in 2023. Hopefully someone like Grossman is signed to help cover that area a bit for cheap, and I wouldn't be upset to see him brought back...but for crying out loud not for 2 years.

[bravesfanforlife88]

White Sox hired the royals coach. Ron Washington staying with us thank god

[CJC]

There is no mystery to Acuna's down year: he was coming off a terrible knee injury, and has a dinosaur manager with no idea how to manage the workload of modern players. Acuna was pushed too hard in RF, wasn't forced to tone it down on the bases, and he was in a constant state of being banged up as a result. Snit is a grandpa dinosaur, and Acuna suffered as a result.

There's only one stat we need to look at: 34.0% FB rate. That mark is easily the lowest of his career, and well below the 45.6% rate he posted last year while having a monster season. Guys who hit the ball as hard as Acuna (Grade 70+ power) need to hit it in the air, and he needs healthy and fresh legs to get that done. The same incompetence that lead to Swanson and Olson playing 162 games is the same incompetence that made it impossible for Acuna to stay productive.

I have no doubt Acuna will come to ST and be the monster we expect early in 2023. It is then up to Snit/AA to figure out how to manage 21st century athletes in the year 2023 to keep him healthy and effective. Yes, that means giving him an occasional day off and instructing him on when being aggressive on the bases makes sense....neither of which Snit has shown any competency in doing.

I want to agree and disagree with you at the same time. Snitker does a terrible job with load management, that we agree on. However, they sat Acuna a bunch after bringing him back, I'm assuming at the direction of the FO. He had several multiple game rest periods anytime he got the slightest boo boo.

Acuna was down coming off of the injury, but I don't think resting him more than they already did would've helped.

I will also agree with the instructions on baserunning, but for different reasons. His 72.5% SB success rate wasn't THAT bad... but his CS came at terrible times strategically in games. He should have gotten a hold sign from the dugout instead of being on his own.

[CJC]

Agree with the Grissom take 100%. He's too good of a hitter to get 2 AB a week with the MLB club. He needs to supersub or start back in AAA.

I know it "thins" the bench technically, but I'd like to see up package Pina and a C level prospect for someone to eat the Ozuna contract. Surely someone is C starved enough to discuss this. Yes, it clears salary, but more importantly it lets us use the bench spots on guys who are actually more valuable to the team. Ozuna sucks a roster spot and we managed Catcher just fine without Pina.

This is 100% accurate. Snit is simply incapable of properly deploying a deep roster. Even if he were, Grissom is probably talented enough to be that guy.

A bench of Heredia, Arcia and Pina is plenty good for whatever limited tactics Snit is able to understand. Like it or not, some combination of Contreras/Rosario/Ozuna will be taking up the bulk of the LF/DH PAs in 2023. Hopefully someone like Grossman is signed to help cover that area a bit for cheap, and I wouldn't be upset to see him brought back...but for crying out loud not for 2 years.

[50PoundHead]

This is 100% accurate. Snit is simply incapable of properly deploying a deep roster. Even if he were, Grissom is probably talented enough to be that guy.

A bench of Heredia, Arcia and Pina is plenty good for whatever limited tactics Snit is able to understand. Like it or not, some combination of Contreras/Rosario/Ozuna will be taking up the bulk of the LF/DH PAs in 2023. Hopefully someone like Grossman is signed to help cover that area a bit for cheap, and I wouldn't be upset to see him brought back...but for crying out loud not for 2 years.

I guess this is one of those rare areas where we disagree. Heredia has no business on the roster of a contender. I'm not a big Duvall fan as most here know, but I will be surprised if he's not back with the Braves in 2023.

[Slippyjms]

0% chance that Olson sits vs lefties. Only way I see Drury brought in is if we can get rid of Ozuna.

I’d agree he doesn’t sit against run of the mill lefties but it provides an option for a starter that’s particularly tough on LHH.

Also this is all based on the premise of kicking Ozuna and Rosario to the curb.

[Enscheff]

I want to agree and disagree with you at the same time. Snitker does a terrible job with load management, that we agree on. However, they sat Acuna a bunch after bringing him back, I'm assuming at the direction of the FO. He had several multiple game rest periods anytime he got the slightest boo boo.

Acuna was down coming off of the injury, but I don't think resting him more than they already did would've helped.

I will also agree with the instructions on baserunning, but for different reasons. His 72.5% SB success rate wasn't THAT bad... but his CS came at terrible times strategically in games. He should have gotten a hold sign from the dugout instead of being on his own.

The FO likely mandated how he was used early, and then again once he got banged up.

It was all the time in between that Snit played him every single day that led to him getting banged up. All those meaningless steal attempts. All that aggressive baserunning nonsense like running through stop signs. Not pulling him when games were out of reach.

Snit simply can't manage modern athletes in the modern game. The talent on the roster has to overcome his incompetence as well as the other team.

[Hudson2]

Max Fried and Dansby won the gold gloves. Dansbys price went up I’m sure.

[Enscheff]

I guess this is one of those rare areas where we disagree. Heredia has no business on the roster of a contender. I'm not a big Duvall fan as most here know, but I will be surprised if he's not back with the Braves in 2023.

Heredia is a perfectly adequate backup in CF who is MLB average against LHPs and plays at least average CF....for like $1M. The fact Snit can't figure out how to use him to take some PAs away from Harris vs LHPs is not Heredia's fault. A team like the Dodgers, As or Rays would figure out how to give him 200 PAs and get ~1 WAR out of him for peanuts. Even the corpse of Pujols proved useful when deployed by a competent oranization.

I'm not sure what else folks are looking for in a backup CFer...especially using Duvall as an alternative.

[thewupk]

Max Fried and Dansby won the gold gloves. Dansbys price went up I’m sure.

Both were deserving. Swanson was at 21 OOA per statcast. Which was far and away the best among SS this year. 2nd place was Hoerner and Lindor at 13.

Don't think this will drive Swanson's price up. Teams already knew he was an excellent defender.

Harris will have a good shot at winning one next year but Grisham will be tough to dethrone.

[GovClintonTyree]

Bowman also said we tried to swap Ozuna for Corbin, but Nats said no. I think that says we want Ozuna gone (may even DFA him) and where payroll currently stands.

Sweet Jesus. What does that solve? Paying Morton with nothing left, paid Hamels, W Smith, Jansen, Odorizzi...we don't need any more ineffective veteran pitchers. I'd just release Ozuna.

[NYCBrave]

Yankees looking to get out from under Josh Donaldson's remaining contract. AA has made some questionable signings, but in retrospect he made the right call with not giving Donaldson a long term deal.

[Russ2dollas]

Klaw's FA guide is out.

He has Correra, Turner and Swanson all at 30 million per year and 6-8 years. I wonder if AA will target a specific guy or just put out a 30 million per year for 5 years and an Option and see who takes it first. Maybe the Dodgers get one, or maybe two because they are the dodgers. Maybe someone wants to be Baez and take the most money but end up on a **** team.

I think the Braves are going to be attractive as a long term winner. Turner and Dansby have personal and relationship ties to the general area.

IF all three guys are going to cost the same, I think I'd go ahead and get Correa. Yes it's a big defensive downgrade and that is concern with Riley over there. But I don't trust Dansby's bat or his defense aging. I'd take Correra, tell him and Snit that Grissom is going to play SS every 5 games to keep Correra healthy (Correa to DH in those games). I'm going to default to the big bat.

My dream is Turner and family really want to go back towards home and take a discount, but I know it's not realistic.

6/150 for Dansby just worries me. I just don't see him as an impact bat and I worry about his defense aging.

[bravesfanforlife88]

Klaw's FA guide is out.

He has Correra, Turner and Swanson all at 30 million per year and 6-8 years. I wonder if AA will target a specific guy or just put out a 30 million per year for 5 years and an Option and see who takes it first. Maybe the Dodgers get one, or maybe two because they are the dodgers. Maybe someone wants to be Baez and take the most money but end up on a **** team.

I think the Braves are going to be attractive as a long term winner. Turner and Dansby have personal and relationship ties to the general area.

IF all three guys are going to cost the same, I think I'd go ahead and get Correa. Yes it's a big defensive downgrade and that is concern with Riley over there. But I don't trust Dansby's bat or his defense aging. I'd take Correra, tell him and Snit that Grissom is going to play SS every 5 games to keep Correra healthy (Correa to DH in those games). I'm going to default to the big bat.

My dream is Turner and family really want to go back towards home and take a discount, but I know it's not realistic.

6/150 for Dansby just worries me. I just don't see him as an impact bat and I worry about his defense aging.

I feel like one aspect that is not being talked about enough on this board regarding the SS position is AA's unwillingness to offer either a no trade clause or an opt out clause. Turner was reportedly unhappy about being traded to LA when the deal went down. Correa just used his opt out to his advantage.

What is the financial amount he'd have to pay either of the 4 SS candidates to forego the no trade and/or opt out clause?