Affordable Care Act

[57Brave]

Should make one pause and consider "where else have I been misinformed"
Climate change politics perhaps? Gun control? Minimum wage? Unemployment? Regulation on business?
Women's health???

Can't help but wonder, after the same people pushed through the disastrous Bush Tax Cuts and took us to wars --- how could anyone blindly find themselves agreeing with the same people?

But hey

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"Here are some of the predictions made by the critics that have taken a factual beating:"

http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer...yintelligencer

[The Chosen One]

It isn't a coincidence now that Obamacare is up and running and is slowly getting popular that Benghazi is back in the picture....

[Tapate50]

It isn't a coincidence now that Obamacare is up and running and is slowly getting popular that Benghazi is back in the picture....

Lol

[yeezus]

It isn't a coincidence now that Obamacare is up and running and is slowly getting popular that Benghazi is back in the picture....

Did Benghazi ever leave the picture?
I swear it's amazing how much it's talked about. My mother is an avid fox news watcher and "Benghazi" is said on every show at least 80 times. They are thoroughly obsessed.
It really doesn't matter what anyone here says about the ACA, there will be an article posted in response on why it sucks, or why it's wrong or un-freedom-like.

[The Chosen One]

Lol

You laugh, but when the unemployment rate was high, the GOP did nothing but continue to attack the number.

Now that it's dropped about 3% in the last few years... it's "well it's lower now but there's still plenty of people that are looking". When it was at a baseline of 9-10% it was ALL about the 9-10%. Now that it's dropped to around 6-7% there's a lot of "Yeah buts". Can't have it both ways.

Obamacare as much as you disagree or don't like it, is slowly gaining popularity now that the dust has settled and people are starting to use it. There's more and more people who are lifelong Republicans that have signed up for it and like it, and that number is only going to continue. It's working in Kentucky, not so much the other deep south states where literally every GOP Governor has blocked medicaid expansion.

Always convenient that Benghazi can be something the GOP can exploit whenever the going gets rough for them.

[sturg33]

Did Benghazi ever leave the picture?
I swear it's amazing how much it's talked about. My mother is an avid fox news watcher and "Benghazi" is said on every show at least 80 times. They are thoroughly obsessed.
It really doesn't matter what anyone here says about the ACA, there will be an article posted in response on why it sucks, or why it's wrong or un-freedom-like.

I don't see how this is even arguable

[yeezus]

I don't see how this is even arguable

I know you don't see it, because you view things like this in a vacuum and in black and white.
Others don't. Welcome to the world.

[sturg33]

I know you don't see it, because you view things like this in a vacuum and in black and white.
Others don't. Welcome to the world.

I'm not even arguing that it's a bad law (although I believe it is). But forcing the populace to do something is the exact opposite of freedom. If you can't at least admit that, then there's no point in discussing with you

[The Chosen One]

I absolutely hate the fact I'm sacrificing my "liberty" to buy health insurance, for the security that others less fortunate than I can have access to affordable and attainable healthcare...

I actually would prefer universal medicare, so that way everyone would be enslaved to helping provide health care for those lazy bums who don't want to work.

[yeezus]

I'm not even arguing that it's a bad law (although I believe it is). But forcing the populace to do something is the exact opposite of freedom. If you can't at least admit that, then there's no point in discussing with you

100% freedom is unattainable. This is a complex issue with a lot of variables.
I don't view taxes as an infringement of my freedom, nor do I view this as an infringement of my freedom. There are trade-offs.

[sturg33]

100% freedom is unattainable. This is a complex issue with a lot of variables.
I don't view taxes as an infringement of my freedom, nor do I view this as an infringement of my freedom. There are trade-offs.

I would imagine that if the federal government forced you to buy a gun in the name of protecting yourself, you would have an issue with that

[sturg33]

Obamacare as much as you disagree or don't like it, is slowly gaining popularity now that the dust has settled and people are starting to use it.

Link: Poll: Obamacare hits new low

The Pew Research Center poll shows disapproval of the law hitting a new high of 55 percent. It comes on the heels of several polls last week that showed the law had very little -- if any -- bump after sign-ups on the health-care exchanges exceeded goals.

[The Chosen One]

Link: Poll: Obamacare hits new low

Perception vs. Reality

It's helping people.

[The Chosen One]

I would imagine that if the federal government forced you to buy a gun in the name of protecting yourself, you would have an issue with that

Switzerland does, and they have a national healthcare system, plus lower taxes than us, and no federal debt.

They also have military requirement as well.

[The Chosen One]

Also, your analogy is terrible.

People can live without a gun so yes I'd be pissed. People walk the tightrope living without health insurance. Not talking about moochers but everyday working joes.

[sturg33]

Also, your analogy is terrible.

People can live without a gun so yes I'd be pissed. People walk the tightrope living without health insurance. Not talking about moochers but everyday working joes.

People can't live without health insurance?

I must have missed those 40 million funerals I heard so much about...

The good news is, now it's only 39 million funerals because ObamaCare has helped 2.5% of those people. At least it's affordable! (If only that were true).

The analogy is not meant to be an apple for apple comparison. It's to show that anytime the federal government FORCES you to buy anything, it could never be described as freedom.

[sturg33]

Perception vs. Reality

It's helping people.

Sorry. You said that people are liking the law. When a record high 55% of the people disapprove of it.

When you say it's helping people, do you mean the people who had no insurance? Sure, I guess it may be helping them. But the rest of the country is paying for it. And frankly, people aren't going to like that. The law will remain unpopular.

[The Chosen One]

You look at 2.5%, I look at 7.8 million people helped so far.

That's a lot considering Obamacare has been the subject of a repeal agenda for political points since it was signed into law. The Republicans gambled their entire 2012 hopes on the country wanting to overturn Obamacare for 3 years... and it didn't work. The death panels, the "take your hands off my medicare", etc.

It would be more popular if the medicaid expansion was approved in the states most needy in the Deep South.

People are using it, people are liking it, and not surprising people that didn't know anything about it and only got their information from Fox News are signing up and liking it. I read it on facebook everyday from random joes across the country. "Long time Republican/Fox News person, was told by a co-worker to sign up and my premium is very affordable. I'm happy with it.".

You indirectly want people to have the freedom to die because they can't afford healthcare, by directly endorsing your platform that you just want people to have the freedom to choose if they want health insurance.

I would rather have universal medicare, but this is better than what we had before and is the bridge to universal medicare.

[yeezus]

I would imagine that if the federal government forced you to buy a gun in the name of protecting yourself, you would have an issue with that

Really depends on the situation. If having guns was essential for the well-being of most people, I'd be OK with it.
Again, I don't view taxes as an infringement of freedom, even though without context saying "being forced to give money to an entity is not freedom!!!" I guess not, but it funds things I need and may take for granted, so it's helpful.

[sturg33]

You look at 2.5%, I look at 7.8 million people helped so far.

But the goal of the law was to get uninsured people insured. That hasn't happened.