2016-2017 Off-Season Thread

[UNCBlue012]

Allard is mine as well. Fried is right behind him.

[CJ9]

The conversation about ranking out starting prospects is why I'd rather wait another year. There are still so many questions on these starting prospects. How does Fried handle a big competition jump to AA? Can Allard put together a healthy season? Can Newcomb carry over his strong close? Same with Touki. How does Weigel look against better competition in AA? How do Anderson, Wentz, Muller and Wilson handle full season ball?

I'd much rather wait another year to get some answers on these guys before we start trading them when we probably aren't ready to be serious contenders yet.

[nsacpi]

The conversation about ranking out starting prospects is why I'd rather wait another year. There are still so many questions on these starting prospects. How does Fried handle a big competition jump to AA? Can Allard put together a healthy season? Can Newcomb carry over his strong close? Same with Touki. How does Weigel look against better competition in AA? How do Anderson, Wentz, Muller and Wilson handle full season ball?

I'd much rather wait another year to get some answers on these guys before we start trading them when we probably aren't ready to be serious contenders yet.

Yup. And I would add Folty and Wisler are hardly finished products. We're in a situation where some patience is called for. I make a deal for someone like Sale this off-season only if the price is very good.

[bravesfanMatt]

Only problem with waiting is bust or regression. If 4 of Newk, Fried, Allard, Touki, Muller, Wentz, Weigel, Sims (50%) regress, then we are in much worse spot because not only did they loose value, but now we need to hold the other 4 closer because lack of faith.

But then we still have Trex, Folty, Wisler, Povse, Gant, Whalen, Ellis, Blair, and Soroka who all could step up as well..

Good Grief we have a ton of pitching..

[praeceps93]

Braves add Fried, Sims, and Johan Camargo to 40-man roster. Only notable leave-off I can see is Connor Lien.

[zbhargrove]

The conversation about ranking out starting prospects is why I'd rather wait another year. There are still so many questions on these starting prospects. How does Fried handle a big competition jump to AA? Can Allard put together a healthy season? Can Newcomb carry over his strong close? Same with Touki. How does Weigel look against better competition in AA? How do Anderson, Wentz, Muller and Wilson handle full season ball?

I'd much rather wait another year to get some answers on these guys before we start trading them when we probably aren't ready to be serious contenders yet.

You're not wrong... its just very addictive to think of Sale for 3 years at his price...

[bravesfanMatt]

Braves add Fried, Sims, and Johan Camargo to 40-man roster. Only notable leave-off I can see is Connor Lien.

I can agree to this... I don't think anyone would take a chance on Connor, but you can't leave Fried and Sims unprotected. Camargo I would be fine either way.

[UNCBlue012]

You're not wrong... its just very addictive to think of Sale for 3 years at his price...

Unless we make big moves, we technically only have him for two years of legit contention though, right? Unless I'm looking at this wrong.

[zbhargrove]

Unless we make big moves, we technically only have him for two years of legit contention though, right? Unless I'm looking at this wrong.

Sure, but I still think if we make a move for an ace, we also acquire a clear upgrade at third.

[Preacher]

http://www.soxtalk.com/forums/index....ic=101067&st=0

Sox fans talk about a potential Braves fit....

from one of their posters,

'Trade would have to be Swanson, Inciarte, Albies, and two of the pitchers and I still wouldn't love it.' hahaha

[50PoundHead]

I am probably the President of the Camargo Fan Club (I think we have two or three members) and I think someone would have taken him in the Rule 5. Good fielder who can play all three IF positions and started to show some power last season. Don't know if he'll ever be a starter, but he could be a solid 250 AB guy. Lien has big-time contact issues that have to be solved for him to contribute consistently at the big league level. Great tools except for contact.

Fried and Sims had to be protected. I could see a club taking Fried in the Rule 5 and using him sparingly like the Twins used Johan Santana after acquiring him.

[NinersSBChamps]

http://www.soxtalk.com/forums/index....ic=101067&st=0

Sox fans talk about a potential Braves fit....

from one of their posters,

'Trade would have to be Swanson, Inciarte, Albies, and two of the pitchers and I still wouldn't love it.' hahaha

Sounds like a guy who doesn't just assume all Braves prospects are gonna be HOFers.

[PurpleBrave]

David O'Brien of the Atlanta Journal-Constitution reports that Chris Sale is the Braves' "focus" as they look to acquire a starter.
O'Brien confirms reports that the Braves have inquired on Chris Archer and Sonny Gray, but it appears they're devoting most of their attention to Sale. The Braves almost surely aren't ready to compete for a playoff spot in 2017, but getting Sale would obviously help them be competitive in the first year in their new ballpark. The lefty has a very team-friendly contract that runs through 2019. Atlanta has the necessary pieces to get something done with the White Sox.

[Preacher]

Sounds like a guy who doesn't just assume all Braves prospects are gonna be HOFers.

I'm not saying he's wrong to want something like that for Sale, its just ludicrous to think the Braves would put those three in a package together.

[zbhargrove]

David O'Brien of the Atlanta Journal-Constitution reports that Chris Sale is the Braves' "focus" as they look to acquire a starter.
O'Brien confirms reports that the Braves have inquired on Chris Archer and Sonny Gray, but it appears they're devoting most of their attention to Sale. The Braves almost surely aren't ready to compete for a playoff spot in 2017, but getting Sale would obviously help them be competitive in the first year in their new ballpark. The lefty has a very team-friendly contract that runs through 2019. Atlanta has the necessary pieces to get something done with the White Sox.

How many times does this need to be posted in this thread?

[Enscheff]

http://www.soxtalk.com/forums/index....ic=101067&st=0

Sox fans talk about a potential Braves fit....

from one of their posters,

'Trade would have to be Swanson, Inciarte, Albies, and two of the pitchers and I still wouldn't love it.' hahaha

That shows you the "other side" that doesn't give two ****s about the Braves prospects, and overvalues Sale. That package is something that would be in the discussion to get Trout, not Sale. The trio of Swanson, Albies and Inciarte is a playoff caliber middle of your defense and top 3 of your lineup under control for 4-6 years.

I think it's pretty clear the piece to build a package for Sale around is Inciarte while his value is at its absolute peak with Mallex ready to step in and represent a 1-2 win downgrade. Swanson is very clearly completely off limits, but if they include Albies the downgrade from Albies to Jace is probably 2-3 wins...which almost cancels out the increase from adding Sale to the rotation. Add in the fact that 6 years of Albies posting 3-4 WAR is far more valuable than 3 years of Sale posting 4-5 WAR, and Albies pretty much has to be off the table as well. There is also no chance I include Acuna or Maitan in any trade since they are the only impact position players in the entire system.

So it comes down to Inciarte and "other stuff". What is that "other stuff"? Give the ChiSox 2 chances at a new Ace by giving them Newcomb and their pick from one of the A ball pitchers? Then throw in a marginal piece like Demeritte, Riley, DPete or Ruiz? Give them salary relief by taking on Shields?

My final offer would be Inciarte, plus Newcomb, plus one of Allard/Fried/Touki/Soroka, plus 1-2 of Demerritte/DPete/Riley/Ruiz, plus take all of Shields remaining contract. Tell them take it or leave it, and stop texting.

If that trade is made the Braves MUST improve C and 3B, and add a RHed 4th OFer, so then I do whatever it takes to get Castro, Valbuena, and Justin Ruggiano.

C - Castro/Flowers (2-3 wins, plus another 20 framing runs)
1B - Freeman (4-5 wins)
2B - Jace for 1-2 months, then Albies (2-3 wins)
3B - Valbuena/Garcia (2-3)
SS - Swanson (3-4 wins)
LF - Kemp (0-1 win)
CF - Mallex/Ruggiano (2-3 wins)
RF - Markakis (1-2 wins)

SP - Sale (4-5 wins), Teheran (3-4 wins), Folty (2-3 wins), Dickey (1-2 wins), Colon (1-2 wins)

BP/Bench - 3-4 wins (most of the bench wins were rolled into overall platoon production above)

Total: 31-44 WAR, which translates to 79-92 wins, so call them an 84-87 win team.

[zbhargrove]

Holy crap... the white sox fans are delusional....

[msstate7]

That shows you the "other side" that doesn't give two ****s about the Braves prospects, and overvalues Sale. That package is something that would be in the discussion to get Trout, not Sale. The trio of Swanson, Albies and Inciarte is a playoff caliber middle of your defense and top 3 of your lineup under control for 4-6 years.

I think it's pretty clear the piece to build a package for Sale around is Inciarte while his value is at its absolute peak with Mallex ready to step in and represent a 1-2 win downgrade. Swanson is very clearly completely off limits, but if they include Albies the downgrade from Albies to Jace is probably 2-3 wins...which almost cancels out the increase from adding Sale to the rotation. Add in the fact that 6 years of Albies posting 3-4 WAR is far more valuable than 3 years of Sale posting 4-5 WAR, and Albies pretty much has to be off the table as well. There is also no chance I include Acuna or Maitan in any trade since they are the only impact position players in the entire system.

So it comes down to Inciarte and "other stuff". What is that "other stuff"? Give the ChiSox 2 chances at a new Ace by giving them Newcomb and their pick from one of the A ball pitchers? Then throw in a marginal piece like Demeritte, Riley, DPete or Ruiz? Give them salary relief by taking on Shields?

My final offer would be Inciarte, plus Newcomb, plus one of Allard/Fried/Touki/Soroka, plus 1-2 of Demerritte/DPete/Riley/Ruiz, plus take all of Shields remaining contract. Tell them take it or leave it, and stop texting.

If that trade is made the Braves MUST improve C and 3B, and add a RHed 4th OFer, so then I do whatever it takes to get Castro, Valbuena, and Justin Ruggiano.

C - Castro/Flowers
1B - Freeman
2B - Jace for 1-2 months, then Albies
3B - Valbuena/Garcia
SS - Swanson
LF - Kemp
CF - Mallex/Ruggiano
RF - Markakis

SP - Sale, Teheran, Folty, Dickey, Colon

That would be a pretty good team

[zbhargrove]

That shows you the "other side" that doesn't give two ****s about the Braves prospects, and overvalues Sale. That package is something that would be in the discussion to get Trout, not Sale. The trio of Swanson, Albies and Inciarte is a playoff caliber middle of your defense and top 3 of your lineup under control for 4-6 years.

I think it's pretty clear the piece to build a package for Sale around is Inciarte while his value is at its absolute peak with Mallex ready to step in and represent a 1-2 win downgrade. Swanson is very clearly completely off limits, but if they include Albies the downgrade from Albies to Jace is probably 2-3 wins...which almost cancels out the increase from adding Sale to the rotation. Add in the fact that 6 years of Albies posting 3-4 WAR is far more valuable than 3 years of Sale posting 4-5 WAR, and Albies pretty much has to be off the table as well. There is also no chance I include Acuna or Maitan in any trade since they are the only impact position players in the entire system.

So it comes down to Inciarte and "other stuff". What is that "other stuff"? Give the ChiSox 2 chances at a new Ace by giving them Newcomb and their pick from one of the A ball pitchers? Then throw in a marginal piece like Demeritte, Riley, DPete or Ruiz? Give them salary relief by taking on Shields?

My final offer would be Inciarte, plus Newcomb, plus one of Allard/Fried/Touki/Soroka, plus 1-2 of Demerritte/DPete/Riley/Ruiz, plus take all of Shields remaining contract. Tell them take it or leave it, and stop texting.

If that trade is made the Braves MUST improve C and 3B, and add a RHed 4th OFer, so then I do whatever it takes to get Castro, Valbuena, and Justin Ruggiano.

C - Castro/Flowers
1B - Freeman
2B - Jace for 1-2 months, then Albies
3B - Valbuena/Garcia
SS - Swanson
LF - Kemp
CF - Mallex/Ruggiano
RF - Markakis

SP - Sale, Teheran, Folty, Dickey, Colon

I'm on board, but I'd still rather sign Turner and trade Garcia for whatever we can get.

[Preacher]

Holy crap... the white sox fans are delusional....

No more so than any other fan base.

Everybody always overrates their own, look at it this way, if the Braves had Sale on that contract and were looking to deal him; wouldn't we want guys like 'Swanson and Maitan' to be in that package?