LOL at the Fast Food Strike

[Oklahomahawk]

Careful sturg my friend, you're straying a little far from Ron, an actual Libertarian and a little too close to Rand, a radical Republican in Libertarian clothing, so to speak. Rand's about as Libertarian as Michelle "Sarah Palin AFTER the lobotomy" Bachmann.

Oh and while you guys are so busy worrying about how much the fine folks at Wal-Mart might have to pay their near-minimum wage workers (who are much closer to you guys' age than teenagers by the way, in spite of what your far right friends constantly tell you) don't forget that the top 4 or 5 Walton family members have about as much green as almost half of Americans put together. Oh and also while you're whining about income redistribution you might wake up for a moment and realize it IS going on and HAS BEEN going on since the wonderful Utopian Reagan 80's, but not in the top to bottom direction the Goebbels-esque Fox Business Channel folks might tell you, but in the exact OPPOSITE direction. So for anyone who's interested in the REAL truth instead of the Kool-Aid flavored "pity the poor downtrodden rich folks, er the job-creators" try feeling for those who have had their jobs sent to India, etc. so the aforementioned top 5% can own a Gulf-Stream 4 instead of a Gulf-Stream 3, while at the same time bemoaning the lack of company loyalty among their workers (those who are still here by the way) and pay their faithful whores on talk radio and certain elements at Fox to feed you more bull**** about how it's the poor who are fighting a class war against the true Americans, those who are just trying to live the American dream.

Oh and just take a moment before you turn on me for telling you the ACTUAL TRUTH, instead of what you're force fed every day and do a little real research somewhere that isn't a far left OR a far right source, or just take me up on my offer that's at least a decade old and for those who consider themselves Christians and pray to THE God of heaven (who's neither red nor blue) and ask HIM for the REAL TRUTH, that is IF you have the NADS, I distinctly remember more than a couple of you who turned down my challenge back during W's Utopia because they didn't need to talk to the actual God I suggested, they said, if I remember correctly, they trusted his messengers here on Earth and didn't need to go that far.

So, have those devils in Armani clothing bring back the jobs, pay their people a decent living wage (no I didn't say split the revenues equally across the board) and then we'll talk about how much they're suffering. And for anyone who's shaking their heads and muttering about how sorry an SOB I might be, let me finish with this, no matter how much it might piss you off to hear it from me right now, it's about 1,000,000 X better to hear it from me now than from God Almighty come Judgement Day and while I may not speak for America's religious community (Gee I wonder why???) you know I speak the truth, that's what causing that heat flash in your gut that your buddy in the red flannel underwear and the cool horns and pitchfork tells you is just righteous indignation.

Oh and peace out all my friends.

[57Brave]

Treating a job at McDonalds as a career and the "main source" of income to raise a family is the problem here. Those jobs aren't meant for that purpose.

There are people an situations where McD is the only option.
And, who says a person cant have a career making burgers -
Are you too good for that ?
Who are you to judge whether a person deserves a living wage based on what they do for a living?

doesn't the person flipping the burgers serve a purpose in our society as much as say a person that works retail or sells insurance?
Or, sells automobiles - why does a person that suckers you into buying a used KIA deserving of a living wage but taht person that sweeps the floor in Wal-Mart isn't?

[acesfull86]

Just to clarify, has anyone here actually asked for a doubling of the min. wage, or is that just what's in the story? I haven't seen anyone advocate doubling.

Isn't that what the people are fighting for?

(Reuters) - Fast-food workers in hundreds of U.S. cities staged a day of rallies on Thursday to demand higher wages, saying the pay was too low to feed a family and forced most to accept public assistance.

About 100 workers in Chicago marched along Michigan Avenue with a large costumed Grinch, chanting: "We can't survive on $7.25." Protesters want the hourly U.S. minimum wage raised to $15 from $7.25.

I thought that's what the discussion is. Or is say $9/hr up from $7.25 considered a "living wage?"

[acesfull86]

So, have those devils in Armani clothing bring back the jobs, pay their people a decent living wage (no I didn't say split the revenues equally across the board) and then we'll talk about how much they're suffering.

It's a nice post, but I'm not sure exactly what your "solution" is. First mandate a "decent living wage," then tell businesses that not only are they not allowed to reduce their employment, but they also have to bring back jobs from overseas (at a higher cost than when they were first outsourced)? And is this to come directly out of the pockets of shareholders/executives without any costs being passed onto the consumers which are made up of mostly the middle/poor classes?

Somehow I don't think that's going to fly.

[yeezus]

Isn't that what the people are fighting for?

(Reuters) - Fast-food workers in hundreds of U.S. cities staged a day of rallies on Thursday to demand higher wages, saying the pay was too low to feed a family and forced most to accept public assistance.

About 100 workers in Chicago marched along Michigan Avenue with a large costumed Grinch, chanting: "We can't survive on $7.25." Protesters want the hourly U.S. minimum wage raised to $15 from $7.25.

I thought that's what the discussion is. Or is say $9/hr up from $7.25 considered a "living wage?"

As I said, is that what's in the story, or do the people here who want a higher min. wage calling for it to be doubled?
Not sure where you pulled $9 out of, either.

[Oklahomahawk]

It's a nice post, but I'm not sure exactly what your "solution" is. First mandate a "decent living wage," then tell businesses that not only are they not allowed to reduce their employment, but they also have to bring back jobs from overseas (at a higher cost than when they were first outsourced)? And is this to come directly out of the pockets of shareholders/executives without any costs being passed onto the consumers which are made up of mostly the middle/poor classes?

Somehow I don't think that's going to fly.

I don't have a solution, but if you think things have gotten to the point where they are now by sheer coincidence or just because the "job creators" are so much more hard working and just pulled themselves up by the bootstraps in that wonderful free market economy, where the only thing separating the successful from the losers is their work ethic then you're already a "heck of a guy" and you'll put me on ignore like so many others have. Or you could take me up on my challenge to ask a real higher power if I'm right or if I'm full of it...

[acesfull86]

As I said, is that what's in the story, or do the people here who want a higher min. wage calling for it to be doubled?
Not sure where you pulled $9 out of, either.

You tell me...I don't want the minimum wage raised at all but I take it you do? So what's the number? I'm just going off what the protesters are asking for ($15). Where I pulled $9 from is I believe that is the number Obama called for the wage to be raised to (and it might be a more realistic number to achieve than $15, though I don't know if it would satisfy those who demand a "living wage").

[acesfull86]

I don't have a solution, but if you think things have gotten to the point where they are now by sheer coincidence or just because the "job creators" are so much more hard working and just pulled themselves up by the bootstraps in that wonderful free market economy, where the only thing separating the successful from the losers is their work ethic then you're already a "heck of a guy" and you'll put me on ignore like so many others have. Or you could take me up on my challenge to ask a real higher power if I'm right or if I'm full of it...

*paging 57....*

[Oklahomahawk]

I know I"m not sturg, and I rarely quote Ron Paul, though I am on record as saying he is a good honest man, just a Libertarian which I can't really go along with generally speaking. Still the truth is the truth.

[Oklahomahawk]

*paging 57....*

When he gets here ask him how often we agree on anything...

[57Brave]

When he gets here ask him how often we agree on anything...

When you get away from the notion of "both sides..." blah-blah blah we actually agree on quite a bit. All the while disagreeing on quite a bit.
See, I can do it too :)

[weso1]

I've come up with a few questions for the raise the min wage folks (myself included):

1) If you raise min wage and increase it to the rate of inflation would that increase the likelihood of min wage jobs becoming more automated? Eventually it's just going to be cheaper to not hire min wage labor at all.
2) Would raising min wage to 15 per hour take a lot of folks off food stamps? Wouldn't that cancel out the raise in the min wage making it somewhat of a moot point. And the one benefit I like about food stamps is that it has to be spent on food. Or would you increase the income max for food stamp participants?
3) Any concern that prices will increase in the very stores and restaurants that min wage earners visit the most?

[57Brave]

To answer your questions here are pages n pages of blogposts explaining the workings. Also offers pro and con analyses

https://www.google.com/search?q=aust...ient=firefox-a

[sturg33]

As I said, is that what's in the story, or do the people here who want a higher min. wage calling for it to be doubled?
Not sure where you pulled $9 out of, either.

See 57's link he just posted... every title is calling for $15

[sturg33]

Just to clarify, has anyone here actually asked for a doubling of the min. wage, or is that just what's in the story? I haven't seen anyone advocate doubling.

Yes

[sturg33]

So you acknowledge that getting a job is not easy... but you think it will be easier if the minimum wage is doubled?

OK

[weso1]

By the way. Anyone can live reasonably comfortably on minimum wage if they choose to. It's all about location. Let's say for example a single mother with 2 kids makes minimum wage and only works 40 hours per week. She makes about 1200 per month.

I just pulled up a random city (Hillsborough, NC) I know has good schools and fairly cheap living (certainly not the cheapest place).

2 bedroom apartment with pool and fitness center in a safe neighborhood - $750
Food - Food stamps (500 per month at no cost to the single parent)
Childcare - (120 per month based on state of North Carolina's childcare program)
Health insurance - Medicaid (no cost)
School - public (free)
tax - negligible

So those are the most important items above... food, shelter, childcare and healthcare in a safe town with a very good school system. So that leaves 330 bucks left over for utilities (North Carolina programs help with this), gas, an inexpensive car (likely could have one donated to them by charity), clothes, toys, etc. which is more than enough to live reasonably comfortably. They don't have to worry about costly home repairs. Am I missing anything? Keep in mind that I'm sure there are even less expensive towns out there if the single parent wants more income for miscellaneous items. And this is for one who only chooses to work 40 hours.

Now granted, it's not the ideal life style by any means however, the idea that min wage is not a "liveable" wage in this country is a pretty dishonest one. It's all about location. If you want to live comfortably then you have to be willing to move. But the truth is that most Americans have to be willing to move to get what they want.

[sturg33]

What you just explained is Wal-Mart exists on solely on exploiting their workers or as some employers would put it , their "people"
.
Why don't you use COSTCO as an example?
Because they seem to be getting on just fine with their pay scale. You must have missed the post a few days back showing that Wal-Mart is really not that profitable to investors because their rate of return has steadily diminished over the past 15 years.
Whereas COSTCO is steadily rising
Was Wal-Mart the example you really wanted to use?

Still not sure how much that Big Mac will cost once the rate is raised? Becasue someone somewhere will devise a better model and will make money and the dinosaur business' will go the way of, well, the dinosaurs. You underestimate the ingenuity of the Free Market system to adapt to new standards. Because what you are missing not only in this discussion but most every other one is the fact of that as things change so does everything around it. You base these numbers on current standards and like I just said -- some one somewhere will figure out how to use the new standards to their advantage.Should Wal-Mart or McD go under --- so be it. Adapt or perish -- isn't that how that goes?

So in a nut shell what you are arguing for is the survival of McDonalds and Wal-Mart to exploit your fellow citizens. Do I understand you right?

Oh but hey, I never fail to disappoint.

You're obsession with Costco is weird and annoying... Stop comparing everything to Costco. They are completely different businesses with completely different business models.

1. Costco employees less than 200,000 people. Walmart employees more than 2 million. I wonder if Costco would be able to pay that wage to 10 times more employees?
2. Costco is a membership model... A lot of their revenue is based on recurring revenue streams, not cheap products. This is a huge advantage
3. Costco does $89 billion in sales in 2012... Walmart did about $450 Billion in sales. Could Costco's practices be sustainable of a program as large as Walmart? No.

[sturg33]

Careful sturg my friend, you're straying a little far from Ron, an actual Libertarian and a little too close to Rand, a radical Republican in Libertarian clothing, so to speak. Rand's about as Libertarian as Michelle "Sarah Palin AFTER the lobotomy" Bachmann.

Oh and while you guys are so busy worrying about how much the fine folks at Wal-Mart might have to pay their near-minimum wage workers (who are much closer to you guys' age than teenagers by the way, in spite of what your far right friends constantly tell you) don't forget that the top 4 or 5 Walton family members have about as much green as almost half of Americans put together. Oh and also while you're whining about income redistribution you might wake up for a moment and realize it IS going on and HAS BEEN going on since the wonderful Utopian Reagan 80's, but not in the top to bottom direction the Goebbels-esque Fox Business Channel folks might tell you, but in the exact OPPOSITE direction. So for anyone who's interested in the REAL truth instead of the Kool-Aid flavored "pity the poor downtrodden rich folks, er the job-creators" try feeling for those who have had their jobs sent to India, etc. so the aforementioned top 5% can own a Gulf-Stream 4 instead of a Gulf-Stream 3, while at the same time bemoaning the lack of company loyalty among their workers (those who are still here by the way) and pay their faithful whores on talk radio and certain elements at Fox to feed you more bull**** about how it's the poor who are fighting a class war against the true Americans, those who are just trying to live the American dream.

Oh and just take a moment before you turn on me for telling you the ACTUAL TRUTH, instead of what you're force fed every day and do a little real research somewhere that isn't a far left OR a far right source, or just take me up on my offer that's at least a decade old and for those who consider themselves Christians and pray to THE God of heaven (who's neither red nor blue) and ask HIM for the REAL TRUTH, that is IF you have the NADS, I distinctly remember more than a couple of you who turned down my challenge back during W's Utopia because they didn't need to talk to the actual God I suggested, they said, if I remember correctly, they trusted his messengers here on Earth and didn't need to go that far.

So, have those devils in Armani clothing bring back the jobs, pay their people a decent living wage (no I didn't say split the revenues equally across the board) and then we'll talk about how much they're suffering. And for anyone who's shaking their heads and muttering about how sorry an SOB I might be, let me finish with this, no matter how much it might piss you off to hear it from me right now, it's about 1,000,000 X better to hear it from me now than from God Almighty come Judgement Day and while I may not speak for America's religious community (Gee I wonder why???) you know I speak the truth, that's what causing that heat flash in your gut that your buddy in the red flannel underwear and the cool horns and pitchfork tells you is just righteous indignation.

Oh and peace out all my friends.

All I did was show a simple math example of what raising the minimum wage would do to a corporation like Walmart. The math is the math.

Here's the thing. Walmart is not perfect, and they get tones of corporate welfare which I do not support. But people are really dumb if you think just forcing business to raise minimum wage isn't going to have negative impacts. It does and it will. And it won't be Walmart who suffers.

[sturg33]

To answer your questions here are pages n pages of blogposts explaining the workings. Also offers pro and con analyses

https://www.google.com/search?q=aust...ient=firefox-a

I would actually like to hear your answers - rather than google. I know you can't think for yourself, but try to at least read an article and then remember it without copy and pasting.