This thread just proves to me that both Heyward and thethe are ****ing nuts. I knew they were crazy but wow.
This thread just proves to me that both Heyward and thethe are ****ing nuts. I knew they were crazy but wow.
Originally Posted by Braves1976
Braves1976 (07-30-2015), jpx7 (07-30-2015), thewupk (07-30-2015)
Peraza is being sent to the Dodgers AAA affiliate in Oklahoma City. I'll be able to see him in person which is cool. It's still not enough for me to like this trade.
There are several problems with this trade.
1) We just did not get comparable value for Peraza and Wood. Period. Is Olivera and a pick worth those two? No, not even close. Again, the Blue Jays got Tulo for a package in which a prospect worse than Peraza was the best piece. Tulo has a big contract, but he's incredibly proven; that more than offsets the risk of Olivera's lack of track record and significant health issues.
2) It indicates we may be overpaying with future assets to try to build up the team for 2016 and 2017, which I think is a bad move.
3) If a pitcher losing some velocity and having a 'funky delivery' leads to a loss of all his value, then why in the world are we stockpiling so much pitching? If this is the going rate for a potentially pretty good hitter with massive question marks, then it brings up the question, yet again, as to why weren't going stronger in the draft and earlier trades to pull in young hitting talent.
I was all on board with the moves we were making. They all made sense, we had a clear goal, and I bought into the line that we could trade from our surplus of pitching for hitting at some point. Well, this move suddenly goes against the grain of the way we've been moving, and if all we can get for Alex Wood and Peraza is Hector Olivera, I don't want to know what we have to take for any of our prospects.
Braves1976 (07-30-2015), sc1767 (07-30-2015)
Hart coming up on the game broadcast. Get your records ready. It's spin time.
Braves1976 (07-30-2015)
This is true.
My bad, i should bash Hart and the FO like everyone here then.
I'd fit in better.
Pretty clear you and others dont like the new FO.
I've said over and over and over how much I like the moves we're making. I hated the Heyward deal, but it turned out ok and ultimately Hart fully won me over. Heck, I've been the only one to side with thethe on several issues.
But I'm evaluating this trade on its merits. It's not an overall evaluation of the entire FO, and it certainly doesn't mean I hate everyone and everything. I just hate this trade.
FWIW Ben Badler just said the Braves did not get robbed because Olivera is a better player than anyone they gave up.
Impossible. Maybe both the Dodgers and the Braves felt this way going into the deal. They both clearly wanted him when he was a FA.
Natural Immunity Croc
Bit of a shame the Dodgers traded him for a middle of the rotation starter who has a funky delivery and will be injured in a couple years.
Freshmaker (07-30-2015)
Bradley is obviously highest on Olivera. But I don't know how anyone can say Olivera is better than Wood.
His own site ranked Olivera the #16 prospect. How is that better than Wood?
jpx7 (07-30-2015)
Yeah guys who cover/watch prospects for a living obviously dont know more than armchair GM's.
I guarantee you will find far more scouts who say Wood is the best player in the deal. I've never claimed to be an expert, but I'll always offer my opinion, and you can do whatever you want with it.
I don't understand how anyone can say a 30-year-old, with durability and health concerns, who put up lesser numbers in Cuba than Cespedes, is better than one of the best young LHP in baseball.
If you or Badler think he is, fine. His opinion doesn't change mine that this is a bad deal.
Braves1976 (07-30-2015), bravesnumberone (07-30-2015), Garmel (07-30-2015)
also FWIW our entire front office obviously also thinks so. there are clearly reasons. and the trade is not devastating or terrible. it's just not.
Heyward (07-30-2015)
Hart and co. have made some very good trades, but this one was not just bad but is really terrible IMO. We could've just kept Uribe for 3B and got an around .800 OPS and great defense rather than do crazy **** like this.
I think that's accurate, but the question is can Olivera stay on the field? If he can then I really think he'll be a 3+ WAR player. That's a big question mark though.
thank you weso1!
Unless we're trying to go for it all in 2016 or 2017, adding a guy like Olivera, even if only talking about his age, makes no sense.
And if we are trying to really go for it all in the next 2 years, then I don't like that, either, because it likely means we're going to sacrifice some of the rebuild to do it.
If Olivera is just a piece to help put a competitive team on the field while sticking around as a piece when we start really contending, fine, but you shouldn't give up Wood and Peraza for that.
I think it's a little too optimistic to think we would get an .800 OPS from 37 year old Uribe. Remember this is the guy the Dodgers basically gave away.
thank you weso1!
Olivera belongs in the AL. He has no glove and will be a huge negative if he ever plays the field for the Braves.
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