Still wondering why I'm supposed to get upset with the NRA over this last gun shooting... Shouldn't be I upset at the shooter? I guess there's no political points in that
The premise of your question was flawed but I gave you an answer anyway. It's not about what would have stopped this specific incident but what are the things that will change the availability of guns in general.
Next the culture and violence promoting entertainment industry should be addressed.
And certainly our war mongering foreign policies play a role too.
The culture is also too fragmented. We need more unifying, community promoting events and ceremonies. Religion plays this role but our religions have failed us so miserably and have been hijacked by crooks again. I can't believe I'm saying it but the country needs a new religion, one that is not tribally based.
Last edited by Runnin; 10-07-2015 at 07:11 PM.
I must have hit a nerve and gotten to the point. Funny how you want to run away from such points. Why do liberals do that? And why are you such an either/or guy? I don't get that either. It is not like we can't have sensible controls on weapons and seek to address the social and mental health problems as well.
To a staggering degree, people don't even know why they do what they do. Assuming that society could point directly to the cause and simply fix it would be naive. Only thing worse than believing that would be doing nothing.
BedellBrave (10-07-2015)
How might national background checks on private sales be instituted, implemented, and enforced? Oregon has such a law on the books. I just don't understand how it is actually suppose to work. Anybody got a clue?
I'm not sure it's flawed. I was just trying to make sure that what we suggest be something that might actually address cases like this. That's the thing I struggle with concerning some of the ideas tossed around each time other than just a total ban on personal firearms.
We are a huge and diverse nation. We aren't ever going to be like Japan or Sweden or the like. If we were a more homogenous people with a much more controlling national government maybe. Course we wouldn't be the USA then.
Last edited by BedellBrave; 10-07-2015 at 08:04 PM.
Runnin (10-08-2015)
I've always considered myself to be a realist/pragmatist where gun ownership is concerned. I grew up in the midst of gun culture, though in a household where it was anathema. I think that, on balance, my home would be less safe with firearms under the roof, and I think that the smart money—the science, in fact—backs me up on that, but I allow for others who make a different calculation. I don't object to the idea of legal firearm ownership. What I object to is the interpretation of the second amendment—which is unique to the last 20 years or so—which holds to the idea that gun ownership is not a right which is rightfully and reasonably regulated, but is unfettered and unalloyed by context and circumstance.
Buying a hunting rifle or shotgun shouldn't be an unreasonable burden. Buying a gun for which the raison d'etre is perforating the internal organs of human beings should be a different question. Pretty much everywhere else in the world, it is. I don't know why it is so hard for us. Actually, I do know why, and it makes me want to vomit.
BedellBrave (10-08-2015), Runnin (10-08-2015)
I'm not a psychiatrist, but just personally feel we need more resources for the mentally ill. These I feel are the truly helpless in our society. We need to be a bit more open in regards to understanding who might be sociopathic and is this person a threat the harm society?
I'm discussing the idea of gun violence rather than mass murder, the former of which is much more prevalent in the US and especially in the inner cities, where they use illegal guns for the most part. Mass shootings make up a very small portion of gun related homicides in this country. I'll just ignore the "n" word comment as I think it's just a silly distraction not worth commenting further.
Prison reform... The vast majority of gun crimes that occur in this country are done by felons. So why are they going back out and committing crimes after they've served time? We need more rehablitation in this country. Let's rehabilitate felons, give them a job and keep them from wanting to commit crimes and murders.
I just feel like those ideas are much better than the idea of handing the mass murderer or whoever a shotgun or rifle rather than a handgun or quasi assault rifle with one or two less bullets and a slightly lesser firing rate. And that's just on the side of how to prevent gun violence rather than how to defend against gun violence.
And so your reply may be why are pubs not supporting these ideas? I agree with that, but I would counter with why are liberals supporting relatively pointless gun regulation laws as opposed to championing more realistic goals to curb gun violence like the ideas I've provided? I'm just done with these ideas that don't and haven't worked. Let's move on from pointless gun regulation that won't make a difference.
Last edited by weso1; 10-07-2015 at 10:58 PM.
thank you weso1!
57Brave (10-08-2015)
didn't hit a nerve at all
just had the same bs argument and "thoughts" come from (what i am guessing is the same article and would guess it came from drudge but i don't want to prejudge all the way) a friend a couple days ago and was curious how long it would take to make it here.
you finally made it here to push that same article about the the "connection of divorce" as if that is the reason this happens
what am i running away from in your mind?
i agree with you
i wish we did have sensible controls on weapons and do things to help the mentally ill.
they are 2 different issues and aren't usually tied together but both need addressing and should be regulated more and i am glad you agree that should happen
"For there is always light, if only we are brave enough to see it. If only we are brave enough to be it." Amanda Gorman
"When Fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross"
i have no side
as much as american bs politics thinks i do
but
do you really think those are comparable and do you really think i am being a hypocrite there?
one side is talking about how all live matters
the other says they are pro choice and i agree that people should have the option of to choice insurance and what they want to do business wise (to a degree obviously (and if you don't like it, you have to pay) and i am not sure why you might try to say that is a negative since you aren't for no regulations at all from previous conversations)
i will say my personal thoughts are for setting up a country to prosper in such a way you have to pay to allow it and we all prosper from that as well but this is where we disagree now i am guessing
but i am sure somehow in your thoughts i didn't answer the question or dodged the conversation or whatever you and [MENTION=68]BedellBrave[/MENTION] say from time to time
"For there is always light, if only we are brave enough to see it. If only we are brave enough to be it." Amanda Gorman
"When Fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross"
"For there is always light, if only we are brave enough to see it. If only we are brave enough to be it." Amanda Gorman
"When Fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross"
the best thoughts i have heard on the gun debate i think
"For there is always light, if only we are brave enough to see it. If only we are brave enough to be it." Amanda Gorman
"When Fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross"
bravesnumberone (10-08-2015)
AerchAngel (10-08-2015)