Farewell to Wood, Peraza, Jimmy Johns, and Avilans.

[thethe]

This is just another way of saying that there is no such thing as a bad deal because whatever return comes in a trade is what the value was for that player.

Was Toussaint's value Gosselin and $10 million? I would say not even close.

Using your logic, we can't ever evaluate a trade. You just take it and accept that you couldn't get anything more. I think we could have gotten more for Wood and Peraza. But here's my point - even if we couldn't, then don't trade them. They have more value to us at that point than their return in a trade. I would rather have Wood and Peraza going forward than Olivera, Paco, Bird, and a pick.

You are making an assumption that they have more value to us based on the premise that a) Wood doesn't fall off or get hurt, and b) Peraza adjusts to the big leagues despite his lack of power and walks.

Personally I thought Peraza would have adjusted but I just dont' like Wood long term.

[thethe]

We don't know. That's why people have issue with the value we gave up to take on that risk.

But the baseball community does because they have heavily scouted him.

[sturg33]

You are making an assumption that they have more value to us based on the premise that a) Wood doesn't fall off or get hurt, and b) Peraza adjusts to the big leagues despite his lack of power and walks.

Personally I thought Peraza would have adjusted but I just dont' like Wood long term.

I think of all the assuming in this thread, you're by far the leader.

[thethe]

I think of all the assuming in this thread, you're by far the leader.

I agree that I am making assumptions. No question about it.

[gilesfan]

This was taken last winter. You didn't even look at the video. This isn't about him taken taking on Cuban pitching. This is a film released to Major League teams showcasing his abilities. Watch the film and look at his bat speed. His bat is not slow.

I watched the video. If it wasn't Cubans he was hitting off of, who was it then?

[smootness]

You are making an assumption that they have more value to us based on the premise that a) Wood doesn't fall off or get hurt, and b) Peraza adjusts to the big leagues despite his lack of power and walks.

Personally I thought Peraza would have adjusted but I just dont' like Wood long term.

Huh? I'm not assuming anything. I'm saying that right now, at this very moment, Wood and Peraza have more value to us than Olivera does.

I love those defending Olivera arguing that I'm the one simply making assumptions, though. Since all Olivera is at this point is one giant assumption.

[thethe]

Huh? I'm not assuming anything. I'm saying that right now, at this very moment, Wood and Peraza have more value to us than Olivera does.

I love those defending Olivera arguing that I'm the one simply making assumptions, though. Since all Olivera is at this point is one giant assumption.

But you are just using what Wood has done thus far in his career and assume that will continue. Baseball people will note evaluate Wood in just that way.

[gilesfan]

But the baseball community does because they have heavily scouted him.

The "baseball community" does not. Every minor league player is a projection. Olivera is the equivalent of a minor league player; it's unknown. Prospects may have varying degrees of tools, but its still projection.

[gilesfan]

But you are just using what Wood has done thus far in his career and assume that will continue. Baseball people will note evaluate Wood in just that way.

He's 24. There is nothing to suggests he's going to get worse than he is right now.

[thethe]

He's 24. There is nothing to suggests he's going to get worse than he is right now.

Declining peripherals and contact rates would suggest otherwise.

[gilesfan]

You are making an assumption that they have more value to us based on the premise that a) Wood doesn't fall off or get hurt, and b) Peraza adjusts to the big leagues despite his lack of power and walks.

Personally I thought Peraza would have adjusted but I just dont' like Wood long term.

This doesn't even make sense. There is no reason to assume Wood is going to fall off a cliff or get hurt. Hell, you even admitted the Dodgers GM was brilliant and he just traded for Wood. What does that GM think about him?

[thethe]

The "baseball community" does not. Every minor league player is a projection. Olivera is the equivalent of a minor league player; it's unknown. Prospects may have varying degrees of tools, but its still projection.

Fair point, but we as message board posters treat it as a complete unknown. Baseball people have watched this kid play and can get a much better feel of his true projection.

[thethe]

This doesn't even make sense. There is no reason to assume Wood is going to fall off a cliff or get hurt. Hell, you even admitted the Dodgers GM was brilliant and he just traded for Wood. What does that GM think about him?

GM thinks there is risk but as long as he stays healthy he should be a good #2.

[smootness]

But you are just using what Wood has done thus far in his career and assume that will continue. Baseball people will note evaluate Wood in just that way.

That's ridiculous, baseball people do it all the time. Free agent contracts and trades are always made based on what a player currently is and has been. Always.

If we made this trade on the assumption that Wood will fall apart in 2 years, then we're really dumb and the Dodgers completely schooled us.

[smootness]

GM thinks there is risk but as long as he stays healthy he should be a good #2.

Then the fact that we took less value than a good #2 alone would bring is an indictment of us.

[chop2chip]

This is 1900 posts of sheer buffoonery, strawman, and confirmation bias on both sides.

I think it's pretty well understood the Braves are leveraging a high degree of risk for a player with a definite higher upside than that was given up. If you are trying to quantify that in either direction, then, well, good luck to you.

[thethe]

Then the fact that we took less value than a good #2 alone would bring is an indictment of us.

To me you absolutely have to factor in the fact that he has declining peripherals and velocity in addition to a funky delivery. I'm sorry but I think that every single baseball GM would do the same thing in trade discussions.

[gilesfan]

Fair point, but we as message board posters treat it as a complete unknown. Baseball people have watched this kid play and can get a much better feel of his true projection.

As they can with every player in baseball. We still traded guys on the upside of their career for a guy on the downside of his career and that cannot be debated.

[sturg33]

I'm 98% certain that if Olivera were not included in this deal, thethe would still defend it by the upside of Bird, Paco, and the pick

[gilesfan]

GM thinks there is risk but as long as he stays healthy he should be a good #2.

YOu claim we are all dumb message board posters in one sentence then the next you can read the brain of a GM?