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Thread: Rethinking law breaking

  1. #41
    It's OVER 5,000! 57Brave's Avatar
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    perhaps someone - anyone can tell me what Tamir Rice did ?
    The best way to stop a bad guy with a gun is to make sure he doesn’t get a gun.

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    I don’t think a single person implied that police are free of guilt.

    It’s stupid points like this that make it impossible to get anything accomplished.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 57Brave View Post
    perhaps someone - anyone can tell me what Tamir Rice did ?
    He carried, pointed, and attempted to draw a realistic replica of a gun. Violated rules 1, 3, and 5 in the first post of the thread. His parents should have taught him those rules, as I was taught and have taught my kids.

    Two officers, Loehmann and 46-year-old Frank Garmback, were responding to a police dispatch call regarding a male who had a gun.[3][4][5] A caller reported that a male was pointing "a pistol" at random people at the Cudell Recreation Center, a park in the City of Cleveland's Public Works Department.[6] At the beginning of the call and again in the middle, he says of the pistol "it's probably fake."[7] Toward the end of the two-minute call, the caller states that "he is probably a juvenile", but this information was not relayed to officers Loehmann and Garmback on the initial dispatch.[8][9][10]

    The officers reported that, when they arrived at the scene, they both continuously yelled "show me your hands" through the open patrol car window. Loehmann further stated that instead of showing his hands, it appeared as if Rice was trying to draw: "I knew it was a gun and I knew it was coming out."[11][12][13] The officer shot twice, hitting Rice once in the torso.[4][14] According to Judge Ronald B. Adrine, "...On the video the zone car containing Patrol Officers Loehmann and Garmback is still in the process of stopping when Rice is shot."[13] Rice died the following day.[15]

    Rice's gun was found to be an airsoft replica; it lacked the orange-tipped barrel that would have indicated it was a toy gun.[16][17] A surveillance video of the incident was released by the police four days after the shooting, on 26 November.[18] On 3 June 2015, the Cuyahoga County Sheriff's Office declared that their investigation had been completed and that they had turned their findings over to the county prosecutor. Several months later the prosecution presented evidence to a grand jury, which declined to indict, primarily on the basis that Rice was drawing what appears to be an actual firearm from his waist as the police arrived.[12][19][20]
    ...
    A review by retired FBI agent Kimberly Crawford found that Rice's death was justified and Loehmann's "response was a reasonable one".[23] The incident received both national and international coverage. It occurred on the heels of several other high-profile shootings of African-American males by police officers.
    Go get him!

    Founding member of the Whiny Little Bitches and Pricks Club

  4. #44
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    oh


    how do we then protect ourselves from the "protectors" ?
    or
    rather POC protect themselves

    cajun started a 130 plus page thread on over reach by police.
    might want to take some time from adding to your exaggerated post count to read and come back to tell us what you read

    Take sturg with you
    The best way to stop a bad guy with a gun is to make sure he doesn’t get a gun.

  5. #45
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    It’s a tragedy what happened to rice but of course it all comes down to parenting. It always does.

  6. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jaw View Post
    He carried, pointed, and attempted to draw a realistic replica of a gun. Violated rules 1, 3, and 5 in the first post of the thread. His parents should have taught him those rules, as I was taught and have taught my kids.

    Two officers, Loehmann and 46-year-old Frank Garmback, were responding to a police dispatch call regarding a male who had a gun.[3][4][5] A caller reported that a male was pointing "a pistol" at random people at the Cudell Recreation Center, a park in the City of Cleveland's Public Works Department.[6] At the beginning of the call and again in the middle, he says of the pistol "it's probably fake."[7] Toward the end of the two-minute call, the caller states that "he is probably a juvenile", but this information was not relayed to officers Loehmann and Garmback on the initial dispatch.[8][9][10]

    The officers reported that, when they arrived at the scene, they both continuously yelled "show me your hands" through the open patrol car window. Loehmann further stated that instead of showing his hands, it appeared as if Rice was trying to draw: "I knew it was a gun and I knew it was coming out."[11][12][13] The officer shot twice, hitting Rice once in the torso.[4][14] According to Judge Ronald B. Adrine, "...On the video the zone car containing Patrol Officers Loehmann and Garmback is still in the process of stopping when Rice is shot."[13] Rice died the following day.[15]

    Rice's gun was found to be an airsoft replica; it lacked the orange-tipped barrel that would have indicated it was a toy gun.[16][17] A surveillance video of the incident was released by the police four days after the shooting, on 26 November.[18] On 3 June 2015, the Cuyahoga County Sheriff's Office declared that their investigation had been completed and that they had turned their findings over to the county prosecutor. Several months later the prosecution presented evidence to a grand jury, which declined to indict, primarily on the basis that Rice was drawing what appears to be an actual firearm from his waist as the police arrived.[12][19][20]
    ...
    A review by retired FBI agent Kimberly Crawford found that Rice's death was justified and Loehmann's "response was a reasonable one".[23] The incident received both national and international coverage. It occurred on the heels of several other high-profile shootings of African-American males by police officers.
    he was 13 and had a toy gun !!!!
    fer chrise sakes
    The best way to stop a bad guy with a gun is to make sure he doesn’t get a gun.

  7. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by 57Brave View Post
    oh


    how do we then protect ourselves from the "protectors" ?
    or
    rather POC protect themselves

    cajun started a 130 plus page thread on over reach by police.
    might want to take some time from adding to your exaggerated post count to read and come back to tell us what you read

    Take sturg with you
    Well you first realize that by following simple rules you have effectively a 0% chance of being killed by a cop.

    I know basic things like this are difficult for you to understand but try someday.

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    Education and celebrating single parenthood has done the most damage to people in this country

    It is intentional

  9. The Following User Says Thank You to sturg33 For This Useful Post:

    Jaw (04-15-2021)

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    Yes it is.

    When the nuclear family is strong. Government loses power. They can’t have that.

    Also need more shareholder value by pushing two income homes.

  11. The Following User Says Thank You to thethe For This Useful Post:

    Jaw (04-15-2021)

  12. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by sturg33 View Post
    Education and celebrating single parenthood has done the most damage to people in this country

    It is intentional
    please tell us all your interactions with teachers and children

    or are you just going to "lecture" people on topics you have no knowledge beside slanted politically based blog posts
    The best way to stop a bad guy with a gun is to make sure he doesn’t get a gun.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 57Brave View Post
    he was 13 and had a toy gun !!!!
    fer chrise sakes
    A toy gun that was manufactured to look like a real gun. And he waved it around pointing it at people. And he reached for it when the cops showed up to make sure everyone was safe and there wasn't about to be a mass shooting in a park.

    It's a tragedy. Either he or his parents are to blame though, not the cops who ran in to danger to protect kids in a park from someone waving a gun.
    Go get him!

    Founding member of the Whiny Little Bitches and Pricks Club

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    they shot a kid with a toy gun.

    no amount of faux justification changes that fact

    //////

    I started a thread asking how we avoid these situation for not only the victims but the police officers that get caught in these situations.
    and really, your response amounted to it is the victims fault and there are no alternatives / solutions.
    Last edited by 57Brave; 04-15-2021 at 11:08 AM.
    The best way to stop a bad guy with a gun is to make sure he doesn’t get a gun.

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    Your mentality is the reason why minorities have had their situations get worse over the past few decades.

    No self determination. No self accountability.

    It’s a poisonous ideology that has poisoned America.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 57Brave View Post
    please tell us all your interactions with teachers and children

    or are you just going to "lecture" people on topics you have no knowledge beside slanted politically based blog posts
    My dad was a teacher for 40 years. In my current social circle there are 8 teachers (all working remote, btw). Two of them are quitting for good bc the system is so ****ed.

    I can look at the data of our test score outputs since the creation of the dept of education.

    I can look at the explosion in children born out of wedlock.

    I can look at the data that shows outcomes for those children are substantially worse.

    I can look at how society and tax incentives celebrates this happening

    This isn't complicated.

    But your ideology insists you take more power from the individual and give it to the state. The state makes things worse and demands more power to solve the issues. You - a very stupid man - nods along approvingly

  17. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jaw View Post
    He carried, pointed, and attempted to draw a realistic replica of a gun. Violated rules 1, 3, and 5 in the first post of the thread. His parents should have taught him those rules, as I was taught and have taught my kids.

    Two officers, Loehmann and 46-year-old Frank Garmback, were responding to a police dispatch call regarding a male who had a gun.[3][4][5] A caller reported that a male was pointing "a pistol" at random people at the Cudell Recreation Center, a park in the City of Cleveland's Public Works Department.[6] At the beginning of the call and again in the middle, he says of the pistol "it's probably fake."[7] Toward the end of the two-minute call, the caller states that "he is probably a juvenile", but this information was not relayed to officers Loehmann and Garmback on the initial dispatch.[8][9][10]

    The officers reported that, when they arrived at the scene, they both continuously yelled "show me your hands" through the open patrol car window. Loehmann further stated that instead of showing his hands, it appeared as if Rice was trying to draw: "I knew it was a gun and I knew it was coming out."[11][12][13] The officer shot twice, hitting Rice once in the torso.[4][14] According to Judge Ronald B. Adrine, "...On the video the zone car containing Patrol Officers Loehmann and Garmback is still in the process of stopping when Rice is shot."[13] Rice died the following day.[15]

    Rice's gun was found to be an airsoft replica; it lacked the orange-tipped barrel that would have indicated it was a toy gun.[16][17] A surveillance video of the incident was released by the police four days after the shooting, on 26 November.[18] On 3 June 2015, the Cuyahoga County Sheriff's Office declared that their investigation had been completed and that they had turned their findings over to the county prosecutor. Several months later the prosecution presented evidence to a grand jury, which declined to indict, primarily on the basis that Rice was drawing what appears to be an actual firearm from his waist as the police arrived.[12][19][20]
    ...
    A review by retired FBI agent Kimberly Crawford found that Rice's death was justified and Loehmann's "response was a reasonable one".[23] The incident received both national and international coverage. It occurred on the heels of several other high-profile shootings of African-American males by police officers.
    Embarrassing. There is video of this, just watch it.

  18. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jaw View Post
    He carried, pointed, and attempted to draw a realistic replica of a gun. Violated rules 1, 3, and 5 in the first post of the thread. His parents should have taught him those rules, as I was taught and have taught my kids.

    Two officers, Loehmann and 46-year-old Frank Garmback, were responding to a police dispatch call regarding a male who had a gun.[3][4][5] A caller reported that a male was pointing "a pistol" at random people at the Cudell Recreation Center, a park in the City of Cleveland's Public Works Department.[6] At the beginning of the call and again in the middle, he says of the pistol "it's probably fake."[7] Toward the end of the two-minute call, the caller states that "he is probably a juvenile", but this information was not relayed to officers Loehmann and Garmback on the initial dispatch.[8][9][10]

    The officers reported that, when they arrived at the scene, they both continuously yelled "show me your hands" through the open patrol car window. Loehmann further stated that instead of showing his hands, it appeared as if Rice was trying to draw: "I knew it was a gun and I knew it was coming out."[11][12][13] The officer shot twice, hitting Rice once in the torso.[4][14] According to Judge Ronald B. Adrine, "...On the video the zone car containing Patrol Officers Loehmann and Garmback is still in the process of stopping when Rice is shot."[13] Rice died the following day.[15]

    Rice's gun was found to be an airsoft replica; it lacked the orange-tipped barrel that would have indicated it was a toy gun.[16][17] A surveillance video of the incident was released by the police four days after the shooting, on 26 November.[18] On 3 June 2015, the Cuyahoga County Sheriff's Office declared that their investigation had been completed and that they had turned their findings over to the county prosecutor. Several months later the prosecution presented evidence to a grand jury, which declined to indict, primarily on the basis that Rice was drawing what appears to be an actual firearm from his waist as the police arrived.[12][19][20]
    ...
    A review by retired FBI agent Kimberly Crawford found that Rice's death was justified and Loehmann's "response was a reasonable one".[23] The incident received both national and international coverage. It occurred on the heels of several other high-profile shootings of African-American males by police officers.
    Embarrassing. There is video of this, just watch it.

  19. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by sturg33 View Post
    My dad was a teacher for 40 years. In my current social circle there are 8 teachers (all working remote, btw). Two of them are quitting for good bc the system is so ****ed.

    I can look at the data of our test score outputs since the creation of the dept of education.

    I can look at the explosion in children born out of wedlock.

    I can look at the data that shows outcomes for those children are substantially worse.

    I can look at how society and tax incentives celebrates this happening

    This isn't complicated.

    But your ideology insists you take more power from the individual and give it to the state. The state makes things worse and demands more power to solve the issues. You - a very stupid man - nods along approvingly
    No one asked about your father or social circle. Or what blog posts you read.
    Asked about you and your experiences.

    From your answer we can surmise you haven't the foggiest what you are talking about

    /////

    In fairness
    I can do that too.
    Recently my sister retired from an inner city school system.
    She talks about over crowding and under funding
    The best way to stop a bad guy with a gun is to make sure he doesn’t get a gun.

  20. #58
    It's OVER 5,000! Jaw's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 57Brave View Post
    they shot a kid with a toy gun.

    no amount of faux justification changes that fact

    //////

    I started a thread asking how we avoid these situation for not only the victims but the police officers that get caught in these situations.
    and really, your response amounted to it is the victims fault and there are no alternatives / solutions.
    My response is that by following the few simple rules listed in the original post, there will be no justification for police shootings.
    Go get him!

    Founding member of the Whiny Little Bitches and Pricks Club

  21. #59
    It's OVER 5,000! 57Brave's Avatar
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    there will and has been crime forever.
    How do we deal with it ?

    The old way doesnt work.
    No matter what ever justification you tag on

    It isnt working and hasnt been working for a long time
    The best way to stop a bad guy with a gun is to make sure he doesn’t get a gun.

  22. #60
    I <3 Ron Paul + gilesfan sturg33's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 57Brave View Post
    No one asked about your father or social circle. Or what blog posts you read.
    Asked about you and your experiences.

    From your answer we can surmise you haven't the foggiest what you are talking about

    /////

    In fairness
    I can do that too.
    Recently my sister retired from an inner city school system.
    She talks about over crowding and under funding
    Oh I see. When you asked me my experience with teachers, you weren't interested at all about my experience with teachers

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