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    Very Flirtatious, but Doubts What Love Is. jpx7's Avatar
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    Spirits and Cocktails

    This thread has been a long time coming, as far as I'm concerned, but [MENTION=6]zitothebrave[/MENTION]'s comments—to some of which I will respond below as a first foray into this all-important subject—finally spurred me to action.

    Quote Originally Posted by zitothebrave View Post
    Unless you're a hipster or a time traveler from the prohibition era, who cares about gin.
    I love gin—but I may be one or both of those things.

    Quote Originally Posted by zitothebrave View Post
    Gimlet - 4 parts gin 1 part lime (hard to do in ounces since you never want more than a half ounce of lime unless someone requests it heavy)
    Not hard for me: I make enough cocktails that I almost always have fresh citrus on-hand. Your gimlet recipe's also missing 0.25 ounces simple-syrup.

    Quote Originally Posted by zitothebrave View Post
    Yellow Rose of Texas - 4 parts tequila 1 part yellow chartruese (sp?) 4 parts pinapple juice fill with club sode
    You're making it super pear-shaped with that pineapple juice and club soda; you just need: 2 oz tequila (I like Espolón, but Camarena is good enough and super cheap), 0.5 oz yellow chartreuse, 0.75 oz lemon juice, 0.5 oz simple-syrup; shake, strain, dribble a couple drops of rose-water, then slightly stir.

    Quote Originally Posted by zitothebrave View Post
    Aviation - Gin, grenadine, lemon and something I'm forgetting
    The crème de violette. A standard, proper Aviation shouldn't have grenadine; it should be: 1.75-2.0 oz gin, 0.5 oz lemon juice, scant 0.5 oz maraschino liqueur, shaken, strained into a coupe, then finished with 0.25 oz crème de violette. Of course, that's if you're using Rothman & Winter; I greatly prefer the Tempus Fugit Liqueur de Violettes, so I use about 0.5 oz of the violette and cut the maraschino a bit more.


    Quote Originally Posted by zitothebrave View Post
    I'm assuming by New Standard Manhattan you're going with the Rye, bitters, and sweet vermouth. Though I'm not 100% where you're going since there are many different kinds of Manhattans.
    My preferred formulation that I mentioned (which is sourced from David Wondrich's Imbibe) contains 2 oz rye, 1 oz red vermouth (I love Noilly-Prat, but Cinzano is entirely serviceable), a scant bar-spoon of maraschino liqueur, a dash of absinthe, and two dashes Angostura—stirred, naturally, and served in a chilled glass. But you're right: there are countless Manhattan variations, and if I'm substituting a quinquina like Byrrh or Bonal for vermouth then I'm more likely to use a straight 2:1 or even 1:1 mix, with a lesser dash of Angostura.

    Quote Originally Posted by zitothebrave View Post
    Personally if I have to pretend to be trendy and drink a mixed drink
    I don't drink cocktails because they're trendy; I drink them because they're tasty.

    Quote Originally Posted by zitothebrave View Post
    Scotch is superior to Rye.
    False. And damn un-American of you.

    Quote Originally Posted by zitothebrave View Post
    And Though if I had my way I'd rather have that scotch neat with maybe a few drops of cold water.
    A love a good rye and soda (as in fizzy water), either mixed or side-by-side.

    Quote Originally Posted by zitothebrave View Post
    Why would I spend 25 bucks on Jack Daniels or Jim Beam
    You shouldn't. That's why you learn your brands.

    Quote Originally Posted by zitothebrave View Post
    As a smart fellow, I'm sure you know the basic history of the cocktail lets you know that the rise of many of the drinks you listed coincided with prohibition, where you had a switch from whiskey to gin (faster aging) and the reason they added so many ingredients is because the liquor sucks. Now that we live in a world where we don't have to consume inferior booze, I see no reason why I shouldn't just enjoy my quality scotches and bourbons, and what nots.
    Plenty of preeminent and primordial cocktails were developed well before the Eighteen Amendment; in a lot of ways, the latter-half of the nineteenth century in the US was the first great cocktail era. Moreover: gin is an awesome spirit, with a great history, and very good gins were cultivated and consumed outside the US before, during, and after Prohibition.
    Last edited by jpx7; 02-04-2014 at 01:52 PM.
    "For all his tattooings he was on the whole a clean, comely looking cannibal."

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  3. #2
    Connoisseur of Minors zitothebrave's Avatar
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    I never said there were no cocktails before prohibition, or that Gin didn't exist before or after. Just stating the facts that the Gin cocktails rose to fame for that reason.

    All the recipes I came up with were from a bar I worked at. We didn't readily have available simple syrup or maraschino liqueur. So grenadine was an easy sub for maraschino and I never learned it another way.

    And scotch is better than Rye, it's not comparable. I'm happy to admit when someone has us beat (and with Rye being traditionally linked to Canada, who cares?). And the Scottish make the best whiskey in the world. Not that Rye is horrible butt trash, but Scotch is much more subtle in it's complexities. While a Rye can contain any large number or grains as long as it contains some Rye in Canada and at least 51% in the US your complexity often comes from what grain is chosen so that's your big differentiator. With a single malt scotch, you're dealing with something that's 3 ingredients: barley, water, and yeast. the intricacies have to do with the smoking on the barley, the kilning process and what it does to the barley's flavor, and the water that's used. The difference between Highland and Lowland scotches is the same as the difference between Champagne and sparkling wine.
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    Very Flirtatious, but Doubts What Love Is. jpx7's Avatar
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    Rye, first and foremost, is a northeastern US whiskey; they Canadians just pimped it harder after the US went bourbon crazy—and I definitely like a good bourbon, but I'm a rye man through and through.

    As to scotch being superior to rye: I think you're crazy in that regard. I've tried a decent amount of scotch, and know more about scotches than I ever planned to know thanks to friends et cetera, but so far I've really only been able to place them into two categories: "hate" and "tolerate." I don't besmirch or begrudge the scotch drink; it's just not my spirit—though I do think rye is just plain better.
    "For all his tattooings he was on the whole a clean, comely looking cannibal."

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    Connoisseur of Minors zitothebrave's Avatar
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    Scotch requires a patient tongue. Drinking a random glass every now and then and you won't really love it. Drink a few tastings every few weeks and you'll slowly pickup the intricacies. Single malt scotch is "harsh" on the palette in the same way that an IPA is a full on assault on your palette, not for everyone. But the Scotch is the king of the whiskeys. The American/Canadian/Japanese/Irish varieties all have strengths, but they all fall short to King Scotch and it's brilliance If you're not a single malt fan, that's fine, you can enjoy your Ryes or Bourbons (I personally prefer generally bourbon's to ryes for their cleanliness but I do enjoy a funky rye every now and then, just not worth it to overstock my liquor shelf like I do with Scotches)
    Stockholm, more densely populated than NYC - sturg

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    Very Flirtatious, but Doubts What Love Is. jpx7's Avatar
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    If I want something smoky and "harsh," I just drink mezcal.

    I've done tastings some scotch tastings, and I've tried as much as I care to try, at least for the time being—scotch just isn't worth it to me.

    And, honestly: if you're arguing in favor of the virtues of a patient tongue, then you're really honor-bound to give gins another try, because the same can be said about that spirit.
    "For all his tattooings he was on the whole a clean, comely looking cannibal."

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    Connoisseur of Minors zitothebrave's Avatar
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    Did you just compare single malt Scotch to Mezcal

    Gin is eh. I'm not into juniper berries. Not my thing. I don't massively disdain gin like i do cheap vodka/tequila.

    Gimme my single malt scotches is awesome. Nothing out there compares to it.
    Stockholm, more densely populated than NYC - sturg

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    It's OVER 5,000! Tapate50's Avatar
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    The only spirits I enjoy are beer, small batch whiskey, scotch, and red wine. I can get more specific if needed, but really there is no need in all this mixer business.

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    Connoisseur of Minors zitothebrave's Avatar
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    You listed 2 spirits, a wine, and a malt beverage. COME ON
    Stockholm, more densely populated than NYC - sturg

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    Quote Originally Posted by zitothebrave View Post
    You listed 2 spirits, a wine, and a malt beverage. COME ON
    I forget terminology gets you all hot and bothered. Wierd.

    Anyway, I guess my point is that water and a splash of lime is the abslute max I'll have with my SPIRITS.
    Ivermectin Man

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    I love both gin and single malt. I'm more likely to go for gin in summer and scotch in winter but that isn't a rule.

    I haven't developed a taste for rye yet but I may give it another try. Fell in love the Glenfiddich a few years ago and now have to steer clear. It just goes down too smooth. I'm slowly working my way through the other big names but haven't found a better one for me yet. Laphroaig tastes like really good cough syrup. It's growing on me.

    I never thought I'd see it but now both Jim Beam and Jack Daniels have a "with honey" product. Haven't tried either yet but I did try another with honey whiskey, Torys (Suntory). It's another I think I may have to avoid.

    I like red wine but lately it gives me a headache.

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    Connoisseur of Minors zitothebrave's Avatar
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    I had the Jim Beam one a few weeks ago. It's not bad. It's more of liqueur than a liquor IMO. But it does go down easy.
    Stockholm, more densely populated than NYC - sturg

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