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Thread: Helicopter/plane Crash over Potomac

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    Quote Originally Posted by thethe View Post
    Military strategy is a task like anything else and our most 'decorated' officers failed miserably.

    There is a reason for that.

    Hegseth will run a better operation than those clowns.
    Your stance is that because military leadership encouraged strategies you find ineffective that it follows that a helicopter pilot didn’t know how to fly a helicopter but was allowed to all this time because she’s a woman? Do you hear yourself?

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    Quote Originally Posted by mqt View Post
    Your stance is that because military leadership encouraged strategies you find ineffective that it follows that a helicopter pilot didn’t know how to fly a helicopter but was allowed to all this time because she’s a woman? Do you hear yourself?
    No - It was a statement to combat the idea of 'credentialism' indicates competency. Especially when those making the decisions on who gets those credentials are ideologically corrupt.
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    Quote Originally Posted by thethe View Post
    No - It was a statement to combat the idea of 'credentialism' indicates competency. Especially when those making the decisions on who gets those credentials are ideologically corrupt.
    In general I will continue to believe credentials imply competency more than lack of a penis automatically implies incompetency.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mqt View Post
    In general I will continue to believe credentials imply competency more than lack of a penis automatically implies incompetency.
    Oh women are highly competent in many areas but the fact you go to this when I just slammed a group of men (many white) for basically being DEI generals is interesting.
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    Quote Originally Posted by thethe View Post
    Oh women are highly competent in many areas but the fact you go to this when I just slammed a group of men for basically being DEI generals is interesting.
    Because the *actual* point at issue is whether or not I was justified in opposing the idea a helicopter crash was caused by DEI as stated explicitly by Trump and Hegseth. It doesn’t feel particularly interesting that you can’t recall how we got here.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mqt View Post
    Because the *actual* point at issue is whether or not I was justified in opposing the idea a helicopter crash was caused by DEI as stated explicitly by Trump and Hegseth. It doesn’t feel particularly interesting that you can’t recall how we got here.
    She just happens to check a lot of the identify politics and was close the Biden regime.

    You don't see it but that isn't a surprise.
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    Quote Originally Posted by thethe View Post
    She just happens to check a lot of the identify politics and was close the Biden regime.

    You don't see it but that isn't a surprise.
    Last week it was DEI initiatives in Air Traffic Control that caused it, so forgive me if I’m not fully sold DEI was the culprit in the case of a helicopter pilot who has been flying a helicopter for years without crashing them suddenly did so. If you just blame DEI at the forefront and wait to find the first non-white male employee involved in any way, it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mqt View Post
    Last week it was DEI initiatives in Air Traffic Control that caused it, so forgive me if I’m not fully sold DEI was the culprit in the case of a helicopter pilot who has been flying a helicopter for years without crashing them suddenly did so. If you just blame DEI at the forefront and wait to find the first non-white male employee involved in any way, it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy.
    Yes - DEI caused a lowering of standards which is a pervasive issue in all aspects of the organization.

    You think its this thing that has to be a 1 for 1 mapping but miss the whole point of how it impacts the effectiveness of an organization.
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    Quote Originally Posted by thethe View Post
    Yes - DEI caused a lowering of standards which is a pervasive issue in all aspects of the organization.

    You think its this thing that has to be a 1 for 1 mapping but miss the whole point of how it impacts the effectiveness of an organization.
    One helicopter crashed into a plane. If that’s what 20 years of Obama era DEI initiatives in this space have led to, I’m not sure it’s a great argument for it being a crisis in need of a solution.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mqt View Post
    [b]One[/] helicopter crashed into a plane. If that’s what 20 years of Obama era DEI initiatives in this space have led to, I’m not sure it’s a great argument for it being a crisis in need of a solution.
    That may be one consequence (only 60+ people!!!! but sure not a great argument).

    There are many others of added layers of costs due to inefficiencies of having incompetent people in charge.
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    Quote Originally Posted by thethe View Post
    That may be one consequence (only 60+ people!!!! but sure not a great argument).

    There are many others of added layers of costs due to inefficiencies of having incompetent people in charge.
    To be clear, that’s just taking you at your word she wasn’t qualified, which is not a thing that’s been proven.

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    Quote Originally Posted by thethe View Post
    Again - “accomplishments” are awarded. The incentive based system in place changes the weight of those “accomplishments”. Look at our distinguished five star generals that absolutely bungled the last four years. Maybe they weren’t that good in the first place. Agreed?
    You're talking about operations and overall governance, which is not an individual result (though I would agree that some of their performance was lacking).

    Captain Lobach by all accounts was an experienced pilot that was able to meet all the criteria required in a rigorous military training and testing program. She was not a "DEI hire" unless you are implying all women in the military are DEI hires.

    If she were pictured wearing a MAGA hat you would have tripped over yourself running to defend her.

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    One major issue I have with this new “blame DEI” play is that if the standards were lowered so much that you can no longer trust them, why is it only being used to go after non-white men? If a white man makes a mistake in his job, could he not also be an employee that is under-qualified? If an isolated incident occurs, such as a helicopter running into an airplane, why is the identity of the pilot any sign of anything? The new standards are already in place for any employee, so we can just look at the standards themselves and determine if they’re adequate, right?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Carp View Post
    You're talking about operations and overall governance, which is not an individual result (though I would agree that some of their performance was lacking).

    Captain Lobach by all accounts was an experienced pilot that was able to meet all the criteria required in a rigorous military training and testing program. She was not a "DEI hire" unless you are implying all women in the military are DEI hires.

    If she were pictured wearing a MAGA hat you would have tripped over yourself running to defend her.
    "by all accounts" means what exactly?

    Your guess is as good as mine but you default to just believing the credentialing/certification despite understanding the environment of lowering standards we have lived in recently.
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    Quote Originally Posted by thethe View Post
    "by all accounts" means what exactly?

    Your guess is as good as mine but you default to just believing the credentialing/certification despite understanding the environment of lowering standards we have lived in recently.
    "By all accounts" meaning by all the information we have of her. Her training background. Her experience (450+ flight hours). Her educational back ground. Nothing suggests she wasn't qualified to be pilot. Insinuating she was a DEI because of her political beliefs is belittling her service record.

    Is there any evidence that military pilot training standards have been lowered? Because I certainly am not aware of them. And certainly my friends and family in the military are not aware of that either. In fact, it would extremely surprising if that were true.

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    The problem.with DEI is rightfully brings into question the qualifications of everyone, especially those who check the DEI boxes.

    This person worked for Joe Biden, so probably a political activist. She was a woman. Check that box. She was gay! Hell yes, get her in the fleet ASAP


    You can watch that video and incompetence is a charitable attribute. Someone, somewhere failed

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    When I board a flight, I'm relieved to see male pilots.

    Not because females can't fly the planes. But because if some emergency happened, I trust the men to handle that adversity much better.

    My combat military friends often shared storied about women losing their **** when things got dangerous, and that they would have to expend as much energy on getting through the situation as they would getting themselves.

    In clthe case of the helicopter, I'm sure this pilot was being told she was flying in the path of a plane. But something happened to where she didn't do anything about it


    Very tragic

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    Quote Originally Posted by sturg33 View Post
    When I board a flight, I'm relieved to see male pilots.

    Not because females can't fly the planes. But because if some emergency happened, I trust the men to handle that adversity much better.

    My combat military friends often shared storied about women losing their **** when things got dangerous, and that they would have to expend as much energy on getting through the situation as they would getting themselves.

    In clthe case of the helicopter, I'm sure this pilot was being told she was flying in the path of a plane. But something happened to where she didn't do anything about it


    Very tragic
    To be fair, I have been consistently neglecting to consider whether or not you personally trust their decision-making abilities under pressure when I try to ascertain if they’re qualified to fly a helicopter. Can I get a hierarchy of which traits make someone a more adept pilot? I’d hate to get on a plane with a pilot under 6’ tall if it might make you feel unsafe.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sturg33 View Post
    When I board a flight, I'm relieved to see male pilots.

    Not because females can't fly the planes. But because if some emergency happened, I trust the men to handle that adversity much better.

    My combat military friends often shared storied about women losing their **** when things got dangerous, and that they would have to expend as much energy on getting through the situation as they would getting themselves.

    In clthe case of the helicopter, I'm sure this pilot was being told she was flying in the path of a plane. But something happened to where she didn't do anything about it


    Very tragic

    Apparently she confirmed she saw it, which means she was likely looking at the wrong plane.

    Like I said earlier, this isn't 1 person's fault. It was a combination of events. All I know is that it is poor taste for a civilian to call into question the achievements and qualifications of military personnel.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mqt View Post
    To be fair, I have been consistently neglecting to consider whether or not you personally trust their decision-making abilities under pressure when I try to ascertain if they’re qualified to fly a helicopter. Can I get a hierarchy of which traits make someone a more adept pilot? I’d hate to get on a plane with a pilot under 6’ tall if it might make you feel unsafe.
    Sounds tedious.

    I think in general, men handle danger better than women, and handle adversity better as well.

    Hell I work in corporate America... 93% of complaints to HR are from women. I'm sure plenty of that is justified... but when faced with adversity, they run to someone else to help much more frequently than the men do

    If a plane is falling out the sky, there's not too many people to run to for help

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