FREDI: "What do you want me to do? Hit the pitcher 4th?" Well. since you asked...

[rico43]

1) Get Heyward out of the leadoff spot (for Pena or Pastor) and/or get him to ditch the facemask. This goes down as a failed project because ...

2) Find a legit No.2 hitter. Maybe it's not La Stella, but maybe it is Simmons.

3) Leave Johnson 3rd or 4th. He can protect FF, or vice versa.

4) Heyward batting 5th. Get him up there with many men on base and he'll find a groove.

5) Gattis or Justin, whoever's hotter bats higher. I'm good with the merit system.

6) End the pitcher 8th BS. To me, this is Fredi's attempt at sarcasm for the criticism. BJ would be an effective 8th if he holds on to his gains in 2014.

PURGE the bench. See ya, 3rd catcher (whasisname?), see ya, Schafer; clock is ticking on you, too Doumit. Bring in an Xavier Nady, a JoeyT, even a Constanza (if he gets healthy soon) or Cunningham. Or trade a darn pitcher.

Thanks for asking!

[zitothebrave]

Ewwww Pena/Pastor at 1 is terrible. Jason needs to hit better, but moving him around isn't gonna do it. Eventually he'll figure his groove out and he'll get his extra base hits and extra hits to fall and all will be fine.

Only way I move Jason to 4 (not 5) is if we bring up TLS and he hits leadoff.

I'm also not a fan of punishing one of our best hitters. I really don't get why people think Justin has sucked. Sure he goes into some cold spells but what hitter doesn't.

Going into today (don't think things moved too much) hitters ranked by wRC+ on the Braves.

1. Justin 150
2. Freddie 149
3. Gattis 118
4. Johnson 90
5. Simmons 88
6. Heyeard 80
7. Bossman 73
8. Pena 73 (cause of overinflated power)
9. Pastor 60
10 Ugga 45

WE suck offensively because someone who's supposed to be offense first in Johnson hasn't done that yet. Jason hasn't hit to his career norms. Bossman hasn't become an above average hitter again, and most importantly, 2B sucks.

The way to improve this team is to stop marching out the craptacular hydra at 2B and try TLS and if he fails Gosselin. It's ridiculous this hasn't happened yet. Braves have some form of rose colored glasses with Pastornicky. Dude is a dud.

I do agree largely with the Bench.

If I was running the team today I'd move Uggla for whatever I can get for him. Even if I only save 2M I do it. I'd sned Pastor to AAA, see if I can trade Scchafer for anything if not DFA him, Doumit I'm ok with he'll hit based on his past.

I'd bring up Terds, Cunningham and TLS

1. Jason
2. TLS
3. Justin
4. Freddie (just to breakup the lefties, could also go TLS, Justin, Freddie, Jason I just like our fastest player hitting in front of someoen who should be able to move him over with ease)
5. Gattis
6. Johnson
7. BOssman
8. Simmons

Simmons can possibly move up a little but I like him at 8

Other way I'd go is the same 1-6 then

7 Simmons
8. P
9. Bossman

[Dalyn]

Fredi needs to go. Better late than never.

[The Chosen One]

Fredi needs to go. Better late than never.

Even if he puts the most saber friendly lineup out there it won't change the fact our guys suck.

[Dalyn]

Even if he puts the most saber friendly lineup out there it won't change the fact our guys suck.

Nor the fact that he sucks.

[Runnin]

Nor the fact that he sucks.

Fredi is bilingual and he shaves his head every day. 'Nuff said.

[BravesfanMike]

Fredi is bilingual and he shaves his head every day. 'Nuff said.

and he just signed a new contract

[PawPawMaxwell]

Fredi: "Frank, Im doing the best I can with what you gave me." "Bobby is gone and you have to look beyond the pitching staff." "Another thing Frank, you have input into the draft process." "You think maybe you could draft a position guy more frequently than every decade?"

Seriously tho, Heyward found lightening in the bottle last year. Leading off this year is a waste of talent when the team cant hit with RISP.

I would consider trading JUP since BJ is unmoveable. There is something to sibling rivalry. Those of you with kids understand this.

Quit sitting Gattis in lieu of Laird. If you must play Laird, get Gattis back out in LF. Lets see what we have in way of value if he has to be traded.
And at worse, he isnt as bad as Doumit out there.

With the AJC now on board with the Uggla situation, I will not be surprised if he isnt released before the next road trip.

Atlantas crowds traditionally rise during school vacation. We'll see shortly if that holds with this teams struggles. The out of towners will not be so anxious to travel to see a losing team.

[zitothebrave]

Hardly the first time Justin being traded has been suggested, I want to know though still, why do people insist on trading the guy who's arguably been the best player on this team this year? In what world does that make this team better? Unless we're getting Tulo, Trout, or Stanton back for him, we'd be 100% morans to make that trade.

I don't buy into sibling rivalry, I don't think trading Justin will magically make BJ be all that he can be. Don't even think joining the Army Reserve could do that. You think just cause they're on the same team means their rivalry is more intense than before? I know my siblings and I never played on the same sports teams (age/gender matching) and we still were competitive as hell. My brother and I used to compare stats in soccer and baseball. When I was finally a teenager (he's 7 years older than me) and on a simila level of talent physically as him we used to play very intense games on the same and different teams and there was never a dynamic shift between us. Sibling rivalry is there if you're on the same team or not. You don't think Justin's MVP level season in AZ wasn't brought up at the Thanksgiving table?

As far as Gattis goes, we're dealing with a fragile catcher it seems. We better hope Bethancourt starts hitting or we're gonna be in a similar boat for some time. I said last year I had concerns about Gattis's durability and it looks like the Braves brass agrees with me.

I hope Uggla is gone soon. That means hopefully with it the death of the hydra. We need to make our team better, cutting Uggla is the first step to doing that. Cutting Pastor is the second.

[PawPawMaxwell]

Hardly the first time Justin being traded has been suggested, I want to know though still, why do people insist on trading the guy who's arguably been the best player on this team this year? In what world does that make this team better? Unless we're getting Tulo, Trout, or Stanton back for him, we'd be 100% morans to make that trade.

I don't buy into sibling rivalry, I don't think trading Justin will magically make BJ be all that he can be. Don't even think joining the Army Reserve could do that. You think just cause they're on the same team means their rivalry is more intense than before? I know my siblings and I never played on the same sports teams (age/gender matching) and we still were competitive as hell. My brother and I used to compare stats in soccer and baseball. When I was finally a teenager (he's 7 years older than me) and on a simila level of talent physically as him we used to play very intense games on the same and different teams and there was never a dynamic shift between us. Sibling rivalry is there if you're on the same team or not. You don't think Justin's MVP level season in AZ wasn't brought up at the Thanksgiving table?

As far as Gattis goes, we're dealing with a fragile catcher it seems. We better hope Bethancourt starts hitting or we're gonna be in a similar boat for some time. I said last year I had concerns about Gattis's durability and it looks like the Braves brass agrees with me.

I hope Uggla is gone soon. That means hopefully with it the death of the hydra. We need to make our team better, cutting Uggla is the first step to doing that. Cutting Pastor is the second.

If JUp is the best this team can look foreward to then we are in for disappointment it seems.

When you have children of your own then come back and we will discuss Sibling Rivalry.

Where has it ever come up about Gattis being fragile? I read constantly and dont recall ever seeing anything about it. Is there a stat for that somewhere.

[zitothebrave]

If JUp is the best this team can look foreward to then we are in for disappointment it seems.

When you have children of your own then come back and we will discuss Sibling Rivalry.

Where has it ever come up about Gattis being fragile? I read constantly and dont recall ever seeing anything about it. Is there a stat for that somewhere.

Justin Upton is currently tied with MikeTrout for the 13th best wRC+ in baseball. What is so bad about that?

I'm one of 5 children in a highly competitive family. I'm pretty sure i have an idea about sibling rivalry. I've lived it I don't need ot see it from the outside.

There is a stat for it. Gattis's games played by year. 2010 60 2011 88 2012 74 2013 110. We've already heard about his knees being hurt this year.

[nsacpi]

Fredi has made the two obvious moves. Sitting Uggla. And playing Gattis more. Now we have to wait. Patience grasshoppers.

[PurpleBrave]

With what we have to play with now...how about batting Johnson lead off? Or at least 2nd?

Stop batting the pitcher 8th, it's ridiculous.

CJ
Simmons
Freeman
J Up
Heyward
Gattis
Bj Upton
2b
Pitcher

Something needs to be done to break up the stretch of wind mills at the top of the line up.

Ultimately I'd like to see what La Stella can do at the top of the lineup.


There really aren't many dumb ideas at this point, except to continue what we've been trying this year

[zitothebrave]

Braves starters by OBP

Freddie - .379
Justin - .356
Jason - .313
Johnson . 303
Simmons - .297
Bossman - .272
Gattis - .272
Uggla - .246

ALso to mention

Pastor .276
Pena .261

The idea of us not having our 3 best OBP guys hitting anywhere but 1-3 doesn't make sense.

If we go on performance it should be

J-Hey
Justin
Freddie
Gattis
Johnson
Simmons
Bossman
2B

Unless we bring up La Stella and he hits.

[BravesfanMike]

Hardly the first time Justin being traded has been suggested, I want to know though still, why do people insist on trading the guy who's arguably been the best player on this team this year? In what world does that make this team better? Unless we're getting Tulo, Trout, or Stanton back for him, we'd be 100% morans to make that trade.

I don't buy into sibling rivalry, I don't think trading Justin will magically make BJ be all that he can be. Don't even think joining the Army Reserve could do that. You think just cause they're on the same team means their rivalry is more intense than before? I know my siblings and I never played on the same sports teams (age/gender matching) and we still were competitive as hell. My brother and I used to compare stats in soccer and baseball. When I was finally a teenager (he's 7 years older than me) and on a simila level of talent physically as him we used to play very intense games on the same and different teams and there was never a dynamic shift between us. Sibling rivalry is there if you're on the same team or not. You don't think Justin's MVP level season in AZ wasn't brought up at the Thanksgiving table?

As far as Gattis goes, we're dealing with a fragile catcher it seems. We better hope Bethancourt starts hitting or we're gonna be in a similar boat for some time. I said last year I had concerns about Gattis's durability and it looks like the Braves brass agrees with me.

I hope Uggla is gone soon. That means hopefully with it the death of the hydra. We need to make our team better, cutting Uggla is the first step to doing that. Cutting Pastor is the second.

Because JUp has value. Who else could we trade

[zitothebrave]

Because JUp has value. Who else could we trade

No one? A pitcher?

Trading arguably our best hitter for a certainly worse hitter isn't what winning teams do.

[gilesfan]

We have 2 guys that can hit. Arguing where the other 6 should hit is futile.

[PurpleBrave]

Braves starters by OBP

Freddie - .379
Justin - .356
Jason - .313
Johnson . 303
Simmons - .297
Bossman - .272
Gattis - .272
Uggla - .246

ALso to mention

Pastor .276
Pena .261

The idea of us not having our 3 best OBP guys hitting anywhere but 1-3 doesn't make sense.

If we go on performance it should be

J-Hey
Justin
Freddie
Gattis
Johnson
Simmons
Bossman
2B

Unless we bring up La Stella and he hits.

I think Heywards obp would be higher if he doesn't bat lead off. He essentially bats in a vacuum with no one on base and BJ Upton behind him every time.

[zitothebrave]

I think Heywards obp would be higher if he doesn't bat lead off. He essentially bats in a vacuum with no one on base and BJ Upton behind him every time.

That's why I think the top 4 should be Jason, Justin, Freddie, Gattis

Gives Jason best chance to succeed with quality hitters behind him.

Granted would love to have TLS, Jason, and Freddie hitting 1-3 but I'm concerned about all lefties.

[nsacpi]

Not to pick on anyhow in particular. But these lineup threads are chock full of arguments that are made without a shred of supporting evidence. Player X would hit better if he hit in a different spot in the lineup or if he had player Y hitting in front or behind him. Player Z would hit better without a faceguard or jockstrap. It is all grasping at straws.

There were two obvious moves that had to be made and Fredi has made them. Uggla has been benched. Gattis' playing time has been increased.

There is a third somewhat obvious third move that has not been made. That would be to play an extra lefty bat or two against righties with strong platoon splits. Guys like Lynn and Miller for example. For his career, Miller has given up an .862 OPS against lefties and .690 against righties. With Lynn it is .797 and .625. It would have made sense to have Pena and/or Schafer/Doumit play against those two guys. Now does that guarantee a win. Of course not. But it would raise our chances of success at the margins.