The Elephant In The Room

[57Brave]

1. I spelled it out because you avoid the victim in your comparison between torture and abortion. You made the latter only about the mother and not the human life being taken. I spelled it out because you emphasized the means of torture (sleep deprivation). So, I emphasized the means of abortion. In other words, I wanted to make clearer comparisons to emphasize Garmel's point which you had obscured. Why that's uncalled for means of discussion per the guy who flippantly compares abortions to knee replacement surgeries is beyond me. And how did I take you out of context?

2. I didn't say my stand wasn't political. I don't cubby-hole things like that. My stand is biological, theological, political, etc. All are involved.

3. And yes, abortion affects lives - more lives than you want to admit.

Once more:
Before any of this or any of that we have a basic disagreement on when the fetus becomes a walking talking feeling working human being. Again you base your end of the discussion on "the human life being taken" and take for granted everyone holds your definition of " human life." I for one don't. So yes , to my mind it is about the mother.

That does not make me "for abortion" . But what I am is in favor of allowing a person to decide . What I am for is creating an environment where abortion is not a best / worst option. Where people can become pregnant and welcome the opportunity to nurture a child. Where an already troubled person does not have to deal with the issues / moral indignity the Pro-Life contingent throws their way . Because of their certainty in their rightness

[sturg33]

Once more:
Before any of this or any of that we have a basic disagreement on when the fetus becomes a walking talking feeling working human being.

I'm fairly certain none of this happens after child birth either

[BedellBrave]

Once more:
Before any of this or any of that we have a basic disagreement on when the fetus becomes a walking talking feeling working human being. Again you base your end of the discussion on "the human life being taken" and take for granted everyone holds your definition of " human life." I for one don't. So yes , to my mind it is about the mother.

That does not make me "for abortion" . But what I am is in favor of allowing a person to decide . What I am for is creating an environment where abortion is not a best / worst option. Where people can become pregnant and welcome the opportunity to nurture a child. Where an already troubled person does not have to deal with the issues / moral indignity the Pro-Life contingent throws their way . Because of their certainty in their rightness

No, that's not the point of disagreement. A human fetus is a human life. A human embryo is a human life. A human zygote is a human life.

And I obviously don't take for granted that everyone holds my definition. I know you don't. And I also truly believe that you are wrong.

Yet, that does not mean that I don't care about the lady who is considering abortion or the one that has had an abortion. Real care and concern for them isn't mutually exclusive to opposition to abortion, as is clear by the helpful actions of many pro-lifers.

Link

[BedellBrave]

I'm fairly certain none of this happens after child birth either

Which I would assume means that 57 believes that abortions all the way up until the moment of birth are okay if the mother chooses to end the life of her child.

[Gary82]

ABORTION!



That should get the elephant's attention.

[BedellBrave]

[goldfly]

elephants are awesome

although one almost killed me in Sri Lanka

[BedellBrave]

Glad it didn't! :)

Yes they are.

The one above? "The Elephant in the Womb"

And yes, I consider it an elephant life.

[Gary82]

I have a great respect and admiration for elephants.

[BedellBrave]

Even "The Elephant in the Womb"?

[Gary82]

Even "The Elephant in the Womb"?

Of course not. Look at that lazy bum mooching off his/her mother. GET A JERB!

[BedellBrave]

But at least you believe that it is alive. Good.

[Gary82]

I find inanimate objects lazy, too.

[BedellBrave]

I don't believe you... :)