Whether you realize or not, Gonzalez has managed two teams worth of players and kept them competitive. Fantastic job even though this board won't admit it.
Whether you realize or not, Gonzalez has managed two teams worth of players and kept them competitive. Fantastic job even though this board won't admit it.
Fredi Gonzalez (08-09-2015), Prikichi (08-09-2015), Pugfan (08-08-2015), Runnin (08-08-2015)
He's doing good work this year but admittedly he's got some good veterans who make his job easier.Originally Posted by VirginiaBrave
You can be as positive as you want to be, and it is still a huge stretch to call 51-60 competitive.
bravesnumberone (08-08-2015), jpx7 (08-09-2015), NinersSBChamps (08-09-2015), tomahawkchop10 (08-10-2015)
Besides that, ever notice every time we kick Miami's butt these threads pop up? Then once that is over and we go back facing teams we don't own so much and start losing again nothing. Funny how that works.
If we played the Marlins all year we'd be World Champions! All Hail Fredi! LOL!
Still we have a better record than predicted and expected. And Hart continues to turn the roster over. Still don't know how he got anything for Chris Johnson
No, I think we're on track to finish right around what most people thought we would.
Braves1976 (08-08-2015), Dalyn (08-08-2015), jpx7 (08-09-2015), tomahawkchop10 (08-10-2015)
While I approve of that move it made sense for both teams and did save the Indians 4 million overall and money next season too. They care more about that while Hart and co. care more about 2017 obviously. Plus Johnson still kills lefties so he isn't a bad platoon bat for an AL team since they can also DH him there and not just play him at third (if they so desire anyway).
I think for the most part Freddi has done a solid job this year personally. That doesn't make up for the awful managing in the past but I think giving him the team next year isn't the worst idea based on his performance this year.
Natural Immunity Croc
But the Marlins have plenty of talent. They guys are still playing hard and that's a credit to them and to Fredi. If we can get our pitching settled down this season will end a lot better than people expected.
Still got more value than he was worth...
I expect the kids to play hard because the group of kids on this team are mostly high character kids (Peterson being among the best examples). But I believe veterans like Gomes deserve credit there rather than Fredi, Peterson of course gave Gomes credit already and early on noting how much Gomes helped him early on in Spring Training, took him under his wing, etc. I am sold on Gomes leadership skills and that is why you've not seen me wanting him gone so fast like others. Plus adding Bourn will help the kids too and players like Maybin have good character as well. And Maybin loves playing so close to home so that's another plus since he's arrived here.
That said, I don't like our starting rotation overall now without Wood so I don't see this little streak lasting long. Miller is very good but we never get him runs it seems and after him there isn't enough.
41-58 versus all teams not named Miami.
Stretch that and say 36-56 versus all teams not named Miami or Milwaukee.
bravesnumberone (08-09-2015)
Statements like this are silly. Yes the Braves are bad, but cherry picking doesn't help your argument.
Similarly the Braves are 48-51 vs all teams not named Washington. Stretch that and they are 48-47 vs all teams not named Washington and Colorado.
When you look at us vs. teams that are in the playoff hunt, we're 20-34. 31-26 against everyone else.
I think Fredi's done a better job this year than in previous years…and I think his on-field managing has improved each of the last two. I still don't think he brings much of anything to the team.
But man, give it a rest. This team is not and has never been competitive. Being in a crappy division has meant that they've managed to be a small handful of games out of the division race until summertime, but that small handful might as well have been a mountain. Again, this team has not seen north of .500 since the first of June.
bravesnumberone (08-09-2015), Dalyn (08-09-2015), jpx7 (08-09-2015)
Competitive is just wins and losses; it's hanging in close on games, making teams beat you rather than rolling over like the Marlins have done this year. There have been so many tough losses that a year or two from now will be going the other way.
I think about the Bill James-ish statement that every team in baseball will win at least 60 games and lose at least 60. It's what they do with the other 40 that matter.
Why? I was told all spring this team would lose 100 games. That is not happening. But the original point was about the turnover and still winning a few games here and there.
Go find those posts. Most people were saying 70-75 wins.
bravesnumberone (08-09-2015)
I think I said between 75-80 and third place. And that's with me being one of the ones who was bitter and just mad we traded Heyward.
There's enough talent on the team, and the guys play hard enough, not to embarrass themselves constantly. But they're not very good.
I think the offense has been built a little more for Fredi, and he's done a few things better.
He still had very terrible bullpen management at times, but it's been overshadowed by just how crappy the bullpen has been outside of Grilli and JJ and a couple other flares.
Braves1976 (08-09-2015), jpx7 (08-09-2015)
Most people were forecasting between 70-76 wins. I said we topped out with a shot at .500 if everything broke right. I don't remember a single credible person saying that we would lose 100 games.
I do remember you saying it was potentially a playoff team, even when EY and CJ were regulars.
To your point, though, I don't know what we can credit Fredi with this season. He certainly has a lot of veterans on the club who have been vocal about their willingness to police the clubhouse. I don't think Fredi is a particularly good manager, and I don't like the way he sometimes seems to not have the backs of the players. That being said, I am far from his most vocal critic.
What I don't really understand about your point is that it seems that Fredi gets no blame for a team that failed to live up to expectations last year, and then somehow gets positive credit for a team with worse personnel that plays exactly to its expectations. Talk about grading on a curve.
Last edited by Julio3000; 08-09-2015 at 12:50 PM.
Braves1976 (08-09-2015), Garmel (08-09-2015), jpx7 (08-09-2015)
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