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Thread: Star Wars Discussion Thread (Spoilers Inside)

  1. #481
    Shift Leader CyYoung31's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zitothebrave View Post
    Nope,

    But you're confusing writing and story.Common issue with most people. A movie like Reservoir Dogs has the simplest story, but it's so impressively well written.
    The story of RD is also, while simple, well done. Story doesn't need to be complex to be good. TFA was neither.

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    Episode VIII: The Last Jedi

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    I <3 Ron Paul + gilesfan sturg33's Avatar
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    So here's something that's always bugged me.

    The rule of the sith is there can only be 2. The entire original trilogy is Vader turning Luke to the Dark Side... In ROTJ, the emperor clearly tells him Luke is his "new apprentice"

    So doesn't Vader know that the emperor's goal is to ultimately replace him with Luke? Why is Vader OK with this?

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    Connoisseur of Minors zitothebrave's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sturg33 View Post
    So here's something that's always bugged me.

    The rule of the sith is there can only be 2. The entire original trilogy is Vader turning Luke to the Dark Side... In ROTJ, the emperor clearly tells him Luke is his "new apprentice"

    So doesn't Vader know that the emperor's goal is to ultimately replace him with Luke? Why is Vader OK with this?
    It's a cult/stockholm syndrome type of thing, what's best for the company is best for me. But the reality is that Vader was hoping his paternal ties would have Luke join him and them overthrow the Emperor and Luke become his apprentice and Vader become the Emperor and master.

    The rule of 2 is also only in ties to the sith specifically. Maul was never a full blown sith because Sidious was an apprentice. Darth Tyrannus also had an "apprentice" in Assage Ventrice. His hope was to build her up and then overthrow SIdious to end the Clone Wars. Similar mechanation that Sidious used with Anakin but Anakin was never his apprentice, the Jedi did all of the training, he just planted the seeds of doubt in him. But Sidious found out about Ventrice gaining power and made Tyrannus cut her off. Which lead to him recruiting Savage Opress (Darth Maul's brother) which lead to Maul being found again, which lead to Sidious overthrowing both of them killing Savage.

    Reality is that the Sith rule of 2 was made to stop another massive uprising which lead to the near death of the Sith. Also it's worth noting that the Rule of 2 was also partially to keep Sith operations a secret. There's no saying that with the Empire established that they wouldn't expand or include non-Sith dark side users in their order. Like Vader gets bumped out fo the Sith but keeps his Imperial role. Or something like that.
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    What zeets said is correct. Although that could change depending if they want to go back and reestablish anything prior to TPM as canon. Right now it's mostly legends and most fans accept it as canon until something new shows up to contradict it.

    But basically for a Sith to truly become a master they need to raise up an apprentice in secret and then kill their master. It's just their way. As we saw with Sidious, in the movies, he ended up having 3 apprentices. In the comics it's been established he's had even more but Vader did find out about them and ended up killing them all.

    Vader wanted to continue this trend and have Luke as his apprentice and wanted Luke to help him kill the emperor.

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    Connoisseur of Minors zitothebrave's Avatar
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    Darth Bane stuff is Canon as it was in the Clone Wars show.
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    Quote Originally Posted by zitothebrave View Post
    Darth Bane stuff is Canon as it was in the Clone Wars show.
    Yes Darth Bane is but besides that nothing else is. Like I said it's assumed everything associated with him is until Disney disproves it which is pretty much how I view anything pre-TPM.

    I tried to get some EP8 news from Hamil yesterday but he wouldn't let anything slip. :(

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    Quote Originally Posted by thewupk View Post
    Yes Darth Bane is but besides that nothing else is. Like I said it's assumed everything associated with him is until Disney disproves it which is pretty much how I view anything pre-TPM.

    I tried to get some EP8 news from Hamil yesterday but he wouldn't let anything slip. :(
    Rule of 2 and Moraband are too. Only thing I can say 100% that isn't cannon is the lineage from Bane to Plagueis.
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    Shift Leader CyYoung31's Avatar
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    I've been saying that Luke is Snoke since Day 1.

    They're probably not cool enough to do that, but that's my dream plot twist for the movie.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CyYoung31 View Post
    I've been saying that Luke is Snoke since Day 1.

    They're probably not cool enough to do that, but that's my dream plot twist for the movie.
    Helluva plot twist, but I'd be crushed
    Ivermectin Man

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    Quote Originally Posted by CyYoung31 View Post
    I've been saying that Luke is Snoke since Day 1.

    They're probably not cool enough to do that, but that's my dream plot twist for the movie.
    Because it wouldn't make sense at all for him to do that.
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    Quote Originally Posted by zitothebrave View Post
    Because it wouldn't make sense at all for him to do that.
    Actually, it would make perfect sense.

    In fact, the original ending to ROTJ was Luke walking off into the forest ominously. The whole of Empire and even parts of ROTJ lead up to his turn. Unfortunately, Lucas pulled it because he was more concerned with selling toys.

    Even Hamill himself said that he saw Luke's turn to the dark side as the next logical step for the third trilogy. He even pitched it to JJ Abrams, no less.

    Last edited by CyYoung31; 04-15-2017 at 12:04 AM.

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    I think Luke could turn but I don't think he's snoke. Episode seven had everyone trying to find Luke. If Luke was snoke why would the first order be out trying to find Luke?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Krgrecw View Post
    I think Luke could turn but I don't think he's snoke. Episode seven had everyone trying to find Luke. If Luke was snoke why would the first order be out trying to find Luke?
    My idea was that it was a test to see who he was worthy of training to be a Sith. Rey succeeded, Kylo failed. Rey turns dark, Kylo turns good.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CyYoung31 View Post
    My idea was that it was a test to see who he was worthy of training to be a Sith. Rey succeeded, Kylo failed. Rey turns dark, Kylo turns good.
    I do buy into the Rey is Anakin reincarnated theory.

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    I think if Luke turns it's to reach to the dark side to slaughter the Knights of Ren to save Rey.
    Forever Fredi


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    Quote Originally Posted by CyYoung31 View Post
    My idea was that it was a test to see who he was worthy of training to be a Sith. Rey succeeded, Kylo failed. Rey turns dark, Kylo turns good.
    Then why would Snoke save Kylo Ren to bring him back and "complete his training"
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    Quote Originally Posted by CyYoung31 View Post
    Actually, it would make perfect sense.

    In fact, the original ending to ROTJ was Luke walking off into the forest ominously. The whole of Empire and even parts of ROTJ lead up to his turn. Unfortunately, Lucas pulled it because he was more concerned with selling toys.

    Even Hamill himself said that he saw Luke's turn to the dark side as the next logical step for the third trilogy. He even pitched it to JJ Abrams, no less.
    there's a difference between turning to the darkside and being Snoke.
    Stockholm, more densely populated than NYC - sturg

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    Quote Originally Posted by Forever Fredi View Post
    I think if Luke turns it's to reach to the dark side to slaughter the Knights of Ren to save Rey.
    I think Luke's goal is to prove that there's more than light and dark and balance. That the force is a being that lives in everyone and falling too hard for one or the other is not good.
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