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Thread: Outside of the box trade proposal..

  1. #1
    Playing the Waiting Game blueagleace1's Avatar
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    Outside of the box trade proposal..

    Before anyone starts saying negative things about this please understand the title of "Outside the box", so without further ado...

    Braves trade:

    1. Hector Olivera
    2. Williams Perez
    3. Rob Whalen


    Rockies trade:

    1. Jose Reyes (we may need to get some $$$ as well -OR- even better a draft pick)
    2. Dom Nunez- C
    3. Jordan Patterson- OF
    4. Sam Moll- LHP


    Why it works for the Rockies:

    The Rockies have been said to have never been too keen on Reyes even prior to his suspension (which was for a total of 51 games) and would clearly love to get out from his contract which has roughly about $40 million left including a $4 million buyout for 2018. They would also be getting two current/future rotation pieces and one in Perez that is able to step in right away with Whalen not being too far behind. It's obvious that they have a hard time getting free agents to sign there without severely overpaying and they are always seemingly on the lookout for rotational depth. We've all seen how much Olivera has struggled to find a place to play defensively and it seems like most "experts" believe in his bat but are a little concerned about where he might play. Obviously, an AL team would be an ideal fit but I think he would make a nice 1B in Colorado where his offensive numbers should only improve and he could probably turn into an average first baseman, a position he had zero chance to play in Atlanta with Freeman.

    Why it works for the Braves:

    I understand this is somewhat a different way to think but I figured I'd put it out there anyway. Now I also know that most people are going to say "Why would you replace one felon with another" and I get it, I truly do but I think the problem would be if we just acquired him straight up so to speak. I guess in my opinion the PR hit we've already taken in reference to Olivera is a bad as it gets for that particular type of crime. Now onto the pieces we'd receive... Obviously, Reyes would be an upgrade over Aybar and gives us a potential leadoff or #2 hitter and would also allow us to be even more cautious with Ozzie and Swanson. Reyes could also become a viable trade asset if both Albies and Dansby are both deemed ready prior to the start of next season and I think his value would be higher than it currently is as it pertains to the suspension since I feel we (the Braves) would have taken the PR hit and most people/clubs would look past that after one trade already. Dom Nunez would instantly become our catcher of the future and a pretty good one at that and if nothing else gives us some depth at a position we currently lack. Jordan Patterson would most likely be our best OF prospect and one profiles really well in RF and should be ready really soon (possibly as early as this year or next). Finally, Moll (LHP who is 93-96 with above average slider and change) is a guy that would give us a quality LH reliever that can slot into the back of our bullpen that lacks depth in that department.


    Again, this is an off the wall idea I had and I understand most will probably laugh or call me an idiot but hey it's just an idea on how to make us better now and in the future while giving up pieces that don't really have a place on our team in the next couple seasons.


    Let me know what you think... I'm also working on a piece about Touki that I hope to finish next week (I'm re-watching all his starts that are available and breaking them down. I am a high school pitching coach in SC)


    Thanks guys/gals!!
    "Don't tell me the sky's the limit when there are footprints on the moon"

  2. #2
    Mr. Free Trade
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    What about a Teheran, Inciarte, Whelan trade for Dahl, McMahon, Reyes, Nunez and Colorado's competitive balance pick.

    Why it works for the Rockies:

    They get a SP who is a decent #2, great #3 who's signed to a good contract and has no significant history of injury. He's likely the most valuable starter available right now or during the upcoming FA season now that Stras has signed his extension. They get an outfielder, in Inciarte, who can play all three OF positions and would be a huge get for their park. They move $37M in money owed to Reyes. They also get another decent SP prospect. They give up a minor league 3B who's blocked by an All-Star in McMahon, a minor league CF in Dahl (who is replaced by Inciarte), a ml catcher who is blocked at the ML level and has a ml competitor in Tom Murphy who is closer to the bigs, and their competitive balance pick.

    Why it works for the Braves:

    They get potential power upgrades and long term fixes for three current holes at 3B, CF, C. They get the competitive balance pick they have been looking for. They get a useful SS who may reclaim previous value, but will at least allow the Braves to keep the Albies/Swanson duo in the minors. The Braves could also conceivably pay part of Reyes comp in a separate trade of Reyes to another Team like the Chisox

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    I'm not sure I see the value from the Rockies' side in the first deal. Olivera does not have the bat to play 1B. And Perez and Whalen have close to 0 value. I just don't see what they're getting in the trade, outside of some savings. They're not giving up any big-time prospects, but I'm not sure what the incentive is for them to do it.

    The second deal would be intriguing, but I'm still not sure they pull the trigger. Whalen, again, has basically 0 value. He's not a 'decent SP prospect'. Teheran and Inciarte is a good return, but I'm not sure it's enough to give up Dahl, McMahon, Nunez, and the pick. That's a huge haul.

  4. #4
    Playing the Waiting Game blueagleace1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by smootness View Post
    I'm not sure I see the value from the Rockies' side in the first deal. Olivera does not have the bat to play 1B. And Perez and Whalen have close to 0 value. I just don't see what they're getting in the trade, outside of some savings. They're not giving up any big-time prospects, but I'm not sure what the incentive is for them to do it.

    The second deal would be intriguing, but I'm still not sure they pull the trigger. Whalen, again, has basically 0 value. He's not a 'decent SP prospect'. Teheran and Inciarte is a good return, but I'm not sure it's enough to give up Dahl, McMahon, Nunez, and the pick. That's a huge haul.
    I don't see why Olivera couldn't put up a line close to .280/.330/.480 in Coors field 81 times and that would be gracious plenty on top of their already annual potent offense. They also need rotation pieces ready to step in right away. AGAIN, it was just an idea.
    "Don't tell me the sky's the limit when there are footprints on the moon"

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    I think Reyes' trade value is still too high for this kind of move for Colorado. I think they will get at least something of actual value in return for Reyes.

    ETA: This is before even considering prospects, a draft pick or money coming our way. I don't think they'd give away Reyes alone for the group we'd be offering.

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    Quote Originally Posted by blueagleace1 View Post
    I don't see why Olivera couldn't put up a line close to .280/.330/.480 in Coors field 81 times and that would be gracious plenty on top of their already annual potent offense. They also need rotation pieces ready to step in right away. AGAIN, it was just an idea.
    I would be pretty shocked at this point if Olivera put up an OPS over .800 in the majors. And if we're using inflated Coors stats as a reason for the Rockies to acquire him, would that not also be true of every single player they might target? They're not going to value a guy higher due to his numbers being higher at Coors because that's true of everyone.

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    I proposed a simpler version on the around baseball thread

    What I read us that the Rockies want him gone. They have story and another top ss close. It's a lot of money and he's an abuser.

    I don't think they'd take Olivera back bc of abuse

    Maybe we could get Reyes plus McMahon (bc he's blocked) and one of their catchers for folty and Jenkins. People keep saying the Rockies love velocity and folty has velocity

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    Quote Originally Posted by mqt View Post
    I think Reyes' trade value is still too high for this kind of move for Colorado. I think they will get at least something of actual value in return for Reyes.

    ETA: This is before even considering prospects, a draft pick or money coming our way. I don't think they'd give away Reyes alone for the group we'd be offering.

    I don't think he has much value. He's OPS'd about .700 for the past two years, his defensive value is now about 0 at best, and he's owed the remainder of $22 million this year along with another $22 million next year.

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    "What is a clvclv"
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    Why in the world would Colorado want an OF (Inciarte) who's already in the big leagues? They have CarGo (under control through next season), Blackmon (under control through 2018), and Parra (under control through 2019) - with Dahl and Tapia on pace to be ready no later than 2018, what possible value does Ender hold for them as a 4th OF? Plus, you're putting Olivera in the way as well (unless you're assuming they'll release him as soon as the trade is finalized).
    Has there EVER been a statement and question a certain someone should absolutely never have made and asked publicly more than...

    Kinda pathetic to see yourself as a message board knight in shining armor. How impotent does someone have to be in real life to resort to playing hero on a message board?

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    Quote Originally Posted by smootness View Post
    I don't think he has much value. He's OPS'd about .700 for the past two years, his defensive value is now about 0 at best, and he's owed the remainder of $22 million this year along with another $22 million next year.
    To be clear, I don't think he has much value. I just think it's still a touch higher than 'bag of baseballs with a different Domestic Violence suspension thrown in' level.

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    Quote Originally Posted by clvclv View Post
    Why in the world would Colorado want an OF (Inciarte) who's already in the big leagues? They have CarGo (under control through next season), Blackmon (under control through 2018), and Parra (under control through 2019) - with Dahl and Tapia on pace to be ready no later than 2018, what possible value does Ender hold for them as a 4th OF? Plus, you're putting Olivera in the way as well (unless you're assuming they'll release him as soon as the trade is finalized).
    That's why u should like my trade

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    Quote Originally Posted by clvclv View Post
    Why in the world would Colorado want an OF (Inciarte) who's already in the big leagues? They have CarGo (under control through next season), Blackmon (under control through 2018), and Parra (under control through 2019) - with Dahl and Tapia on pace to be ready no later than 2018, what possible value does Ender hold for them as a 4th OF? Plus, you're putting Olivera in the way as well (unless you're assuming they'll release him as soon as the trade is finalized).
    Not that bad actually. You add a guy with a bunch of value in Inciarte, which gives you the flexibility to trade Parra Blackmon and Cargo if needed and return a ton of prospects or near ready prospects. So its not a full rebuild but retooling
    Get off my lawn!

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    I figure Dahl is close to untouchable. He's good and close. It would allow them to flip cargo for a haul and save a bunch of money.

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    Director of Minor League Reports rico43's Avatar
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    My outside the box trade is to send Olivera back to Cuba for an unnamed incarcerated former player to be named later. Preferably someone named Tomas Jose.

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    On BBA's Top 100 Prospects List PurpleBrave's Avatar
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    I think we end up shipping Grilli or Vizcaino to Texas. It'd be nice to get Profar somehow...Texas has a deep system and is in dire need of bullpen help

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    It's OVER 5,000! UNCBlue012's Avatar
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    I really really don't want to get rid of Viz.

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    Braves probably prefer Yunel back to Reyes. Reyes not a Braves clubhouse kind of guy. Is he? Plus he can't even get on the field. Suspended. Always appears injured. Pass.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PurpleBrave View Post
    I think we end up shipping Grilli or Vizcaino to Texas. It'd be nice to get Profar somehow...Texas has a deep system and is in dire need of bullpen help
    I know talent is talent, but with our relative strength up the middle Profar is not the guy I'd be giving up our assets to acquire.

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    A Chip Off the Old Rock Julio3000's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rico43 View Post
    Preferably someone named Tomas Jose.

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