Black on Black violence - Where is the uproar?

[AerchAngel]

Being preaching this for 13 years on this board about this, still nothing resolved but gotten worse. And gun laws will not have prevented this.

As some of you on Facebook saw my grandma's picture, I went to the funeral this last weekend. I love Chicago, great food, the atmosphere, but what I don't like is every night hearing gunshots and then the ambulances/police each night. We even got shot at. It sound like a firecracker to a M80 on the scale and it was rapid. The police think it was scaring gun fire as a warning shots, no holes but shells. Seeing my cousin run towards us the others who live in the city told me to go inside and take the kids to safety. I ask them if this is normal and why doesn't the police come around. Only reply I got is when there is only shooting, they don't patrol. I am thinking wow and excited at the same time to see how people react to something like that.

Well the article hit on what happened to my cousin. She got into a fight over a guy, well she didn't start it or finished it as they were targeting her. She already lost her sister, the one I mentioned on here months ago and she too was in a relationship with a guy and now he is in jail and probably will receive life in prison.

I had to ask my cousins about this after the 3rd night, does anyone say anything to address this issue. All I got was laughs and the answer they gave me was...we are on our own in this. So knowing me, I ask about Obama, Jackson, Sharpton and I got hard stares. Struck a nerve but they were nice in their response. They were hoping someone in black leadership would do something but since nothing has been done since Dr. King and Mr. Farrahkhan is someone they do not trust we have a severe void in leadership.

So, I was right in my assessment, we will continue to have problems and no one is going to address them. They rather (Obama and others) keep us ignorant and to turn on each other and not address the problem because as long as there is a problem, they are relevant.

If you read the issues we have in Illinois, it is a carbon copy of what is happening to blacks. As long as there are problems with the Democrat controlled state, they want a Rep Governor so they can blame everything on him/them and do not fix the issue. The citizens of Chicago are fed up with them but I just why keep voting for the same thing.

It is what it is regardless of the situation.

Sad when you vote the same way regardless if they can or can't help you. Victims of the 1964 passage passed down generation to generation. We gained on some things but it bred/replaced a lot of bad things along with it.

Listening to the pastor talk about my grandmother brought tears to my eyes seeing how blacks back in the 40's and 50's were strong families, 10 to 15 kids apiece but somehow in the 70's they lost their way and subsequent generation getting worse. He preached about single parenting and dads not being around. Some of my cousins have kids out of wedlock but thankfully their grandmorther or my mom would take the kids in or help with their kids. Some of the black race is not as fortunate and that is who needs to be targeted.

What can be done to solve this? Well throwing gas on the fire and enabling this is not going to help. The Republicans can and the black Conservatives (Christians/Baptist and Methodists) can do a lot by promising something to keep families together but I don't think the Democrats in power will allow it just like the stonewalling they are doing in Chicago and the state of Illinois now.

[Krgrecw]

AA, you can't 'fix' it. You'll never get people to give their guns up, get a job or be a good husband/father. A decent percent of whites in Appalachia are the same way only they are stuck on meth instead of the 'thug' culture.

[Oklahomahawk]

AA, you can't 'fix' it. You'll never get people to give their guns up, get a job or be a good husband/father. A decent percent of whites in Appalachia are the same way only they are stuck on meth instead of the 'thug' culture.

It's a hell of a lot more than a "decent percent" of whites and in a lot more places than Appalachia, though I can vouch for your overall description. My daughter worked for the DHS in SE Oklahoma for a little over a year and she told me stories that you guys would not believe and I know many of y'all are as cynical as I am. People in general have gotten "pretty damn effing sorry" in very significant numbers and it crosses all racial, ethnic, geographic, political, and socioeconomic lines. In fact I'm to a point where I am surprised when I see someone go out of their way to be the kind of person I used to believe most people are.

The man upstairs still shows me though sometimes, just to shock me I guess. About a month ago the wife and I had a blowout just after we got off the Interstate over in AR coming home. I pulled over and got out and looked at it and started trying to figure out where the jack, etc., was since this is a new vehicle (to us anyway) and the tires were still in excellent shape (other than these new gaping holes in this one). Well before I had even found everything two people stopped, coming from each direction and offered to help. Both were about as "hick" as you can get but both seemed sincerely nice and caring. It still didn't make me appreciate having to drive almost 3 1/2 hours on a donut but it did make me appreciate that there are still good people out there and let's face it, you aren't going to find them when everything is rosy, you're only going to find them when you've just had "that blowout" in life. I just hope all of us always have one or two of them waiting in the wings somewhere, so to speak.

[bravos4evr]

my instinct is to ask where you keep your ten foot pole on this subject, BUT. Interesting facts about post civil rights act: the % of black owned business declined, violent crime increased, % of single parent homes increased and % of incarcerated blacks increased. It's odd, but it seems like the law, while laden with good intentions, had a detrimental impact in the black community.

IMO, the constitution protects terrible people to and as such I think private business owners who do not do govt contracts should be able to hire and serve anyone they want. Of course they would have to face the consequences of their choices (protests, bad reputation leading to closure...etc) but I think that private business should be private.

Govt on the other hand, govt should never be allowed to discriminate against any citizen for any reason that is related to race, religion or wtvr.


EDITED TO ADD: now, one could argue that the act isn't to blame as much as the advent of entitlements that made poor blacks basically dependent on the govt. However, black culture kinda turned it's back on their own locally owned businesses which closed in record numbers between 1964 and the mid 70's which didn't help their independence and led to more crime, more govt reliance and thus more poverty.

[AerchAngel]

http://thefederalist.com/2016/06/06/...e-automobiles/

Interesting when Chicago was brought up......I was part of that survey of getting shot at and I was minding my own business..... my cousin, not so much, she started it by beating some ho down and they brought back reinforcements with weapons.

[57Brave]

"As some of you on Facebook saw my grandma's picture, I went to the funeral this last weekend. I love Chicago, great food, the atmosphere, but what I don't like is every night hearing gunshots and then the ambulances/police each night. We even got shot at. It sound like a firecracker to a M80 on the scale and it was rapid. The police think it was scaring gun fire as a warning shots, no holes but shells. Seeing my cousin run towards us the others who live in the city told me to go inside and take the kids to safety. I ask them if this is normal and why doesn't the police come around. Only reply I got is when there is only shooting, they don't patrol. I am thinking wow and excited at the same time to see how people react to something like that."

Sorry bout your Grandmother

Suppose we regulated the weapons manufacturers and drastically limited the availability or not only the guns but the bullets.
It might take a generation ...

The common denominator in all of these stories is "shooting "
Why not try getting the guns out of our society. Tried everything else - used every other excuse -- yet keep hearing the same old story.
Plain as the nose on your face

[Krgrecw]

I'm in downtown Chicago right now and nobody has yet tried to shoot me.

oh and 57 is a moron

Wrong Color.

[AerchAngel]

Wrong Color.

Krg gets it.

[Krgrecw]

AA, there are simple ways that gun violence can be drastically reduced in Inner city Chicago. I can get it done in a month.

[AerchAngel]

AA, there are simple ways that gun violence can be drastically reduced in Inner city Chicago. I can get it done in a month.

1. Money for guns? THey will take your money, give you their guns, wait a week and then buy them again from a cartel Mexican or other.
2. Take an army in there with tanks? They are like cockroaches man, shoot one, three more will come.
3. Police....BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA, I think I saw one cop car the weekend I was there patrolling, actually he was protecting a block party, which is kind of cool.

One big thing I'd noticed, more speed bumps, because the streets that don't have them, they are doing 60 easily with children around.

The food, OMG, it is so awesome. If I lived in Chicago I would easily weigh in the 300's, instead of the 230 now.

I ate a lot of Popeyes, lot of Gyros, light of Italian beef and RIBS RIBS and more RIBS. White Castle SUCKED.

[Oklahomahawk]

AA, there are simple ways that gun violence can be drastically reduced in Inner city Chicago. I can get it done in a month.

Why am I sensing a "Hiroshima Solution" in the near future?

[Krgrecw]

Why am I sensing a "Hiroshima Solution" in the near future?

Nah. I'd just call up the guard and have them frisk everyone in the troubled areas. Put up checkpoints and have everyone searched.

[cajunrevenge]

The root cause of this is is the over criminilization of people. Its not a war on drugs its a war on people. All this disproportionally affects the poor and more specifically poor black people. What we need are cops who are there to actually serve and protect and not just looking for any reason they can victimize someone for breaking a victimless crime. I hear Chicago doesnt have enough money to fund their schools but they got enough money to lock someone up for smoking a joint. Prison is a mental illness factory and while someone people need to be there we are creating a mental health epidemic by putting innocent people in prison. Due to the high amount of drug cases there i a severe shortage of public defenders who almost always try to steer you to taking a plea deal. We have corrupt judges who will throw you in jail for challenging their power by informing people to their right to jury nullification. We as a society almost instantly judge a person guilty before they get a trial isnt helping either.

[bravos4evr]

THey will take your money, give you their guns, wait a week and then buy them again from the police they sold them to

bolding mine

[bravos4evr]

The root cause of this is is the over criminilization of people. Its not a war on drugs its a war on people. All this disproportionally affects the poor and more specifically poor black people. What we need are cops who are there to actually serve and protect and not just looking for any reason they can victimize someone for breaking a victimless crime. I hear Chicago doesnt have enough money to fund their schools but they got enough money to lock someone up for smoking a joint. Prison is a mental illness factory and while someone people need to be there we are creating a mental health epidemic by putting innocent people in prison. Due to the high amount of drug cases there i a severe shortage of public defenders who almost always try to steer you to taking a plea deal. We have corrupt judges who will throw you in jail for challenging their power by informing people to their right to jury nullification. We as a society almost instantly judge a person guilty before they get a trial isnt helping either.

that's why one of my biggest solutions to the gun violence issue is the decriminalization of drugs. take the street money out of the issue. Prohibition should have taught us a lesson, but apparently it didn't.

the second is INCREASE punishment for committing crimes with guns, and DECREASE penalties for committing crimes without guns, actually execute people on death row (in the public square) and use the taxation of now legal drugs to fund treatment centers, mental health facilities and other things.

Oh, and make parents accountable for the actions of their children.

[bravos4evr]

to expand on my last point, I mean within reason. if the parents are involved, have a history of parent/teacher contact, have attempted to solve the problems, then no, don't throw the in jail because their kid commits a crime. But those parents who could give a ****? don't provide a good environment, don't care if their kids are criminals or going to school? take their kids away and lock them up.

people need to learn that choices have consequences and that we are responsible for our actions, and the actions of our kids.

[cajunrevenge]

that's why one of my biggest solutions to the gun violence issue is the decriminalization of drugs. take the street money out of the issue. Prohibition should have taught us a lesson, but apparently it didn't.

the second is INCREASE punishment for committing crimes with guns, and DECREASE penalties for committing crimes without guns, actually execute people on death row (in the public square) and use the taxation of now legal drugs to fund treatment centers, mental health facilities and other things.

Oh, and make parents accountable for the actions of their children.

- I dont know what the gun laws are now but I think the sentences are pretty stiff already. If 10 years isnt going to scare someone then 20 years isnt going to either. What I would do is put a heavy presence of cops in those bad areas whose sole purpose is to prevent and respond to violent crimes. Make sure those in the community know what they are there for although I wont blame them for being skeptical. As it is now drug deals have to carry guns because they cant exactly depend on police protection if someone tries to harm them.

- Just the money we save on prisons would cover a majority of the cost of rehab. For some reason people get all upset when you say you want to spend 30k a year to rehab a drug addict but have no problem spending 30k a year to imprison them.


- I am not really in favor of the death penalty until our justice system improves. Lately theres been a lot of scandals at crime labs for falsifying lab results to help the prosecution and thats should scare the **** out of everyone.


- You are exactly right about prohibition. The war on drugs only serves to protect law enforcement jobs and the cartels.

- I agree with you in spirit about the parents but I dont see that helping the situation. Its just taking a bad situation and making it worse. Even the worst parents are usually better than foster parents and I dont trust police, prosecutors, and CPS to apply this as intended. These are all underlying issues of the same problem. People are generally the result of their environment when growing up. If police werent so focused on victimzing the poor those communities wouldnt be hell holes that lead to people who are so trashy they dont care what their kids do. There will always be ****ty people but we can minimize it.

[57Brave]

- I dont know what the gun laws are now but I think the sentences are pretty stiff already. If 10 years isnt going to scare someone then 20 years isnt going to either. What I would do is put a heavy presence of cops in those bad areas whose sole purpose is to prevent and respond to violent crimes. Make sure those in the community know what they are there for although I wont blame them for being skeptical. As it is now drug deals have to carry guns because they cant exactly depend on police protection if someone tries to harm them.

- Just the money we save on prisons would cover a majority of the cost of rehab. For some reason people get all upset when you say you want to spend 30k a year to rehab a drug addict but have no problem spending 30k a year to imprison them.


- I am not really in favor of the death penalty until our justice system improves. Lately theres been a lot of scandals at crime labs for falsifying lab results to help the prosecution and thats should scare the **** out of everyone.


- You are exactly right about prohibition. The war on drugs only serves to protect law enforcement jobs and the cartels.

- I agree with you in spirit about the parents but I dont see that helping the situation. Its just taking a bad situation and making it worse. Even the worst parents are usually better than foster parents and I dont trust police, prosecutors, and CPS to apply this as intended. These are all underlying issues of the same problem. People are generally the result of their environment when growing up. If police werent so focused on victimzing the poor those communities wouldnt be hell holes that lead to people who are so trashy they dont care what their kids do. There will always be ****ty people but we can minimize it.

I agree with everything you've said but let me add.

The weapons themselves. Regulating the manufacturing and distribution of not only the guns but the projectiles.
Buy back programs --

The government is not and will not have mass confiscations
Until we get past that point of hysteria this issue will never move forward

Another method is finding political candidates that propose solutions rather than drum up confusion with sloganeering
If you disagree with HRC's gun proposals, who has a better one?

End of the day what is being done is not working for anyone
except those making money off of the present system

[Krgrecw]

[QUOTE=cajunrevenge;313824]The root cause of this is is the over criminilization of people. Its not a war on drugs its a war on people. All this disproportionally affects the poor and more specifically poor black people. What we need are cops who are there to actually serve and protect and not just looking for any reason they can victimize someone for breaking a victimless crime. I hear Chicago doesnt have enough money to fund their schools but they got enough money to lock someone up for smoking a joint. Prison is a mental illness factory and while someone people need to be there we are creating a mental health epidemic by putting innocent people in prison. Due to the high amount of drug cases there i a severe shortage of public defenders who almost always try to steer you to taking a plea deal. We have corrupt judges who will throw you in jail for challenging their power by informing people to their right to jury nullification. We as a society almost instantly judge a person guilty before they get a trial isnt helping either.[/QUOTE



Drugs are a victimless crime? So people don't kill each other for drugs? People don't overdose from drugs? People don't become addicted to drugs and then commit crimes to feed their drug addiction?


Nice to know.



Here's an idea. Don't commit a crime

[cajunrevenge]

Drugs are a victimless crime? So people don't kill each other for drugs? People don't overdose from drugs? People don't become addicted to drugs and then commit crimes to feed their drug addiction?


Nice to know.



Here's an idea. Don't commit a crime

- I am smoking a blunt right now. Explain to me where the victim in this "crime" is.

- People kill each other for money. The violence is a result of prohibition of drugs just as it was for alcohol. You have people killing each other for money that can be made off selling drugs. This is a market that exists directly because of prohibition of drugs. Drug dealers cant call the cops when they get robbed. Its both the reason why people rob drug dealers and the reason drug dealers carry guns and will kill people trying to rob them. If the police were focused on providing a safe environment instead of trying to charge as many people with as many crimes as they can we wouldnt have this problem. As for people hopped up drugs committing violent crimes that will always happen just like there will always be idiots who get drunk and commit violent crimes. A lot of those people hopped up on drugs committing violent crimes are just a product of the system. Do a little drugs as a teen and get caught. Get started in the system and end up with a 10 year sentence on a third strike for a gram of weed. Come out loopy as **** and no one will hire you. Family dont give two ****s anymore. End up homeless and with no life prospects why not turn back to drugs. Then with nothing to lose you turn to the harder stuff because its a slight reprieve from the nightmare that is your life.

- I am not going to say drugs are a good choice to make but freedom isnt just about making government approved good choices. Countries have placed a death penalty on drug use and even that doesnt work. At the least we need to stop compounding the problem of drug abuse. We should be ruining peoples lives because they get caught with an ounce of weed at 19. In most cases we are making that person a criminal when they are otherwise law abiding citizens.