The Trump Presidency

[Hawk]

I don't like what Trump did here. He basically used the power of the federal government to compel Carrier to keep jobs in the US.

How?

[weso1]

How?

United Technologies, Carrier's parent company, gets about 10% of its revenue from the federal government, according to the WSJ. I find it hard to believe he didn't play this card. Also, the threat of tariff to Carrier was significant.

[Hawk]

First off, you are mixing "compell" which means to force with "compelling" which means to illicit interest. But that's not the big problem with your answer.

It depends on how one views their place in the cosmos. Henry Ford (screwball anti-Semite though he was) turned the business world on its head at Ford plants throughout the country when he paid much higher wages than the competition. I paraphrase, but when Ford was asked why he paid what he paid, his response was basically "I want my workers to be able to afford what they build."

Now granted, that was almost a century ago and the world of consumer products has changed dramatically, but there's no question that Carrier would survive if it remained in the United States even without subsidies. Maybe some folks in the upper reaches don't do as well and investors don't do as well either (which is the biggest problem we face in our economy), but paying workers a decent wage and keeping the doors open shouldn't be the arduous task many make it out to be.

Sorry I didn't see this earlier for some reason.

I'm not mixing my definitions. I defined 'compel' in my original post with respect to businesses being forced to act out of their own self-interest (or the interest of their share/stake-holders) to compete and grow.

In my subsequent post I used 'compelling' to describe the obvious incentives behind outsourcing labor.

Yeah, Carrier would survive. But when you run a company in a capitalist country your goal isn't survival. It's to make as much money as possible.

Ford raised wages because he was losing money on skilled worker turnover. He also built Fordlandia to save a buck. He was a brilliant businessman, but not a patron saint.

[goldfly]

He'll probably be better than Obama. Of course that's not saying much.

congrats on saying something really stupid

[Hawk]

United Technologies, Carrier's parent company, gets about 10% of its revenue from the federal government, according to the WSJ. I find it hard to believe he didn't play this card. Also, the threat of tariff to Carrier was significant.

I mean that's plausible but it's also a little far-flung. If he truly had them over a barrel don't you think he would have just demanded Carrier keep all of its jobs in the US?

[sturg33]

Don't like Trump meddling with the market... he doesn't seem to understand basic economics.

And what's to stop more companies threatening to leave in order to get a better tax deal?

Just make policy that is business friendly and the rest will take care of itself.

[Oklahomahawk]

Yeah, Carrier would survive. But when you run a company in a capitalist country your goal isn't survival. It's to make as much money as possible.

I apologize for butting in and I promise to be brief, but this is without a doubt where I have the biggest problems with conservatives and free market types. Sure people in business are in it to make a profit but when there is not limit to what they will do to make a profit and there's limit to their greed and willingness to give into it then there's my problem and for anyone who's looking for the #1 reason why this country has already started down the slippery slope to hell you need look no further.

Again, my apologies. We now take you back to your regular programming. :)

[Garmel]

congrats on saying something really stupid

I wouldn't say something stupid. That's yours and 57's job.

[Hawk]

I apologize for butting in and I promise to be brief, but this is without a doubt where I have the biggest problems with conservatives and free market types. Sure people in business are in it to make a profit but when there is not limit to what they will do to make a profit and there's limit to their greed and willingness to give into it then there's my problem and for anyone who's looking for the #1 reason why this country has already started down the slippery slope to hell you need look no further.

Again, my apologies. We now take you back to your regular programming. :)

[weso1]

I mean that's plausible but it's also a little far-flung. If he truly had them over a barrel don't you think he would have just demanded Carrier keep all of its jobs in the US?

Why would Carrier care at all if Trump didn't have leverage?

I'm not convinced Trump knew about the other jobs and I don't think his team, who probably knew, cared about the other jobs. Trump's team pushed the propaganda.

[sturg33]

I apologize for butting in and I promise to be brief, but this is without a doubt where I have the biggest problems with conservatives and free market types. Sure people in business are in it to make a profit but when there is not limit to what they will do to make a profit and there's limit to their greed and willingness to give into it then there's my problem and for anyone who's looking for the #1 reason why this country has already started down the slippery slope to hell you need look no further.

Again, my apologies. We now take you back to your regular programming. :)

It is much better for the middle class employees and investors of that company if they are making as much money as possible.

I can't grasp why this is such a challenging concept for so many

[goldfly]

I wouldn't say something stupid. That's yours and 57's job.

nice, the "i'm rubber, you're glue" retort

good job garmel

[Garmel]

nice, the "i'm rubber, you're glue" retort

good job garmel

Thanks, goldfly. I'm looking forward to the next 4-8 years of your childish, looney meltdowns while Trump is in office. It'll definitely be entertaining.

[goldfly]

overall, it isn't though

[goldfly]

Thanks, goldfly. I'm looking forward to the next 4-8 years of your childish, looney meltdowns while Trump is in office. It'll definitely be entertaining.

oh garmel, come on

you honestly can't be rooting for this loser fascist to be around for 8 years

even your i'm rubber you're glue dumbass can't believe he can be good for the overall good

[goldfly]

But at this point I'm willing to give Trump the benefit of the doubt

why though?

i honestly don't get it

what he has said and then surrounded himself around with obviously shows he has no desire to actually do any good or "drain the swamp"

[goldfly]

I'm buckled in and enjoying the ride to hell. It's enjoyable watching the regressive left show every bit of its collective ass while at the same time Trump destroys conservatism.

uh, ok

a weird take but will take that you know he is awful at least and it hasn't even begun

[Garmel]

oh garmel, come on

you honestly can't be rooting for this loser fascist to be around for 8 years

even your i'm rubber you're glue dumbass can't believe he can be good for the overall good

I'm not sure yet but like Hawk said I plan on giving him the benefit of the doubt. However, calling him a "loser fascist" makes me realize your opinions can't be taken seriously.

[goldfly]

I'm not sure yet but like Hawk said I plan on giving him the benefit of the doubt. However, calling him a "loser fascist" makes me realize your opinions can't be taken seriously.

oh poor garmel

we will find you a save space while the others talk

[chop2chip]

why though?

i honestly don't get it

what he has said and then surrounded himself around with obviously shows he has no desire to actually do any good or "drain the swamp"

He's definitely off to a horrible start (well, preparing to start).

Though, should note that his mistakes are generally poor optics, not necessarily significant. This is what I expect the next four years to be. Bad imaging with no accomplishment one way or another.