We knowOriginally Posted by 57Brave
When they don't get their way... they get play-dough, cry-ins, and pitchforks
We know
When they don't get their way... they get play-dough, cry-ins, and pitchforks
His systematic threats to the freedom of the press. His repeated accusations to undermine freedom to assemble. His continued attack on the legitimacy of the electoral process. His unrelenting prejudice against Islam and its effects on Muslim Americans. I will give him credit that he hasn't tried rolling back the rights of LGBT citizens in these first couple weeks.
I don't think that at all.
I just think the Russian conspiratorial angle is exhausted.
So what you are basically saying is he hasn't.
You stated: "The trump administration has not once tried to restrict free speech or any freedom for American citizens." You asked me to name one example of him trying to restrict those freedoms. I gave you a generous heaping of examples for you to pick from. He is very much TRYING to restrict freedoms left and right (no pun intended).
He has rightfully criticized the lack of journalism in the press.
He has rightfully criticized the violent tactics of the left during protest.
He has rightfully criticized the electoral process with potential illegals voting.
He has rightfully criticized Islam for the barbaric religion that it is. It's astonishing to me that a gay man would ever even consider for a minute to defend Islam.
Yes and no. The election is over.
But something happened and now it's part of history, which is not going away. Trump's weird affinity for Putin only makes it conspiracy seem more real.
I more or less agree with the first half of your post, but fail to see how smart diplomacy has suddenly morphed into "a weird affinity".
We need Russia right now - our FP agenda in Europe and the Middle East literally hinges on a solid relationship with Putin - so I don't see the harm in refraining from pissing on his shoes for a few months.
Reminds me of an episode from The West Wing when the President of Indonesia visits and the White House staff insists on publicly roasting him with a few choice remarks against his country's human rights record (because it's 'our job' to tell the world how to act) in the President's speech at a state dinner. A few minutes later, one of the Indonesian deputies is approached behind the scenes and asked for a policy favor. He tells them to go hell.
Last edited by Hawk; 02-05-2017 at 10:07 PM.
Trump lies on a daily basis. He should be criticized 24/7 until he starts behaving like an adult.
He is damaging America's image around the world which will affect the economy. He should be criticized for it 24/7 until he's either gone or starts acting like a president with the country's best interests in mind.
Trump encouraged violence from the stump. He should probably be in jail or at least in court for it. He bears some blame in the spike in violence against minorities in his name.
Violent tactics of the left? Come on. A little pushing and shoving is nothing.
Tactics??? What about Trump's tactic to lie so much and so often about everything that the media cannot focus on anything that matters?
The electoral process highly favors the GOP with their long time campaign to deny and suppress the black vote. Everybody knows this. Especially Trump and the GOP brain trust. It's been going on for decades. They've perfected it and turned voter suppression of African Americans into an artform. All Republican operatives at every level know and accept this. All intelligent Rep voters know this. When a GOP supporter or Fox News watcher talks brings up illegal voting on the left, they just smile and think "People are so gullible."
Last edited by Runnin; 02-05-2017 at 10:43 PM.
Isn't Obama also on record somewhere of saying that America needed "a reboot" of its relationship with Russia?
He's gone well beyond just "criticizing" those institutions and people, Thethe. When his first instinct is to accuse demonstrators of being professionals and paid rather than acknowledging their right to gather and protest, that is crossing a dangerous line. When he pulls in the press to berate and humiliate them and restrict their access on Day 1, that is a deliberate attempt to control the media. When he first claims that the election is rigged in anticipation of losing, and then after winning still claims that there are millions of illegal voters without any proof, there is no other way to describe that other than he has been aiming to delegitimize the entire democratic process. Has he once differentiated between the great majority who peacefully worship Islam and the fringe element of extremists? And as a gay man, yes, I'm no fan of Islam. But I'm also no fan of Christianity. Still, I recognize the right for people to worship those religions. But when those religions try to impose those beliefs on others, that's when I get fighting mad.
Last edited by DaneHill; 02-05-2017 at 10:14 PM.
Um, is this a feature or a bug?
The Chosen One (02-06-2017)
Yeah -- and then he sent Hillary to give Lavrov a Staples Easy Button emblazoned with the word 'reset' incorrectly translated into Russian (it said 'overload' instead). True story.
Runnin (02-06-2017)
I hope you didn't assume that I equated anything Trump has done or said thus far as "smart diplomacy". Perhaps an argument can be made that when you enter a negotiation from a position of power, you can get away with most anything and it won't hurt you to lower the bar of decency of ethics as far as you can get away with. But I wouldn't make that argument and would fear that in the long term you would create a lot of enemies, as DT has done his whole career.
The "weird affinity" comment comes from the fact that one year ago Russia was "our biggest enemy" according to both DT and the GOP talking point memo. All of the sudden, last year DT switched sides. That's odd.
The Magnitsky Act and the Looming Russian Danger
This is an interesting podcast - Trumpcast - interview with Bill Browder, the investor and author of Red Notice: A True Story of High Finance, Murder, and One Man’s Fight for Justice. He and the host discuss how business in Russia operates, the threats made on Browder’s life by Vladimir Putin, and the dangers facing our country with a president who’s willing to curry favor to Russia.
It's on Slate, which of course is very left leaning. The podcasts begins with an actor reading DT's tweets in voice, but it's mostly informative about The Magnitsky Act.
Hawk (02-05-2017)
Of course not.
This time a year ago we also believed Jeb Bush was going to be the Republican nominee for President.The "weird affinity" comment comes from the fact that one year ago Russia was "our biggest enemy" according to both DT and the GOP talking point memo. All of the sudden, last year DT switched sides. That's odd.
Things change.
We should be wary of Russia, sure, but maybe there can be two winners for the time being.
Runnin (02-05-2017)
The Syrian disaster has changed the calculus for all foreign policy and strategy.
Hawk (02-05-2017)
I guess that depends on whether or not you've tried the Kool-Aid yet.
Julio3000 (02-06-2017)
You have to admit that's not on the same level as suddenly changing foreign policy on the mysterious whims of one man, lunatic or not. Deciding to cozy up to our arch Cold War enemy of the last 65 years is a big move. But yes, things do change and it's smart to align with countries that share our mutual interests.
Putin's goal is only to weaken the U.S. and strengthen Russia.
And part of me thinks the final act of this crazy drama is going to end with DT running naked and alone across Lenin Square in the middle of the night, never to be seen again.
Last edited by Runnin; 02-05-2017 at 11:30 PM.
I stopped believing Jeb was going to be the nominee towards the end of 2015.
He was getting lower and lower in the polling.
Forever Fredi
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