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    Very good joe rogan podcast yesterday

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    Quote Originally Posted by Metaphysicist View Post
    One of the interesting things I rarely hear about is, what standard do we use for asylum? Over the summer, I went and watched a random slate 11th Circuit cases on appeal; one of them was an asylum case.

    The undisputed facts, found by the immigration judge his/herself were that the guy was deliberately targeted by Al-Shabaab for being, you know, anti-Al-Shabaab. He was threatened, tortured his genitals, and then even blew up his house with a rocket or something. His daughter and sister were killed; his father was seriously wounded. Like, it wasn't a question of whether all that happened or whether the guy was lying. It was a question if that was an appropriate situation for asylum purposes.

    And the immigration judge had denied the petition. Which, I mean, that seems crazy, right? If not a guy whose home was blown up by literal world-famous Islamic terrorists, then who are we giving asylum?
    Al-Shabaab is not a government.

    It's a terrible situation no doubt but it's not asylum eligible.

    It is an indisputable fact that the majority of claims are complete bull**** and just the raw numbers should indicate to a reasonable person that there is a consolidated message being taught to migrants.

    Where is that messaging coming from? Who is funding that type of operation? And finally, why are they doing it?

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    Not Actually Brian Hunter Metaphysicist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by thethe View Post
    Al-Shabaab is not a government.

    It's a terrible situation no doubt but it's not asylum eligible.

    It is an indisputable fact that the majority of claims are complete bull**** and just the raw numbers should indicate to a reasonable person that there is a consolidated message being taught to migrants.

    Where is that messaging coming from? Who is funding that type of operation? And finally, why are they doing it?
    Your first point is just wrong. Al-Shabaab is a participant in the Somali civil war and has been, a la ISIS elsewhere, the de facto governmental entity in parts of Somalia. This was not even a point of contention in the hearing I attended. The issue was about how his claim was classified.

    Regardless, the larger point is that this guy is one of the alleged 70% failed applications you are decrying as "bull****." The claim is very real, but it is just not fitting into some technical category (and also being appealed, so who knows how it gets resolved).

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    if my thought dreams could be seen goldfly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Metaphysicist View Post
    One of the interesting things I rarely hear about is, what standard do we use for asylum? Over the summer, I went and watched a random slate 11th Circuit cases on appeal; one of them was an asylum case.

    The undisputed facts, found by the immigration judge his/herself were that the guy was deliberately targeted by Al-Shabaab for being, you know, anti-Al-Shabaab. He was threatened, tortured his genitals, and then even blew up his house with a rocket or something. His daughter and sister were killed; his father was seriously wounded. Like, it wasn't a question of whether all that happened or whether the guy was lying. It was a question if that was an appropriate situation for asylum purposes.

    And the immigration judge had denied the petition. Which, I mean, that seems crazy, right? If not a guy whose home was blown up by literal world-famous Islamic terrorists, then who are we giving asylum?
    We have lost our way as a country
    "For there is always light, if only we are brave enough to see it. If only we are brave enough to be it." Amanda Gorman

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    Quote Originally Posted by Metaphysicist View Post
    Your first point is just wrong. Al-Shabaab is a participant in the Somali civil war and has been, a la ISIS elsewhere, the de facto governmental entity in parts of Somalia. This was not even a point of contention in the hearing I attended. The issue was about how his claim was classified.

    Regardless, the larger point is that this guy is one of the alleged 70% failed applications you are decrying as "bull****." The claim is very real, but it is just not fitting into some technical category (and also being appealed, so who knows how it gets resolved).
    Maybe if they didn't come from a ****hole country they'd get asylum.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Carp View Post
    Maybe if they didn't come from a ****hole country they'd get asylum.
    Or if they weren't economic migrants coached by far left groups meaning to destroy america.

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    Quote Originally Posted by thethe View Post
    Or if they weren't economic migrants coached by far left groups meaning to destroy america.
    I'm sure that's what it is. It can't be that people actually need asylum.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Carp View Post
    I'm sure that's what it is. It can't be that people actually need asylum.
    When such a large percentage of people who claim asylum are being rejected? Come on man...put aside the political bias and see what's happening.

    These poor people are coached into thinking the dangerous trip is worth it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by thethe View Post
    When such a large percentage of people who claim asylum are being rejected? Come on man...put aside the political bias and see what's happening.

    These poor people are coached into thinking the dangerous trip is worth it.
    I mean I would say don't ever change. But I know you won't because one doesn't drink this much of the Kool Aid and isn't suffering permanent effects.
    Stockholm, more densely populated than NYC - sturg

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    Quote Originally Posted by thethe View Post
    When such a large percentage of people who claim asylum are being rejected? Come on man...put aside the political bias and see what's happening.

    These poor people are coached into thinking the dangerous trip is worth it.
    And it couldn't possibly be at the direction of the current administration....

    This has nothing to do with people cheating the system and everything to do with the ridiculous and morally bankrupt policies of the Trump Administration. It's just like the same myth that the majority of people on welfare or other federally funded programms are cheating the system and spending their money on drugs. Are there instances of this? Sure. But they are isolated and don't represent the majority of the people.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Carp View Post
    And it couldn't possibly be at the direction of the current administration....

    This has nothing to do with people cheating the system and everything to do with the ridiculous and morally bankrupt policies of the Trump Administration. It's just like the same myth that the majority of people on welfare or other federally funded programms are cheating the system and spending their money on drugs. Are there instances of this? Sure. But they are isolated and don't represent the majority of the people.
    A tremendous amount was being rejected by Obama and then the 'Caravans' started.

    I wonder...just wonder how such a large group of people could be organized and all simultaneously claim asylum.

    Hmm.....
    Natural Immunity Croc

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    Quote Originally Posted by thethe View Post
    A tremendous amount was being rejected by Obama and then the 'Caravans' started.

    I wonder...just wonder how such a large group of people could be organized and all simultaneously claim asylum.

    Hmm.....
    This simply isn't true, at least in regards to comparing them to Obama. Trump lowered the amount of admissions to historic lows.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Carp View Post
    This simply isn't true, at least in regards to comparing them to Obama. Trump lowered the amount of admissions to historic lows.
    Because it's clear to anyone these are economic migrants.

    Do you think caravans manifested without any organized infrastructure?

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    Quote Originally Posted by thethe View Post
    Because it's clear to anyone these are economic migrants.

    Do you think caravans manifested without any organized infrastructure?
    The caravans increase the total amount of people seeking asylum. That has nothing to do with amount of admissions approved, only the percentages.

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    if my thought dreams could be seen goldfly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by thethe View Post
    Or if they weren't economic migrants coached by far left groups meaning to destroy america.
    You are outright crazy


    Where can one get a job describing everything the left does of coaching people, paid protesters etc etc etc

    I do this **** for free and would rather get paid to have to be against the idiots like you and get paid to travel while doing it
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carp View Post
    The caravans increase the total amount of people seeking asylum. That has nothing to do with amount of admissions approved, only the percentages.
    It impacts everything because they are organized and instructed to request asylum even though that's not their true reason.

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    Quote Originally Posted by thethe View Post
    It impacts everything because they are organized and instructed to request asylum even though that's not their true reason.
    For one, this is more rhetoric that can't be substantiated.

    Secondly, again this only affects the total number of asylum requests. Trump's administration has reduced the cap for asylum seekers to the lowest they've ever been, which again. It's just another example of just how morally bankrupt this administration is.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Carp View Post
    For one, this is more rhetoric that can't be substantiated.

    Secondly, again this only affects the total number of asylum requests. Trump's administration has reduced the cap for asylum seekers to the lowest they've ever been, which again. It's just another example of just how morally bankrupt this administration is.
    Or how it has wisened up to the scheme.

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