Spring Opportunity: Colorado Rockies

[Horsehide Harry]

The Rocks went into the spring thinking they needed one more starter. Now that Bettis is out indefinitely, they need two. They also have a strong belief that they could be contenders (and certainly should be a more realistic contender than Atlanta). To me, that spells opportunity.

I would offer a trade of: Folty, Wisler and Flowers for OF Dahl, C Murphy, 3B Tyler Nevin, and their comp balance pick #69

Rocks get their starters and a veteran catcher who probably brings more than Murphy for 2017. Braves get a high end OF talent that they will have to wait on (cracked rib), a young catcher who's close, a long term 3B prospect and the comp balance pick.

The trade hurts Atlanta little for 2017, as they have Danks, Collmenter and Blair who could fill the hole left by Folty short term and any number of long term options. Wisler probably needs a new address at this point. And Flowers, while a veteran short term loss, isn't part of the long term plan and I would be OK with Recker or Murphy replacing him. There's a chance you would be selling low on Folty, but probably not the others.

The Rocks get another hard thrower, k guy who slots into their rotation immediately and who they control. They get a flyer on Wisler who may (or may not) be a 4 or 5 guy for them and they get a stabilizing guy at catcher. Possibly selling low on Dahl BUT they have the depth to take the chance.

Won't happen BUT if the Rocks wanted to swap out Wisler for Teheran and expand the deal to include Rodgers, something like: Teheran, Folty, Flowers for Dahl, Rodgers, Murphy, Nunez, Pint and the pick, I would do it.

[nsacpi]

I would do both versions.

[bravesfanMatt]

This is why HH is my best friend. He can do these trades that just make you go hmm.

[rico43]

You would be much closer to reality if you were to project Dickey instead of Folty. They have a short-term need and you would protect your potential young star.

The second trade would be foolhardy. A year from now you would have zero starters with big league experience.

[nsacpi]

You would be much closer to reality if you were to project Dickey instead of Folty. They have a short-term need and you would protect your potential young star.

The second trade would be foolhardy. A year from now you would have zero starters with big league experience.

Under the second version, we would have Wisler and Dickey as holdovers. Add one from Newcomb/Blair/Sims. That would leave two major league starters to be acquired via trade or signing.

Pretty much under any scenario we are going to need to acquire at least one major league starting pitcher for 2018.

The acquisition of Dahl does imply that we move one of Inciarte/Kemp/Markakis.

[Horsehide Harry]

You would be much closer to reality if you were to project Dickey instead of Folty. They have a short-term need and you would protect your potential young star.

The second trade would be foolhardy. A year from now you would have zero starters with big league experience.

Dickey can't go to Colorado. His knuckle likely doesn't work well there. They have decided apparently to focus on power arms who can strike guys out.

Trading Folty, Teheran and/or Wisler does create holes. However, at some point you have to start trusting in the pile of pitching you traded for and drafted during the rebuild.

I see Colorado as a target of opportunity.

[Freshmaker]

Love the idea HH! I'd personally like to keep one of Teheran/Folty, so would prefer your first scenario. I like Dahl tho. Trade makes a lot of sense. Just swap Fried in for Folty and voila. We can then hopefully get someone to take Neck off our hands

[atl717]

Rockies aren't trading Dahl. That's not realistic.

[nsacpi]

Dickey can't go to Colorado. His knuckle likely doesn't work well there. They have decided apparently to focus on power arms who can strike guys out.

Trading Folty, Teheran and/or Wisler does create holes. However, at some point you have to start trusting in the pile of pitching you traded for and drafted during the rebuild.

I see Colorado as a target of opportunity.

We do have this awkward gap of a year or two before the guys who pitched at Rome or lower last year arrive in the big leagues. It could be filled internally if Fried, Weigel or some of the others develop rapidly. Otherwise we will have to go outside the organization for major league pitching in 2018-19.

It is likely we will need to go outside the organization for at least one major league pitcher in 2018. Even without trading Teheran and/or Folty. But that doesn't rule out making the kinds of trade you proposed. It just has to be justified by the return. As with any other trade.

I suppose there is one subtle angle to consider. Trading away guys like Teheran/Folty could lead the front office to make the sort of risky free agent signing that is best avoided by a mid-market team.

[Braves1976]

I like both trade ideas too, but I don't think Coppy and co. will even consider something like that.

[Braves1976]

We do have this awkward gap of a year or two before the guys who pitched at Rome or lower last year arrive in the big leagues. It could be filled internally if Fried, Weigel or some of the others develop rapidly. Otherwise we will have to go outside the organization for major league pitching in 2018-19.

It is likely we will need to go outside the organization for at least one major league pitcher in 2018. Even without trading Teheran and/or Folty. But that doesn't rule out making the kinds of trade you proposed. It just has to be justified by the return. As with any other trade.

I suppose there is one subtle angle to consider. Trading away guys like Teheran/Folty could lead the front office to make the sort of risky free agent signing that is best avoided by a mid-market team.

The latter angle is only more of a danger (more than it usually would be) if Teheran and/or both are moved IMO.

[nsacpi]

The latter angle is only more of a danger (more than it usually would be) if Teheran and/or both are moved IMO.

I think the FO will try to do something splashy if the team struggles this year. Among the reasons I'm rooting for a solid season from the team this year where we stay in semi-contention to the end. I think a poor season will lead to some risk taking in an effort to accelerate the re-build.

[Braves1976]

I think the FO will try to do something splashy if the team struggles this year. Among the reasons I'm rooting for a solid season from the team this year where we stay in semi-contention to the end. I think a poor season will lead to some risk taking in an effort to accelerate the re-build.

If they'd did a better job putting together the bullpen and bench this could be a team to challenge for a wild card. But as it stands now I don't see that but more due to how the decided to go. It doesn't give me the idea they are serious about winning this year.

[nsacpi]

If they'd did a better job putting together the bullpen and bench this could be a team to challenge for a wild card. But as it stands now I don't see that but more due to how the decided to go. It doesn't give me the idea they are serious about winning this year.

They seem persuaded that the second half offensive surge from last year can be fully sustained.

[Braves1976]

They seem persuaded that the second half offensive surge from last year can be fully sustained.

That is very unlikely IMO, esp. in a WBC year which means our players in the WBC could fade faster than normal years in the second half and not finish as strong in Sept. And while that is true for other teams too, the Braves sent some key players to play in the WBC that they'll need to finish strong again (Freeman, Teheran and Inciarte). That said, I know they signed SR and he was lost via a car crash but even with him our bench wasn't good. Now without him our bench is even weaker and we have two players fighting for the final spot that even last year wouldn't be in consideration. And I don't like our bullpen overall nor our 8 man bullpen plans either.

[thewupk]

This is why HH is my best friend. He can do these trades that just make you go hmm.

He's no murph when it comes to trade ideas

[The Chosen One]

He's no murph when it comes to trade ideas

In fairness, Matt is a relative newbie here. So he never saw Murph trade ideas in his prime.

[Braves1976]

Rockies aren't trading Dahl. That's not realistic.

I agree and Folty alone might not bring more than the rest of that deal. I doubt they have much if any interest in Wisler or Flowers. Wisler in Colorodo? LOL that would be homerun derby! And even Folty is too much a fly-ball pitcher that he'd probably do bad there.

[Horsehide Harry]

I agree and Folty alone might not bring more than the rest of that deal. I doubt they have much if any interest in Wisler or Flowers. Wisler in Colorodo? LOL that would be homerun derby! And even Folty is too much a fly-ball pitcher that he'd probably do bad there.

I think you guys are underselling Folty's value. He's a decent, young, controllable, cheap starter with a big arm and a lot of potential to get better. He also fits exactly how the Rocks are currently building their rotation. As for Flowers, he's exactly what they want and need right now, a veteran catcher who can lead their young staff to pair with their catcher of the future Wolters. As far as Wisler, he has value, although reduced, now.

As for Dahl, no team ever wants to give up a good player. However, to get you have to give and while Dahl is a good prospect, from the Rocks POV he can be traded since they have a large number of OF on the team and Tapia on the way.

[Braves1976]

I think you guys are underselling Folty's value. He's a decent, young, controllable, cheap starter with a big arm and a lot of potential to get better. He also fits exactly how the Rocks are currently building their rotation. As for Flowers, he's exactly what they want and need right now, a veteran catcher who can lead their young staff to pair with their catcher of the future Wolters. As far as Wisler, he has value, although reduced, now.

As for Dahl, no team ever wants to give up a good player. However, to get you have to give and while Dahl is a good prospect, from the Rocks POV he can be traded since they have a large number of OF on the team and Tapia on the way.

Folty is too much a fly-ball pitcher and prone to the homerun ball for Colorado, that was my point and says more about the match there than his potential. There are plenty of pitchers that would do bad in Colorado, that could do fine elsewhere. As far as Flowers goes, I figure most teams value him as a back-up rather than a starter. Further, Dahl is coming off a strong rookie season and playing in Colorado he should continue to do very well. This is why I don't see him traded and if he were it would take a different package IMO.

That said, I love the trade for us if they would do it. I just wouldn't get my hopes up.