I'm sure plenty of people said the same thing about attaching BJ to Kimbrel. It sure made little sense to me...yet....it happened. They would also be getting a decent young controllable guy back in Julio AND salary relief + whatever else.Originally Posted by Heyward
I'd add Allard to the package instead of Julio. Julio has almost no value right now besides his contract.
This is sadly accurate. He has fewer at-bats, though. Let's see if Kevin can have a strong final month.
One example until the RP market became insane.
Julio + weaker prospects isnt netting Fulmer.
Of course not. I wasn't saying weaker prospects. My thoughts would be adding Julio and giving them salary relief to lesson killing the farm. As mentioned above, something like Julio, Allard and a lesser prospect plus taking Verlander.
Taking verlander isn't going to lighten the cost.
Verlander's been good lately.
He's given up 3 ER or less in his last 6 starts going 6 innings in all but one of them. Verlander still can pitch.
Indeed. He would be our best pitcher easily. Whether he is worth that contract and if they Tigers need to shed it is what's up for debate.
I could see a big trade lining up this offseason where we bring in 2 pitchers like Fulmer and Verlander. Verlander, Folty, Fulmer, Teheran, Newcomb would be a playoff quality rotation. I'd assume Allard and a few others not named Wright and Soroka would be in a trade. But we'd have a very solid rotation for several years to come.
Last edited by Hudson2; 08-06-2017 at 06:15 PM.
IMO, given the Braves current situation and the Kemp deal, his contract would be worth it.
Your expectation, barring the injury fears that every player carries with him, is that he would outperform what the Braves spent the same amount of money on this offseason on veterans. The Braves no longer having the real flexibility to maintain three veteran outside pitching spots, it seems like a reasonable move.
Verlander can be a veteran presence to the young kids, he's probably going to be the best pitcher on the staff, and there is a reasonable chance he gives the Braves a year or two year of true #1 starter ability.
Braves would shed his deal in 2019 when Kemp came off, which would be good timing for making a big move and might be about right for the young kids to actually be ready. IF his option vested, you'd be bringing back a Cy Young contender on a one year 20 million dollar deal, which is not too far off the qualifying offer. You could trade that if you needed to.
I would do that deal depending on what it cost to bring him back.
Now, whether he would agree to come to Atlanta with no real obvious prospects for WS contention, I don't know. HE seems like someone that a big market team that is already a WS contender would be better off acquiring and he seems like he would probably want to hold out for that.
Verlander is old. That worries me. He'll be 35 next season. I guess I'm fine with taking that gamble (all $56MM [guaranteed] of it) if the Braves were in the position to contend in 2018, but, to me, Verlander alone doesn't bridge that gap. Is he really a guy that could get this team over the hump in 2018, or would he just be a fading ace that's swallowing up $28MM of payroll on a mediocre mid-market team? And, if the team does evolve into a threat by 2019 (graduation of prospects, maturation of players, acquisitions) is Verlander still TOR material? If he's not, are the Braves really in the position to pay a #3 that kind of coin? It seems risky.
Last edited by Hawk; 08-06-2017 at 07:53 PM.
#3 or worse
Ivermectin Man
Considering likely price, risk and everything else, I'd rather trade for Verlander than Fulmer.
"I am a victim, I will tell you. I am a victim."
"I am your retribution."
Just because the Braves used their valuable assets to clear payroll doesn't mean other teams are going to rush to do it.
Fulmer is insanely valuable, probably around $130m+ in surplus value. The prospect cost to acquire him would be hard to stomach. Even taking Verlander's negative value as part of a package won't get Fulmer's value under $100m.
The Braves can probably acquire Fulmer, but it will cost them so much prospect capital they won't have a good enough team around him to win anything.
If we are talking off-season deals I'd prefer still targeting Archer. The Rays are stuck in perpetual retooling and might accept Matt Adams as a fourth piece instead of an extra prospect, or seem like the type of team that might be higher than normal on Comargo. Not that the prospect haul wouldn't still hurt, but they may have their eye on some of our less touted guys to make it hurt less.
Archer is probably a much more likely target. I would prefer the Braves wait until next year's trade deadline to make sure they are contenders, but converting pitching prospects into Archer this offseason wouldn't be a bad move.
I just prefer avoiding trade deadline overpays, the contenders premium is real. I'd rather pay in the winter with hopes of contending vs overpay at the deadline when we know we are.
I could be convinced either way. All depending on how many other improvements the Braves make to the rest of the roster.
If they sign someone legit for 3b and project to win 80-85 games, sure, push some chips in to get Archer and become an 85+ win team.
If they decide to "see what they have" with Camargo at 3b and Swanson at SS...I wouldn't want to see them commit the required assets to get Archer.
The contenders premium is real for good reason...it is extremely valuable to know if you're a contender before converting future wins into current wins.
Give me Cole hammels. Probably wouldn't cost anything and is only guaranteed for 2018 with an option for 19.
Would love to see him back in the NL.
Yeah, that move in a vacuum would be not ideal. Curious to see the 3b market develop. Like last year with Turner,not sure a lot of teams will have a need. At the right price I like Moose better than most on the board. Maybe the Mariners decide to sell and Seager becomes available, and I'm a fan of dealing with their insane GM.
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