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Thread: Affordable Care Act

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    I'm not sure what Trump would be accomplishing blaming the Democrats for failing to repeal/replace Obamacare, when that's decidedly what their voters wanted.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Forever Fredi View Post
    There's always a vintage Trump tweet for every situation.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Runnin View Post
    This is certainly more on Ryan than anyone else though it's nice that Thumper gets smeared by association. The CEO POS POTUS really showed how clueless his is to how govt works. His reputation to those who believed in him will take a hit.
    I'm not sure why he thought the ultimatum would work. just makes his dealmaking abilities look brutally bad. He campaigned on his business acumen being able to sell to congressman. Glad to see he's getting a taste of reality or is he? First instinct for damage control is blame Dems.

    Funny thing is Trump didn't drag Ryan through the mud. Actually defending him.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Forever Fredi View Post
    I'm not sure why he thought the ultimatum would work. just makes his dealmaking abilities look brutally bad. He campaigned on his business acumen being able to sell to congressman. Glad to see he's getting a taste of reality or is he? First instinct for damage control is blame Dems.

    Funny thing is Trump didn't drag Ryan through the mud. Actually defending him.
    Maybe because he knows that wherever Ryan is on this mess, he's right beside him.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Runnin View Post
    Maybe because he knows that wherever Ryan is on this mess, he's right beside him.
    And he needs Ryan to get some of what he wants done.

    If the GOP elect a more conservative speaker like Gowdy there's no way Trump gets anything done.
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    2016:
    "Lemme tell ya folks. These people are idiots. It's not that difficult. You open up the state lines and you create competition. It's a beautiful thing. But we have these people in Washington that don't know what they're doing."


    2017:
    "Who knew healthcare would be so complicated?"
    Forever Fredi


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    Quote Originally Posted by sturg33 View Post
    mqt tell me when a government run anything performed better than the private sector.

    We'll ignore the personal liberty side of it.
    Despite the fact that it hemorrhages money, the USPS represents a government-run enterprise that is cheaper, more reliable, and more accessible than its competitors.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hawk View Post
    Despite the fact that it hemorrhages money, the USPS represents a government-run enterprise that is cheaper, more reliable, and more accessible than its competitors.
    GOP took money out of USPS retirement to try and help pay for Iraq War. Wasn't that the case?
    Forever Fredi


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    Quote Originally Posted by Runnin View Post
    This is certainly more on Ryan than anyone else though it's nice that Thumper gets smeared by association. The CEO POS POTUS really showed how clueless his is to how govt works. His reputation to those who believed in him will take a hit.
    Ryan used a bad process to push a truly horrible bill. On the other hand, pushing the blame onto him is letting Trump off the hook unjustly.

    Trump failed every imaginable test of leadership along the way. He didn't understand the bill, couldn't articulate a coherent argument for it, couldn't sell it to the public, and couldn't sell it to his own caucus.

    It was an embarrassing failure of leadership all around, which he compounded by disclaiming responsibility, blaming the minority party, and pretending he never said things that he said.

    It's funny that the would-be authoritarian is not actually an effective leader.

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    I'm amazed Trump was still defending the bill not just once but multiple times after it got watered down.

    Art of the Deal says don't show desperation but the fact he kept pushing a bill that by even his standards was garbage is mind boggling.
    Forever Fredi


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    Quote Originally Posted by Julio3000 View Post
    Ryan used a bad process to push a truly horrible bill. On the other hand, pushing the blame onto him is letting Trump off the hook unjustly.

    Trump failed every imaginable test of leadership along the way. He didn't understand the bill, couldn't articulate a coherent argument for it, couldn't sell it to the public, and couldn't sell it to his own caucus.

    It was an embarrassing failure of leadership all around, which he compounded by disclaiming responsibility, blaming the minority party, and pretending he never said things that he said.

    It's funny that the would-be authoritarian is not actually an effective leader.
    But not surprising. Trump's own words explain it better than anything, "Just shows that you can have all the cards and lose if you don't know what you're doing."

    Btw, I believe the #1 issue now according to polls is health care.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Julio3000 View Post
    I'm not sure why there's not a general consensus that Ryan is essentially a fraud. All he's ever really done is polish his reputation as a Very Serious Budget Guy (without ever really having to show his work) and put a telegenic face on generic plutocracy-friendly policy.

    He's a budget wonk who can't pass a budget. He's an anti-government guy who's spent his entire adult life in government. He's a conservative who can't write major legislation that conservatives support. He's a leader who can't fashion a consensus with a biggest-in-a-century majority.
    http://www.slate.com/blogs/moneybox/...al_leader.html

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    so we have agreed that since we aren't really ready to go with a left idea

    that the republican idea of Obama care really isn't terrible?
    "For there is always light, if only we are brave enough to see it. If only we are brave enough to be it." Amanda Gorman

    "When Fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross"

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    Quote Originally Posted by Forever Fredi View Post
    I'm amazed Trump was still defending the bill not just once but multiple times after it got watered down.

    Art of the Deal says don't show desperation but the fact he kept pushing a bill that by even his standards was garbage is mind boggling.

    if democrats don't learn tying bad ideas to him as soon as possible

    so that insecure piece of **** panics

    then this is a bigger loss



    his whole mantra is selling himself as a success (which we know is bull****)

    so, if you want to go against him, pin any and all bad ideas (like this rich tax cut disguised as healthcare) as his ideas
    "For there is always light, if only we are brave enough to see it. If only we are brave enough to be it." Amanda Gorman

    "When Fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross"

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    Quote Originally Posted by Julio3000 View Post
    Trump failed every imaginable test of leadership along the way. He didn't understand the bill, couldn't articulate a coherent argument for it, couldn't sell it to the public, and couldn't sell it to his own caucus.
    Apparently he didn't understand the bill well enough to even negotiate with the Congress members he called to the WH. I suspect that's the real reason he called an end to negotiations. He quickly tired of having to display his ignorance on the subject.

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    sturg, BTW I asked my sister who is in medical research about the NIH cuts that I decried but you weren't that concerned about. She says that NIH works on things like vaccines because private industry won't because it's a one-off with no on-going stream of revenue and that NIH funds out-of-the-box projects with some promise that private industry won't pursue because of the relative uncertainty of success. She also thinks that all this whining about the medical device tax in the ACA is a crock. All it does is pad the bottom line and does nothing to promote innovation.

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    Trump now has the standing to go down in history as the one who made health care sustainable.

    A coalition of (D) and moderate (R) could do it.
    I doubt he planned it this way but the Freedom Caucus is politically/electorially boxed in. The TParty Caucus has boxed themselves in and what is left is a majority coalition.
    Will be interesting to see this play out




    Heidi Przybyla‏Verified account @HeidiPrzybyla 16h16 hours ago

    Heidi Przybyla Retweeted Maggie Haberman

    Thing is ... Dems have said all along they're ready to deal on fixing Obamacare -- and actually have ideas on how to do so.
    ................

    Or he goes down as the dick that cut Meals on Wheels monies
    Last edited by 57Brave; 03-25-2017 at 08:18 AM.
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    He has an opportunity. And I see it as a test of the campaign-era rhetoric used to sell him to skeptics: he's non-ideological, he's a populist, he's not really a Republican, etc.

    Democrats are going to have to ask themselves some tough questions about whether or not they're capable of assembling a governing coalition with enough staying power to get anything bigger and more lasting done in the future (I'm not optimistic about that).

    It's also going to be complicated by '18 electoral politics.

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    Donald J. Trump
    @realDonaldTrump
    ObamaCare will explode and we will all get together and piece together a great healthcare plan for THE PEOPLE. Do not worry!

    ---

    Well, that settles that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Julio3000 View Post
    He has an opportunity. And I see it as a test of the campaign-era rhetoric used to sell him to skeptics: he's non-ideological, he's a populist, he's not really a Republican, etc.

    Democrats are going to have to ask themselves some tough questions about whether or not they're capable of assembling a governing coalition with enough staying power to get anything bigger and more lasting done in the future (I'm not optimistic about that).

    It's also going to be complicated by '18 electoral politics.
    The "Hassert Rule" where (R) votes as a bloc ?
    This might be opening moderate (R) found to break out of that

    '18 electoral politics. Remember who came out on top (popular vote) and look at vote totals in districts that pushed Trumps Electoal College number over the top
    Perhaps the biggest mistake Trump has made so far is thinking he has a mandate. Kinda like Bush43 and SS in 05

    (D) has ads coming out today.
    My understanding is the consultants that made Sanders a national figure are running (D) outreach/ door knockers

    This is doable for them
    Last edited by 57Brave; 03-25-2017 at 10:30 AM.
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