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Thread: Russia Collusion Scandal (aka A Leftist fantasy)

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    Do Trump's lawyers see the irony of claiming that Mueller received emails improperly?
    Last edited by Runnin; 12-17-2017 at 08:33 AM.
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    Er, so it looks like the GSA told transition participants that if they used their system and/or devices, everything would be subject to government rules re privacy and disclosure. These were .gov emails, for goodness' sake.

    I doubt there's any dirt being done in those emails, but there may be evidence of false statements based on interviews and testimony.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Julio3000 View Post
    Er, so it looks like the GSA told transition participants that if they used their system and/or devices, everything would be subject to government rules re privacy and disclosure. These were .gov emails, for goodness' sake.

    I doubt there's any dirt being done in those emails, but there may be evidence of false statements based on interviews and testimony.
    I'm guessing the emails may prove useful in backing up any testimony that Flynn may provide.

    There has been a strong tendency (and I'm being understated here) for people in the upper echelons of the Trump campaign to provide untrue or misleading answers when asked about certain matters. I'm guessing that this tendency might have continued even while under oath or while answering questions from law enforcement.

    So Mueller has had these emails since August and his team has been using them as a guide when questioning various people from the campaign and White House. It wasn't until a week or so ago that someone noticed this. Aye.
    Last edited by nsacpi; 12-16-2017 at 11:22 PM.
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    Setting aside the fact that this is basically just another attempt by the Trump legal team to deflect and cast doubt on the investigation, I'm intrigued by the direction being taken by conservative media here. We've crossed over from "nothing to see here" to trying to find legal loopholes to snuff out the investigation.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mqt View Post
    Setting aside the fact that this is basically just another attempt by the Trump legal team to deflect and cast doubt on the investigation, I'm intrigued by the direction being taken by conservative media here. We've crossed over from "nothing to see here" to trying to find legal loopholes to snuff out the investigation.
    The situation is getting dire for Trump, Kushner, etc. The most curious part is the role his legal team has taken in painting a very rosy picture for him. It is almost as if they are part of the Deep State Conspiracy. Almost legal malpractice if you ask me. It is shocking to see them make all these reassuring public assessments about what is clearly a very dire situation.
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    Quote Originally Posted by mqt View Post
    Setting aside the fact that this is basically just another attempt by the Trump legal team to deflect and cast doubt on the investigation, I'm intrigued by the direction being taken by conservative media here. We've crossed over from "nothing to see here" to trying to find legal loopholes to snuff out the investigation.
    I think at this point it amounts to a high-stakes wager. Congressional Republicans and the right-wing media infrastructure are betting that there is not going to be a killshot. No direct evidence of a criminal conspiracy involving Russia. So they are anticipating the fight to come, over embarrassing circumstantial evidence and obstruction of justice, etc, by undermining the partiality and credibility of the investigators. There's plenty of precedent for this, from Clinton to Iran-Contra, with some success. So even if they lose the majority and are subject to hostile oversight, they've already laid the groundwork for a defense in the grounds of an eternal partisan witch-hunt.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Julio3000 View Post
    Er, so it looks like the GSA told transition participants that if they used their system and/or devices, everything would be subject to government rules re privacy and disclosure. These were .gov emails, for goodness' sake.

    I doubt there's any dirt being done in those emails, but there may be evidence of false statements based on interviews and testimony.
    If this is the case then there is nothing left to discuss.

    can you share the source for the GSA disclosures? Did they make the claim to Trump for America? Is there a signed agreement? What is the assumption when GSA's services are procured?
    Last edited by thethe; 12-17-2017 at 06:18 AM.
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    Could be an interesting week of events. Some building chatter of everything from Kushner being indicted, which would set off a chain of events that leads to Mueller being fired on Friday. Given that Friday is the last day before the long Christmas weekend, I think it's a good bet something big happens that day, one way or the other.

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    Quote Originally Posted by thethe View Post
    If this is the case then there is nothing left to discuss.

    can you share the source for the GSA disclosures? Did they make the claim to Trump for America? Is there a signed agreement? What is the assumption when GSA's services are procured?
    It's based on an interview with the Deputy Senior Counsel at GSA. His position is that transition officials were individually and collectively aware of the policies wrt privacy, privilege, and law enforcement. The TFA position is that they received a verbal agreement from the Senior Counsel (who died in August) that the GSA would notify them of any law-enforcement requests for information.

    It appears that the TFA position boils down to a verbal agreement (whatever that's worth) with a guy who's not in any position to confirm or deny it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Julio3000 View Post
    It's based on an interview with the Deputy Senior Counsel at GSA. His position is that transition officials were individually and collectively aware of the policies wrt privacy, privilege, and law enforcement. The TFA position is that they received a verbal agreement from the Senior Counsel (who died in August) that the GSA would notify them of any law-enforcement requests for information.

    It appears that the TFA position boils down to a verbal agreement (whatever that's worth) with a guy who's not in any position to confirm or deny it.
    I have doubts that something this official would be handled with a verbal agreement. That procedure should be docuented somewhere (SOP).

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    Quote Originally Posted by thethe View Post
    I have doubts that something this official would be handled with a verbal agreement. That procedure should be docuented somewhere (SOP).
    I agree. I think if TSA had a document that underpinned their case they'd be waving it around, rather than referring to a verbal agreement...which is why I'm skeptical of their argument.

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    Quote Originally Posted by thethe View Post
    I have doubts that something this official would be handled with a verbal agreement. That procedure should be docuented somewhere (SOP).
    People involved with prior transitions have also indicated that what the Deputy Senior Counsel described is in fact the arrangement that they worked under. It would not be surprising if this so-called "verbal agreement" never happened. The Deputy Senior Counsel says it never happened as far as he knows. But if it did, it appears not to have been communicated to the career civil servants. I don't think that kind of verbal agreement has any force (even if it had legality) if it is not incorporated into the policy manuals that guide the actions of the civil servants. All they did was follow SOP when Mueller's letter requesting the information landed on their desk.

    But I'm sure there is nothing nefarious or troublesome in the emails. Trumpophiles can rest easy.

    There is a lesson though for future transition teams to consider: Next time go with a private server. There is space for one in a Chappaqua basement.
    Last edited by nsacpi; 12-17-2017 at 10:06 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Julio3000 View Post
    I agree. I think if TSA had a document that underpinned their case they'd be waving it around, rather than referring to a verbal agreement...which is why I'm skeptical of their argument.
    Seems that it would be a black and white case.

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    Ok, so they got their headline:

    "Mueller Improperly Obtained Emails, Trump Lawyers Say"

    Some version of that ran in pretty much every outlet yesterday. And, of course, it's true. That is what the TFA lawyers say.

    The response is this:

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    I believe the GSA is the account owner referenced by Peter Carr. All of these emails are government property. And I believe the doctrine of executive privilege only applies to the sitting president, not the president-elect.
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    Wonder what they define as 'appropriate criminal process'

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    Quote Originally Posted by thethe View Post
    Wonder what they define as 'appropriate criminal process'
    I would assume a subpoena or warrant in cases where the owner of the email account is a private individual.
    "I am a victim, I will tell you. I am a victim."

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