Cost of Promoting Albies Now

[Hawk]

I don't really find it shocking that the FO would trot out a line toeing the CBA and paying lip service to the idea of putting the best team available on the field.

[sturg33]

I don't really find it shocking that the FO would trot out a line toeing the CBA and paying lip service to the idea of putting the best team available on the field.

But they've never done anything to contradict that lip service.

I really think they have a hard time understanding value...

1. They thought Kemp would be a worthy investment, despite him being a negative player

2. They thought Markakis was worth a 4 year commitment coming off neck surgery and age 31

3. They thought Matt Adams was SO good, that they were willing to move the franchise player to a position he has never played to accomodate

4. They have now wasted prime years of two consensus top 10 MLB prospects in order to bring them up in non-contending seasons, and I guarantee they will do the same with Acuna

5. They clearly missed the warning signs of Julio... and did not trade him when the market was hot an his value was its highest

6. They've developed a re-build strategy focused way too heavily on pitching, and we are starting to see the cracks in that philosophy

7. They traded away a generational talented shortstop, and actually legitimately believed that Aybar would not be a steep drop off in production

If I thought hard enough about this, I could probably name several more examples

[Hawk]

But they've never done anything to contradict that lip service.

I really think they have a hard time understanding value...

1. They thought Kemp would be a worthy investment, despite him being a negative player

2. They thought Markakis was worth a 4 year commitment coming off neck surgery and age 31

3. They thought Matt Adams was SO good, that they were willing to move the franchise player to a position he has never played to accomodate

4. They have now wasted prime years of two consensus top 10 MLB prospects in order to bring them up in non-contending seasons, and I guarantee they will do the same with Acuna

5. They clearly missed the warning signs of Julio... and did not trade him when the market was hot an his value was its highest

6. They've developed a re-build strategy focused way too heavily on pitching, and we are starting to see the cracks in that philosophy

7. They traded away a generational talented shortstop, and actually legitimately believed that Aybar would not be a steep drop off in production

If I thought hard enough about this, I could probably name several more examples

The discussion I am trying to have here is whether or not the team was aware of the service time implications of calling Albies up.

I agree with everything else you listed, to a tee, but it's all kind of tangential to the point.

[sturg33]

The discussion I am trying to have here is whether or not the team was aware of the service time implications of calling Albies up.

I agree with everything else you listed, to a tee, but it's all kind of tangential to the point.

I think they are aware that it costs them a year... but I'm not sure they are aware of the surplus value they are forfeiting... and if they are, holy **** I think that may be worse

[Enscheff]

The discussion I am trying to have here is whether or not the team was aware of the service time implications of calling Albies up.

I agree with everything else you listed, to a tee, but it's all kind of tangential to the point.

The Braves obviously know about the service time implications. That much is obvious.

The apparent hole in their knowledge is how to value those service time implications.

As sturg said, they have shown an alarming inability to properly valuate players, and valuing service time considerations is a big part of that...especially when the team is building around young players.

When they do the same thing for Swanson and Albies and Acuna and Maitan...that will add up to HUGE value lost.

[Hawk]

The hole in their knowledge is how to value those service time implications.

But can you really call it a hole yet? Again, I'm just talking about service time.

I guess, from my perspective, it's still too fluid. Too many extraneous factors to consider.

Yes, if Albies ends up becoming an integral part of the team's core then they've squandered future value. Absolutely. But that's presuming a great deal and isolating the impacts of player development, acquisitions, injuries, etc.

Take Heyward for example. The decision to play him early cost the Braves future control, but if we're calcuating ultimate value ... did they actually lose out? Maybe they did. I don't know.

I agree that the call-up was premature for all the same reasons you do, but I don't necessarily agree with the previous comment that the Braves are simply 'dumb' and made the decision willy-nilly. I do think they have a plan, not saying it's the right one.

[Enscheff]

But can you really call it a hole yet? Again, I'm just talking about service time.

I guess, from my perspective, it's still too fluid. Too many extraneous factors to consider.

Yes, if Albies ends up becoming an integral part of the team's core then they've squandered future value. Absolutely. But that's presuming a great deal and isolating the impacts of player development, acquisitions, injuries, etc.

Take Heyward for example. The decision to play him early cost the Braves future control, but if we're calcuating ultimate value ... did they actually lose out? Maybe they did. I don't know.

I agree that the call-up was premature for all the same reasons you do, but I don't necessarily agree with the previous comment that the Braves are simply 'dumb' and made the decision willy-nilly. I do think they have a plan, not saying it's the right one.

The Heyward promotion was defensible because the Braves were trying to earn a playoff spot. The Braves ended up winning the WC spot by 1 game over SD that year. Holding down Heyward for 2 weeks may have cost them a playoff appearance that year.

That was not the case when Dansby was promoted. That was not the case when Albies was promoted. Both seasons were non-contending seasons.

There was no reason to promote Swanson last August, and there was no reason to promote Albies this August.

They have shown a clear lack of knowledge/concern about how much future value these promotions are costing the organization, and nothing suggests they will act any differently in the future.

[Pachoo]

The Heyward promotion was defensible because the Braves were trying to earn a playoff spot. The Braves ended up winning the WC spot by 1 game over SD that year. Holding down Heyward for 2 weeks may have cost them a playoff appearance that year.

That was not the case when Dansby was promoted. That was not the case when Albies was promoted. Both seasons were non-contending seasons.

There was no reason to promote Swanson last August, and there was no reason to promote Albies this August.

They have shown a clear lack of knowledge/concern about how much future value these promotions are costing the organization, and nothing suggests they will act any differently in the future.

Agreed. The Braves know the implications of not using the loopholes. They just don't seem to care, obviously not believing it is much of a handicap long term. I hope they extend both Swanson and Albies early to mitigate the early promotions.

I still hold out hope that they are at least smart enough to keep Acuna off the MLB roster until the 3rd week of next season.

[rico43]

The Heyward promotion was defensible because the Braves were trying to earn a playoff spot. The Braves ended up winning the WC spot by 1 game over SD that year. Holding down Heyward for 2 weeks may have cost them a playoff appearance that year.

That was not the case when Dansby was promoted. That was not the case when Albies was promoted. Both seasons were non-contending seasons.

There was no reason to promote Swanson last August, and there was no reason to promote Albies this August.

They have shown a clear lack of knowledge/concern about how much future value these promotions are costing the organization, and nothing suggests they will act any differently in the future.

Asking this question out of true curiousity about your opinion, and not to pick a fight (which you seem to want to do way too much) ... why is calling up Albies at age 20 the same as calling up Swanson at 22 with four years of college baseball behind him?

FYI, I have generally avoided this discussion, but I was considering that they held Albies back; in fact that the trade for Phillips was designed to keep him in the minors as long as needed. In every other way other than the service time concern, he was ready for the majors, as he is showing on a nightly basis.

I do share your hope that Acuna stays back until May, precisely because of his age; but I had a concern last night when it looked like Ender injured his throwing hand.