Heyman - Braves expected to shop veteran outfielders

[steveAKAslick]

Per Heyman
braves, w/ wunderkind acuna on cusp, will need to make room. which means these 2 vets are likely to hit trade block.

http://bit.ly/2vWcldk

[Enscheff]

This is going to be a lot like me tying to get rid of my old lawn mower when I bought a new wunder-Honda.

Markakis is my usable old lawnmower I had to give away to (and transport for) a guy who wanted to use it to chop down brush behind his property.

Kemp is the broken down riding lawnmower on my in-law's ranch that we will have to pay money to have hauled away.

[50PoundHead]

This is going to be a lot like me tying to get rid of my old lawn mower when I bought a new wunder-Honda.

Markakis is my usable old lawnmower I had to give away to (and transport for) a guy who wanted to use it to chop down brush behind his property.

Kemp is the broken down riding lawnmower on my in-law's ranch that we will have to pay money to have hauled away.

They will get little for Markakis, but I can see them moving all of that contract to the right team. Markakis could be useful to someone in the right situation. We probably get less for Kemp and what we get will depend on how much of the contract we will continue to pick up.

[bravesfanMatt]

Why do we need a lawnmower when we have a goat like Acuna...

[Chico]

I could see us trading them both, putting Acuna in RF and looking at a guy like Justin Upton or JD Martinez for LF. I'm thinking there's going to be a much bigger shakeup than probably everyone on this board. I cannot see this FO sitting on their hands this offseason and seeing what happens organically.

Markakis is not a hard trade. I don't think we'll get much back than a lottery ticket, but he's a servicable player and good clubhouse guy.

Kempo is going to be harder. I highly doubt we eat money the old fashion way. We'll take back another contract or tie some low level prospects or extra pen arms to him...or a combination of both.

[Knucksie]

Not exactly surprising news.

[Southcack77]

They will get little for Markakis, but I can see them moving all of that contract to the right team. Markakis could be useful to someone in the right situation. We probably get less for Kemp and what we get will depend on how much of the contract we will continue to pick up.

Markakis could be useful to the Braves. He really doesn't have to be moved though the lineup looks a little weird keeping him and getting rid of Kemp.

[JxnMissFan]

This is going to be a lot like me tying to get rid of my old lawn mower when I bought a new wunder-Honda.

Markakis is my usable old lawnmower I had to give away to (and transport for) a guy who wanted to use it to chop down brush behind his property.

Kemp is the broken down riding lawnmower on my in-law's ranch that we will have to pay money to have hauled away.

Perfect analogy

What surprises me is this presented as news. I assumed they have always been to the trade block.

I'm sure that there are several teams calling the johns about the dynamic duo since this news broke

[Enscheff]

I think folks are severely underestimating how much negative value Kemp carries.

The Braves will have to assume so much salary and/or include so much prospect capital to move him they may as well just drop him.

This is not a Touki for Arroyo situation.

[Enscheff]

Heyman's follow up piece: "Braves will try to win more games in 2018"

Followed with "thethe is stoked about it"

[Enscheff]

given what we owe on their contracts expected surplus value is about negative 30 mil for Kemp and negative 3 mil for Muk

Agreed.

We have seen what no-glove sluggers have signed for lately...about $10M total on 1 a year deal. Kemp is owed almost $40M. The math is easy.

I'm convinced Kemp can be productive if managed like a catcher and subbed for defensively at the end of games.

Markakis can hold down a spot for another year. Maybe dump him at the deadline for a nothing return.

Might as well keep both. There's no reason Acuna can't compile a few hundred more AAA PAs other than the FO trying to rush the competitive window and save their jobs.

[Hudson2]

I think we'll see alot of moves this winter bc no way does the FO let the team suck for a 2nd straight year in the new stadium.

[Southcack77]

Agreed.

We have seen what no-glove sluggers have signed for lately...about $10M total on 1 a year deal. Kemp is owed almost $40M. The math is easy.

I'm convinced Kemp can be productive if managed like a catcher and subbed for defensively at the end of games.

Markakis can hold down a spot for another year. Maybe dump him at the deadline for a nothing return.

Might as well keep both. There's no reason Acuna can't compile a few hundred more AAA PAs other than the FO trying to rush the competitive window and save their jobs.

Figure the Dodgers money goes wherever, so you are talking about 18 million for 2018 and 2019. If the Braves could get away with throwing in $8 million for each season, I believe they would come out ahead of what they owed Oliveira or pretty close. They should jump on that. That is the scenario that I would be looking at the hardest, but it may be the one that is more difficult for the front office to weather politically. Paying to get rid of the cleanup hitter they acquired does look bad, even if the net result was a year and a half of decent offense and the elimination of the 2020 obligation to Oliveira. It would be a net win though in my book if they could do it.

They probably have to throw in more than that though, but I think I might give Kemp 20 million over 2 years to DH / play a little LF. Maybe.

[smootness]

Kemp is garbage, and we aren't going to be able to give him away. Might as well cut him and eat all the money.

I think he's fatter now than he was at any point last year.

[Russ2dollas]

Agreed.

We have seen what no-glove sluggers have signed for lately...about $10M total on 1 a year deal. Kemp is owed almost $40M. The math is easy.

I'm convinced Kemp can be productive if managed like a catcher and subbed for defensively at the end of games.

Markakis can hold down a spot for another year. Maybe dump him at the deadline for a nothing return.

Might as well keep both. There's no reason Acuna can't compile a few hundred more AAA PAs other than the FO trying to rush the competitive window and save their jobs.

I agree.

Honestly I'd put them as a platoon in LF and just eat the money. I think it could be a decent platoon and having that bat off the bench would be solid. The money is spent, I don't care how it looks. Ideally you'd pay your 4th OF 500K and a multi WAR starter 10+ million. It's the same money, just in reverse if Acuna is in RF and Neck is on the bench. Braves always like spending money on vet clubhouse guys anyway. Better Neck at 11 million than Bonifacio. Acuna gives you a back up CF option so you don't have to have on of those.

IIRC if we just cut Olivera for the suckage and the criminal behavior we were out 30 million total ending in 2020. Now we owe Kemp 36 million ending in 19. I personally would feel victory for any deal that causes us to eat less than 30 million.

I know Kemp is bad. But it does seem reasonable that there would be an AL team who could use him at 2/12-15. If we would be willing (not sure we are) to admit the mistake we could dump him and eat 20-25 million. If that's the case we saved some money from Olivera and go it off the books a year early......SUCCESS.

It seems like Acuna is going to be RF early, if not opening day. I'd honestly prefer LF to be some combination/platoon of Lane Adams/Comargo/Neck/Dustin Peterson. Ship Kemp off and eat 25 million and let Neck be the club house guy and Eric Hinske PH. Neck is still a decent hitter who gets the bat on the ball and he'd be great to PH late when you have runners in scoring position. Honestly 11 million is that much, especially if you are paying the minimum at LF, RF, 3B, 2B and SS.

[clvclv]

Still think Markakis back to the Orioles to keep them on the fringes of competitive for the last year they control Machado makes sense. Eating the money ($3 million) ought to make Markakis worth a 45 FV prospect and would make the trade salary-neutral for Baltimore since they'd be replacing Seth Smith with Markakis for roughly the same money - not to mention bringing back a fan-favorite. If we could get Jomar Reyes or D. J. Stewart back for him, I'd pounce - Stewart quietly regained "prospect instead of suspect" status this year IMO.

Platoon Kemp and Adams in LF and play Acuna if and only if you can unload Markakis and spend the savings on somebody like Cobb on a three year deal or start working on extensions for the kids.

[Enscheff]

MLBTR also agrees with how worthless these guys are:

Super braves fan
2:09 Who's more likely to go...... markakis or Kemp... what's the possible return

Jeffrey Todd
2:09 Hoo boy. Neither?
2:10 Call me crazy, but I don't really expect the Braves to clear room for Acuna over the winter. It's not like they can't just wait and do that whenever it seems advisable.
2:11 Clearly, ATL would be willing to offload either player. But there just isn't going to be much interest. And I think it would be silly to put Acuna on the opening day roster and burn up a year of control.
2:12 Return for Markakis or Kemp, btw, will be cost savings. Both contracts are under water.

[Southcack77]

MLBTR also agrees with how worthless these guys are:

Super braves fan
2:09 Who's more likely to go...... markakis or Kemp... what's the possible return

Jeffrey Todd
2:09 Hoo boy. Neither?
2:10 Call me crazy, but I don't really expect the Braves to clear room for Acuna over the winter. It's not like they can't just wait and do that whenever it seems advisable.
2:11 Clearly, ATL would be willing to offload either player. But there just isn't going to be much interest. And I think it would be silly to put Acuna on the opening day roster and burn up a year of control.
2:12 Return for Markakis or Kemp, btw, will be cost savings. Both contracts are under water.

I agree with this.

I think the best move is to trade neither over the Winter.

Let Acuna start the season in the minors and force the issue after you have preserved the year of service time.

I don't see any reason to move Markakis. If you write off 2018 then who really cares if he is on the roster or not. He's a competent hitter who doesn't embarrass himself in the field. He's a one WAR dude and maybe that isn't a starter on a good club, but I guess it plays and you can have a worse reserve if it comes down to it.

Kemp is the guy that moving really opens things up for you. You aren't getting out of it without eating a bunch of 2019 salary, but you might find you feel good about the portion that you didn't eat.

So spend 8 million of your 2018 payroll on getting rid of Kemp. Then use 8 million of the expiring Markakis money to get rid of Kemp in 2019. That maybe preserves enough payroll space to go out and get something interesting in LF or a space holder somewhere for the open season in 2020.

The idea of getting anything other than a C- prospect out of Kemp/Markakis combined trade is probably not in anyone's mind barring something really unforeseen.

[Southcack77]

Still think Markakis back to the Orioles to keep them on the fringes of competitive for the last year they control Machado makes sense. Eating the money ($3 million) ought to make Markakis worth a 45 FV prospect and would make the trade salary-neutral for Baltimore since they'd be replacing Seth Smith with Markakis for roughly the same money - not to mention bringing back a fan-favorite. If we could get Jomar Reyes or D. J. Stewart back for him, I'd pounce - Stewart quietly regained "prospect instead of suspect" status this year IMO.

Platoon Kemp and Adams in LF and play Acuna if and only if you can unload Markakis and spend the savings on somebody like Cobb on a three year deal or start working on extensions for the kids.

Would you rather pay Machado 30 million (?) or Freddie 22 million (expiring) in 2022? that's an thought experiment, though maybe not realistic.


I don't think the Orioles are giving away Machado. They should try to resign him. If not, he's still worth prospects at the deadline, I bet. Also if the Os give up on signing him unlikely the Braves have much of a chance.

[chipchildress]

Agreed.

We have seen what no-glove sluggers have signed for lately...about $10M total on 1 a year deal. Kemp is owed almost $40M. The math is easy.

I'm convinced Kemp can be productive if managed like a catcher and subbed for defensively at the end of games.

Markakis can hold down a spot for another year. Maybe dump him at the deadline for a nothing return.

Might as well keep both. There's no reason Acuna can't compile a few hundred more AAA PAs other than the FO trying to rush the competitive window and save their jobs.

why not hold acuna out until 2020? get through both of these contracts and knowing the pitching will be horrible, there's no way this club is competing next year or probably the next. so why waste his time? i'm dead serious here. if folks are up in arms about saving service time, there's no difference in waiting two more years by that logic.