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Thread: Parkland School Shooting

  1. #381
    A Chip Off the Old Rock Julio3000's Avatar
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    And, yes, I will say unequivocally that the Democratic Party punted on guns. No question about it. I was and am disappointed by that fact. The pertinent question, though, is why?

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  3. #382
    It's OVER 5,000! bravesnumberone's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hawk View Post
    One idea, three words: campaign finance reform
    Not surprisingly and not coincidentally, the NRA has been vehemently against those three words in the past. Maybe it's changed, Idk.

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    It's OVER 5,000! Jaw's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Julio3000 View Post
    I take that to mean that you've have supported gun control measures if they were introduced in 2009?
    No. More that the angst directed at NRA and GOP should be shared with the Dems. And that its surprising they didn't change it when they had filibuster proof control....since they're so willing to cast blame on others now.

  5. #384
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    Quote Originally Posted by bravesnumberone View Post
    Not surprisingly and not coincidentally, the NRA has been vehemently against those three words in the past. Maybe it's changed, Idk.
    Well, so has the Supreme Court of the United States.

    I wonder how much the NRA is paying them.

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    It's OVER 5,000! bravesnumberone's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Julio3000 View Post
    And, yes, I will say unequivocally that the Democratic Party punted on guns. No question about it. I was and am disappointed by that fact. The pertinent question, though, is why?
    I think to a large political reasons in terms of wanting to win voters. I still remember seeing John Edwards make a campaign appearance in semi-rural Georgia and a third of the speech was about how integral guns had been in his life. It was one of the most disingenuous things I've ever witnessed and led to me the conclusion that he was a fake sack of **** before he was outed as such.

    I don't think the organization's influence stops at the Republican Party at all.

    It's practically a political slur to have anything less than an "A" from the NRA.

  7. #386
    It's OVER 5,000! Jaw's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Julio3000 View Post
    And, yes, I will say unequivocally that the Democratic Party punted on guns. No question about it. I was and am disappointed by that fact. The pertinent question, though, is why?
    Likely because they realize the NRA isn't some evil consortium of guns manufacturers, but an association of people who are fond of their right to guns. And that angering that association of people would likely result in a red wave in the next election.
    Go get him!

    Founding member of the Whiny Little Bitches and Pricks Club

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    Quote Originally Posted by Julio3000 View Post
    People who lobby for their easy availability are to some degree complicit when they are used for their express purpose.
    Man, I just can't get behind this logic. I wish it were that cut and dried.

  9. #388
    It's OVER 5,000! bravesnumberone's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hawk View Post
    Well, so has the Supreme Court of the United States.

    I wonder how much the NRA is paying them.
    Well, if you look at the composition of the court and some of the people who have been on there the last decade or so, it isn't difficult. I've long lamented the court has become a political tool for both sides.

  10. #389
    A Chip Off the Old Rock Julio3000's Avatar
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    I am personally in favor of reforms to gun laws and measures that effect the power of industry lobbies to affect the political process, yet I am unwilling to countenance criticism of the people who advocate and vote for the exact opposite of what I believe.

    Nice place to hang your hat.

  11. #390
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    Quote Originally Posted by bravesnumberone View Post
    Well, if you look at the composition of the court and some of the people who have been on there the last decade or so, it isn't difficult. I've long lamented the court has become a political tool for both sides.
    Wait, so you are saying the NRA owns SCOTUS judges?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Julio3000 View Post
    I am personally in favor of reforms to gun laws and measures that effect the power of industry lobbies to affect the political process, yet I am unwilling to countenance criticism of the people who advocate and vote for the exact opposite of what I believe.

    Nice place to hang your hat.
    It's high ground in this debate.

  13. #392
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    But I like how we've couched accusations of murder as "criticism".

  14. #393
    A Chip Off the Old Rock Julio3000's Avatar
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    I think the Heller decision threw the Democrats' messaging into flux. Until then, it was relatively easier for a D politician to take a federalist position. And, honestly, there's some logic to that. I don't really care that much about what people are packing in sparsely populated areas of the Great Plains and the west. There are valid reasons for those folks to be carrying, just as (IMO) there are valid reasons to restrict what people are carrying in more densely populated areas.

    Now, the Heller decision was essentially based on Scalia having a seance with the founding fathers, but that's a discussion for another day.

  15. #394
    I <3 Ron Paul + gilesfan sturg33's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Julio3000 View Post
    I am personally in favor of reforms to gun laws and measures that effect the power of industry lobbies to affect the political process, yet I am unwilling to countenance criticism of the people who advocate and vote for the exact opposite of what I believe.

    Nice place to hang your hat.
    Would definitely stop psychos from getting a weapon and killing people.

    Have we considered the gun free schools idea yet?

  16. #395
    A Chip Off the Old Rock Julio3000's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hawk View Post
    But I like how we've couched accusations of murder as "criticism".
    Moral culpability and legal culpability? Not my province, exactly, though I have my opinions. But, again, if you think that, for example, the type of weapon used in the most recent massacre shouldn't have been legally in the hands of the shooter, it would seem to follow that you could be arsed to apportion a measure of blame for the folks who've actively and successfully campaigned for its availability.

  17. #396
    It's OVER 5,000! bravesnumberone's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hawk View Post
    Wait, so you are saying the NRA owns SCOTUS judges?
    I don't know if they "own" judges, but think they have a tremendous influence. He's dead now, but Scalia's writing in the Heller case backs that up.

  18. #397
    A Chip Off the Old Rock Julio3000's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sturg33 View Post
    Would definitely stop psychos from getting a weapon and killing people.

    Have we considered the gun free schools idea yet?
    Yes, you've made yourself clear. I wait with bated breath for your suggestion of how ending gun-free zones will also mitigate mass shootings.

  19. #398
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    Quote Originally Posted by Julio3000 View Post
    Yes, you've made yourself clear. I wait with bated breath for your suggestion of how ending gun-free zones will also mitigate mass shootings.
    If we just post signs at every school, every mall, every movie theater, every concert venue, every office, that say, "Armed people here," that will stop it all.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bravesnumberone View Post
    I don't know if they "own" judges, but think they have a tremendous influence. He's dead now, but Scalia's writing in the Heller case backs that up.
    Wow.

  21. #400
    It's OVER 5,000! bravesnumberone's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hawk View Post
    Wow.
    Are you denying that the Supreme Court has been turned into a political tool?

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