Camargo

[msstate7]

2018: .257/.349/.451 1.9 fWAR (82 games)
Vs lhp: .294/.341/.588
Vs rhp: .240/.352/.388

Career: .277/.340/.452 3.0 fWAR (164 games)

bWAR for 2018 = 2.1
bWAR for career = 3.2

Could he end up our 3b for the foreseeable future?

[jpx7]

That “vs rhp” line would look real bad if his elevated bb-rate is more sample-size mirage than material improvement. That’s what gives me pause with La Camargue. But he’s in the mix.

[mfree80]

Walking would seem to fall more in the category of a skill that could be enhanced than a manifestation of luck.

To me that is the biggest signal that he is getting it rather than just on a hot streak.

[Enscheff]

Walking would seem to fall more in the category of a skill that could be enhanced than a manifestation of luck.

To me that is the biggest signal that he is getting it rather than just on a hot streak.

What part of this graph looks like a fluke to you?

[JxnMissFan]

What part of this graph looks like a fluke to you?

Thank you. Everyone seems to forget that he was propped up last year with an unsustainable BABIP and this year he is carrying a walk rate that is unsustainable. If you average the two sets of 82 game numbers I don"t think anyone on this board would be happy to have that player as thier starting 3rd baseman.

[chipchildress]

What part of this graph looks like a fluke to you?

that's clearly an upward trending line.

now back to your regularly scheduled "often wrong, never in doubt" postings.

[jpx7]

that's clearly an upward trending line.

now back to your regularly scheduled "often wrong, never in doubt" postings.

I think the point is that it’s a slight upward trend, but the outlier period early on skews Camargo’s 2018 to look like he’s made a more substantial improvement than he really has.

[Enscheff]

The Braves can do better at 3B than a guy who can't hit RHP, especially since defensive value declines at an earlier age than offensive value.

Posting overall numbers for platoon players and then extrapolating them over a full season is a more than a bit misleading as well...

Camargo's overall career line has been accumulated while facing ~29% LHP, while the average MLB hitter faces ~39% LHP. Camargo has been placed in situations he is more likely to succeed in, so extrapolating those numbers to a full season completely ignores the fact that he wouldn't be in those advantageous situations as frequently over the course a full season as an everyday player.

He is a perfectly fine stop gap until Riley gets his shot, and I would look for the Braves to add a LHH who can help cover 3B a bit as well.

[sturg33]

The Braves can do better at 3B than a guy who can't hit RHP, especially since defensive value declines at an earlier age than offensive value.

Posting overall numbers for platoon players and then extrapolating them over a full season is a more than a bit misleading as well...

Camargo's overall career line has been accumulated while facing ~29% LHP, while the average MLB hitter faces ~39% LHP. Camargo has been placed in situations he is more likely to succeed in, so extrapolating those numbers to a full season completely ignores the fact that he wouldn't be in those advantageous situations as frequently over the course a full season as an everyday player.

He is a perfectly fine stop gap until Riley gets his shot, and I would look for the Braves to add a LHH who can help cover 3B a bit as well.

Doesn't that imply he HASNT faced lefties at the average clip, and thus his overall numbers are skewed negatively?

[GeorgiaGirl]

I think the reason his walk rate was spiked earlier was because teams were going on his old scouting report where he was a pure hacker. That obviously changed very quickly after May, because in May, even just looking at BA-OBP split, it was at over +.100. Since then, it's just at +.056 (which is better than 2017, but is not as great as it was in May).

The hilarious thing about his season is for quite a while, statcast stats were saying he was getting unlucky. Now it's reversed! They say he's getting a little lucky now.

His LHH swing is still ugly unless you throw him an up and away pitch or just a complete mistake.

[JxnMissFan]

Camargo will be like Jace Peterson. He will have stretches where he looks good and he will have bad stretches but as soon as he hits his arb years and cost 2.5 million a year he will be gone.

[Chico]

AA stated we were in on an impact LH bat that he will continue to explore in the offseason. The more I looked in to it, the more I think Travis Shaw could have been that guy.

The Brewers could use some pitching. They Have Lecerg at 3B and Hiura as their 3B and 2B of the future who could both be ready next season some time. They now have Schoop who could play 2B or 3B.

I'm not sure what the return would need to be and it may very well need to include Camargo to offset the timetable of Lecerg and Hiura being ready, but Shaw may be a guy we can go after this offseason.

[Enscheff]

AA stated we were in on an impact LH bat that he will continue to explore in the offseason. The more I looked in to it, the more I think Travis Shaw could have been that guy.

The Brewers could use some pitching. They Have Lecerg at 3B and Hiura as their 3B and 2B of the future who could both be ready next season some time. They now have Schoop who could play 2B or 3B.

I'm not sure what the return would need to be and it may very well need to include Camargo to offset the timetable of Lecerg and Hiura being ready, but Shaw may be a guy we can go after this offseason.

This is a very good take, and I think you might be onto something.

It was odd for the Brewers to acquire Mous, move Shaw to 2B where he hasn't ever played at the MLB level, and then acquire another 2B in Schoop...all while having Hiura nearly ready at 2B. Then they failed to acquire ANY pitching when they had a pretty big need there.

It almost seems like Shaw was supposed to be flipped to the Braves for young pitching with Mous and Schoop at 2B/3B, but the Shaw deal didn't happen for whatever reason.

I agree with you...Shaw might be a very likely trade target this off season.

[Chico]

This is a very good take, and I think you might be onto something.

It was odd for the Brewers to acquire Mous, move Shaw to 2B where he hasn't ever played at the MLB level, and then acquire another 2B in Schoop...all while having Hiura nearly ready at 2B.

It almost seems like Shaw was supposed to be flipped for young pitching with Mous and Schoop at 2B/3B, but the Shaw deal didn't happen for whatever reason.

Yeah. It was odd.

[Enscheff]

Doesn't that imply he HASNT faced lefties at the average clip, and thus his overall numbers are skewed negatively?

You are correct. His overall line would be bumped up if he faced more LHP.

Still, that .240/.352/.388 line vs RHP isn't what you want to see in an everyday 3B whose real BB rate probably doesn't support that .352 OBP long term.

Everything else suggests his 2018 BB rate vs RHP of 13.1% is more likely to be half that going forward. Suddenly a .240/.310/.388 line vs RHP doesn't look playable at all.

[GeorgiaGirl]

If I were Camargo, I'd at least try to give up switch hitting. He was not a switch hitter at the start, but tried to learn it. And I think, based off what we see, it's pretty clear he's a true talent, .650 OPS'er on that side.

He should play some winter league just batting right handed and see if he can pull off going back to being a RHH at this point.

[Enscheff]

Would solarte make it through waivers? I’m doubtful he would.

The failure to fix this glaring hole on the roster is why I could only give AA a B overall for his first trade deadline in Atlanta.

[CyYoung31]

I think the point is that some unnamed poster is absolutely clueless, and oddly proud about it.

That poster introduced us to BiLE. He’s a certified genius as far as I’m concerned.

[Orphan Black]

So to me Camargo has now had a full season worth of ABs and appears to be a 3-4 WAR player. Is this not good enough for people?

[thewupk]

So to me Camargo has now had a full season worth of ABs and appears to be a 3-4 WAR player. Is this not good enough for people?

no