User Tag List

Page 294 of 323 FirstFirst ... 194244284292293294295296304 ... LastLast
Results 5,861 to 5,880 of 6450

Thread: 2018 Offseason And Targets

  1. #5861
    Very Flirtatious, but Doubts What Love Is. jpx7's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Posts
    8,245
    Thanks
    21,759
    Thanked 5,020 Times in 2,893 Posts
    Mentioned
    25 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by clvclv View Post
    I didn't suggest they should - as a matter of fact I said I wouldn't disagree that price was too high.

    I only pointed out that everyone needs to take a step back when complaining about the asking price since I'm relatively sure the vast majority of posters here would've screamed bloody murder if the same situation would've come up at the end of Chipper's tenure.

    I'm not sure whether I buy the notion that Gray is a better Pitcher at this point, but people have suggested using Gohara in a deal to get him. Given Gray's monstrous struggles on the big stage in NY vs. Bumgarner's career postseason pedigree, I'd call them a wash at best. If you'd move Gohara for Gray, then why not MadBum? I realize the numbers folks don't like talking about his playoff success when valuing him, but it is a consideration if you're making a push - there still wasn't anyone you wanted Bobby to run out there in games that counted other than Smoltzie, even as he began to slow down.
    I wouldn’t deal Gohara or any of those pitchers for Gray, either. One of Kluber, Bauer, or Carrasco are the pitchers I’d entertain for that set. Paxson would’ve been nice, as would’ve Morton, given his short-term desires and lack of QO. But either Bumgarner or Gray are value bounce-back buys, and if their teams price them higher, then the Braves shouldn’t bite.
    "For all his tattooings he was on the whole a clean, comely looking cannibal."

  2. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to jpx7 For This Useful Post:

    clvclv (01-09-2019),Southcack77 (01-09-2019)

  3. #5862
    Creepy Lurking Stalker
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Posts
    24
    Thanks
    21
    Thanked 9 Times in 2 Posts
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    I know Julio has some control issues but how much of a real upgrade would Gray be? and i sure dont wanna go prospect heavy to get him like the Yankees seem to be asking, MadBum is clearly better but has one year left, I feel like if we are to deal for a starting pitcher it needs to be a clear upgrade with more than 1 year left on their contract.

    Julio ERA 4.49 Whip 1.37

    Gray ERA 4.90 Whip 1.50

    MadBum ERA 3.26 Whip 1.24

  4. #5863
    10 yr, $185 million Extension
    Join Date
    Jun 2016
    Posts
    4,674
    Thanks
    197
    Thanked 746 Times in 574 Posts
    Mentioned
    4 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by clvclv View Post
    I didn't suggest they should - as a matter of fact I said I wouldn't disagree that price was too high.

    I only pointed out that everyone needs to take a step back when complaining about the asking price since I'm relatively sure the vast majority of posters here would've screamed bloody murder if the same situation would've come up at the end of Chipper's tenure.

    I'm not sure whether I buy the notion that Gray is a better Pitcher at this point, but people have suggested using Gohara in a deal to get him. Given Gray's monstrous struggles on the big stage in NY vs. Bumgarner's career postseason pedigree, I'd call them a wash at best. If you'd move Gohara for Gray, then why not MadBum? I realize the numbers folks don't like talking about his playoff success when valuing him, but it is a consideration if you're making a push - there still wasn't anyone you wanted Bobby to run out there in games that counted other than Smoltzie, even as he began to slow down.
    Gohara being mentioned in a Gray deal is equally bad, IMO. I'm not necessarily high on Gohara, but you don't trade six years of high upside control for one year of an ok pitcher.

    Not a problem moving him but save those bullets from something a little bit better.

  5. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Southcack77 For This Useful Post:

    clvclv (01-09-2019),jpx7 (01-09-2019)

  6. #5864
    10 yr, $185 million Extension
    Join Date
    Jun 2016
    Posts
    4,674
    Thanks
    197
    Thanked 746 Times in 574 Posts
    Mentioned
    4 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by jpx7 View Post
    I wouldn’t deal Gohara or any of those pitchers for Gray, either. One of Kluber, Bauer, or Carrasco are the pitchers I’d entertain for that set. Paxson would’ve been nice, as would’ve Morton, given his short-term desires and lack of QO. But either Bumgarner or Gray are value bounce-back buys, and if their teams price them higher, then the Braves shouldn’t bite.
    Yep.

  7. #5865
    It's OVER 5,000!
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Posts
    5,039
    Thanks
    787
    Thanked 1,006 Times in 691 Posts
    Mentioned
    4 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by clvclv View Post
    I didn't suggest they should - as a matter of fact I said I wouldn't disagree that price was too high.

    I only pointed out that everyone needs to take a step back when complaining about the asking price since I'm relatively sure the vast majority of posters here would've screamed bloody murder if the same situation would've come up at the end of Chipper's tenure.

    I'm not sure whether I buy the notion that Gray is a better Pitcher at this point, but people have suggested using Gohara in a deal to get him. Given Gray's monstrous struggles on the big stage in NY vs. Bumgarner's career postseason pedigree, I'd call them a wash at best. If you'd move Gohara for Gray, then why not MadBum? I realize the numbers folks don't like talking about his playoff success when valuing him, but it is a consideration if you're making a push - there still wasn't anyone you wanted Bobby to run out there in games that counted other than Smoltzie, even as he began to slow down.
    The only proposals involving Gohara to the Yanks were for Gray and Frazier. I don't remember anyone suggesting Gohara for Gray straight up. That'd be a terrible deal for us.

  8. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Carp For This Useful Post:

    clvclv (01-09-2019),jpx7 (01-09-2019)

  9. #5866
    PosiBraves Hell Gatekeeper
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Posts
    14,317
    Thanks
    28
    Thanked 4,016 Times in 2,441 Posts
    Mentioned
    18 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Champman33 View Post
    I know Julio has some control issues but how much of a real upgrade would Gray be? and i sure dont wanna go prospect heavy to get him like the Yankees seem to be asking, MadBum is clearly better but has one year left, I feel like if we are to deal for a starting pitcher it needs to be a clear upgrade with more than 1 year left on their contract.

    Julio ERA 4.49 Whip 1.37

    Gray ERA 4.90 Whip 1.50

    MadBum ERA 3.26 Whip 1.24
    FOs no longer use such stats to evaluate pitchers.

  10. The Following User Says Thank You to Enscheff For This Useful Post:

    Champman33 (01-09-2019)

  11. #5867
    Sabermetric Slut
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    Your Mom's Basement
    Posts
    13,890
    Thanks
    955
    Thanked 3,913 Times in 2,502 Posts
    Mentioned
    6 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Champman33 View Post
    I know Julio has some control issues but how much of a real upgrade would Gray be? and i sure dont wanna go prospect heavy to get him like the Yankees seem to be asking, MadBum is clearly better but has one year left, I feel like if we are to deal for a starting pitcher it needs to be a clear upgrade with more than 1 year left on their contract.

    Julio ERA 4.49 Whip 1.37

    Gray ERA 4.90 Whip 1.50

    MadBum ERA 3.26 Whip 1.24
    Gray outside of Yankee Stadium is quite a bit better than Julio. There is an upgrade there imo.

  12. The Following User Says Thank You to thewupk For This Useful Post:

    Champman33 (01-09-2019)

  13. #5868
    Creepy Lurking Stalker
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Posts
    24
    Thanks
    21
    Thanked 9 Times in 2 Posts
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Enscheff View Post
    FOs no longer use such stats to evaluate pitchers.
    I have followed the board for years and appriciate the advanced stats that you and others have put out, but i still dont see enough of an upgrade to warrant a Gohora, Wilson or even Wentz imo

  14. #5869
    Creepy Lurking Stalker
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Posts
    24
    Thanks
    21
    Thanked 9 Times in 2 Posts
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by thewupk View Post
    Gray outside of Yankee Stadium is quite a bit better than Julio. There is an upgrade there imo.
    i realize that and also take into consideration that gray had to deal with the AL East alot but im not willing to give up a 50/55 prospect for him.

  15. #5870
    10 yr, $185 million Extension
    Join Date
    Jun 2016
    Posts
    4,674
    Thanks
    197
    Thanked 746 Times in 574 Posts
    Mentioned
    4 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Champman33 View Post
    i realize that and also take into consideration that gray had to deal with the AL East alot but im not willing to give up a 50/55 prospect for him.
    I'm skeptical that you can just disregard his work at Yankee Stadium. I think he's just fine as a buy low candidate with upside or as part of a bigger deal.

  16. #5871
    NL Rookie of the Year
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Posts
    2,166
    Thanks
    128
    Thanked 875 Times in 516 Posts
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Champman33 View Post
    I have followed the board for years and appriciate the advanced stats that you and others have put out, but i still dont see enough of an upgrade to warrant a Gohora, Wilson or even Wentz imo
    I doubt Wentz amounts to much more than current day Gray.

  17. #5872
    "What is a clvclv"
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    Nebo, NC
    Posts
    6,019
    Thanks
    3,536
    Thanked 1,661 Times in 1,100 Posts
    Mentioned
    5 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by jpx7 View Post
    I wouldn’t deal Gohara or any of those pitchers for Gray, either. One of Kluber, Bauer, or Carrasco are the pitchers I’d entertain for that set. Paxson would’ve been nice, as would’ve Morton, given his short-term desires and lack of QO. But either Bumgarner or Gray are value bounce-back buys, and if their teams price them higher, then the Braves shouldn’t bite.
    Completely understandable. However, at the end of the day, AA has to start moving some of these pieces - even if that results in a questionable deal or two. No one's arguing some trades could turn out to be regrettable, but in the Braves' situation you're going to have to take a couple chances unless there's some influx of cash coming that no one sees. The list of 2019 MLB-ready arms is ridiculous at this point...

    Folty (going nowhere), Gausman (going nowhere), Newcomb (likely takes a BIG deal to move him), Julio (likely going nowhere unless you find a sucker)

    That leaves you with 9 guys - Touki, Fried, Soroka, Gohara, Wilson, Allard, Parsons, and at some point Weigel and Anderson for the #5 slot and not enough slots at Gwinnett for the rest of them - with a GAPING hole in LF and questionable offensive options at SS, CF, and behind the plate.

    If he's scared of moving some of the more highly thought of guys for Realmuto, Haniger, or Peralta because those Pitchers MIGHT reach their ceilings sometime down the road, signing Donaldson was a giant mistake. You just don't do that unless you're making a push, and stopping short of adding the other pieces when they're available SCREAMS the Tex situation all over again. I don't like Pollock's asking price any more than what the rumored returns for the other three options appears to be, but if you're not willing (or can't afford) to pay them why in the *ell did you jump out there and get Donaldson - even for one year??? He's stopping halfway right now - the "to-do list" was upgrading the bench (check), upgrading the pen (meh at best), upgrading a corner OF spot (not even close, but it's fine to argue a healthy Donaldson mitigates that somewhat), and adding someone at the top of the rotation (nope).
    Waters is intersting too. Would prefer a guy that projects to more power though. (2017 Draft Thread)

    If they don't make additions they can expect the same 3-5 win improvement they saw last year. That makes the Braves a 75-78 win team. (What's the best we could hope for in 2018?)


    The Blackjack Dealer

  18. #5873
    Creepy Lurking Stalker
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Posts
    24
    Thanks
    21
    Thanked 9 Times in 2 Posts
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Southcack77 View Post
    I'm skeptical that you can just disregard his work at Yankee Stadium. I think he's just fine as a buy low candidate with upside or as part of a bigger deal.
    if the cost is low yes i agree by low, but reports have been Yankees are asking for alot maybe its posturing?

  19. #5874
    Creepy Lurking Stalker
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Posts
    24
    Thanks
    21
    Thanked 9 Times in 2 Posts
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by mqt View Post
    I doubt Wentz amounts to much more than current day Gray.
    Wentz has a ton of upside.

  20. #5875
    Arbitration Eligible
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    Flowery Branch, GA
    Posts
    2,945
    Thanks
    412
    Thanked 837 Times in 474 Posts
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Rangers have signed Shelby Miller to a 1 year deal
    " The 2018 Braves give fans reason to believe again." - Bowman

  21. #5876
    Sabermetric Slut
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    Your Mom's Basement
    Posts
    13,890
    Thanks
    955
    Thanked 3,913 Times in 2,502 Posts
    Mentioned
    6 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Champman33 View Post
    i realize that and also take into consideration that gray had to deal with the AL East alot but im not willing to give up a 50/55 prospect for him.
    Of course not. I peg Gray as a 2+ WAR guy and he's estimated to get 9-10 in arby. Only way I send a 50 FV guy is if the Yankees eat some salary. That's not likely and the Yankees likely want more than a 45 FV guy. That's why expanding that to add Frazier is a likely situation if talks get deep with Gray.

  22. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to thewupk For This Useful Post:

    Champman33 (01-09-2019),jpx7 (01-09-2019)

  23. #5877
    Anytime Now Frankie...
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Posts
    1,260
    Thanks
    7
    Thanked 411 Times in 264 Posts
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Deester11 View Post
    The sky is falling! We dismissed Roy Clark and Brian Bridges?
    Guess we won't need them with the big trades about to go down.

  24. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Deester11 For This Useful Post:

    Champman33 (01-09-2019),Freshmaker (01-09-2019)

  25. #5878
    Very Flirtatious, but Doubts What Love Is. jpx7's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Posts
    8,245
    Thanks
    21,759
    Thanked 5,020 Times in 2,893 Posts
    Mentioned
    25 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by mqt View Post
    I doubt Wentz amounts to much more than current day Gray.
    Is he even better than a current-day Foles?
    "For all his tattooings he was on the whole a clean, comely looking cannibal."

  26. The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to jpx7 For This Useful Post:

    Champman33 (01-09-2019),Individual-1 (01-09-2019),mqt (01-09-2019),msstate7 (01-09-2019),Super (01-09-2019)

  27. #5879
    10 yr, $185 million Extension zbhargrove's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Bismarck, ND
    Posts
    4,615
    Thanks
    237
    Thanked 953 Times in 638 Posts
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Champman33 View Post
    I know Julio has some control issues but how much of a real upgrade would Gray be? and i sure dont wanna go prospect heavy to get him like the Yankees seem to be asking, MadBum is clearly better but has one year left, I feel like if we are to deal for a starting pitcher it needs to be a clear upgrade with more than 1 year left on their contract.

    Julio ERA 4.49 Whip 1.37

    Gray ERA 4.90 Whip 1.50

    MadBum ERA 3.26 Whip 1.24
    Post Gray's numbers away from Yankee stadium and I think you'll see a better idea why... considering they were much closer to his norms
    Enscheff is the most brilliant baseball mind of our time. No seriously. he's fantastic and really remarkable. You're going to love him. Magnificent. Really great.

  28. #5880
    Expects Yuge Games nsacpi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Posts
    20,365
    Thanks
    1,495
    Thanked 7,308 Times in 4,541 Posts
    Mentioned
    18 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Champman33 View Post
    its crazy to me how teams like the Dbacks (Peralta) Mariners (Haniger) are holding on to them when they should be rebuilding.
    they're not doing a full rebuild...we didn't either as Harry would remind you
    “It's a shame the White House has become an adult day care center. Someone obviously missed their shift this morning.” Senator Bob Corker

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •