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Thread: BA top 10 Braves prospects

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    BA top 10 Braves prospects

    1 - Austin Riley

    2 - Ian Anderson

    3 - Mike Soroka

    4 - Kyle Wright

    5 - Touki Toussaint

    6 - Bryse Wilson

    7 - Drew Waters

    8 - Cristian Pache

    9 - William Contreras

    10 - Luiz Gohara

    Interesting list, Waters > Pache is interesting and Riley #1 most interesting to me.

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    There are some silly geese over at BA.

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    This isn't a great list. I mean, the 10 are probably correct... but not the order.
    "Can a man still be brave if he is afraid? That is the only time a man can be brave." - G.R.R.M (Game of Thrones)

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    Quote Originally Posted by UNCBlue012 View Post
    This isn't a great list. I mean, the 10 are probably correct... but not the order.
    I think the top 5 is about right, you could flop the order anywhich way, but thats not bad. And Waters > Pache isnt crazy, his bat/tools are very good.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Heyward View Post
    I think the top 5 is about right, you could flop the order anywhich way, but thats not bad. And Waters > Pache isnt crazy, his bat/tools are very good.
    It's more the order. The 10 themselves are accurate.
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    Quote Originally Posted by UNCBlue012 View Post
    It's more the order. The 10 themselves are accurate.
    When you are getting into 50fv players, which is what the back end of that top 10 represents, the ranking themselves is pretty meaningless because there is very minimal separation.

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    I still don't get the infactuation with Pache... I understand he's a great defender but I haven't seen the strides offensively everyone else on here is seeing with squinting eyes. He has a long way to go and he has a ton of holes in his game.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Heyward View Post
    1 - Austin Riley

    2 - Ian Anderson

    3 - Mike Soroka

    4 - Kyle Wright

    5 - Touki Toussaint

    6 - Bryse Wilson

    7 - Drew Waters

    8 - Cristian Pache

    9 - William Contreras

    10 - Luiz Gohara

    Interesting list, Waters > Pache is interesting and Riley #1 most interesting to me.
    I can see the logic behind ranking a postion player ahead of all similarly ranked pitchers, and completely understand folks not drinking the “Pache’s floor is Kevin Pillar” koolaid.

    Wilson might be a little high, but I wouldn’t argue too strongly for any ranking of the Soroka/Anderson/Wright/Touki/Gohara group. A couple of those guys need to pan out for the Braves to have any long term success.

    I’m just glad to see Allard finally dropped from these lists.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Enscheff View Post
    I can see the logic behind ranking a postion player ahead of all similarly ranked pitchers, and completely understand folks not drinking the “Pache’s floor is Kevin Pillar” koolaid.

    Wilson might be a little high, but I wouldn’t argue too strongly for any ranking of the Soroka/Anderson/Wright/Touki/Gohara group. A couple of those guys need to pan out for the Braves to have any long term success.

    I’m just glad to see Allard finally dropped from these lists.
    I still think that Pache is way too low. The Kevin Pillar floor comp is silly, but he is still probably the best defensive outfielder in the minors and I think he made the requisite strides necessary to justify a high ranking. He is currently a really high 55 or low 60 in my book. He's really starting to transform his body and you could see the improving power as a result in AA Pearl. It didn't really seem like it cost him much speed either.

    To me, the only thing that he really needs to greatly improve at the moment is his understanding of the strike zone and plate discipline. If he can manage to make those strides offensively while continuing to show growth in his power game, he's easily a top 10 prospect. Obviously there are still some hurdles to him reaching that, but the upside is just too high for me to justify a number 8 ranking.

    I'm also pretty low on Riley. I still think he's a good prospect, but I still have serious questions about his defense and his bat playing at the MLB level.

    Everything else on the list is fine, but I'd order the pitchers at the top a little differently. I'm surprised to see Contreras in the top 10, but I kind of agree with it. I like him, for a catching prospect. I'm always reserved with C prospects because they seem to bust quite often.

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    Quote Originally Posted by zbhargrove View Post
    I still don't get the infactuation with Pache... I understand he's a great defender but I haven't seen the strides offensively everyone else on here is seeing with squinting eyes. He has a long way to go and he has a ton of holes in his game.
    Well, ZB, allow me to retort. He absolutely has made strides. He's not perfect at this point, but an alteration in his swing, more attention to detail and repetition has given him that arrow pointing up description. This is the year to see most of it come together considering they were aggressive with him although he was considered more raw than Derian Cruz at one point. I've seen them both since they signed and I also haven't spoken to anyone that didn't think that Pache would be more than just defense. He's also grown a lot since signing. Infatuation may not be the word as I'd trade Waters or Pache if we got a TOR young pitcher.

    Maybe he's not Acuna, but I think he's about where he should be and will be more. JMHO.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Deester11 View Post
    Well, ZB, allow me to retort. He absolutely has made strides. He's not perfect at this point, but an alteration in his swing, more attention to detail and repetition has given him that arrow pointing up description. This is the year to see most of it come together considering they were aggressive with him although he was considered more raw than Derian Cruz at one point. I've seen them both since they signed and I also haven't spoken to anyone that didn't think that Pache would be more than just defense. He's also grown a lot since signing. Infatuation may not be the word as I'd trade Waters or Pache if we got a TOR young pitcher.

    Maybe he's not Acuna, but I think he's about where he should be and will be more. JMHO.
    I didn't say he hasn't made strides but there are people who actually think he's gonna be ready in 2019 or 2020... unless he really breaks out he has a long long way to go. He has all the raw skills but so do most big time prospects who fail

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    Quote Originally Posted by zbhargrove View Post
    I didn't say he hasn't made strides but there are people who actually think he's gonna be ready in 2019 or 2020... unless he really breaks out he has a long long way to go. He has all the raw skills but so do most big time prospects who fail
    I think its pretty obvious that he still needs at least a year of development time, but I see no reason to think that he couldn't be up by 2020 under the right circumstances. I think a 2020 call up is a perfectly reasonable expectation for Pache.

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    Did we bribe BA to put Riley #1? You know the marlins won't talk about a trade unless it's your #1

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    Quote Originally Posted by msstate7 View Post
    Did we bribe BA to put Riley #1? You know the marlins won't talk about a trade unless it's your #1
    I was pretty surprised. I know reports are that he may be a plus defender, now and I know his power potential is good, but seeing him rated above some of the arms that have proven a lot more than he has is definitely a surprise to me. With JD at third, assuming he remains healthy Riley should get a whole season to prove himself at AAA. It would be nice if he turns out to be a legit power bat.

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    Quote Originally Posted by msstate7 View Post
    Did we bribe BA to put Riley #1? You know the marlins won't talk about a trade unless it's your #1
    Not really that big a stretch when you take everything into a consideration. Which prospect on that list isn't entirely projection or has shown as much at an advanced level?

    Still holding out hope but no matter how high their ceilings are, you can argue that none of the Pitchers have "proven" what he has above A+/AA.
    Waters is intersting too. Would prefer a guy that projects to more power though. (2017 Draft Thread)

    If they don't make additions they can expect the same 3-5 win improvement they saw last year. That makes the Braves a 75-78 win team. (What's the best we could hope for in 2018?)


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    Quote Originally Posted by jimsnores View Post
    I was pretty surprised. I know reports are that he may be a plus defender, now and I know his power potential is good, but seeing him rated above some of the arms that have proven a lot more than he has is definitely a surprise to me. With JD at third, assuming he remains healthy Riley should get a whole season to prove himself at AAA. It would be nice if he turns out to be a legit power bat.
    Soroka without the injury issue would be rated higher. That said he wouldn't even be able on the list if it wasn't for the injury.

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    Dave (Minnesota):

    Is Riley's rise to the top spot have more to do with a rise in his prospect status or a drop in the status of some of the pitchers (Soroka, Wright)? Also do you think he could adjust to playing left field? Thanks.

    J.J. Cooper: I don't think the Braves have a clear No. 1 this year. You could easily make an argument for Soroka (shoulder injury dinged him a little), Wright or Anderson and I could see cases for Toussaint, Wilson, Waters or Pache. The gap from No. 1 to No. 2 on this list last year was pretty significant because Acuña was such a good prospect. The gap from No. 1 to No. 7 on this list is smaller in many ways than the gap from Acuña to No. 2 last year.

    Manu (Mexico):

    Surprising to see Waters ahead of Pache: Pache has a higher seiling IMO; can you explain the reasoning behind that ranking?

    J.J. Cooper: Sure. It's close, but the feedback I got over numerous conversations was that there is a lot more belief in Waters' bat. With Pache, we all know that he is going to provide solid if not excellent defense in center field which is quite valuable. But with the bat, it's still a whole lot of projection with Pache. His 2018 season was a nice step forward, but I feel confident in saying that Waters has a full grade or more better bat and power and Waters, while not the athlete or defender that Pache is, is very solid in both aspects himself (and is a better basestealer). They have different strengths and weaknesses, but to me there isn't a lot of separation between them as prospects.
    Last edited by Braves1976; 12-05-2018 at 07:06 PM.

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    The 1-7 comment is interesting enough. Much more interesting when you see Drew Waters at 7.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Braves1976 View Post
    Dave (Minnesota):

    Is Riley's rise to the top spot have more to do with a rise in his prospect status or a drop in the status of some of the pitchers (Soroka, Wright)? Also do you think he could adjust to playing left field? Thanks.

    J.J. Cooper: I don't think the Braves have a clear No. 1 this year. You could easily make an argument for Soroka (shoulder injury dinged him a little), Wright or Anderson and I could see cases for Toussaint, Wilson, Waters or Pache. The gap from No. 1 to No. 2 on this list last year was pretty significant because Acuña was such a good prospect. The gap from No. 1 to No. 7 on this list is smaller in many ways than the gap from Acuña to No. 2 last year.

    Manu (Mexico):

    Surprising to see Waters ahead of Pache: Pache has a higher seiling IMO; can you explain the reasoning behind that ranking?

    J.J. Cooper: Sure. It's close, but the feedback I got over numerous conversations was that there is a lot more belief in Waters' bat. With Pache, we all know that he is going to provide solid if not excellent defense in center field which is quite valuable. But with the bat, it's still a whole lot of projection with Pache. His 2018 season was a nice step forward, but I feel confident in saying that Waters has a full grade or more better bat and power and Waters, while not the athlete or defender that Pache is, is very solid in both aspects himself (and is a better basestealer). They have different strengths and weaknesses, but to me there isn't a lot of separation between them as prospects.
    He basically said on TC podcast that they discount pitching prospects because of injury concerns. Then said other than Ian Anderson, none of the Braves pitching prospects were finished pieces with no lingering concerns.

    Said scouts all believed in Riley's defense and power and that most scouts now believe the hit tool is adequate for the power.

    Waters over Pache is pretty obvious. Pache has one stint of anything more than singles power in his career -- this past season in one level of A ball.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Southcack77 View Post
    He basically said on TC podcast that they discount pitching prospects because of injury concerns. Then said other than Ian Anderson, none of the Braves pitching prospects were finished pieces with no lingering concerns.

    Said scouts all believed in Riley's defense and power and that most scouts now believe the hit tool is adequate for the power.

    Waters over Pache is pretty obvious. Pache has one stint of anything more than singles power in his career -- this past season in one level of A ball.
    If a young player only has one year in which he’s displayed power, I can’t think of a better scenario than it being his most recent season.

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