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Thread: 2020 Field

  1. #481
    It's OVER 5,000! 57Brave's Avatar
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    Let's deal with what candidates say in context:


    Elizabeth Warren
    ‏Verified account @ewarren

    People come up to me, introduce themselves,

    and then tell me how much student loan debt they have.

    Their debt is keeping them from buying homes, starting businesses,

    and pursuing the careers they want.

    It's time to cancel the debt that is crushing an entire generation.
    The best way to stop a bad guy with a gun is to make sure he doesn’t get a gun.

  2. #482
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    Jodi Sperber, PhD
    ‏ @jsperber
    13h13 hours ago
    Replying to @annehelen

    Seriously. My plan is to have it paid off by the time I am 55.

    That is 9 years from now. For loans I took out in 1998-1999.
    The best way to stop a bad guy with a gun is to make sure he doesn’t get a gun.

  3. #483
    It's OVER 5,000! 57Brave's Avatar
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    you may object to Warrens plan. I'm not so sure I agree with it to the letter

    There is no denying there is a problem that effects each of us. Remaining static for whatever reason is really not a solution but a huge part of the problem itself
    The best way to stop a bad guy with a gun is to make sure he doesn’t get a gun.

  4. #484
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    Great idea to have non-college attendees in the country subsidize those that go to college.

    Can't see any potential fallout due to that decision.
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  5. #485
    It's OVER 5,000! 57Brave's Avatar
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    we agree.

    It is a "great idea" that we subsidize each other.
    As in I help pay for the road you drive to the grocery store on. I help subsidize the electricity where you listen to AM talk radio
    and if you get sick I help subsidize the research that leads to a cure for your illness

    So glad to see you think it a "great idea"
    ...........................

    As a non-college attendee have no problem helping subsidize this person
    She has been paying college loan for 20 years.

    I will pay for my house and land (since 2003) sooner than she pays her ticket to the middle class

    Can we agree we all have a right to upward mobility ?
    The best way to stop a bad guy with a gun is to make sure he doesn’t get a gun.

  6. #486
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    Everyone pays into those concepts that you mention. Non-college attendees don't benefit for some middle/upper class individual to go to college.

    If you don't want debt then go to a city/state school, work while attending and find a job that helps pay for schooling. Its not a difficult concept. I have no sympathy for anyone that willfully signed off on borrowing tens of thousands of dollars and now don't have a good enough job to pay back their obligations.

    I have a 2700 dollar mortgage payment. Anyone want to help me pay that off?
    Last edited by thethe; 04-27-2019 at 07:12 AM.
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  7. #487
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    "Donald Trump will serve a second term as president of the United States.

    It’s over."


    Little Thethe Nov 19, 2020.

  8. #488
    It's OVER 5,000! 57Brave's Avatar
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    yes, Bernie Sanders has advocated for free housing
    ..............

    Robert Byrd used to have a saying "dont tax me, dont tax ye, tax that man behind the tree "

    we all in some way subsidize each other . The sooner that becomes an accepted notion the sooner we can move forward and discuss the hows and whatfors of the social contract.

    Education, health and housing to my mind are "life liberty and the pursuit of happiness"
    How would you define " life lib ... " ???
    Last edited by 57Brave; 04-27-2019 at 07:36 AM.
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  9. #489
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    'Free' housing / 'Free' college is such a misnomer.

    Nothing is free.

    Its a damn shame that such a large portion of this country has completely ditched the idea of personal accountability.
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  10. #490
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    well of course there are qualifications and regulations attached.
    These are intellegent people --- they realized and accounted for your objections long before they even started this conversation.


    you definition ... ?
    The best way to stop a bad guy with a gun is to make sure he doesn’t get a gun.

  11. #491
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    We're 6 pages into this and all 57 has done is to give examples of people being in debt.

    This is not a "policy" it's a bailout. It does literally nothing to address the cause of the debt. In fact, it will only make it worse. Colleges can simply keep raising prices because now they KNOW the govt will take care of it.

    The reason student debt is so terrible is because of government involvement and of course the socialist solution is to double down.

  12. The Following User Says Thank You to sturg33 For This Useful Post:

    acesfull86 (04-27-2019)

  13. #492
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    if you read Warren, she does address "cause of the debt".
    For close to 20 years now.


    one mans bailout is another mans investment.
    The best way to stop a bad guy with a gun is to make sure he doesn’t get a gun.

  14. #493
    Expects Yuge Games nsacpi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by thethe View Post
    Great idea to have non-college attendees in the country subsidize those that go to college.

    Can't see any potential fallout due to that decision.
    the way the tax code is written, low income voters (mostly those without college) pay very little taxes...the way I would frame it is whether college debt should be such a high priority and should have so much money devoted to resolving...I would target the problem more narrowly and focus on predatory for profit institutions who are abusing the system and taking advantage of students while delivering little value
    "I am a victim, I will tell you. I am a victim."

    "I am your retribution."

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    Quote Originally Posted by nsacpi View Post
    the way the tax code is written, low income voters (mostly those without college) pay very little taxes...the way I would frame it is whether college debt should be such a high priority and should have so much money devoted to resolving...I would target the problem more narrowly and focus on predatory for profit institutions who are abusing the system and taking advantage of students while delivering little value
    Lower income families would have increased tax obligations resulting from these plans proposed by the Democratic candidates. The math doesn't work without it.

    The real culprits in this whole mess are the universities. There are no good reasons why tuition rates should be increasing at the rates that they have other than the fact they know free money is available in the form of student loans. Its quite the scheme devised where no cost is too high.
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  16. #495
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    Quote Originally Posted by nsacpi View Post
    the way the tax code is written, low income voters (mostly those without college) pay very little taxes...the way I would frame it is whether college debt should be such a high priority and should have so much money devoted to resolving...I would target the problem more narrowly and focus on predatory for profit institutions who are abusing the system and taking advantage of students while delivering little value
    Reasonable take. We should be objectively quantifying the problem, doing an honest assessment of how and why it came to be, then come up with a solution to actually get at the root issues. Warren’s plan feels like dropping a nuclear bomb on something that may just require a hammer.

  17. #496
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    Quote Originally Posted by thethe View Post
    Lower income families would have increased tax obligations resulting from these plans proposed by the Democratic candidates. The math doesn't work without it.
    that's an assumption...Warren's tax plans dont hit lower income people.
    "I am a victim, I will tell you. I am a victim."

    "I am your retribution."

  18. #497
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    Quote Originally Posted by acesfull86 View Post
    Reasonable take. We should be objectively quantifying the problem, doing an honest assessment of how and why it came to be, then come up with a solution to actually get at the root issues. Warren’s plan feels like dropping a nuclear bomb on something that may just require a hammer.
    there is a problem...but Warren inflates it...in general borrowing for college is a sound idea...but there are some abuses that need to be fixed
    "I am a victim, I will tell you. I am a victim."

    "I am your retribution."

  19. #498
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    Quote Originally Posted by nsacpi View Post
    that's an assumption...Warren's tax plans dont hit lower income people.
    The plan is based on being able to implement a wealth tax on 50+ million in accumulated wealth and collecting on each of those dollars. When that inevitably doesn't happen, as you know it won't, then the tax burden will shift to the middle and lower class as all tax hikes do.
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  20. #499
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    Quote Originally Posted by thethe View Post
    The plan is based on being able to implement a wealth tax on 50+ million in accumulated wealth and collecting on each of those dollars. When that inevitably doesn't happen, as you know it won't, then the tax burden will shift to the middle and lower class as all tax hikes do.
    again you are making assumptions and jumping to conclusions...my own take is that even if Warren or Sanders gets elected large scale student debt forgiveness ain't happening...that's me jumping to a conclusion

    there are some parts of Warren's plan I like, such as subsidies to state university tuition that make them much less costly or even effectively free to the students...I think something like that has a better chance of passing...but even that is a long shot
    Last edited by nsacpi; 04-27-2019 at 10:32 AM.
    "I am a victim, I will tell you. I am a victim."

    "I am your retribution."

  21. #500
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    Quote Originally Posted by nsacpi View Post
    again you are making assumptions and jumping to conclusions
    So your assumption is that the collection on this wealth tax will have a 100% realization?
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