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Thread: Around The Majors 2019

  1. #1881
    Very Flirtatious, but Doubts What Love Is. jpx7's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CyYoung31 View Post
    Oh, I don’t know about that one, Chief.
    We set a high bar for that, as a society, but especially on this forum.
    "For all his tattooings he was on the whole a clean, comely looking cannibal."

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    Quote Originally Posted by BeanieAntics View Post
    Montgomery is almost certainly going to contribute to the Royals, but who cares? The Royals are going to be awful for the next 2.5 years. Like I said, I can see the argument that Montgomery could rebuild value and be flipped, but if the Royals idea was to trade for him and keep him for 2.5 years, then its a really dumb deal albeit relatively inconsequential, and the Royals would have been far better off getting the 35 FV prospect. At least that player would have a chance at being a contributor at some point on a contending team.
    It doesn't have to be either/or. The Royals are unlikely to be competitors in the upcoming seasons barring some clever FA additions and some luck from a mostly barren farm system; however, that doesn't mean they shouldn't try to get better. Montgomery potentially can help them get better while also rebuilding his value into something worth trading for a better prospect than the 35 FV guy Maldonado would have brought back.

  3. #1883
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carp View Post
    It doesn't have to be either/or. The Royals are unlikely to be competitors in the upcoming seasons barring some clever FA additions and some luck from a mostly barren farm system; however, that doesn't mean they shouldn't try to get better. Montgomery potentially can help them get better while also rebuilding his value into something worth trading for a better prospect than the 35 FV guy Maldonado would have brought back.
    Montgomery could probably fairly easily rebuild his value enough to get a 35 prospect........he and MM have pretty much the same value.....i do not get the point being made.
    "This is the end of my presidency. I'm ****ed." - Donald J. Trump, innocent and totally exonerated man, upon hearing a special counsel has been appointed to investigate him.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Carp View Post
    It doesn't have to be either/or. The Royals are unlikely to be competitors in the upcoming seasons barring some clever FA additions and some luck from a mostly barren farm system; however, that doesn't mean they shouldn't try to get better. Montgomery potentially can help them get better while also rebuilding his value into something worth trading for a better prospect than the 35 FV guy Maldonado would have brought back.
    I guess this is just a philosophical disagreement on how rebuilds should be done. I think a team in a rebuilding process needs to embrace the suck and only focus on acquiring future value in the form of bettering their farm system. If that is what the Royals are planning to do with Montgomery, then that might be a better idea than trying to get that value out of Maldonado. If the Royals plan to keep Montgomery for 2.5 years in the hope that he'll turn them into a 67 win team instead of a 65 win team, that is where I have the problem. I think that is stupid. Its the same reason why I was against the signing of Markakis at the outset of our rebuild.

    At the same time, I understand that there will inevitably be some value wasted on a bad rebuilding team and it could make sense to hold on to some assets that you think might contribute to a future competitive window, even if that means wasting some of their best years on a bad team. That is why I was fine with keeping Freeman and would have been fine with keeping Andrelton. I don't think Montgomery fits that role for the Royals and I think its a terrible idea to actually trade for guys whose value you plan on wasting, unless you plan on flipping him for something better later on. Otherwise, just go out and sign one of the dozens of replacement level players for league minimum in order to fill out your roster.

    This move is a lesser extreme than some of the other ones that I think the Royals have screwed up since these players are barely above replacement level themselves, but it does point to an approach that I think will hurt the Royals moving forward.

  5. #1885
    Sabermetric Slut
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    Giants are winning again today.

  6. #1886
    It's OVER 5,000! msstate7's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by thewupk View Post
    Giants are winning again today.
    Personally I hope they keep winning. I just don't think we'll get bumgarner or Smith, but I think some of our competition might. I would love to have smith and like bumgarner though

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    Quote Originally Posted by Super View Post
    Montgomery could probably fairly easily rebuild his value enough to get a 35 prospect........he and MM have pretty much the same value.....i do not get the point being made.
    Are you talking about my point? Have I not said over and over and over at this point that my original post was under the assumption that Montgomery was a free agent at the end of this year? I think we could all agree that this trade would have been stupid under those circumstances, but I was wrong. I'm not sure why I thought his contract was expiring. Then clv made a bad justification for making the trade which started the other discussion while Enscheff and jpx pointed out that he must be looking to flip him for something in the future, a point with which I agreed once I realized he had 2.5 years of control left.

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    Quote Originally Posted by msstate7 View Post
    Personally I hope they keep winning. I just don't think we'll get bumgarner or Smith, but I think some of our competition might. I would love to have smith and like bumgarner though
    I tend to agree. I've said for a while that I think the Braves end up with a guy a tier or two under Smith, like Greene or even Watson.

    Bumgarner can do whatever.
    "Can a man still be brave if he is afraid? That is the only time a man can be brave." - G.R.R.M (Game of Thrones)

    "So we beat on, boats against the current, borne back ceaselessly into the past." - F. Scott Fitzgerald (G. Gatsby)

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    Quote Originally Posted by BeanieAntics View Post
    I guess this is just a philosophical disagreement on how rebuilds should be done. I think a team in a rebuilding process needs to embrace the suck and only focus on acquiring future value in the form of bettering their farm system. If that is what the Royals are planning to do with Montgomery, then that might be a better idea than trying to get that value out of Maldonado. If the Royals plan to keep Montgomery for 2.5 years in the hope that he'll turn them into a 67 win team instead of a 65 win team, that is where I have the problem. I think that is stupid. Its the same reason why I was against the signing of Markakis at the outset of our rebuild.

    At the same time, I understand that there will inevitably be some value wasted on a bad rebuilding team and it could make sense to hold on to some assets that you think might contribute to a future competitive window, even if that means wasting some of their best years on a bad team. That is why I was fine with keeping Freeman and would have been fine with keeping Andrelton. I don't think Montgomery fits that role for the Royals and I think its a terrible idea to actually trade for guys whose value you plan on wasting, unless you plan on flipping him for something better later on. Otherwise, just go out and sign one of the dozens of replacement level players for league minimum in order to fill out your roster.

    This move is a lesser extreme than some of the other ones that I think the Royals have screwed up since these players are barely above replacement level themselves, but it does point to an approach that I think will hurt the Royals moving forward.
    I've never understood the idea of "embrace the suck." IMO, you should never stop trying to get better, even in rebuilding years. That doesn't mean mortgage the future either. Like nsacpi says, you always look for the best value. While obviously you don't want to sacrifice the future, you can add plenty of value guys like the Braves did in 2017 with Dickey, Colon, Garcia, and Sean Rodriguez and still put out the best roster you can for your budget, in hopes of either competing or flipping these guys at the deadline. The Braves managed to only trade Garcia, but he brought back Ynoa who is now solidly among our top 10-15 propsects. I'm sure the goal isn't to only improve 2 wins with such moves, but if a move like this results in that outcome, I also don't see the big deal. The MLB draft isn't like the NFL draft.
    Last edited by Carp; 07-17-2019 at 02:42 PM.

  10. #1890
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carp View Post
    I've never understood the idea of "embrace the suck." IMO, you should never stop trying to get better, even in rebuilding years. That doesn't mean mortgage the future either. Like nsacpi says, you always look for the best value. While obviously you don't want to sacrifice the future, you can add plenty of value guys like the Braves did in 2017 with Dickey, Colon, Garcia, and Sean Rodriguez and still put out the best roster you can for your budget, in hopes of either competing or flipping these guys at the deadline. The Braves managed to only trade Garcia, but he brought back Ynoa who is now solidly among our top 10-15 propsects. I'm sure the goal isn't to only improve 2 wins with such moves, but if a move like this results in that outcome, I also don't see the big deal. The MLB draft isn't like the NFL draft.
    The idea behind embracing the suck is to not waste value on bad teams when that value isn't likely to contribute when your good again. Instead, you should trade that current value when you can in order to get assets that will help your team once you are good again. Its not just about being terrible to get a good draft pick, although that is part of it. But its also about building up a farm system that will eventually develop into a competing MLB roster.

    The Royals already have a very underwhelming farm system that is probably bottom third in the league. They don't have very many MLB assets to trade that would make it better, and their best asset, Merrifield (who is 30), is currently wasting his prime seasons on a terrible team. If there were ever a team that desperately needed to embrace the suck, its the KC Royals. They have a likely seller's market this year and have a prime opportunity to make their future a lot brighter. They should be looking to move Dozier, Merrifield, Soler, Kennedy, Diekman, and any other older asset that they can extract value out of.

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    I love how this board can go 3 pages arguing about a player's value on another team, that Braves will never get, nor want.

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  13. #1892
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nerfherders View Post
    I love how this board can go 3 pages arguing about a player's value on another team, that Braves will never get, nor want.
    Crap. Are We talking about Hayward again
    Coppy

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    It's OVER 5,000! UNCBlue012's Avatar
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    "Can a man still be brave if he is afraid? That is the only time a man can be brave." - G.R.R.M (Game of Thrones)

    "So we beat on, boats against the current, borne back ceaselessly into the past." - F. Scott Fitzgerald (G. Gatsby)

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    Quote Originally Posted by UNCBlue012 View Post
    Wright vs Strasburg
    Julio vs Corbin
    Soroka/Gausman vs ?
    Soroka/Gausman vs scherzer?

    They seems to have the pitching advantage if that's how it plays out. I'm gonna be there Saturday... hopefully it's soroka

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    I see why but I wish Gaus could have had one more minor league start. His last start was good but he got in trouble early and better hitters might have buried him. That said I am not sure when his rehab is up either.
    Coppy

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    Shift Leader CyYoung31's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by msstate7 View Post
    Wright vs Strasburg
    Julio vs Corbin
    Soroka/Gausman vs ?
    Soroka/Gausman vs scherzer?

    They seems to have the pitching advantage if that's how it plays out. I'm gonna be there Saturday... hopefully it's soroka
    They’d have the advantage in almost any matchup.

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    It's OVER 5,000! msstate7's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CyYoung31 View Post
    They’d have the advantage in almost any matchup.
    Yeah, I guess you're right... assuming scherzer pitches

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    Quote Originally Posted by CyYoung31 View Post
    They’d have the advantage in almost any matchup.
    Except when Stras pitches. We own him.

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    Quote Originally Posted by UNCBlue012 View Post
    I expected Wright to run with his chance in the rotation at the beginning of this year, but it was clear he wasn't executing/locating his pitches at all.

    It will be very interesting to see if he has figured anything out.

    I'm still probably the high man on Wright around here.
    I think he (Teheran) finishes with a FIP ~3.3. -CrazyTrain 3/25/2019

    Gausman had a bad walk ratio for us -CrazyTrain 11/20/2018
    BB/9 with Braves: 2.72

    Fried, Newk and a couple other guys for Bumgarner and give him a pay day for 6ish years -CrazyTrain 10/15/18

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    Quote Originally Posted by Enscheff View Post
    I expected Wright to run with his chance in the rotation at the beginning of this year, but it was clear he wasn't executing/locating his pitches at all.

    It will be very interesting to see if he has figured anything out.

    I'm still probably the high man on Wright around here.
    Probably right there with you. Wasn’t there mention of him and Carle tipping pitches last time up?

    For some reason I feel like this time he makes a case to stay. I was really impressed the last time up with the stuff, but the location was really lacking.

    He’s been on a heater at Gwinnett.
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