The Coronavirus, not the beer

[sturg33]

And the "it would have been the same" argument suffers from the same flaw. You can't prove it with that data set. You need a control group which is almost impossible as even small difference between cities in things like public transportation, population density, and climate can cause significant differences.

I don't think mask mandates are effective, especially not in the US. I'm just saying you're throwing out conclusions you can't make based on the data.

Please look up the study that was done that actually had a controlled randomized trial

[thethe]

I actually see this as a condemnation of parenting. My kid got more time outside and more physical activity during the lockdowns than at any other point in his life. The air was clean, the weather was great, and there was precious little else to do.

Blame the parents who were put in an impossible situation?

Some people will defend what we as a society have done till the end.

[striker42]

Child abuse and those that perpetuate these measures either via masking or lockdowns or vaccinations are contributing to the madness that is crippling children.

What a joke of a society we are.

I'm still completely at a loss as to how putting a piece of cloth across a kid's face in public or how a vaccine is child abuse. It seems your definition of child abuse is any parenting decisions you disagree with. Is a bedtime earlier or later than you think advisable child abuse? A poor choice in bedtime can have negative effects on a child so wouldn't that meet the bar of child abuse?

[sturg33]

I actually see this as a condemnation of parenting. My kid got more time outside and more physical activity during the lockdowns than at any other point in his life. The air was clean, the weather was great, and there was precious little else to do.

Sure fella.

They closed parks. They closed beaches. They cancelled sports. They told parents their kids could kill them if they are exposed.

Good for you for not being a total sheep on your own kid but the rest of society was encouraged to parent in fear, as they still are as evidenced by forced masking on 2 year olds and college vaccinated kids not allowed to go to a dining hall

Wake up

[striker42]

Blame the parents who were put in an impossible situation?

Some people will defend what we as a society have done till the end.

No, I'm just someone who puts the responsibility of parenting on the parent. If society makes a bad choice that makes your job as a parent harder, tough. You're still the parent and it's still your responsibility to raise your kid. Parenting is one long succession of difficult situations that you have to navigate and it's your job as a parent to navigate them. If you fail, it's on you. If you succeed, it's on you.

[thethe]

I'm still completely at a loss as to how putting a piece of cloth across a kid's face in public or how a vaccine is child abuse. It seems your definition of child abuse is any parenting decisions you disagree with. Is a bedtime earlier or later than you think advisable child abuse? A poor choice in bedtime can have negative effects on a child so wouldn't that meet the bar of child abuse?

Putting an obstruction over their mouth so they have a dirty piece of cloth is at the very worst unhygienic.

Then the psychology of not being able to see your friends smile or react to you. The idea of not seeing mouths move for toddlers to learn language.

This is basic psychology and the fact you are arguing against it being child abuse is very strange to me.

[sturg33]

I'm still completely at a loss as to how putting a piece of cloth across a kid's face in public or how a vaccine is child abuse. It seems your definition of child abuse is any parenting decisions you disagree with. Is a bedtime earlier or later than you think advisable child abuse? A poor choice in bedtime can have negative effects on a child so wouldn't that meet the bar of child abuse?

Stop conflating individual decisions with government mandates

[thethe]

No, I'm just someone who puts the responsibility of parenting on the parent. If society makes a bad choice that makes your job as a parent harder, tough. You're still the parent and it's still your responsibility to raise your kid. Parenting is one long succession of difficult situations that you have to navigate and it's your job as a parent to navigate them. If you fail, it's on you. If you succeed, it's on you.

Well not everyone has the situation you (lawyer) or me (finance) that other people have.

We are lucky but it seems that you may just be using your own experiences to justify what we have done to children which is unfortunate.

[thethe]

Sure fella.

They closed parks. They closed beaches. They cancelled sports. They told parents their kids could kill them if they are exposed.

Good for you for not being a total sheep on your own kid but the rest of society was encouraged to parent in fear, as they still are as evidenced by forced masking on 2 year olds and college vaccinated kids not allowed to go to a dining hall

Wake up

The defense is startling.

[thethe]

Imagine trying to impress your first girl at 8 years old and you can't even see if she is smiling at you?

Not child abuse......

[thethe]

Imagine the sweat and filth building in that mask all day and then kids get acne which impact their confidence.

Not child abuse....

[thethe]

And all for nothing. Masks do nothing. Kids are not at risk at all (statistically).

We are doing far more harm.

Someone needs to explain why we never thought of doing this for the flu even though it kills more children while also acknowledging that all studies show that children are not material vectors of the CCP virus.

[sturg33]

Kids in NYC are only allowed to whisper with their mask on. They can take their mask off to eat, but cannot talk. They must sit alone and look forward during lunch time while not talking.

All bc adults are scared little bitches

[striker42]

Well not everyone has the situation you (lawyer) or me (finance) that other people have.

We are lucky but it seems that you may just be using your own experiences to justify what we have done to children which is unfortunate.

I freely admit that my situation is easier than other have. However, parenting is an area that I don't cut anyone any slack. You have a kid, that kid is your responsibility. You have a fundamental right to raise that kid how you see fit and with that comes responsibility.

My belief in parental responsibility goes far beyond Covid. I don't think there's anything that the government is responsible for in raising your kid. Not even education. Ultimate the responsibility lies with the parent on everything.

[striker42]

Imagine trying to impress your first girl at 8 years old and you can't even see if she is smiling at you?

Not child abuse......

Imagine trying to impress your first girl at 8 years old and your parents forced you to wear some dorky looking clothes. Child abuse?

[striker42]

Imagine the sweat and filth building in that mask all day and then kids get acne which impact their confidence.

Not child abuse....

Imagine a parent deciding to not let their 13 year old girl wear makeup to school which impacts her confidence. Child abuse?

[thethe]

As Sturg said. You are conflating a completely irrelevant situation with the government forcing muzzles over kids faces. Just a disgusting equivalent with all due respect.

[nsacpi]

If you fail, it's on you. If you succeed, it's on you.

You're half right there. I'll let you figure out which half.

[striker42]

I want to delve into this child abuse angle more so I looked up the law in Georgia. In Georgia, the crime is called Cruelty to Children. There are a couple different levels and different ways to commit it but the most relevant language to this discussion is when someone causes "a child under the age of 18 cruel or excessive physical or mental pain."

But to know where that line is you have to look at the cases which are absolutely stomach churning. Where you see physical abuse arise in when the force used on a child is excessive. You see cases of a child being whipped for hours causing wounds or a child being beaten with a belt until they're bruised across much of their body. Mental pain is crossed in cases of things like murdering or raping someone in front of the child or molesting the child.

Basically, bad parenting does not equal child abuse. Parents have a lot of latitude in how they parent. There are things other parents do that I think are wrong and have a negative impact on the child. But a negative impact does not equal child abuse.

[sturg33]

Lol the religious cult is strong