Second ('Third') Trump Presidency Thread

thethe said:
Expecting actors like China/Russia to respect the rule of law without heavy enforcemnt is a fools errand.
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I don't expect them to respect rule of law. They certainly do not to the extent to which I think they should. But I also think we have the power and tools to constrain them without abandoning our principles. I'm not saying any of this is easy. Reasonable people will disagree about the restraints we should operate within. But to abandon all restraints would mean Russia and China have won. Their vision of a world where rule of man and raw power operate will have prevailed.
 
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nsacpi said:
I don't expect them to respect rule of law. They certainly to not to the extent to which I think they should. But I also think we have the power and tools to constrain them without abandoning our principles. I'm not saying any of this is easy. Reasonable people will disagree about the restraints we should operate within. But to abandon all restraints would mean Russia and China have won. Their vision of a world where rule of man and raw power operate will have prevailed.
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Seems like the abandoned restraints are going to consolidated US power (and our allies in the middle east) so that we can be a better enforcement engine around the world.
 
chop2chip said:
Is Ukraine not an example of heavy enforcement of the rule of law?
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Indeed. An important component of which has been the arrest warrant issued for Putin by International Criminal Court. There are very important principles involved and we should not abandon them.
 
thethe said:
Mine too - US needs to be as strong as possible to enforce or else its meaningless.
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I think we have tried to follow legal procedures in indicting and now bringing Maduro to trial. There is a precedent from what happened to Noreiga.
 
thethe said:
What legal precedent existed to bomb Irans nuclear facilities?
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I think it is a gray area but I think there is some legal justification on national security grounds to take action against a hostile country acquiring a nuclear bomb.
 
thethe said:
Is China weaker today because we control Venezuelan oil?
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Yes. But I would ask a different question. Are we subverting and weakening rule of law by taking control of Venezuela's oil?

In this case I would argue oil is fungible and the effect on China is very small. The effect on undermining rule of law and respect for sovereignty is larger. In the end this whole operation might embolden China to become even more heavy-handed with its neighbors.
 
nsacpi said:
Yes. But I would ask a different question. Are we subverting and weakening rule of law by taking control of Venezuela's oil?

In this case I would argue oil is fungible and the effect on China is very small. The effect on undermining rule of law and respect for sovereignty is larger.
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Rule of law is meaningless if that includes allowing a rogue state to be infiltrated by our enemies to plot our destruction. If you dont' think that was happening then its hard to agree on anything within this discussion.
 
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