Sherman: Braves offered Heyward 80M after 2013

[50PoundHead]

We are just looking at the first 5 years, champ, maybe you missed that?

Winfield's wOBA - .344
Heyward's wOBA - .342

Winfield's wRC+ - 116
Heyward's wRC+ - 115

Winfield's oWAR - 59.1
Heywards's o WAR - 72.1

Winfields' ISO - .151
Heyward's ISO - .165

Again.......for the first 5 years, Heyward has been just as good as Winfield offensively, you can argue he's actually been better.

It's the next seven that will make the difference for good or ill depending on where you sit on the comparison in the first place. Heyward has had one season better than the worst season Winfield had in years six through twelve of Winfield's career. Not saying Heyward cannot match those numbers, but Winfield was a pretty awesome force in his prime.

I watched Winfield up close when he played for the University of Minnesota. Saw him live several times (both on the baseball diamond and the basketball court). Just an absolutely stellar athlete. I saw him leg out a triple and it was like he only took two strides between second and third base (although I know he took more). And he pitched as well as playing RF. This was in an era before strength training (not that Winfield needed any strength training), but he was totally ripped and, as such, really stood out.

 

[yeezus]

We are just looking at the first 5 years, champ, maybe you missed that?

Winfield's wOBA - .344
Heyward's wOBA - .342

Winfield's wRC+ - 116
Heyward's wRC+ - 115

Winfield's oWAR - 59.1
Heywards's o WAR - 72.1

Winfields' ISO - .151
Heyward's ISO - .165

Again.......for the first 5 years, Heyward has been just as good as Winfield offensively, you can argue he's actually been better.

Cherry picking at its finest. Wanna extend it to 6 seasons, or na? Because Jason has been trending down across the board for 3 years now. I guess you're super impressed, but no one else is. And when you say "Heyward is basically already Winfield" you're just wrong. So far, Heyward is not on pace to come close to the Winfield comparison. He would have to drastically improve instead of getting worse. He's getting worse.

 

[BRule]

It's the next seven that will make the difference for good or ill depending on where you sit on the comparison in the first place. Heyward has had one season better than the worst season Winfield had in years six through twelve of Winfield's career. Not saying Heyward cannot match those numbers, but Winfield was a pretty awesome force in his prime.

I watched Winfield up close when he played for the University of Minnesota. Saw him live several times (both on the baseball diamond and the basketball court). Just an absolutely stellar athlete. I saw him leg out a triple and it was like he only took two strides between second and third base (although I know he took more). And he pitched as well as playing RF. This was in an era before strength training (not that Winfield needed any strength training), but he was totally ripped and, as such, really stood out.

100% agree with this

The point was to the people who have been saying Heyward is a disappoint or think he was supposed to Barry Bonds or someone else. Scouts compared him to Winfield, so far....the first 5 years....he's been similar. Obviously he needs to sustain and get better to have Winfield's career.

 

[yeezus]

100% agree with this

The point was to the people who have been saying Heyward is a disappoint or think he was supposed to Barry Bonds or someone else. Scouts compared him to Winfield, so far....the first 5 years....he's been similar. Obviously he needs to sustain and get better to have Winfield's career.

He's been regressing mightily when he needs to improve drastically. Do you see him becoming Winfield at this point? Please tell me you do, I'll die of laughter.

 

[BRule]

Cherry picking at its finest. Wanna extend it to 6 seasons, or na? Because Jason has been trending down across the board for 3 years now. I guess you're super impressed, but no one else is. And when you say "Heyward is basically already Winfield" you're just wrong. So far, Heyward is not on pace to come close to the Winfield comparison. He would have to drastically improve instead of getting worse. He's getting worse.

Are you slow? Did Heyward steal your comp?

When did I say Heyward was Winfield? Obviously you have reading comprehension problems.

Why would we compare 6 years when Heyward has only played 5? That doesn't seem to make sense to me.....after this year, feel free to comp the first 6 years of both.

 

[BRule]

He's been regressing mightily when he needs to improve drastically. Do you see him becoming Winfield at this point? Please tell me you do, I'll die of laughter.

If he gets healthy, there's no reason Jason can't be a top player in this league. If he doesn't overcome the injuries, then he's obviously not going to have Winfield's career.

 

[yeezus]

Are you slow? Did Heyward steal your comp?

When did I say Heyward was Winfield? Obviously you have reading comprehension problems.

Why would we compare 6 years when Heyward has only played 5? That doesn't seem to make sense to me.....after this year, feel free to comp the first 6 years of both.

You said he has basically lived up to the Dave Winfield comp. No, he hasn't, and he's trending AWAY from that comp, not towards it. I can cherry pick numbers too, and use things other than the mean to show Heyward is not Winfield, even the first 5 seasons.

 

[sturg33]

He's been regressing mightily when he needs to improve drastically. Do you see him becoming Winfield at this point? Please tell me you do, I'll die of laughter.

I'm not sure what you want. They've both played 5 full seasons and the comps show Heyward as equal or better. Your hatred of Heyward is blinding you to facts

 

[BRule]

You said he has basically lived up to the Dave Winfield comp. No, he hasn't, and he's trending AWAY from that comp, not towards it. I can cherry pick numbers too, and use things other than the mean to show Heyward is not Winfield, even the first 5 seasons.

Clearly you can't read and comprehend words, nor do you understand baseball or baseball statistics. I'm not going back and forth with you anymore....everyone else understands what has been said. Keep hatin' on bruh.

 

[Enscheff]

Just so I am clear...

We are comparing Jason Heyward to Dave Winfield, the HOFer with 3110 hits and 465 HRs? The guy whose OPS+ over his early career went like this:

106 (not even close to a full season)
115
116
135
124
151
166

While Heyward's went like this so far:

131
93
117
114
106
80

If Heyward recovers to put up a 150 OPS+ year this season, then we can talk. Until then, just stop, please.

It should be beyond obvious that Heyward most likely isn't going to become the player we all hoped for. And certainly NOT the next Dave Winfield.

 

[thethe]

Are you slow? Did Heyward steal your comp?

When did I say Heyward was Winfield? Obviously you have reading comprehension problems.

Why would we compare 6 years when Heyward has only played 5? That doesn't seem to make sense to me.....after this year, feel free to comp the first 6 years of both.

Are you including Winfields first year when he had 150 PA's?

 

[thethe]

Just so I am clear...

We are comparing Jason Heyward to Dave Winfield, the HOFer with 3110 hits and 465 HRs? The guy whose OPS+ over his early career went like this:

106
115
116
135
124
151
166

While Heyward's went like this so far:

131
93
117
114
106
80

If Heyward recovers to put up a 150 OPS+ year this season, then we can talk. Until then, just stop, please.

It should be beyond obvious that Heyward most likely isn't going to become the player we all hoped for. And certainly NOT the next Dave Winfield.

Owned!

 

[BRule]

Just so I am clear...

We are comparing Jason Heyward to Dave Winfield, the HOFer with 3110 hits and 465 HRs? The guy whose OPS+ over his early career went like this:

106 (not even close to a full season)
115
116
135
124
151
166

While Heyward's went like this so far:

131
93
117
114
106
80

If Heyward recovers to put up a 150 OPS+ year this season, then we can talk. Until then, just stop, please.

It should be beyond obvious that Heyward most likely isn't going to become the player we all hoped for. And certainly NOT the next Dave Winfield.

Again....we have established Winfield had more power, 113 OPS+ vs 128 for the first 5 years. Obviously the injuries don't help Heyward. Take a look at all of the stats and numbers and they are similar players with similar value (Although advanced stats say Heyward was more valuable) If you don't want to admit that, not my issue. Numbers are what they are.

 

[thethe]

Again....we have established Winfield had more power, obviously the injuries don't help Heyward. Take a look at all of the stats and numbers and they are similar players, if you don't want to admit that, not my issue. Numbers are what they are.

And if you are going to ignore that Jason has not even closely resembled the player from his rookei season then that is not our issue as well.

Jason is clearly trending down. I hope he figures out how to fix his swing and realize that potential but at this point I would bet against it.

 

[BRule]

And if you are going to ignore that Jason has not even closely resembled the player from his rookei season then that is not our issue as well.

Jason is clearly trending down. I hope he figures out how to fix his swing and realize that potential but at this point I would bet against it.

Dude.......how are you guys this slow? No one said what Heyward was going to be......we are talking about his first 5 years. ****

 

[thethe]

Dude.......how are you guys this slow? No one said what Heyward was going to be......we are talking about his first 5 years. ****

And of course including that fist year where Winfield had 150 PA's because if we extended it to the first five FULL seasons then it would look bad.

 

[BRule]

And of course including that fist year where Winfield had 150 PA's because if we extended it to the first five FULL seasons then it would look bad.

Use whatever year you want, they are still similar.....here, use his 6th year. Still similar, Winfield, again....more power, no one is saying otherwise. For whatever reason people want to make Heyward out to be some scrub who never lived up to his "potential" it's just bull**** and that's the point of posting Heyward's comp coming out of High School and the side by side stats. People are posting laughing at Heyward's first 5 years because they are SLIGHTLY worse than Winfield, who's a HOF'er. It's a joke and it's the ex-Braves-itis at it's finest.

Winfield's wOBA - .354
Heyward's wOBA - .342

Winfield's wRC+ - 123
Heyward's wRC+ - 115

Winfield's oWAR - 91.0
Heywards's o WAR - 72.1

Winfields' ISO - .168
Heyward's ISO - .165

 

[NinersSBChamps]

So...

Jason Heyward=Dave Winfield

 

[Tapate50]

Head ASPLODE

So...

Jason Heyward=Dave Winfield

 

[Heyward]

The hatred for Heyward goes way beyond the defending of Heyward.

que the "I love Heyward but..." posts

None of the so called Heyward bashers hate Heyward.

It's just funny the Hart haters/Heyward defenders acted like it was one of the worst trades all-time.

Yet now that he isnt hitting well yet, it's crickets.

Does well in Game 1, Heyward homers come out, since then __________________