*sigh* I didn't say he wasn't being pitched to by Cubans. I give up.
Farewell to Wood, Peraza, Jimmy Johns, and Avilans.
- Thread starter CrimsonCowboy
- Start date
*sigh* I didn't say he wasn't being pitched to by Cubans. I give up.
His FIP last year was 3.25 vs. 3.4 this year. He's essentially 1 start from having equal peripherals.
If the funky delivery was such a concern, why did we draft him in the 2nd round?
I don't see how you can judge bat speed on a guy facing batting practice and Cuban pitching and use it as your basis vs. a guy scouting him this year in American baseball. The guy may be wrong for sure, but where would you place more stock in?
chop2chip
Well-known member
Upside or downside, the Braves traded 4 years of Alex Wood (who isn't likely to get better) for 6 years of Olivera. This isn't a situation where we are looking to invest past this season's, so concerning ourselves with Olivera's age 35 season doesn't really concern me. Now he could be garbage so there is something to be said concerning the risk of the unknown, but if he's a 4 WAR player (very possible) then this is trade will work itself out splendidly.
Every pitcher's velocity declines and most pitchers' K rates drop, at least for a time. These are not huge negatives against Alex Wood. The fact that we allowed them to be is, once again, an indictment of us.
If we came to the negotiating table and said, 'Look, we know Alex Wood is a big risk of injury,' then shame on us. Equating the risk of Wood with the risk of Olivera is absurd.
Haha what? Olivera has higher upside than Wood? Especially Wood and Peraza combined?
No, its just what I think. I'm not claiming to be right. Am I not allowed to share my opinions here?
They also traded 6 years of Peraza, Avilan, and JJ. I don't see why Wood is likely to not get better since he's 24 years old. We got slightly over 5 years of Olivera, but I don't see how he's very possibly a 4 WAR player....hell, ignoring, the majority of projections; he can't even stay on the field.
I don't know. YOu'll have to ask the people in charge at the time. It ended up being a great pick nonetheless. I'm really not too sure what that has to do with his future though.
50PoundHead
Hessmania Forever
Whose saying thats what the Braves are doing here? What if Friedman went to them and the Braves have always felt this way as well.
I'd much rather trade someone one year too early. Again, we would have been railing the Braves for trading Hanson after year 2 but in the end anything we got back would have been a positive.
As I've said numerous times...I don't think the trade was necessarily a good deal. I just don't agree that its this disaster that its being made out to be and that Hart went out on some bender to destroy the franchise.
And the Braves got back a top 30 pick in what is said to be a loaded draft and a pitcher with a very projecatble arm. This trade is really about Wood vs. Olivera if you ask me. But at the same time, I wouldn't have minded to hang onto Peraza.
I'll make this as simple as I can in terms of why I dislike the trade:
I don't care about the JJ/Avilan/Paco/Bird/pick portion of the deal. I think we did fine there, and I like the pick we got. Had the entire deal been JJ and Avilan for the pick alone, it would have been a good deal.
What I care about is the Peraza, Wood, Olivera portion, as I imagine most do. And I'm not even that concerned about Peraza being in it. I understand if front offices don't see Peraza with tons of value.
But in comparing these three:
Age - obviously in favor of the Dodgers, which is kind of strange, given the relative position of the two teams
Risk - in favor of the Dodgers, and I don't know how anyone can say differently
Talent - in favor of the Dodgers overall
Total years of control - in favor of the Dodgers
That ain't good.
I don't care about the JJ/Avilan/Paco/Bird/pick portion of the deal. I think we did fine there, and I like the pick we got. Had the entire deal been JJ and Avilan for the pick alone, it would have been a good deal.
What I care about is the Peraza, Wood, Olivera portion, as I imagine most do. And I'm not even that concerned about Peraza being in it. I understand if front offices don't see Peraza with tons of value.
But in comparing these three:
Age - obviously in favor of the Dodgers, which is kind of strange, given the relative position of the two teams
Risk - in favor of the Dodgers, and I don't know how anyone can say differently
Talent - in favor of the Dodgers overall
Total years of control - in favor of the Dodgers
That ain't good.
Show me proof that bat speed slows down when the level of play goes up. I don't know of anyone's bat speed slowing down then they got to the Majors.
I disagree on the talent portion. There have been many talent evaulators who have seen Olivera play that think he can be an impact bat. And since all we hear about his how much more rare hitting is I think that puts talent in the corner of the Braves here.
SO you would trade Peraza, JJ, Avilan, for a draft pick, a not top 200 reliever prospect, and a promising LOOGY that is out for the year?
I certainly wouldn't trade Wood straight up for Olivera either. Maybe a cost controlled corner outfielder in his mid 20s with good projection.
yeezus
It's OVER 5,000!
of the two negative articles posted, one of them wasn't very negative at all. the SI one stated the obvious: if he can't get on the field, it will be a terrible trade. well, no ****.
Peraza's prospect light is dimming according to some. I still like what he could become, but he better hit .300 or he's not much. hitting .300 will be hard to do with his power (or lack thereof).
How can we just dismiss Wood's drop in velo? People keep saying he's doing it on purpose. Well, his velo is down, and so are his results, so maybe he should try and ramp it up again? Get back last year's results? The "purposeful" drop in velo doesn't appear to be working.
I like the players we gave up. But I also really like Olivera, and so do a lot of people. And he should be a massive bargain.
Peraza's prospect light is dimming according to some. I still like what he could become, but he better hit .300 or he's not much. hitting .300 will be hard to do with his power (or lack thereof).
How can we just dismiss Wood's drop in velo? People keep saying he's doing it on purpose. Well, his velo is down, and so are his results, so maybe he should try and ramp it up again? Get back last year's results? The "purposeful" drop in velo doesn't appear to be working.
I like the players we gave up. But I also really like Olivera, and so do a lot of people. And he should be a massive bargain.
I don't care what the Braves feel about Wood's future. Believing Wood is at risk of injury in the future is a reason to trade him; it is not a reason to take lesser value for him. If the Dodgers also feel that way, go to someone else. You just don't allow them to lessen his value because they see him as a risk going forward. You tell him he is a good #2 at 24 years old, he has been a good #2 for 3 years now, and that is his price. If they want a good #2, they will pay the price for a good #2. And if they aren't willing, you back away. It's not complicated.
No one ever said this trade destroys the franchise. But it is a bad deal and is not a good sign for possible future moves.
sturg33
I
Oh. Are we back to evaluating deals based on years of control now?
Since Avilan/JJ don't have much value then I think if the Braves really liked the draft and this pitcher then I could see this trade being a right value swap. I think we are underselling the ceiling of this pitcher. But the liklihood of him reaching the ceiling seems low. I bet the Braves are banking that they can develop him better than other teams can.