So, we can arrest Kim Davis now, right?

sturg33 said:
I don't reckon you ever said you're cool with it. Only 57 went to those lengths.

But you didn't condemn it, like you're doing here.

Carry on
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I don't remember being involved in a "let's cut the faces off unwanted babies" discussion, but knowing you, there's a lot more to it than just that.
 
it's also odd christians try and take away other's rights and hold others as less than them, but feel they are the ones under attack. the mental gymnastics of nut jobs.
 
yeezus said:
it's also odd christians try and take away other's rights and hold others as less than them, but feel they are the ones under attack. the mental gymnastics of nut jobs.
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I'm more annoyed at attacks on business owners and the like. I don't like a Christian baker being forced to bake a cake, as I've said numerous times. The same goes the other way around
 
yeezus said:
*God makes gay people*
God: "Sinner! You'll burn in hell for this!"
But didn't you make them, God?
God: "Ah, ****."
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Creation
Fall
Redemption
New Creation

That's the theological paradigm that I use, and a rather basic Christian anthropology. The way you've characterized the view leaves out the critical importance of the Fall. Of course you don't have to agree with our view, but I think you ought to deal with it fairly and not present a caricature.
 
zitothebrave said:
But if you can't do your job, then you should step down. I'm all for conscientious objectors. But what you're basically saying is someone should join the army as a pacifist and be allowed not to participate in war, or maintaining war machines, or so on so forth. Which I don't agree with.
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There's one aspect of her job that she's asking for accommodation on - not the entire job. The accommodation isn't a substantial one.

And no, that is not what I'm saying and that you think is evidence that you aren't clearly thinking about this. She didn't run for the clerk's position on a platform of being anti-clerk or that clerking is sinful.
 
BedellBrave said:
Was pointing out the hole in your analogy. I'm really not pushing for a grandfathering clause as much as continuing the American tradition of allowing for conscientious objectors, something that should, imho, be advocated by the Left and Right - and especially for freedom lovers.
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she isn't a judge

she signs documents for marriage
 
BedellBrave said:
I'm thinking that you are unfairly describing this. She isn't so much as seeking to impose her views on others as she is trying to not have her name, but rather her office, used on the licenses. Why that's such a hard accommodation to grant is beyond me. And why you guys get so exercised against her really, honestly, seems to speak more about you than it does her.

I also don't quite understand how you, of all posters, don't get how one can have a conscientious objection to certain laws. I had viewed you as a champion of such.
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i do

when your view on objection of laws is to make sure that others aren't treated as equal then

you can gtfo with that cause it is the opposite of what i view.
 
yeezus said:
it's also odd christians try and take away other's rights and hold others as less than them, but feel they are the ones under attack. the mental gymnastics of nut jobs.
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No mental gymnastics. A clerk is asking for a reasonable accommodation. Or history proves that this is fairly commonplace, and right or wrong, we generally try to grant such because we value conscientious objection. To not do so smells of Statism.

Our problem is though, is that we tend to only support conscientious objectors that share our views - when it is wisest, imho, to support those that differ from us, for the sake of all.
 
I also think it's ridiculous that "my side" has stooped to crapping on her past. That has nothing at all to do with her doing her job. It's petty bull****.
 
BedellBrave said:
There's one aspect of her job that she's asking for accommodation on - not the entire job. The accommodation isn't a substantial one.

And no, that is not what I'm saying and that you think is evidence that you aren't clearly thinking about this. She didn't run for the clerk's position on a platform of being anti-clerk or that clerking is sinful.
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And you can join the army and not think that the country will be going to war. My point still largely stands. THere's a difference between objecting, and breaking the law. If she cannot do her job, then she shouldn't do it. If she refuses to then we're in the situation we're in now. She will not go to hell because her name is on a certificate.
 
I can see it now. She dies and meets God and he says "Kim, you lived a very sinful life but you repented and were born again, thats cool and all but about these gay marriage certificates with your name on it, I condemn the to eternal damnation!" Is that really a God I want to worship in the first place?
 
Dalyn said:
I also think it's ridiculous that "my side" has stooped to crapping on her past. That has nothing at all to do with her doing her job. It's petty bull****.
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maybe

not saying it has anything to do with her job

if i was her, i wouldn't be casting stones etc though knowing her past
 
zitothebrave said:
And you can join the army and not think that the country will be going to war. My point still largely stands. THere's a difference between objecting, and breaking the law. If she cannot do her job, then she shouldn't do it. If she refuses to then we're in the situation we're in now. She will not go to hell because her name is on a certificate.
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On the last sentence - I agree. But my call is not to determine what her view is on that.

She can do her job - just not that aspect of it and she's asked for what seems to be a reasonable accommodation that Kentucky statute would allow for (again if the WaPo editorial is correct).
 
cajunrevenge said:
I can see it now. She dies and meets God and he says "Kim, you lived a very sinful life but you repented and were born again, thats cool and all but about these gay marriage certificates with your name on it, I condemn the to eternal damnation!" Is that really a God I want to worship in the first place?
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But I suspect that is not what she is saying or believing. It's a straw man.
 
Dalyn said:
I'm sure she feels like her god has forgiven her for her past.
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i'm sure she does

that doesn't mean she gets to stand on her soapbox and preach down to others now though and treat them as 2nd class citizens.
 
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