Extent Ender

sturg33 said:
Isn't Ender just a worse version of Heyward? And you seem to really not be a fan of Heyward
Click to expand...

seriously, this again?
i'll say it again: I never had a problem with Heyward's game while he was here. Loved watching him play. Was sad when he was traded. That said, I didn't want to pay him $22M+ per year for 6-10 years.
That's not to say I don't like a player, think he sucks, can't play, etc. Not even close, really. Surely you understand that.

Oh and this year, Heyward has been way worse than Ender.
 
sturg33 said:
Isn't Ender just a worse version of Heyward? And you seem to really not be a fan of Heyward
Click to expand...

"not really being a fan of Heyward" is really the same thing as "not wanting to pay Heyward 20-22 million a year?"

You're better than that. Don't skew what people say when you know you're doing it on purpose.
 
Sorry if I'm missing something... but yeezus seems to be suggesting we should extend Inciarte bc he is a 3-5 WIN player.

Thos wins are primarily defensive driven - much like Heyward. And he undoubtedly a worse hitter than Heyward (this year not withstanding)...

So why is investing the money in Heyward a bad investment, while investing the money in Inciarte is not? Unless he thinks Inciarte will command much less $/WAR than Heyward?

For the record - I'm in favor of extenting Inciarte
 
sturg33 said:
Sorry if I'm missing something... but yeezus seems to be suggesting we should extend Inciarte bc he is a 3-5 WIN player.

Thos wins are primarily defensive driven - much like Heyward. And he undoubtedly a worse hitter than Heyward (this year not withstanding)...

So why is investing the money in Heyward a bad investment, while investing the money in Inciarte is not? Unless he thinks Inciarte will command much less $/WAR than Heyward?

For the record - I'm in favor of extenting Inciarte
Click to expand...

Because defense in center > defense in right. If you can get Ender to sign for cheap then go for it. But I doubt many would be happy for extending Ender if he signed for market value or slightly less.
 
smootness said:
I should have said that there's more evidence to support the notion that he doesn't have severe splits. He's not a big-time hitter regardless, but I'm not going to platoon a guy who isn't terrible against lefties with his D in CF.
Click to expand...

He has been terrible vs. lefties for his career. But, with this team, it does make sense to get him as many at bats as possible to see if he can improve vs. lefties. Which he has in a small sample.
 
sturg33 said:
Sorry if I'm missing something... but yeezus seems to be suggesting we should extend Inciarte bc he is a 3-5 WIN player.

Thos wins are primarily defensive driven - much like Heyward. And he undoubtedly a worse hitter than Heyward (this year not withstanding)...

So why is investing the money in Heyward a bad investment, while investing the money in Inciarte is not? Unless he thinks Inciarte will command much less $/WAR than Heyward?

For the record - I'm in favor of extenting Inciarte
Click to expand...

I'm not in favor of giving Ender 8 years at $20M+ per.
The situations aren't comparable. There is no way you can't understand this; you're choosing not to in an attempt to make a point.
 
gilesfan said:
He has been terrible vs. lefties for his career. But, with this team, it does make sense to get him as many at bats as possible to see if he can improve vs. lefties. Which he has in a small sample.
Click to expand...

One year was his rookie year.
The next was a SSS.
This year he's been much better, also in a SSS.
There's not a lot of evidence to say he can't hit lefties. The fact he's doing ok vs. them this year is encouraging. And you choose to argue that. It's incredible.
 
yeezus said:
One year was his rookie year.
The next was a SSS.
This year he's been much better, also in a SSS.
There's not a lot of evidence to say he can't hit lefties. The fact he's doing ok vs. them this year is encouraging. And you choose to argue that. It's incredible.
Click to expand...

Im looking at his entire work. You are cherry picking. Whatever floats your boat.
 
gilesfan said:
Im looking at his entire work. You are cherry picking. Whatever floats your boat.
Click to expand...

How am I cherry picking? I'm adding context. The two are entirely different. The improvement is a very good thing, yet all you want to do is downplay it.
 
gilesfan said:
Im looking at his entire work. You are cherry picking. Whatever floats your boat.
Click to expand...

But his career is still cherry picking. He had an average 1st year.. abysmal 2nd year and another average to trending up 3rd year vs. Lefties. So who is he?

I like Ender as a player. His impact goes beyond the stat sheet. I would be all for extending him until his 30 -32 year old season.. **depending on how much of course.
 
Lefties are hitting 242/308/369 - 677 against lefties this year in MLB. Take that for what you will when comparing others.
 
sturg33 said:
Sorry if I'm missing something... but yeezus seems to be suggesting we should extend Inciarte bc he is a 3-5 WIN player.

Thos wins are primarily defensive driven - much like Heyward. And he undoubtedly a worse hitter than Heyward (this year not withstanding)...

So why is investing the money in Heyward a bad investment, while investing the money in Inciarte is not? Unless he thinks Inciarte will command much less $/WAR than Heyward?

For the record - I'm in favor of extenting Inciarte
Click to expand...

I think you've found it.
 
smootness said:
I think you've found it.
Click to expand...

I think the Heyward contract (one of several) is showing why you don't pay big money for speed, defense and base running. The only way he ever becomes worth his contract is if he becomes that .285 30 HR guy who mostly keeps his defense and base running.
 
Horsehide Harry said:
I think the Heyward contract (one of several) is showing why you don't pay big money for speed, defense and base running. The only way he ever becomes worth his contract is if he becomes that .285 30 HR guy who mostly keeps his defense and base running.
Click to expand...

Not to rehash this. But comparing Heywards contract ($$$/year) to other recent contracts then Heyward certainly didn't get paid for speed, defense, and base running. It was based almost solely on his offense. Unless you think someone like Justin Upton also gets paid for defense and base running. 20 million buys you a good offensive player on the open market.
 
sturg33 said:
Sorry if I'm missing something... but yeezus seems to be suggesting we should extend Inciarte bc he is a 3-5 WIN player.

Thos wins are primarily defensive driven - much like Heyward. And he undoubtedly a worse hitter than Heyward (this year not withstanding)...

So why is investing the money in Heyward a bad investment, while investing the money in Inciarte is not? Unless he thinks Inciarte will command much less $/WAR than Heyward?

For the record - I'm in favor of extenting Inciarte
Click to expand...

The big difference is I don't hear him wanting to extent him for 20-25 million a year... which was his only beef with Heyward... and obviously Inciarte won't get anywhere near that.
 
Horsehide Harry said:
I think the Heyward contract (one of several) is showing why you don't pay big money for speed, defense and base running. The only way he ever becomes worth his contract is if he becomes that .285 30 HR guy who mostly keeps his defense and base running.
Click to expand...

He would be underpaid at that point.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top