The Trump Presidency

Julio3000 said:
If by that you mean that Trump Tower resident Paul Manafort was subject to surveillance dating back to 2014, then yeah, you right.

If you mean it in the Trumpian "Obama had my wires tapped" sense, then yeah, you wrong.
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We don't know the extent of the tapping yet. All we know is that a connection in Trump tower was tapped (as per the report).
 
How does the validity of this court order get impacted if it was based on a now debunked dossier?
 
Homey, I'm not sure what you're talking about.

Manafort was under surveillance predating his involvement with the campaign.

The whole "Obama had my wires tapped" thing has already been knocked down.

If members of the campaign were under surveillance, it was subject to court order, and not because of an oppo research document. There would have to be a judge signing off.
 
holy ****, the disciples of the orange man still out here spitting lies about wire tapping cause the small handed psycho lied
 
Runnin said:
"The dossier" has been debunked? Most all of it has been confirmed.
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not in the alternate reality that trump supporters now live in. yes, a lot of it has been confirmed as true. but if they say it's been debunked, their mind believes it. it's the best part of being brainwashed.

imagine if obama had hired someone like manafort to his campaign. fox news would have blown it's collective load after this news. but there's always an excuse, always a justification. obviously trump didn't make any of his own decisions because he's an ignorant moron who doesn't know anything. but that doesn't absolve him of this kind of thing.

he speaks to world leaders today. no dumb people chanting and cheering for him. he is going to look so painfully stupid.
 
Manafort was a really weird hire. You can kind of squint and see the rationale for having him do the delegate wrangling at the convention, because he had experience with that, but his resume in US politics was a generation old, and his overseas work was full of red flags. This was known at the time, so it's easy to impute sketchy motivations.
 
Julio3000 said:
Manafort was a really weird hire. You can kind of squint and see the rationale for having him do the delegate wrangling at the convention, because he had experience with that, but his resume in US politics was a generation old, and his overseas work was full of red flags. This was known at the time, so it's easy to impute sketchy motivations.
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He did offer to work for free. And I think even back then a lot of people were not interested in working for Trump. So you have some weird hires.
 
fox news is sitting on the manafort story trying to figure out how to spin it, and the trumpets are waiting for what fox news tells them to say.
 
I think Fox could pretty easily spin it as "Look, Trump was right, his campaign was tapped!", if they are of a mind to.

Pretty sure I saw something that said the investigation into Manafort was called off, then reopened after he joined the campaign. Now, I don't think that there is causation there, but it would be an easy spin if that is the goal.
 
Jaw said:
I think Fox could pretty easily spin it as "Look, Trump was right, his campaign was tapped!", if they are of a mind to.

Pretty sure I saw something that said the investigation into Manafort was called off, then reopened after he joined the campaign. Now, I don't think that there is causation there, but it would be an easy spin if that is the goal.
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The "causation" according to the CNN story were

"intercepted communications between Manafort and suspected Russian operatives, and among the Russians themselves, that reignited [FBI] interest in Manafort."
 
Jaw said:
I think Fox could pretty easily spin it as "Look, Trump was right, his campaign was tapped!", if they are of a mind to.

Pretty sure I saw something that said the investigation into Manafort was called off, then reopened after he joined the campaign. Now, I don't think that there is causation there, but it would be an easy spin if that is the goal.
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his campaign wasn't tapped, though. a man he hired for his campaign was previously tapped (which means they had cause), and then re-tapped later, again with cause. so no, trump wasn't right at all. not even a little bit. he's a master at spinning facts as long as less-than-intelligent people want it to be true, so i'm sure he'll go that route. but any critical thinking put into this and one should see that what he said is and was always false.
 
nsacpi said:
The "causation" according the the CNN story were contacts with Russians that raised some red flags within our intelligence agencies.
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Mmmhmm.

So they can't nail Manafort (who has been under investigation since dinosaurs roamed the earth) for taking dirty money from Yanukovych, but they are suddenly able to muster substantive cause to renew his FISA warrant once he's hired as Trump's campaign chairman?
 
Julio3000 said:
Manafort was a really weird hire. You can kind of squint and see the rationale for having him do the delegate wrangling at the convention, because he had experience with that, but his resume in US politics was a generation old, and his overseas work was full of red flags. This was known at the time, so it's easy to impute sketchy motivations.
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I mean, maybe ... especially if one finds gas stations, Greyhound buses, and brown paper bags sketchy.
 
Ehh. It's not only "less-than-intelligent people" that wonder how this would be reported by CNN and other left of center outlets if it had happened 8 years earlier. Trump said Trump Tower was tapped, Clapper said specifically and definitively that there was not and had not been a FISA court order to tap Trump or his campaign. Now we find out that an active member of the Trump campaign was tapped, while working for the campaign, and in Trump Tower.

The "spin" writes itself easily enough here, for both sides.
 
Hawk said:
Mmmhmm.

So they can't nail Manafort (who has been under investigation since dinosaurs roamed the earth) for taking dirty money from Yanukovych, but they are suddenly able to muster substantive cause to renew his FISA warrant once he's hired as Trump's campaign chairman?
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the trigger was not his hiring as campaign chairman
 
Hawk said:
Mmmhmm.

So they can't nail Manafort (who has been under investigation since dinosaurs roamed the earth) for taking dirty money from Yanukovych, but they are suddenly able to muster substantive cause to renew his FISA warrant once he's hired as Trump's campaign chairman?
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So you're saying it was political, and not based on intercepted communications with foreign intelligence targets under surveillance, as reported. How does that not amount to "substantive cause," if it's signed off on by DoJ, FBI, and a judge?

FISA warrants affirm "suspicion that the subject of the warrant may be acting as an agent of a foreign power."
 
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