AA's Failure

Carp said:
For one, they didn't have 30 million more. It's been widely assumed for awhile now (unless your Mark Bradley) that the Braves had 40-50 million to work with. They spent roughly 30 million, and will likely spend another 5-10 million for mid-season upgrades.

If you don't think AA would be fired after 4 seasons of missing the playoffs with the talent he currently has, then you haven't been paying attention to baseball. And if you don't think Liberty would bend to public outcry, you must not pay attention to basically every sport in America.
Click to expand...


Agreed.

Why can't people just disagree with decisions without having to make everything so dramatic and full of motives that fit their own odd idea of villainy.
 
nsacpi said:
Actually less so than is typical of similar threads. What happened with Carle and Jackson yesterday did crystalize some concerns that are entirely valid.
Click to expand...

I definitely have concerns about those 2, but I can also see they're pretty much filling spots till guys get healthy. If those guys aren't close to getting healthy, then the flipping out could be warranted.
 
Carp said:
Also, why haven't we signed Ryan Madson? Seems like a pretty obvious move on a minor league at this point (unless he's demanding a major league deal).
Click to expand...

I'd give Madson a major league deal right now. He's a far better option than either Jackson or Carle.

If we'd had DFA'd Duvall at the end of ST we could have given his 40 man spot and money to Madson and had an actual useful piece without adding payroll or exposing anyone of worth to waivers.
 
striker42 said:
Four seasons of failure wouldn't cause AA to be fired. Four seasons of failure might cause fan dissatisfaction that results is decreases in revenue. That decrease would cause AA to be fired. If the fans hated AA, the product on the field was terrible, and yet every game was a sellout, AA would keep his job.

However, the way fans tend to express dissatisfaction with a team is by not giving the team money. So failure would almost certainly lead to less revenue and thus to AA's firing.

Fan outcry is only relevant if it threatens the money. Liberty does not care at all if you're happy or not except as far as it impacts your willingness to give them money. When teams bow to fan outcry it is almost always because they're afraid of the drop in revenue fan dissatisfaction will cause. If there's no risk to revenue, there's no placation.
Click to expand...

You're arguing semantics. Of course us missing the playoffs will lead to lower revenues. At best you could argue it's a risky move, but in reality, it would be an extremely dumb move to marginalize costs for some sort of bonus structure when your job security is entirely dependent on the on-field success of the franchise.
 
Last edited:
Enscheff said:
After losing game 1 we have declared the Braves to be stuck in “baseball purgatory” for the next several years?

At least the board is in mid season overreacting form!
Click to expand...

I declared that they were stuck in baseball purgatory long ago. Certainly, one game isn't a trend. But this offseason was a trend for me which re-enforces my concerns regarding the rebuilding plan - they got to a point where perception says they should contend but find themselves in a place where they don't have enough payroll space to fill the holes needed to feed the fire of contending and that if they go into a full on trade the farm to contend now mindset then they are a one or two year wonder cratering back into a rebuild once again.
 
msstate7 said:
I definitely have concerns about those 2, but I can also see they're pretty much filling spots till guys get healthy. If those guys aren't close to getting healthy, then the flipping out could be warranted.
Click to expand...

Assuming Minter and O'Day come back in a reasonable timeframe, it is just part of the ups and downs you have each season. I mostly view it as a test of Snitker's ability to manage with a short pen. It will be interesting to see if he gives Sobotka and Parsons some semi-high leverage innings before he turns to Carle again in a similar situation.
 
Horsehide Harry said:
I declared that they were stuck in baseball purgatory long ago. Certainly, one game isn't a trend. But this offseason was a trend for me which re-enforces my concerns regarding the rebuilding plan - they got to a point where perception says they should contend but find themselves in a place where they don't have enough payroll space to fill the holes needed to feed the fire of contending and that if they go into a full on trade the farm to contend now mindset then they are a one or two year wonder cratering back into a rebuild once again.
Click to expand...

This offseason was a result of a miscalculation of cOF cost by AA and the inability of the Braves to add long term payroll debt because of MLB debt servicing rules due to the desire to add even more long term commercial debt.

You didn’t call that happening 3 years ago. There is plenty of young talent around, and there would be plenty of cash if the Braves weren’t suddenly more interested in being a realty development company instead of a baseball team.
 
Enscheff said:
This offseason was a result of a miscalculation of cOF cost by AA and the inability of the Braves to add long term payroll debt because of MLB debt servicing rules due to the desire to add even more long term commercial debt.

You didn’t call that happening 3 years ago. There is plenty of young talent around, and there would be plenty of cash if the Braves weren’t suddenly more interested in being a realty development company instead of a baseball team.
Click to expand...

This seems like the more plausible scenario. That and AA being a stickler for getting good value.
 
msstate7 said:
I definitely have concerns about those 2, but I can also see they're pretty much filling spots till guys get healthy. If those guys aren't close to getting healthy, then the flipping out could be warranted.
Click to expand...

I disagree. Your argument is premised on the idea of total health by the pen once Minter and O'Day return. We know Viz has shoulder issues and who knows if Venters is going to hold up long term. Minter and O'Day returning healthy and staying healthy is also far from a guarantee.

Then there's the fact that we're relying on Parsons and Sobotka to perform in key roles while cutting their teeth.

The issue here is depth. AA should have added at least two relievers in the offseason. A closer or at least legit set up man and a middle reliever. That would provide the depth to keep guys like Jackson and Carle off the roster except in transient, 8th man roles while letting the younger relievers rotate up and down between Atlanta and AAA as needed.

The fact that Carle and Jackson are more than the 8th man shows how little depth we have in the pen.
 
Carp said:
You're arguing semantics. Of course us missing the playoffs will lead to lower revenues. At best you could argue it's a risky move, but in reality, it would be an extremely dumb move to marginalize costs for some sort of bonus structure when your job security is entirely dependent on the on-field success of the franchise.
Click to expand...

It also makes no sense for AA to run up to his absolute payroll limit this year when doing so wont alter revenue. Save the money, increase profits, reap the reward.

Maybe if they miss the playoffs this year the calculus changes and he has to sink more money into payroll. That's not the case right now though. Coming off a division title win that ignited the fan base and still fielding a legitimate team, he has some ability to go cheap.
 
striker42 said:
It also makes no sense for AA to run up to his absolute payroll limit this year when doing so wont alter revenue. Save the money, increase profits, reap the reward.

Maybe if they miss the playoffs this year the calculus changes and he has to sink more money into payroll. That's not the case right now though. Coming off a division title win that ignited the fan base and still fielding a legitimate team, he has some ability to go cheap.
Click to expand...

Again, the inherent risk of not making the playoffs eventually getting you fired should outweigh any short term bonus structure. The simplest answer is most often the correct one, and so far the simplest explanation is what Enscheff mentioned.
 
Hudson2 said:
They didn’t. But he would be at 3b instead of JD and the money used to upgrade an actual hole. Isn’t hard to figure it out..thanks.
Click to expand...

There is a valid argument in his statement. You are comparing 3 starters in a vacuum but not paying attention to the bench upgrade that Jogun brings.
 
I find it exceedingly unlikely AA didn’t spend payroll to boost his 2019 bonus. It seems illogical to be that short sighted. If the Braves face plant this year attendance will plummet, and AA will be on the hot seat. He knows this, so there’s no way he made roster decisions based on some bonus for a single year.
 
Carp said:
Again, the inherent risk of not making the playoffs eventually getting you fired should outweigh any short term bonus structure. The simplest answer is most often the correct one, and so far the simplest explanation is what Enscheff mentioned.
Click to expand...

It's not just a bonus structure. I think AA getting a bonus is a big motivator but that's not all. If the Braves turn a fantastic profit this year that will solidify AA with Liberty far more than winning the division will.

The simplest explanation is most likely true. To me, trying to maximize profits is the simplest explanation. The Braves are being run as a business, profits are always going to be the driving force.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top