Taking on a contract?

C

Chico

New member
We have money to spend, in a weak FA class for hitters, and will probably want to hang on to our top prospects. Add all these up and there is a chance we take on a "bad" short term contract as a means to an end in acquiring young impactful hitters. I listed a few contracts below of players that I could see filling a short term need for us, whose team is probably looking to get out of their contract. I included any buyouts. Some of these may also be a way to dump Chris Johnson. The Rockies, Dodgers, Cubs, and Indians seem to make the most sense IMO

Carlos Gonzalez 2/38

Andre Ethier 2/38

CJ Wilson 1/20.5

Matt Garza 2/25

Miguel Montero 2/24

John Danks 1/15.75

Nick Swisher 1/15

Michael Bourn 1/14

Coco Crisp 1/11.75

Derek Holland 1/11.5

Kurt Suzuki 1/6
 
If the Braves actually have money to spend and actually spend it, it better be for legit players. I am sorry but I wouldn't want any of these contacts you listed above. I understand what you are getting at, but if the Braves have to go that route we are once again in for a poor season.
 
Cargo is the most interesting on the list. There are some other bad contracts that are less short-term in nature. Kemp and Choo come to mind. In the case of those the other team would have to kick in some money.

Among the second tier free agents, I like Zobrist to play left (and anywhere else if the need comes up).
 
Cleveland is choking on Bourn and Swisher right now and they have 2 pretty good OF prospects in Zimmer and Frasier.
 
NinersSBChamps said:
If the Braves actually have money to spend and actually spend it, it better be for legit players. I am sorry but I wouldn't want any of these contacts you listed above. I understand what you are getting at, but if the Braves have to go that route we are once again in for a poor season.
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The reason you don't want any of these contracts is they were overpaid in free agency, which is something we have to be weary of given our financial restraints. I do want to win next year, but more importantly I want more core players for the long run. If we can get them without having to take on money that's great, but I'm not seeing exactly how that's going to happen, thus the speculation.
 
Chico said:
We have money to spend, in a weak FA class for hitters, and will probably want to hang on to our top prospects. Add all these up and there is a chance we take on a "bad" short term contract as a means to an end in acquiring young impactful hitters. I listed a few contracts below of players that I could see filling a short term need for us, whose team is probably looking to get out of their contract. I included any buyouts. Some of these may also be a way to dump Chris Johnson. The Rockies, Dodgers, Cubs, and Indians seem to make the most sense IMO

Carlos Gonzalez 2/38 - someone will wind up paying a good prospect or two for him.
Andre Ethier 2/38 - given that he's been their most consistent OF all season, I don't think they're willing to give him away at this point.
CJ Wilson 1/20.5 - they have no position prospects in their system, and I can't (personally) see them adding an arm since they'll need to replace him.
Matt Garza 2/25 - run away kicking and screaming - don't think you'd want to be paying him in 2017 to be in the way like CJ (or now, for that matter).
Miguel Montero 2/24 - same as above - no need to pay him. Going to be time to let Bethancourt sink or swim soon.
John Danks 1/15.75 - no particularly interesting prospects in their system (to me).
Nick Swisher 1/15 - don't see Hart taking on another deal and instantly releasing the veteran to get the prospect again, but do like Frasier (can't fathom them moving Zimmer at all).
Michael Bourn 1/14 - see above.
Coco Crisp 1/11.75 - personally doubt Beane will include prospects to move someone now, he's already cleared plenty of salary with earlier moves.
Derek Holland 1/11.5 - I'd expect to hear rumbling about a Holland extension shortly. They got Hamels for the future, and Darvish/Hamels/Holland/Perez would be a nice rotation.
Kurt Suzuki 1/6 - Twins don't need to move him, and they're still in the race - why would they attach a prospect to move him?
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Really don't see Hart making a deal for a big contract at this point unless it's for a long-term piece. Unless that piece was a RH power bat, long-term Catcher, or TOR starter, why wouldn't you just wait to spend money this winter??? JMO, but the 2 year guys you listed aren't likely extension candidates, and they'd leave you less money to chase a right-handed bat or "Ace" when you go shopping this winter.
 
clvclv said:
Really don't see Hart making a deal for a big contract at this point unless it's for a long-term piece. Unless that piece was a RH power bat, long-term Catcher, or TOR starter, why wouldn't you just wait to spend money this winter??? JMO, but the 2 year guys you listed aren't likely extension candidates, and they'd leave you less money to chase a right-handed bat or "Ace" when you go shopping this winter.
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I don't think we want to commit to a long term contract outside of a TOR starter. That's what got us into trouble in the first place. Let's say you call Cleveland and want Clint Frazier, and they tell you taking back Swisher or Bourn and his contract is part of it. There's no long term commitment, and you have your future power hitting left fielder. Maybe you're trying to get Soler from the Cubs and they tell you taking back Montero is part of the deal. You have your power right fielder and a catcher to bridge the gap to whomever your future is.

Will they do something like this? I dunno. But I think it's just as likely as going big in free agency, and being hamstrung by future commitments.
 
Tapate50 said:
Cargo jumps out at me off that list. Very intriguing and I like the length of that deal...
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There's no long term commitment. Maybe you get Ryan MCMahon back who should be ready when Cargo's contract is up, and then move Olivera to LF. Or maybe you shoot for Tom Murphy and have your power hitting catcher of the future.
 
I still think we should look at the young Rockies 3b blocked now. That guy and cargo for some arms and jace. Move Oliver's to 2b.
 
Swapping Teheran and CarGo would make some sense, imo. We would need either cash or prospects from Colorado though, considering the team friendly deal Teheran is on.
 
Yeah, CarGo at this point isn't necessarily a contract you're taking on but rather an asset that you pay to acquire. The Rockies want to trade him so that they can trade his present value for some prospects.
 
mqt said:
Yeah, CarGo at this point isn't necessarily a contract you're taking on but rather an asset that you pay to acquire. The Rockies want to trade him so that they can trade his present value for some prospects.
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Not that interested in Cargo. Will be 30 next year and can't stay healthy.

Although it seems that's exactly what Hart is looking for
 
No thanks at all to CarGo. This team is already pretty LHed heavy with Markakis, Freeman and Jace being 3 of the best hitters on the team. A guy like Gordon would be OK because he, like Freeman and Markakis, handles LHed pitching well. CarGo is absolutely terrible vs LHed pitching, and should be platooned...not something you want out of a guy being paid like a franchise cornerstone.

The need for RHed bats is part of the reason the Braves overpaid for Olivera, and why I would be all for signing Cespedes if he can be had for around $20M per year. Add an offensively competent catcher (maybe an AJ/CB platoon again) and suddenly this becomes a legit lineup:

Markakis
Olivera
Freeman
Cespedes
Maybin
catcher
Jace
Simmons
 
I'm not big on Cespedes. He's got some pop, but living with the 300 OBP, bad defense, and bad attitude isn't worth it for what someone will be willing to spend for the power.
 
I don't disagree with concerns about the low OBP, but I think it should be noted that his OBP was .356 his rookie year, and it has rebounded to .325 this year. It's not like he is some out of control K machine. Despite the low-ish OBP, he is still an impact bat that can put up an .800 OPS in the middle of a lineup...something that isn't exactly easy to acquire nowadays. A successful lineup can have a guy like that in the middle of it, just not 3-4 of them. I would expect a slash line from him of about .270/.320/.500 moving forward for the next few years.

I think his defensive problems might be a bit overstated, however. I don't know much about his defense, but the fact he has spent some time in CF for the Mets this year and played it fairly often in his Oakland years tells me he should be more than adequate in LF, but probably doesn't have the arm for RF.

I also haven't heard anything bad about his attitude (he is not Puig at least).
 
Enscheff said:
I don't disagree with concerns about the low OBP, but I think it should be noted that his OBP was .356 his rookie year, and it has rebounded to .325 this year. It's not like he is some out of control K machine. Despite the low-ish OBP, he is still an impact bat that can put up an .800 OPS in the middle of a lineup...something that isn't exactly easy to acquire nowadays. A successful lineup can have a guy like that in the middle of it. I would expect a slash line from him of about .270/.320/.500 moving forward for the next few years.

I think his defensive problems might be a bit overstated, however. I don't know much about his defense, but the fact he has spent some time in CF for the Mets this year and played it fairly often in his Oakland years tells me he should be more than adequate in LF, but probably doesn't have the arm for RF.
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He's got a .332 BABIP going this year. I think that will average out dropping his OBP back to .300-.310. He's got the arm, but the problem has been his refusal to work on his defense. In Boston he refused to take balls off the green monster, which was part of the reason he was traded to Detroit.
 
Cespedes is not bad defensively. He's been about average and is better than average this year.

Adding an average defensive LF doesn't hurt you, but it would mean we're average at best everywhere in the OF.
 
Chico said:
I'm not big on Cespedes. He's got some pop, but living with the 300 OBP, bad defense, and bad attitude isn't worth it for what someone will be willing to spend for the power.
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Agreed. If we can’t trade for better — and I hope we can, mind — I’d rather stick with Markakis, Mallex, and Maybin. Get 3M to sponsor us and use the extra cash to get a catcher and an ace.

Now the question is … who is better in the everyday line up, Uribe or Jace? With Uribe at third, you can slide Olivera over to second, and use Jace as a spot starter, super sub, and injury protection.

Figure out which one of these moves don’t work, and you still have budget room to retool for 2017.

None of this is plan A, mind. But you could do worse. This year proves it.
 
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