Trump Trials Watch I

Carp said:
Trump clearly had an opportunity to say that he would punish these criminals that destroyed the country. Since he didn't come out and say exactly that, then he clearly implied that he won't do it.

Given that, it's clear sturg is right and thethe is wrong.
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I'm ashamed to say it took me this long to get the meaning of this one
 
Can our criminal justice system maybe focus on cases where there’s an actual victim?

Trump gets a $300,000,000+ fine for embellishing the value of his properties, even though it’s the bank’s job to do its own due diligence? (And by the way, the bank didn’t bring the lawsuit because they were satisfied)

Trump could get jail time for what amounts to a clerical error on a hush money payment where the prosecutor took a misdemeanor and built a Frankenstein’s monster of 34 felonies? Who was the victim?

Hunter Biden faces 25 years behind bars for lying on a checkbox included on a government form? Who’d he shoot with that gun? Who was the victim…the government?

Idk what we’re doing.
 
acesfull86 said:
Can our criminal justice system maybe focus on cases where there’s an actual victim?

Trump gets a $300,000,000+ fine for embellishing the value of his properties, even though it’s the bank’s job to do its own due diligence? (And by the way, the bank didn’t bring the lawsuit because they were satisfied)

Trump could get jail time for what amounts to a clerical error on a hush money payment where the prosecutor took a misdemeanor and built a Frankenstein’s monster of 34 felonies? Who was the victim?

Hunter Biden faces 25 years behind bars for lying on a checkbox included on a government form? Who’d he shoot with that gun? Who was the victim…the government?

Idk what we’re doing.
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Our society mostly works on the honor code. I'd say crimes that erode that honor code have a real cost and are not "victimless." The costs are socialized and spread over a large number of victims.

For example, insider trading undermines confidence in financial markets. It's difficult to identify a "victim" when those kinds of crimes are committed but the social costs are real and often large.
 
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acesfull86 said:
Can our criminal justice system maybe focus on cases where there’s an actual victim?

Trump gets a $300,000,000+ fine for embellishing the value of his properties, even though it’s the bank’s job to do its own due diligence? (And by the way, the bank didn’t bring the lawsuit because they were satisfied)

Trump could get jail time for what amounts to a clerical error on a hush money payment where the prosecutor took a misdemeanor and built a Frankenstein’s monster of 34 felonies? Who was the victim?

Hunter Biden faces 25 years behind bars for lying on a checkbox included on a government form? Who’d he shoot with that gun? Who was the victim…the government?

Idk what we’re doing.
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Where you been? A significant amount of people go to prison for victimless crimes.
 
Hunter doesn't realistically face 25 years behind bars. Even in a state that is tough on gun crimes. But he absolutely deserved to be prosecuted and found guilty, as there was no question whatsoever that he committed a crime. He even admitted multiple times that he was abusing drugs during the time he bought a handgun.

But the penalty here should be fairly minimal for someone without a prior criminal record and this was a non-violent crime. I do find it unlikely he actually serves prison time. And certainly no more than maybe 6 months in jail.
 
cajunrevenge said:
Where you been? A significant amount of people go to prison for victimless crimes.
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funny how so many people suddenly find that to be an interesting insight

but i would say most so called victimless crimes have victims...it is just that the costs are broadly socialized so it is hard to identify an individual "victim"...does not make such criminal activity costless or victimless
 
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acesfull86 said:
I recall saying we should focus on crimes with actual victims…I don’t recall saying we should give up…
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so if i don't pay my taxes who is the actual victim

afaik there isn't any victim being harmed

my point is a lot of crimes have costs that are very broadly socialized...they can be quite serious even if there isn't a readily identifiable victim

there is also a bit of a falacy of composition at work here...if one person doesn't pay taxes or falsifies business records it is not a big deal...but if such behavior becomes common then of course it is
 
nsacpi said:
funny how so many people suddenly find that to be an interesting insight

but i would say most so called victimless crimes have victims...it is just that the costs are broadly socialized so it is hard to identify an individual "victim"...does not make such criminal activity costless or victimless
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Would you say cheating in an election has victims? Does paying a lower rate on your loan to your bank because you lied about your financial situation make the bank a victim? What do you think the reaction would be by the Trump tards if DB publicly supported the prosecution or claimed or be the victim?
 
Carp said:
Hunter doesn't realistically face 25 years behind bars. Even in a state that is tough on gun crimes. But he absolutely deserved to be prosecuted and found guilty, as there was no question whatsoever that he committed a crime. He even admitted multiple times that he was abusing drugs during the time he bought a handgun.

But the penalty here should be fairly minimal for someone without a prior criminal record and this was a non-violent crime. I do find it unlikely he actually serves prison time. And certainly no more than maybe 6 months in jail.
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I agree. The judge will exercise common sense (with the help of guidelines) when sentencing time comes. Like everyone else Hunter will have the right of appeal. I don't think he stands a chance on the facts of the case. The Supreme Court's evolving jurisprudence on the 2nd amendment is his best chance on appeal. Yet another example of the law becoming ironic in recent times.
 
cajunrevenge said:
Would you say cheating in an election has victims? Does paying a lower rate on your loan to your bank because you lied about your financial situation make the bank a victim? What do you think the reaction would be by the Trump tards if DB publicly supported the prosecution or claimed or be the victim?
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lol
 
nsacpi said:
I agree. The judge will exercise common sense (with the help of guidelines) when sentencing time comes. Like everyone else Hunter will have the right of appeal. I don't think he stands a chance on the facts of the case. The Supreme Court's evolving jurisprudence on the 2nd amendment is his best chance on appeal. Yet another example of the law becoming ironic in recent times.
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Republican might want to check on Don Jr if they have an issue with drug addicts buying guns. junior is clearly coked up and has lots of guns.
 
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