Braves Trade Heyward, Walden to Cardinals for Miller and Tyrell Jenkins

yeezus said:
I'm in agreement with whoever is saying Wren should have been fired. I was a defender of his for the most part, but I think looking at where this team was and how the offense was constructed he kinda had to go. But then the argument for him is no matter what your opinion of BJ was when we initially signed him, no one could at all foresee the complete and total collapse as an all-around baseball player he had. Few guys ever have been as big a disappointment, and how terrible he's been is amazing. He could have regressed a good amount after coming here and still been far more productive. I also think he counted on Heyward becoming that guy and carrying them a bit more. I don't blame Heyward completely, because he wasn't necessarily set up for success here, he's still young, and various other reasons.

The front office clearly didn't believe in and value him like many others did (and did not, as well). I think a decent question for every one is: How much would you have given him and for how long? Just you personally. IMO he's worth about $22 mil a year and could end up being a bargain at that. He's still young, is a great athlete, and still has projections in his frame. I don't really know if the Braves even offered him that much, or if they did and he turned it down. I don't think he would have, but I don't know.
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It would be tough for me to go over 20M but I would be fine with a 7 year 140M deal.

My argument is that I don't believe his defense will over inflate his WAR in the second half of that deal so I think I'm still taking a risk that he will develop offensively.
 
BedellBrave said:
Why in the world would any sane GM tie up that amount - which is what 16% of the budget in the production that Heyward gives you? Even if he ticks up a bit in his production? Does that make sense?
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You would be kind of betting on him to do so. Jumps in a player's game that talented can happen at any time. I guess the Braves didn't want to gamble on him. I'm in the camp that thinks it would be a good gamble that he will see a decent uptick and be even more valuable. Some teams will agree with the Braves, others will agree with us whining on here.
 
thethe said:
I think thats very possible. But after this year he is going to get an 8 year deal at the very least and like I've said he will be very good the first half of the contract but that second half could get hairy if he doesn't further improve his hitting.
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That's true for most contracts. You get a bargain out of the production for the 1st half and then the second half evens out. That's why you see players restructure their contracts later in the deals. To help everyone out assuming your team has financial problems. We'll see it with Freeman and someone we'll see it with Heyward.
 
thethe said:
A player who is as massive as Heyward will probably lose speed and flexiblity faster than a guy like AOKI who is just a twig.

Maybe Heyward slims down but if you've spent any time in a gym you would know that guys that big don't typically stay nimble.
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I don't see why he can't add more weight and get back to his previously displayed power. It's not like he's been a slap hitter, ever. Some feel we've seen the potential and think it's a worthwhile gamble. Pretty much all players are gambles in some regard. Everything is there and he's still young.
 
If we trade Upton I'd be a lot more comfortable with a full rebuild. Wasting Freddie and Kimbrel's prime years to sell tickets seems like a waste of time.
 
yeezus said:
You would be kind of betting on him to do so. Jumps in a player's game that talented can happen at any time. I guess the Braves didn't want to gamble on him. I'm in the camp that thinks it would be a good gamble that he will see a decent uptick and be even more valuable. Some teams will agree with the Braves, others will agree with us whining on here.
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Mid-market teams can't gamble like that. Why is this hard to understand?
 
yeezus said:
I don't see why he can't add more weight and get back to his previously displayed power. It's not like he's been a slap hitter, ever. Some feel we've seen the potential and think it's a worthwhile gamble. Pretty much all players are gambles in some regard. Everything is there and he's still young.
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Heyward should stop getting bigger. I think he should have went more ofthe Ken Grffey route and gotten more wiry strength. Heyward is a massive human being. I'm not sure if you have ever seen him in person. He is tremendous.
 
"Marlins owner Jeffrey Loria tells Manny Navarro of the Miami Herald that he plans to surround Stanton with an improved lineup and can afford to go out and add a bat to hit behind him this offseason."

Womp.
On the bright side, if we had Reuben Amaro at the helm, we'd have traded Heyward for Bartolo Colon and a C-level prospect.
 
BremanFan88 said:
If we trade Upton I'd be a lot more comfortable with a full rebuild. Wasting Freddie and Kimbrel's prime years to sell tickets seems like a waste of time.
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If you are trading for guys that are on the cusp then we wouldn't be wasting their prime years.
 
skillet said:
You fully expect Jason to bust out, even though he hasn't yet done it in 5 full major league seasons that encompasses 2819 plate appearances. His home runs have dropped from 27 to 14 to 11 over the past three. Could Jason break out, sure, but there is no evidence over the past 5 years to support that theory.
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HOME RUNS R EVRYTHNG!
 
This was sometime in the afternoon.

Buster Olney ‏@Buster_ESPN
With ATL trading Heyward, makes sense for them to deal Justin Upton now. Seattle--no longer on his no-trade list--a good fit. (For Walker?)
 
thethe said:
If you are trading for guys that are on the cusp then we wouldn't be wasting their prime years.
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We'd have to acquire a lot of players who are just on the cusp. Our lineup is literally a mess and worse if Justin goes. I don't see how one trade will fix that.
 
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